I have read the whole thread.

Who is the offending mod, dev, or gm?

I welcome people who play planeshift to send me, Xillix, a private message regarding any abuse they feel has been perpetuated against them on our forums and assure all parties that it will be dealt with quickly.

Originally posted by QueenofFools

I have read the whole thread.

Who is the offending mod, dev, or gm?

I welcome people who play planeshift to send me, Xillix, a private message regarding any abuse they feel has been perpetuated against them on our forums and assure all parties that it will be dealt with quickly. 

The conversation has taken place across multiple threads so I'm sorry but you have a lot more reading ahead of you if you want to be caught up with everyone else who has posted here.

Wait, I think I may have confused myself.  Are you interested in knowing about every official who has ever been a "power hungry tyrant", or are you just after the name of the one who TriMoon encountered?

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Originally posted by pstruth
Wait, I think I may have confused myself...are you just after the name of the one who TriMoon encountered?

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Originally posted by Tuxide

 

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Originally posted by pstruth
Wait, I think I may have confused myself...are you just after the name of the one who TriMoon encountered?

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Bingo. I don't think he's talking to you, I think he's talking to the one who started this thread.

 

There's been much posted in this thread so you'll excuse me if I'm uncertain of what Q was responding to.

I would vastly prefer that I was informed of every instance of alleged abuse than random indefensible blanket statements from anonymous posters.

I have read every word of every thread on this forum, in some cases many times.

For me, it's such a general problem that's been around for so long that I no longer find any point in calling out specific individuals.  I'm happy playing the game and keeping my head low and that's the advice I give to others.  I think it's noble for people to go through the official channels if they have a grievance with the GMs, and I use to do it myself, but it's so rare for anything to come from it that I no longer see the point.  It only results in bringing yourself unwanted attention.  I've accepted the state of the GM team as the way things are and now it's simply a matter of doing what's practical.  Just like I'm not going to waste my time and energy trying to turn around the IRC channel, I'm too selfish to try to improve the attitudes of the GMs and devs.

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Originally posted by pstruth
For me, it's such a general problem that's been around for so long that I no longer find any point in calling out specific individuals.

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Originally posted by Tuxide

 

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Originally posted by pstruth
For me, it's such a general problem that's been around for so long that I no longer find any point in calling out specific individuals.

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For Pete's sake, I haven't ever seen you do this here, and it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me why one would just sit here and take this nonsense then. I'm not saying that no problem currently exists on the official board, what I'm saying is that nobody's going to believe what another person says on this board without being backed up by specific examples. You mentioned one moderator's name and that is it, with nothing to back your claim up, nothing that can be worked off of.

 

The issue I am having now is that I would like to address the supposed problem. No one will be disciplined, I will just speak with the involved parties and see if we can make some changes to how they comport themselves.

If policy changes are needed to address gm dev moderator interaction I can also discuss those. The idea that any problem cannot be rectified is alien to me.

I am not asking you to do any of this all alone. If other people are having issues send them to me and I will investigate the situation that player perceives as abusive and seek a redress of any wrongs.

QueenofFools, Talad has made the claim that the devs have no contact with the players and that those players who complain about things are merely a few petty individuals who are trying to sabotage the game for spite. If you are sincere, I am glad. However I hope you can understand why someone might be skeptical of change given the usual reaction criticisms are met with by not only Talad and the devs/GMs but by "regulars" such as Tuxide and UtMoon.

I think you're sincere, but I'm not sure how you'll be able to do it. Changing the culture of a team is very difficult, especially when you're a relative newcomer. Also working against you is the fact that you're only a member of the settings team, so a lot of people will be saying you don't know what you're talking about or that you're overstepping your bounds just based on your title.

If I were in your shoes, I'd probably be going to other devs both past and present and asking for their ideas and opinions. Getting a hold of ex devs is doable and important, and I also think it's good to let such individuals know that they are still relevant to the project. It would also give you some insight into the history of Planeshift and the state of things in years past. A part of knowing where you are is knowing where you've been. I've also noticed a trend of problems being downplayed during the period they're relevant, only to then be admitted to once they have passed.

Apart from that, I'd just keep my eyes and ears open. If you've read all my posts then you already know where I stand. A blind eye has been turned to a lot of things and it's impossible to go back in time and recount everything.

Oh dear, you have some misconceptions in this last post . . .

Relative newcomer? No no, I would hope you have seen I have had a systemic affect on many aspects of the game.

ONLY a member of the settings team is another big misconception. Settings has direct influence in:

The features developed

Gm team operation

Defining needs from the Art team

This is in addition to the written content of the game, fixing bugs oriented around this, settings driven gm events, and many other facets of production.

In any case I have been up to my neck in PS solidly and full time for free for well over a year now. I know the project and its direction and history quite well.

The culture of the game has already undergone many significant changes. I am present to alter such things more often than any dev or player so my short time involved is more than adequately compensated for.

You seem to have a lot of opinions and have probably played a while. You should consider joining the team so that you can have a direct impact on fixing the problems you identify.

