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WAR (Warhammer Online) Forum » General Discussion » How will the 3 Realms be set up?

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32 posts found
  airtrooper

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/19/04
Posts: 78

1/26/06 7:07:54 PM#21

Originally posted by Anofalye

Originally posted by airtrooper

OMG chaos and empire in the same realm ..... who gives a shit if it gives me the chance to play both a human and a chaos char when the practical alternative is not putting one or the other in the game at all.



MANY fans will care.  The guys who own the franchise rights should care as well, because the worth of the franchise is based on what peoples think of the franchise.

 

Some changes are not acceptable...and the Chaos, the Empire, the High Elfs can't mix at all in a RvR as in sharing the same faction.  Slaanesh and Khorne doesn't mix at all either, despite been Chaos.

 

A small twist is acceptable, not putting everything in game is acceptable, making a travesty and putting two factions together while they would never is not acceptable in the Warhammer universe.  Now I am merely 1 fan, 1 individual.  But I am sure that many (maybe a majority, maybe a minority, I dunno) other fans will care that it respect the spirit of the franchise.

 

If you buy a McDonald, you can't start selling Pepsi because you prefer Pepsi over Coke yourself, this is part of what it means to have a franchise.  If nobody is enforcing it now, it doesn't means that is should not respect some rules.  If you have a McDonald and you doesn't sell Big Mac...it is going to annoy a lot of your customers.

 

A Franchise give many nice BONUS for a company, but it also means many obligations, I am not sure Turbines understand that...and even if Turbines doesn't pay a hefty price for betraying the franchise, WotC, Atari and Hasbro are going to pay a hefty price on future game releases, in terms of games not sold.  Turbines prolly doesn't care for the franchise owners.  Mythic prolly care for the franchise owners, I doesn't think Mythic will consider lightly to disappoint an existing fanbase in order to sell more in the short terms.  Maybe I doesn't know Mythic.  But I think they will care.

 

And High Elfs can't mix with the Empire...just...can't...happen!  Put the Wood elfs, fine!  Or leave the Empire to NPCs only.  I dunno.  But if you only have 3 realms, you doesn't have tons of choices, you either leave factions off limits or you betray the franchise.  Chaos alone have 2 Major realms...and that can be divided into countless minors realms (including Malal which for some reasons, I always love despite been...relatively ignored).

 

Heck, you can even have RENEGADE High Elfs working for the Empire...that is somewhat acceptable, but you than need a DESIGN to make sure a player can't start as a High Elf...he has to unlock that race for future characters, that way it remains a minority...RENEGADES.  But the High Elfs as a faction remain outside, NPCs controlled or whatever...

 

The fact you have the "Power" to do what you want doesn't mean it is wise...a franchise should be respected.  And Warhammer is 1 of the strongest franchise in the RPG world and I am merely "part-time" fan in the case of this franchise...I can tell you, many fans will care a LOT.  The initial support you get from a franchise like Warhammer is easily outmatching any support a betraying can grant you, now if you are purely short term thinking and selfish you might still want to do it...but if you grant a though toward the well-beeing of the franchise, you will never betray something major in it.

 

Many devs does many bad move on franchises they never develop themselves, we see it happen in the past and it will happen in the future, I hope Mythic will not be on this shitty list but on the list of those who promote and developp the franchise, building forward rather than backtracking on already establish major aspects.


Well for starters I dont think it would be fun to put those two realms together and only stated that to make a point. I just went to extrems in the opposite dir to the extremes you are proposing. Taking everything that has been written in the warhammer books (some of which no doubt already contradicts itself ) as being gospal and not subject to change would make it impossiable to turn it into a computer game that would be any fun.

So mythic is bound to piss people off by not including things in the game or adding things that some will find objectionable but they are not going to please everyone completely. what they are doing is the practicle and sensiable route.

they can always create some backstory to explain what they are doing. Also consider if GW created this world as part of their own rpg or table top game and just realeased the source books. This converstion would not likely even be happing and you would be taking about how cool these new concepts are and what potential things you can do with it in those games.

