Ok...When Champions Online first came out of Beta And went Live...I was tottally Against it 100% cause I thought Cryptic was messin up and wasnt on accedent either....But then I had friends say to me that the game got better and Cryptic actually took time and listened to what people want and did it in Champions. Well of corse I told them No way...Didnt happen....But.....Then I went home and tried it...And i have to say..I have changed my whole opinion On Cryptic and the Champions Online MMORPG...I got back on and to my suprise it was 100% better than what it was right after the Live release...I know people Will say mean things here about this post but I rather dont care cause I see it for myself....I just wondered why people still have the Hate for the game??  Cause it has changed for the better and that tells me Cryptic is trying to work with the Gamers....

Really Bill?  Come now...

:(

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Originally posted by Quizar1973
Ok...When Champions Online first came out of Beta And went Live...I was tottally Against it 100% cause I thought Cryptic was messin up and wasnt on accedent either....But then I had friends say to me that the game got better and Cryptic actually took time and listened to what people want and did it in Champions. Well of corse I told them No way...Didnt happen....But.....Then I went home and tried it...And i have to say..I have changed my whole opinion On Cryptic and the Champions Online MMORPG...I got back on and to my suprise it was 100% better than what it was right after the Live release...I know people Will say mean things here about this post but I rather dont care cause I see it for myself....I just wondered why people still have the Hate for the game??  Cause it has changed for the better and that tells me Cryptic is trying to work with the Gamers....

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Rorschach's Journal

Read a funny post today. Everyone laughed.

"I know people Will say mean things here about this post but I rather dont care cause I see it for myself"

Then why post.

The only thing I have to say that is mean is your use of . . .instead of just a period.  I do that a lot though so I can't call you out on that.  One thing to do that is more acceptible is to change them to   a dash instead.

Aside from that I don't think there is anything wrong with your post.  I have a hard time believing that the game is 100% better.  I can see some improvements but not that large.   I hope you don't get flamed too bad.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion - and you are allowed to share yours.  See how I used the dash there. . . I just think it looks nicer. . oh now see I am not :)

Well....I...Didnt Know....I was Gonna....(Ohh my bad)- Be Graded--On the post,s Grammer--Or I would have done better...LOL

I bought the game when it came out, and I think the highest character i got was to about 23.

Stopped playing for several months. I recently picked it up again , level a guy to 40, and then had literally nothing to do.

There is one or two level 40 dungeons. There is what is called Nemesis Confrontation, and then endless mission to get 1 or two coins of which you need 1000 or more of to buy some purple item which may or may not have a costume piece associated with it.

If you love costumes, alts, and chatting with friends, and endless farming of 5000 mobs for titles and or now purchasable costumes, then this is the game for you.

I gotta say I'm looking forward to Dc universe, but it may go the same way as Heroes, and Champions. These games just do not have the amount of content that swords and sorcery fantasy games have int he end. Maybe its just a brick wall with the hero genre in and of itself.  I dunno, it just seems once you ooohed and ahhhed over the neat powers, and firstt ime villans, or how incredibly bad ass you looking standing at the tailor with 30 other people, it is over.

Well..Yea i agree with you there. The Superhero Games dont have Armor and Weapons to Buy/Find like Fantasy games have. But they have as much Quests, And yea the Character Customization is the best out there IMO. Ide have to say..The only Difference i beilive in Superhero games and Fantasy Games is the Weapons and Armor/Robes you can find and Buy. And i know alot of games out there that get to where you have nothing to do at High levels other than chat and team up and do Quests over again. Well there is creating an Alt and strt from scratch again...LOL

My Problem with CO is that it's still way to generic. I recently came back because more news has been released about DCUO and I can't play it yet so figured I'd get in some Superhero action in for a month. After a few days I'm ready to cancel again though. 

Yes a lot has improved in CO. Melee has seen some love, more content has been added, lot of bugs have been resolved. The problem is the core problem for me is still there. It's just to generic of an MMO. You have a ton of gopher quests (Go fer this, go fer that) still making you feel like Super Ultra Errand boy and then of course when you hit cap... there just isn't a lot to do. 

I played for a month at launch then got bored with the game, stayed for 2 more months doing nothing but PvP until I got bored with that. Came back gave it another go and everything still feels inherently the same. Yes there has been some improvement but my main issue has been and sadly will always be the core of the game. 

Combat is fun, Customization rocks, the rest is less than mediocre. 

But this is just imho. A good example of what I mean is the halloween event. They gave us 13 dungeons with 13 fallen hero's to defeat but each dungeon and hero felt exactly the same as the one before. Strategy was the same, looks were the same, everything was essentially the same with very few differences. Thats CO in a nutshell, generic as can be. At least to me. 