In terms of ex- devs I would like to cite the example of karyuu who bent over backwards to make sure that players had their say. She was so eventually plowed over with comments and vitriolic posts that she resigned from the forums.  Perhaps a mistake of ours is being too close to the players. By doing so there are many tangible benefits but one negative side is that if a dev and a player get into a conflict it looks as if the game devs are being pushy, more generally, it appears as though we bully the community somehow.

Most games do not have devs that interact at all with their communities, this is left to mods etc.

Talad was not being false when stating devs do not have time to interact with players. Most of them do not at all. A few of us have made it a priority to interact with the players and find out what they are thinking. Talad does not oversee the personal interactions of every member of the dev community because he is frankly too busy developing content and managing assets. (which most would prefer him doing)

Incidentally I also run the PR dept so this is all in my sphere of influence.

Let's not keep bumping this thread with an ugly topic shall we? Make a new one if you want to carry this conversation on. The original poster is much more angry than you seem. If we are to move ahead I don't think it helps anyone PS or MMORPG.Com or even the conversation itself to have this thread stay atop the conversation about PlaneShift.

I already made my thread. And you're right, I'm more resigned than angry. This isn't about saving my feelings though.

I think the problem with karyuu was that she wanted to be understanding and she wanted to treat people like human beings, but she didn't know how to do it while distancing herself from the situations she was handling. Because she put so much of herself into what she was doing, she couldn't help but take it very personally when people lashed out. To do what she was doing successfully, you have to know not to take anything that happens personally. You are there to be an ambassador of the game, and that might mean being a good actor and giving a polite response to something you are personally offended by.

As well intentioned as karyuu was, it's not something that everyone can do. That's not to say it isn't worth doing though. If I were to give an example of the right way to react in such situations, I'd probably refer to the posts you've made in this thread. You've stayed on message, you haven't gotten personal over anything nor have you thrown around insults and baiting accusations (like some have), and you're projecting the ideal persona for the given situation. What I think most people don't understand, including other members of the dev team, is that this is something you have to work at over time and it involves thinking of the role as the role and not as a simple extension of yourself. That's the trap karyuu may have fallen into.

Thank you for your kind remarks howtoland, I will be doing some soul searching Immediately.

Since you seem to understand sarcasm well enough (witty rejoinder there at the end), maybe I can help you with modesty, arrogance, and confidence.

modesty:

Arrogance:

offensive display of superiority or self-importance; overbearing pride.

Confidence:

Now, since all that I said was true, there was no boastfulness. Since I posed my post as hoping pstruth had noticed the changes, there is no vanity.  So I am not in danger of immodesty. That pretty much leaves me comfortably in the realm of confidence.

This post here in its presumption that you need to be taught a lesson about language is arrogant, where do you think the lesson you intended to teach me places you?

Originally posted by QueenofFools

Thank you for your kind remarks howtoland, I will be doing some soul searching Immediately.

 

Since you seem to understand sarcasm well enough (witty rejoinder there at the end), maybe I can help you with modesty, arrogance, and confidence.

modesty:

1.	the quality of being modest; freedom from vanity, boastfulness, etc.

2.	regard for decency of behavior, speech, dress, etc.

3.	simplicity; moderation.

Arrogance:

offensive display of superiority or self-importance; overbearing pride.

Confidence:

1.	full trust; belief in the powers, trustworthiness, or reliability of a person or thing: We have every confidence in their ability to succeed.

2.	belief in oneself and one's powers or abilities; self-confidence; self-reliance; assurance: His lack of confidence defeated him.

3.	certitude; assurance: He described the situation with such confidence that the audience believed him completely.

Now, since all that I said was true, there was no boastfulness. Since I posed my post as hoping pstruth had noticed the changes, there is no vanity.  So I am not in danger of immodesty. That pretty much leaves me comfortably in the realm of confidence.

This post here in its presumption that you need to be taught a lesson about language is arrogant, where do you think the lesson you intended to teach me places you?

 

There's a line between arrogance and confidence that you don't seem be aware of. Almost anybody who doesn't know you or your game who stumbles in to this post and reads your belittling posts can see this.

Thank you for proving both my point and that of the original poster's by replying in such a manner. You've saved me from having to reply to anything else you post.

Odd, I had assumed the original poster's point was "Don't play this game cause a mod was mean to me." not "Don't play this game because the Devs are proud of the work they have done."

I don't understand your perspective at all. The first post was full of half-truths. I guaranty it. The following supporters of that post were seriously over exaggerated. I also guaranty that.

acraig (Dev) mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/1672497 - I fail to see how that is arrogant or aristocratic.

Mordraugion (Mod and GM) mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/1748687 - Again, this does not support your claim.

(the following is not an attack on pstruth. It is a simple statement of perspective.)

Xillix's posts have been well intended with offers of help to those who have felt wronged. I would consider pstruth's to be the condescending ones, both assuming that  Xillix did not read every word in this forum on the subject before posting, does not have understanding the situation, and has no true power to change anything. He goes on to insinuate that he has all the answers, yet it is not worth his time to try to fix any of the 'problems'. I have to question your own perspective when saying Xillix is condescending, self important, and that he is the one who "deserve to be developing is a sense of modesty."

