Its amazing that NCSoft is able to offer a game like City Of Heroes to be F2P but has as yet been able to decide if Aion is going to be free.  It may never be free right.  WOW is not free so Aion is not free.  Similar engines.

I think both games need some redoing as in price.

Sure, Aion lost a million subs in the past two years...drops them down to three million.  It's still NCSoft's second highest game (Lineage only took #1 because of additional sales that generated additional revenue).

Aion and CoX are nowhere near each other as far as subs or revenue.

Originally posted by VirusDancer

Sure, Aion lost a million subs in the past two years...drops them down to three million.  It's still NCSoft's second highest game (Lineage only took #1 because of additional sales that generated additional revenue).

Aion and CoX are nowhere near each other as far as subs or revenue.

Theres no news nor information that "Aion lost a million subs in the past two years" and theres no information about "3+1 million subs two years ago" either.

Please refrain from spreading such rumors.

As for F2P.. Its not as if NCSoft "couldnt" change Aion to F2P "yet", its simply they dont want to, as they dont see any need nor advantage of it apparently.

Originally posted by Kalay

Its amazing that NCSoft is able to offer a game like City Of Heroes to be F2P but has as yet been able to decide if Aion is going to be free.  It may never be free right.  WOW is not free so Aion is not free.  Similar engines.

I think both games need some redoing as in price.

WoW and Aion do not have similar engines at all.  Like, not even close to the same engine. 

Originally posted by Sukiyaki

Originally posted by VirusDancer

Sure, Aion lost a million subs in the past two years...drops them down to three million.  It's still NCSoft's second highest game (Lineage only took #1 because of additional sales that generated additional revenue).

Aion and CoX are nowhere near each other as far as subs or revenue.

Theres no news nor information that "Aion lost a million subs in the past two years" and theres no information about "3+1 million subs two years ago" either.

Please refrain from spreading such rumors.

 

As for F2P.. Its not as if NCSoft "couldnt" change Aion to F2P "yet", its simply they dont want to, as they dont see any need nor advantage of it apparently.

Um... http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-1.png

How is that spreading a rumor?

Originally posted by Kalay

Its amazing that NCSoft is able to offer a game like City Of Heroes to be F2P but has as yet been able to decide if Aion is going to be free.  It may never be free right.  WOW is not free so Aion is not free.  Similar engines.

I think both games need some redoing as in price.

So, just to get this straight...  You feel if you were president of NCSoft that a reduction in fee's to Aion is a smart idea?  You feel that having the number two/three MMO in the world and making over 50 million per month is a bad thing and that they should lower their fee in search of a hypothetical new user base?

You do realize that SWG went searching for this hypothetical new user base when they launched the NGE right?  Did it work out for them?

Originally posted by VirusDancer

Originally posted by Sukiyaki

Originally posted by VirusDancer

Sure, Aion lost a million subs in the past two years...drops them down to three million.  It's still NCSoft's second highest game (Lineage only took #1 because of additional sales that generated additional revenue).

Aion and CoX are nowhere near each other as far as subs or revenue.

Theres no news nor information that "Aion lost a million subs in the past two years" and theres no information about "3+1 million subs two years ago" either.

Please refrain from spreading such rumors.

 

As for F2P.. Its not as if NCSoft "couldnt" change Aion to F2P "yet", its simply they dont want to, as they dont see any need nor advantage of it apparently.

Um... http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-1.png

How is that spreading a rumor?

Wild guessing doesnt become a fact nor gains any more validation by expressing it in form of a dot on a scientifically appearing chart, neither does it by posting it on a website you own. There is NO news about or indicating these explicit peaks, nor those losses you named and mmodata is already know to use "guesses" and "estimates" aka nothing more than any poster here could provide you with.

Otherwise please update your knowledge to the latest known factual facts featured below. its a chart. It cant be wrong.

Originally posted by Sukiyaki

Wild guessing doesnt become a fact nor gains any more validation by expressing it in form of a dot on a scientifically appearing chart, neither does it by posting it on a website you own. There is NO news about or indicating these explicit peaks, nor those losses you named.

Otherwise please update your knowledge to the latest known factual facts featured below. its a chart. It cant be wrong.

So the only evidence you will take is a note from NCSoft admitting they lost a crap load of subs?  I'm not saying that MMOdata is totally accurate but on the other hand, I do know western MMO players dont tend to like eastern grind games and I'm sure Rift grabbed some subs from Aion as well.  Without a note from NCSofts mom, I'm still faily confident that they have indeed lost some subs.  How many subs I dont know but to say they have not lost any due to no word from NCSoft is a bit naive.