If the game was bad but got better then why are people still hating? Gaming companies only deserve one shot to impress in my book. If they fail at launch then there is no one else but them to blame for the people who continue to hate a game even if it has improved. As a consumer I have no responsibility to keep my eye on a game I hated waiting to see if it gets better and then give it another chance.. Why would I when there are other alternatives? I would only when and if I felt like but I certainly don't have any obligation.

I too came back to the game because "it's gotten a lot better since release" but I don't see it. It's still boring quests in boring settings with borings storylines and boring graphics. I guess my point is that... it's .. wait for it... boring.

There is nothing that feels epic in this game when I'm suppose to be thise heroic superhero and instead i'm fetching documents from a plane crash and digging people out of snow. Honestly I think this game would have worked better as  a fantasy game. The amount of quests thown at you and the lack of variety leaves a lot to be desired. The game feels way to mechanical and the crafting is meh.. the little defense/offense items are also nothing to get excited about it.

Also there is a lack of community at least earlier on from what I could see. It's not the communities fault though. There is no reason to talk to anyone else in the first couple areas which is bummer.

There are good things.. maybe.. but you just wanted to know the bad things.. so that's how I feel...

(edit: The person above probably said it better... it's boring because it's generic or vice versa ^^)

Originally posted by Quizar1973

Well..Yea i agree with you there. The Superhero Games dont have Armor and Weapons to Buy/Find like Fantasy games have. But they have as much Quests, And yea the Character Customization is the best out there IMO. Ide have to say..The only Difference i beilive in Superhero games and Fantasy Games is the Weapons and Armor/Robes you can find and Buy. And i know alot of games out there that get to where you have nothing to do at High levels other than chat and team up and do Quests over again. Well there is creating an Alt and strt from scratch again...LOL

Well with regarding the Armor and weapons to be equipped with the Character. DC Universe has that option for it. Armor wise you can equip it or leave it invisible but keep the stats. Weapon wise you can equip the different weapons and have different animation. Now on saying that , we can only say if it works until the game comes out.

Originally posted by natuxatu

If the game was bad but got better then why are people still hating? Gaming companies only deserve one shot to impress in my book. If they fail at launch then there is no one else but them to blame for the people who continue to hate a game even if it has improved. As a consumer I have no responsibility to keep my eye on a game I hated waiting to see if it gets better and then give it another chance.. Why would I when there are other alternatives? I would only when and if I felt like but I certainly don't have any obligation.

 

I too came back to the game because "it's gotten a lot better since release" but I don't see it. It's still boring quests in boring settings with borings storylines and boring graphics. I guess my point is that... it's .. wait for it... boring.

There is nothing that feels epic in this game when I'm suppose to be thise heroic superhero and instead i'm fetching documents from a plane crash and digging people out of snow. Honestly I think this game would have worked better as  a fantasy game. The amount of quests thown at you and the lack of variety leaves a lot to be desired. The game feels way to mechanical and the crafting is meh.. the little defense/offense items are also nothing to get excited about it.

Also there is a lack of community at least earlier on from what I could see. It's not the communities fault though. There is no reason to talk to anyone else in the first couple areas which is bummer.

There are good things.. maybe.. but you just wanted to know the bad things.. so that's how I feel...

 

(edit: The person above probably said it better... it's boring because it's generic or vice versa ^^)

 I agree with some that you said that it gets boring sometimes..I agree...But Ive played many of MMO's that i have heard alot of people say...Im Bored...hehe...CO is just one of them....But what you said when you mentioned there is nothing that feels Epic in the game...I want to ask...Flying without a plane is not epic??? Tunneling underground isnt epic??? Can you make Ice or Electicity fly out of your hands???  To me stuff like that are Epic... Just becuase the Aggro or Villians dont look Epic dosent mean you cant do Epic things.

Originally posted by Quizar1973

Originally posted by natuxatu

If the game was bad but got better then why are people still hating? Gaming companies only deserve one shot to impress in my book. If they fail at launch then there is no one else but them to blame for the people who continue to hate a game even if it has improved. As a consumer I have no responsibility to keep my eye on a game I hated waiting to see if it gets better and then give it another chance.. Why would I when there are other alternatives? I would only when and if I felt like but I certainly don't have any obligation.

 

I too came back to the game because "it's gotten a lot better since release" but I don't see it. It's still boring quests in boring settings with borings storylines and boring graphics. I guess my point is that... it's .. wait for it... boring.