You have no idea what he has done for the project, and come in here with zero knowledge of the situation. Yet you self importantly assume he is being overly prideful. If you truly saw behind the scenes, you would fully understand that he is actually being quite modest. He has nothing to apologize for. You, on the other had, have been rude and assuming from your very first post.

I love where I live, and built the house I live in now with my own hands. It is more unique than most houses you will ever see. I dictate what goes where in that house, and what rooms you can go in with or without shoes. If someone asks why I needed to build a 40 foot tall tower or a room with a ten foot theater screen, I will tell them because I can, and because I wanted to. I am proud of what I have done and offer no apologies for stating that. If that is arrogance that you think needs an apology, then I ask that you and your buddies stay off my property. Anyone else who wants to come and have a good time... you are more than welcome to visit. (figuratively)

Enough with the blasted personal attacks, that's not what this forum is here for.

Originally posted by UtMoon

Odd, I had assumed the original poster's point was "Don't play this game cause a mod was mean to me." not "Don't play this game because the Devs are proud of the work they have done."

I don't understand your perspective at all. The first post was full of half-truths. I guaranty it. The following supporters of that post were seriously over exaggerated. I also guaranty that.

acraig (Dev) mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/1672497 - I fail to see how that is arrogant or aristocratic.

Mordraugion (Mod and GM) mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/1748687 - Again, this does not support your claim.

(the following is not an attack on pstruth. It is a simple statement of perspective.)

Xillix's posts have been well intended with offers of help to those who have felt wronged. I would consider pstruth's to be the condescending ones, both assuming that  Xillix did not read every word in this forum on the subject before posting, does not have understanding the situation, and has no true power to change anything. He goes on to insinuate that he has all the answers, yet it is not worth his time to try to fix any of the 'problems'. I have to question your own perspective when saying Xillix is condescending, self important, and that he is the one who "deserve to be developing is a sense of modesty."

You have no idea what he has done for the project, and come in here with zero knowledge of the situation. Yet you self importantly assume he is being overly prideful. If you truly saw behind the scenes, you would fully understand that he is actually being quite modest. He has nothing to apologize for. You, on the other had, have been rude and assuming from your very first post.

I love where I live, and built the house I live in now with my own hands. It is more unique than most houses you will ever see. I dictate what goes where in that house, and what rooms you can go in with or without shoes. If someone asks why I needed to build a 40 foot tall tower or a room with a ten foot theater screen, I will tell them because I can, and because I wanted to. I am proud of what I have done and offer no apologies for stating that. If that is arrogance that you think needs an apology, then I ask that you and your buddies stay off my property. Anyone else who wants to come and have a good time... you are more than welcome to visit. (figuratively)

I'm not coming back to this thread again. I've made my point more than two times, and it hasn't changed.

Originally posted by QueenofFools

Thank you for your kind remarks howtoland, I will be doing some soul searching Immediately.

 

Since you seem to understand sarcasm well enough (witty rejoinder there at the end), maybe I can help you with modesty, arrogance, and confidence.

modesty:

1.	the quality of being modest; freedom from vanity, boastfulness, etc.

2.	regard for decency of behavior, speech, dress, etc.

3.	simplicity; moderation.

Arrogance:

offensive display of superiority or self-importance; overbearing pride.

Confidence:

1.	full trust; belief in the powers, trustworthiness, or reliability of a person or thing: We have every confidence in their ability to succeed.

2.	belief in oneself and one's powers or abilities; self-confidence; self-reliance; assurance: His lack of confidence defeated him.

3.	certitude; assurance: He described the situation with such confidence that the audience believed him completely.

Now, since all that I said was true, there was no boastfulness. Since I posed my post as hoping pstruth had noticed the changes, there is no vanity.  So I am not in danger of immodesty. That pretty much leaves me comfortably in the realm of confidence.

This post here in its presumption that you need to be taught a lesson about language is arrogant, where do you think the lesson you intended to teach me places you?

Originally posted by Anumesa
Howtoland or whatever your name is (i really dont feel like looking back to check) I dont see how Xillix's comments could honestly cause you to "not want to try" PS. Thats ridiculous, if you were even paying attention and bothered to read the thread then you would realize that he was only responding to attacks on the game that he puts in a LOT of time and effort to. If you read the entire thread you may also have realized that he was trying to address the (so-called) problems with the GM and dev team that pstruth and other whiners seem to have. When he asked for the individuals to be listed that they had a problem with, all of a sudden they changed their tune. So please forgive him his bit of sarcasm :)

I said that the attitude devs show players drives people away from the project. We have someone who has been driven away from the game because of the attitude he felt from a dev. And now you're still insulting and dismissing me, calling me a "whiner"? Do you see the problem here?

Originally posted by UtMoon

He goes on to insinuate that he has all the answers, yet it is not worth his time to try to fix any of the 'problems'.

Actually, what I implied is that I don't think the problem can be fixed. It would at least be a very large undertaking, and yes, it gets to the point where it's just not worth it for me.