Originally posted by Sukiyaki

Originally posted by VirusDancer

Originally posted by Sukiyaki

Originally posted by VirusDancer

Sure, Aion lost a million subs in the past two years...drops them down to three million.  It's still NCSoft's second highest game (Lineage only took #1 because of additional sales that generated additional revenue).

Aion and CoX are nowhere near each other as far as subs or revenue.

Theres no news nor information that "Aion lost a million subs in the past two years" and theres no information about "3+1 million subs two years ago" either.

Please refrain from spreading such rumors.

 

As for F2P.. Its not as if NCSoft "couldnt" change Aion to F2P "yet", its simply they dont want to, as they dont see any need nor advantage of it apparently.

Um... http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-1.png

How is that spreading a rumor?

Wild guessing doesnt become a fact nor gains any more validation by expressing it in form of a dot on a scientifically appearing chart, neither does it by posting it on a website you own. There is NO news about or indicating these explicit peaks, nor those losses you named and mmodata is already know to use "guesses" and "estimates" aka nothing more than any poster here could provide you with.

Otherwise please update your knowledge to the latest known factual facts featured below. its a chart. It cant be wrong.

MMOData is not my site, lol...

...no news to represent that increase?  Um, lol...you're kidding right?

So the release of the game in North America, Japan, Australia, Europe, and Russia would not trigger a spike in the game's subscribers...?

Um, lol...you're kidding right?

The release of WoW's Cataclysm would not have triggered a decline?  The sheer number of games released between the end of 2010 and now would not have?

WoW lost just as many subs in half the time...

...NCSoft is laying off near 2% of their workforce in a consolidation effort.

Keep kidding yourself...if it helps.

Sounds about right, and that was probably 800,000 North American subs that dropped.

So basically neither of both of you actually can give any evidence for these explicit numbers (because there is none) you reposted,  nor want to admit that these numbers have no basis thus you are actually spreading rumors and just act like theres "clear information" and resort to attack me instead for being "naive"?

Please refrain from posting "numbers" that are simply made up by a person with no more clue than any of you and me, except that person owns a website.

Pulling strawmen, to avoid admitting your and the "sources" total lack of any clear nor fractional information validating these numbers or which these numbers could have been extrapolated from, like talking about your impression of Aions state, about other games releases, about recent news about some layoffs does not make these numbers pulled by someone random on the web out of his *** in any way true nor accurate.

I didnt say the website is owned by you, you misunderstood. I am saying since you are gullible enough to believe a guy because he is posting his made up numbers in form of a chart you may aswell take my random numbers:

So please proceed to follow my advice and update your information with the up to date "fact chart" I posted before.

@Sukiyaki, while normally it is not done in this manner - you've taken such an antagonistic approach in response, I'm going to go ahead and ask...

...do you have proof that Aion did not lose that many subs over the two year period?

You state that the information from that site is bogus - yet - you offer no actual proof to the contrary to refute those numbers.

Do you have sub numbers from NCSoft stating otherwise?

Because, generally speaking - my original post was that even though Aion had lost a number of subs over that two year period - the game was still doing well and it would be silly for NCSoft to go F2P with the game at this point based on doing so with CoX.

CoX's sub numbers have always been miniscule in comparison to Aion - even with the drop.

Aion's generally the leading revenue generator for NCSoft (only being outpaced in Q2 because of a sales push for Lineage).

Reasons to explain both the growth of Aion to the high point on the chart and for the decline after it have been provided... the obvious explanation for the growth and reasonable explanations for the decline.

So...prove the data from MMOData is wrong...

...instead of just saying it is.

Originally posted by VirusDancer

@Sukiyaki, while normally it is not done in this manner - you've taken such an antagonistic approach in response, I'm going to go ahead and ask...

...do you have proof that Aion did not lose that many subs over the two year period?

You state that the information from that site is bogus - yet - you offer no actual proof to the contrary to refute those numbers.

Do you have sub numbers from NCSoft stating otherwise?

Because, generally speaking - my original post was that even though Aion had lost a number of subs over that two year period - the game was still doing well and it would be silly for NCSoft to go F2P with the game at this point based on doing so with CoX.

CoX's sub numbers have always been miniscule in comparison to Aion - even with the drop.

Aion's generally the leading revenue generator for NCSoft (only being outpaced in Q2 because of a sales push for Lineage).