There is nothing that feels epic in this game when I'm suppose to be thise heroic superhero and instead i'm fetching documents from a plane crash and digging people out of snow. Honestly I think this game would have worked better as  a fantasy game. The amount of quests thown at you and the lack of variety leaves a lot to be desired. The game feels way to mechanical and the crafting is meh.. the little defense/offense items are also nothing to get excited about it.

Also there is a lack of community at least earlier on from what I could see. It's not the communities fault though. There is no reason to talk to anyone else in the first couple areas which is bummer.

There are good things.. maybe.. but you just wanted to know the bad things.. so that's how I feel...

 

(edit: The person above probably said it better... it's boring because it's generic or vice versa ^^)

 I agree with some that you said that it gets boring sometimes..I agree...But Ive played many of MMO's that i have heard alot of people say...Im Bored...hehe...CO is just one of them....But what you said when you mentioned there is nothing that feels Epic in the game...I want to ask...Flying without a plane is not epic??? Tunneling underground isnt epic??? Can you make Ice or Electicity fly out of your hands???  To me stuff like that are Epic... Just becuase the Aggro or Villians dont look Epic dosent mean you cant do Epic things.

That epic feel that you would expect from having super powers is killed off by many asinine things. Super Speed loses any epic feel once you realize you can't do anything but run fast. There are no powers tied in with Superspeed. It's just a travel power and a very limited one at that. You can't run up obstacles or run sideways on walls. Not only that but you become fairly slow while in combat. 

Tunneling should feel epic but it doesn't because of similar asinine things. You know how silly it is for you to not be able to tunnel under a box, or a wall, or any number of other silly little things?

Flying should be epic, but even with invulnerability a single trash can will knock you out of the sky. 

Super Jump.... how many times do you think the hulk killed himself with his super jump?  Why can I jump really high only to take damage when I land?

Acrobatics is fairly nice, I wish I could grab onto things and swing etc. but it works better than most other travel powers. 

Teleport, it's epic up until you realize that EVERYONE uses teleport... well this is true with PvP'rs and they use it because it's about the only travel power that really is epic. 

I don't really feel epic in CO, what I feel like is the B squad Super Hero on the Super Hero special Olympics team. I can tunnel, but get stopped by a box... I can fly and have invulnerability but I tend to be sent crashing down by trashcans... I can Jump really high but have to be careful because I can kill myself doing so.  I can be taken down by normal run of the mil thugs. I spend most of my Super hero days running errands for other hero's and civilians. If I do fight a Super Villain I will likely need help. 

I agree with the poster that says CO doesn't deliver that epic feel. To me it delivers the exact opposite,

Thanks.. yes that was my point overall which is why I said it would be an okay fantasy game where I was some dude with magic. Its a superhero game and I dont feel super or heroic really.

And yes other games can be boring but there are things that help keep it interesting. I don't feel like CO has an interesting setting to look at. (At least none that I've seen.) It doesn't have that community feel that can help with the down time and so on. So when i get bored there is really nothing worth doing that can change that feeling.

But again that's just my opinion.

Well I really agree with the tunneling...It is retarted that you cant tunnel under walls and boxes but as far as flying i have never been knocked out of the air. But just getting off the ground is Epic to me...Just like Fantasy MMO's If i get a flying mount wether I get Knocked off or not...I still feel Epic just riding it and gettin off the ground. Epic in my Book is Something you do But are not suppose to be able to do (I hope ya know what im syain there)..And Flying or even digging in the ground is just that. But as everyone else says Thats just my opinion. I see that CO is still on the back burner for alot of people BUT Cryptic is still trying to fix it...Thats not opinion its fact and i trully think that people can earn back or just Earn my respect...And Cryptic has.

I like the game, hate the social aspects too it.

(1) There is no reason to team... ever as far as I can tell.  I did just about everything in the game when I was playing and teamed perhaps once or twice.

(2) There are few to no social spaces.  No player housing.  No super bases.  Nothing that really is a central spot for people to gather if they make a supergroup.  All a supergroup is right now is a chat channel.  I like to RP, if they managed bases and other social areas, I would think of coming back.

(3) The zones that the game has are very well done.  However, they are too few which limits roleplay even further (as well as variety)

They need to improve the social aspects of the game to lure me back.  I think they'll do it in time.  It's still a young title and as long as they continue to improve it, I'm sure that they will do just fine.

I love the character creation but pass on the rest. I tried it when it first came out. My main problem was what some other people have mentioned...I just didn't feel super at all. The combat was blah (especially the effects), the missions were boring, and the world seemed small. I had the same problem with COH.

I hope DCU is better, but we'll see. 

Well, seeing this CO hate thread, I had to jump in. Let's compare it to the MMO in its field, and other popular MMOs.

CO vs CoH:

- Grind in CO is virtually non-existant

- CO's powers are more robust and action-oriented

- Teaming not needed some of the time. (I'd love to see someone solo Dr. Destroyer). CoH pretty much requires it.

- Travel in CO is faster and more geared to what you pick (Teleport is fastest, flight is second)

- CoH limits you to classes. CO does not.

- PvP doesn't break the PvE system.

- One account, one virtual server, no need for transfers when one server is low on people.

CO vs WoW:

- CO: No grind. Wow: Tons of grind

- More options for creation. I could even re-create the succubus pet from WoW.

- While there are some need to team for some missions (such as Dr. Destroyer's lab), the rest doesn't need it.

- Oh, I love WALKING to the next zone in WoW, don't you?

- Again, one account, one server.

Originally posted by Shilar

Well, seeing this CO hate thread, I had to jump in. Let's compare it to the MMO in its field, and other popular MMOs.

 

CO vs CoH:

- Grind in CO is virtually non-existant

What does CoH have to grind that CO doesn't?  CoH has more than enough missions at all levels.  Potentially infinite missions...

- CO's powers are more robust and action-oriented

Also, grindingly simplistic.  tap buildup power til' you have enough energy for big power, use it.  Block occasionally.

- Teaming not needed some of the time. (I'd love to see someone solo Dr. Destroyer). CoH pretty much requires it.

I hardly ever have to group in CoH, especially now that you can control how powerful the Boss is.  I just group for fun and the XP bonus.

- Travel in CO is faster and more geared to what you pick (Teleport is fastest, flight is second)

Agree... I like that there are many more options for travel.  They got that mostly right, though activation/deactivation still looks and feels awkward and klunky.  In comparison, CoH's takeoff and landing animations make everything look natural and smooth.  When I jump, then activate flight, it's totally Superman...

- CoH limits you to classes. CO does not.

CoX plans to open up powersets in the near future.  Going Rogue is the setup for that.

- PvP doesn't break the PvE system.

With CO, PVE is already broken.  It can be ridiculously easy or difficult, for mobs that are the same level.

- One account, one virtual server, no need for transfers when one server is low on people.

"Where are you?"

"I'm at the ghost town"

"I'm here.  I don't see you."

"Switch to instance 42"

"Oh, there you are"

How immersive.  It has its advantages, but it just don't feel right.

 

CO vs WoW:

- CO: No grind. Wow: Tons of grind

Still not getting how you can make this claim.  Perhaps having other systems of advancement that don't involve attacking stuff = grind to you.  I'm not saying WoW doesn't have grind, I just can't see how you can say it does and that CO doesn't.

- More options for creation. I could even re-create the succubus pet from WoW.

No argument, here.  

- While there are some need to team for some missions (such as Dr. Destroyer's lab), the rest doesn't need it.

It would be hard to make the argument(with a straight face) that WoW lacks solo content.  And even as a guy that argues mostly on the pro-solo side, I can't for the life of me see how having content specifically for groups is a bad thing. 

- Oh, I love WALKING to the next zone in WoW, don't you?

As long as there are quick travel options(like most modern games have), I'm fine with it.  I like exploring, but sure, once I've explored, I don't care to have to hoof along the same road back and forth; qto's fix that problem just fine.  I do like CO's travel powers, but being able to fly from one end of the map to the other in a couple minutes makes the world seem a bit tiny.  In terms of immersive impact, it's like a fast forward button.  You miss alot of interesting details.  That is, you WOULD if you weren't playing CO, where interesting details don't really exist.

- Again, one account, one server.

Again, sharded world with dozens of different realities, making your journey seem even less significan't than it actually is, which is saying something.  It's a pragmatic but cynical approach; "people are gonna leave our game in droves, so let's make sure it always seems like there are lots of people on by sharding the crap out of everything."

On only one occasion in 10 years have I ever given a game a second chance. If it sucks at launch, I am done forever. That way I don't reward game companies who make games that suck at launch.

Originally posted by Robsolf

Originally posted by Shilar

Well, seeing this CO hate thread, I had to jump in. Let's compare it to the MMO in its field, and other popular MMOs.

 

CO vs CoH:

- Grind in CO is virtually non-existant

What does CoH have to grind that CO doesn't?  CoH has more than enough missions at all levels.  Potentially infinite missions...

When I played, when I got to level 15-16 in CoH, I had very few missions I could play at my level  The rest was "smash baddies, rinse, repeat." When i5 came out, the game was literally broken for most players, save controllers, which now had better blasts than Blasters.

- CO's powers are more robust and action-oriented

Also, grindingly simplistic.  tap buildup power til' you have enough energy for big power, use it.  Block occasionally.