Reasons to explain both the growth of Aion to the high point on the chart and for the decline after it have been provided... the obvious explanation for the growth and reasonable explanations for the decline.

So...prove the data from MMOData is wrong...

...instead of just saying it is.

1) I didnt say the data is wrong I say your claim as well your sources datapoints are baseless. Huge difference.

That alone already makes it unneccesary to provide evidence contradicting them.I made no claim about right or wrong. I made a claim about baseless and verified.

You claimed numbers. I said theres no source on such numbers. You denied and posted a secondary source as verification. I say your secondary source does not have official sources either and there still no evidence about neither your nor that websites numbers. Now you ask me to prove the numbers are wrong? Are you purposefully trying to dodge and push the burden of proof  and work to prove the numbers YOU throw around on ME? Or are you not comprehending how the concept of burden of proof and general concept of proof works?

2) You are actualy realy asking ME to provide information that baseless datapoints are "wrong", when I said they are baseless exactly because there is no actual information about such numbers? Even assuming the burden of proof was on my side instead of yours that would not make any sense. Not just are you assuming there IS contrary evidence (irrelevant to the fact that lack of contrary evidence makes such a claim not true nor remaining valid until disproven, because MMODATata is not the primary source making the statements, NCSoft is, anyone else couldnt know if NCSoft didnt say it), you are also litereally asking me to prove that there really is no evidence by providing the evidence I just said would be missing?

This is not a matter of right and wrong. Its not a matter of dropping and rising subs, Its not a matter about NCSoft or Aion doing god fine or bad. Its certainly not a matter about layoffs or your personal impression. Its a matter about statements about hard information ( only NCSoft or their subsidaries have direct insight into) lacking evidence and the refered to secondary source (MMOData) is lacking to provide any evidence or sources for their statements too. Its a matter of your continued relucatance to refrain from spreading rumors and admit they are just rumors.

You want some facts from me even though your are the person making claims about 4, 3 or 1 million users numbers and losses?

Im not even obligated even from the point of an argument to deliver them and do your work but here is one anyway.

The

a) highest ever officially reported global subscriptionnumber

b) last ever officially reported global subscriptionnumber or any data atleast min. subs could be derived from (i.e PCU peaks)

c) the only ever reported subscriptionnumber above 1 million

was and is 2.7 Million subscriber in November 2010 in the Korean version of the Nov 2011 IR report of NCSoft and that official datapoint is not even brought up in the MMOData chart, yet there are 3 higher numbers before and 1 higher after where there should be an empty chart.

I know ALL of the datapoints. Its easy to know because NCSoft rarely ever reported any numbers at all. 970k shipped boxes, 250k then 400k preorders pre launch, 650k 1st month post launch in the West, meanwhile Korea never reported any number besides the first months post launch PCU numbers all allong ~300k, and a single time they announced a 2.7 million worldwide numbers, Shanda(Aion China) reported plus 1Million 3 days after launch, and thats it. Thats all. Theres only one single global subscriber number ever reported and its not even on that bogus chart and you ask me to provide contrary evidence?

Now how about you post just a single source from NCSoft or any of ther subsidaries to mention anything above 3 Million or even 4 Million? Im not even asking about the drop of millions you claimed.

@Sukiyaki... source for anything you said?  No source?  Just more typing...eh?

You contradicted yourself numerous times in what you stated... at that.

I'm done with this thread.  I have a habit of getting in trouble for feeding trolls.  I'll not continue to do so here.

Good luck... good life.

Originally posted by VirusDancer

@Sukiyaki... source for anything you said?  No source?  Just more typing...eh?

You contradicted yourself numerous times in what you stated... at that.

I'm done with this thread.  I have a habit of getting in trouble for feeding trolls.  I'll not continue to do so here.

Good luck... good life.

I laugh, I provided the source for the single credible datapoint in the whole argument (while you the actual claimant still lack any effort to prove you point and resort to attacking me instead) mark it bold so you cant claim you missed it and you feign ignorance over it...

The rest is pointing out where exactly you fail at common sense and the basic concept of burden of proof. I dont have a source where to cite from "The general consencus accepts the forum user VirusDancer spreads rumors and is in denial his source is only a third party user either, not providing any credible or official sources either." I dont need it.

I rest my case, this is simpy denial and ignorance of personal fault. Good luck on your life too, you'll seriously need it much more with that attitude. Atleast some others may be wiser.