In CO, the "tap" power is whatever you want it to be, and it's a toggle. CoH, it's a punch, and you have to tap each punch.

- Teaming not needed some of the time. (I'd love to see someone solo Dr. Destroyer). CoH pretty much requires it.

I hardly ever have to group in CoH, especially now that you can control how powerful the Boss is.  I just group for fun and the XP bonus.

Again, i5, I was playing Blasters, and I couldn't even survive 3 henchmen. CO I plow them over. Which makes for a more superheroic MMO, a hero that dies on same-level henchmen, or stuggles a bit with a boss?

BTW, CO is planning the difficulty slider, so one will be able to raise up the number of baddies.

- Travel in CO is faster and more geared to what you pick (Teleport is fastest, flight is second)

Agree... I like that there are many more options for travel.  They got that mostly right, though activation/deactivation still looks and feels awkward and klunky.  In comparison, CoH's takeoff and landing animations make everything look natural and smooth.  When I jump, then activate flight, it's totally Superman...

Problem is Superman would be faster super jumping in CoH, where in CO it's flight. I like running start/flight buildup. Course, I'm playing winged heroes....

- CoH limits you to classes. CO does not.

CoX plans to open up powersets in the near future.  Going Rogue is the setup for that.

So I could be a tank with a blast power? cool, now if only their CC would become more robust, like CO. I love having torn wings.

- PvP doesn't break the PvE system.

With CO, PVE is already broken.  It can be ridiculously easy or difficult, for mobs that are the same level.

CO, the henchmen are easy, villains are tough, bosses a lot tougher, and big bosses too tough to solo. CoH, I'd still be struggling with 3 henchmen.

- One account, one virtual server, no need for transfers when one server is low on people.

"Where are you?"

"I'm at the ghost town"

"I'm here.  I don't see you."

"Switch to instance 42"

"Oh, there you are"

How immersive.  It has its advantages, but it just don't feel right.

On the other token, with CoH...

"Where are you?" *said in a forum*

"Oh, I'm in Steel Canyon, by the PvP entrance."

"I'm here, I can't see you."

"I'm on the Champion server"

"Drat, I don't have a character there!"

"Too bad."

 

CO vs WoW:

- CO: No grind. Wow: Tons of grind

Still not getting how you can make this claim.  Perhaps having other systems of advancement that don't involve attacking stuff = grind to you.  I'm not saying WoW doesn't have grind, I just can't see how you can say it does and that CO doesn't.

It's called playing the game. When I tried Horde, I ran out of quests around 15-16 in orc country, and 23-24 on the Undead areas. To get to the next set of quests, I'd have to WALK about 20-30 minutes to the nearest travel station, and get near the next area, and WALK to it (another 20-30 minutes). On the Alliance side I ran out around 30-31, and had no idea where to go, no clue. In CO I'm at lvl 29, and have a full plate.

- More options for creation. I could even re-create the succubus pet from WoW.

No argument, here.  

- While there are some need to team for some missions (such as Dr. Destroyer's lab), the rest doesn't need it.

It would be hard to make the argument(with a straight face) that WoW lacks solo content.  And even as a guy that argues mostly on the pro-solo side, I can't for the life of me see how having content specifically for groups is a bad thing. 

One main issue I have is the instances, and when I was there waiting an hour or two trying to build a team or join one. Instances in CO usually has someone asking every 10 minutes.

- Oh, I love WALKING to the next zone in WoW, don't you?

As long as there are quick travel options(like most modern games have), I'm fine with it.  I like exploring, but sure, once I've explored, I don't care to have to hoof along the same road back and forth; qto's fix that problem just fine.  I do like CO's travel powers, but being able to fly from one end of the map to the other in a couple minutes makes the world seem a bit tiny.  In terms of immersive impact, it's like a fast forward button.  You miss alot of interesting details.  That is, you WOULD if you weren't playing CO, where interesting details don't really exist.

I typically prefer to explore quickly. I want to feel good and powerful, without being a munchkin. As far as missing details, I've little problems with that on my rig.

- Again, one account, one server.

Again, sharded world with dozens of different realities, making your journey seem even less significan't than it actually is, which is saying something.  It's a pragmatic but cynical approach; "people are gonna leave our game in droves, so let's make sure it always seems like there are lots of people on by sharding the crap out of everything."

Nooo, one complaint I hear is they can't hook up with their friends on another server without either making a new character and fight back up to their level, paying a fee to change servers. With sharding, there are no worries on changing servers, it's a simple "change instance" button. Zone Chat also insures that there are people looking to team for the harder instances.