Lastly. I have NEVER played the table top or any table top game with someone whos first rule was not.... dont let the rules of the game prevent you from having fun and change whatever you think you need to in order to have fun... I would not want to play with such a person because you would spend more time arguing over what some overly vauge rule means than playing the game.

  airtrooper

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/19/04
Posts: 78

1/26/06 7:30:03 PM#22

My mind has been working over time and i even came up with a general story outline that would satisfy me for putting empire and a chaos faction on the same side.

a situation develops where in the name of the greater good it is deemed the lesser of two evils to accept a chaos faction as a temporary ally( in this case temorary would be for the life of the online game which can be turned into a really cool final closing event in breaking up this alliance) which when we no longer need them we can take care of these evil doorers as they so rightly deserve. ( Make this particular empire faction come off as being so foucused on doing good that they actually are evil the dragon lance world did this with the cataclysam for those that read those novels.) The chaos faction of course accepted this alliance becasue they felt  such an alliance would bring them more opportunity to run amok  and they could try to convert them to their beliefs if this does not work we can eventually turn against them when we no longer have any use for them.

the opportuntiy for special events and roll playing from this one quickly thought up ( and plagirized i admit ) idea is great. A sufficently creative person can come up with a ton of other storys that can acclopish the same thing that would also solve some other issues..... such as everyone wanting to play chaos and overpopulating that one realm... makes it so you could have a chaos faction in every realm allied with a neutrel or good faction. It would have the added benifit of solving population balance issues ... somthing that is not an issue for the table top game but could defenitly casue problems for RVR on the computer.

now that I think of it more this would actually be kinda fun to play. And for me it solves the one worry i have about this game in that to many people are wanting to play one faction over all the others which would make the RVR part of the game very very very not fun( speaking from similar experiances in daoc.) given the choice between swallowing the above story or playing an rvr game with a 10-4-1 ratio of people in the three realms i will swallow the above story and have fun playing the game.

  Vervayne

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/31/05
Posts: 18

2/07/06 6:11:31 PM#23

If you read Mythic's January newsletter then you now know what races will be in each realm.
Here is a link to a story condensing what they explained in their backstory of the 'Age of Reckoning':

http://warhammeroffline.com/article.php?story=20060130194052282

  Anofalye

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/19/03
Posts: 7442

The enemy is so dumb! They believe that WE are the enemy! - A famous orc commander.

2/07/06 8:11:02 PM#24

The FIRST rule is that the DM is always right.

 

However, when a DM change everything too much, players don't play with him.

 

See airtrooper, you are stretching it too far.  The rules can be changed or twisted LIGHTLY.  But in the case of a MMO, you have to consider that the average player never use anything but the books.  No clarification but the books.  So it is a duty to remains kinda loyal.  Warhammer is more than an average new game, it is a working franchise, 1 of the oldest.  You HAVE to stick to many rules.  Maybe not all, but everytime you twist any rule, you have to ask yourself, is it worth it?

 

Eldarr and Empire doesn't work in 1 faction.  This is not a tiny rule, this is something CENTRAL.  It would be like making a D&D game where the Abyss and the 9-Hells are together, it just doesn't work at all.

 

If WAR put the Empire and the High Elfs together, I can tell you I won't stick to a DM who can't even respect the basic guidelines of the scenario.

 

The DM is always right...up to the points the players leave.  The older the franchise, the more games with various DM players got, the harder is the task and the more the DM has to stick to the books.  We all play with various DM, we all experience variations...but we all can accept the rules in the books.  Twists may cost you many players, each of them.

 

If you are not sticking closely enough to the rules, instead of been a BONUS to have the Warhammer name, it will become a FLAW.  Peoples expect it to be similar to the books.  Maybe not identical, but close enough.

 

DDO is a prime example of what "TO NOT DO" with a franchise.

 

Airtrooper, your reasoning is the reasoning of a NEW product...the older the product, the stronger the franchise, the more you have to stick with as much as possible from the books.

- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - René Levesque about the denial NO on the poll to his dream, project and goal. (Free translation)

  Anofalye

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/19/03
Posts: 7442

The enemy is so dumb! They believe that WE are the enemy! - A famous orc commander.

2/07/06 8:15:59 PM#25

Originally posted by Vervayne

If you read Mythic's January newsletter then you now know what races will be in each realm.
Here is a link to a story condensing what they explained in their backstory of the 'Age of Reckoning':

http://warhammeroffline.com/article.php?story=20060130194052282


I can tell you I am extremely unlikely to be playing.  Because it contradict itself with already learned backgrounds.  I doesn't even see the rules and the system yet.  It would not be named Warharmmer I would be neutral and may or not play it.  But it is named Warhammer and it cannot even respect basics aspects of the scenario...they doesn't deserve my trust is how I feel and they lose some faction with me when I consider the game.

Devs have to learn to respect franchises or to start from scratch if you can't.

- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - René Levesque about the denial NO on the poll to his dream, project and goal. (Free translation)

  Volkmar

Novice Member

Joined: 3/04/04
Posts: 2508

2/08/06 1:48:32 AM#26

jeez Ano, i asked it before and i ask it again:

What it is so hard to understand about High elves and Empire allying out of circumstances?

They DID IT IN THE PAST in the official books you refer to and i don't see why they shouldn't do it again. (Remember who made the Imperial magical colleges a reality?)

The background story created by Mythic developers seems sound enough and i can see why the Phoenix king would send help to one of their ALLY (maybe you forgot that Empire and High Elves ARE ally and not enemies? they have constant trade commerce and friendly relations... what the heck is the big deal?) instead of risking having all the Old World engulfed by chaos.

Cause he knows perfectly well that the Empire is the strongest Old World kingdom, if the Chaos absorbs it, i really doubt that bretonnia and the wood elves could be able, alone, to stop it.

The Phoenix King also knows perfectly well that the Chaos won't stop there, but will eventually cross over and lie siege to Ulthuan itself. with the kingdoms of men and dwarves destroyed, to who the High Elves would ask for help? nobody!

From http://us.games-workshop.com/games/warhammer/highelves/gaming/albion/default.htm 

"Above all other armies, the High Elves were instrumental in defeating the Dark Master and setting back his evil plans. Leading powerful allies such as the Empire and the Dwarfs, the High Elves were able to repel the hordes and push the Dark Master off of the island of Albion."

Good enough for you?

WAR, has the name might suggest, is played out during a massive war where racial consideration and distrusts are normally put aside. Maybe you can tell us why not?

Have a nice day

"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"

- My New World of Darkness Tabletop RPG Blog:
http://realmofroleplay.com/?cat=19

  airtrooper

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/19/04
Posts: 78

2/08/06 1:53:19 PM#27

Originally posted by Anofalye

Originally posted by Vervayne

If you read Mythic's January newsletter then you now know what races will be in each realm.
Here is a link to a story condensing what they explained in their backstory of the 'Age of Reckoning':

http://warhammeroffline.com/article.php?story=20060130194052282


I can tell you I am extremely unlikely to be playing.  Because it contradict itself with already learned backgrounds.  I doesn't even see the rules and the system yet.  It would not be named Warharmmer I would be neutral and may or not play it.  But it is named Warhammer and it cannot even respect basics aspects of the scenario...they doesn't deserve my trust is how I feel and they lose some faction with me when I consider the game.

Devs have to learn to respect franchises or to start from scratch if you can't.


I have meet people that think like that but not many out of the group of people i play warhammer with. Having a 2vs 2 game we would put any sides together and not care what the books say about it. Its about playing the game not adhering to the rules at all costs. For People who think like this it would not be possiable to make a warhammer game into a computer game and satisfy Them. Developers know that there are a certain percentage of people that cant be satisfied and most likely are not that concerned about it.

If you are going to be this ridgid in what you want in the game you could have saved yourself the trouble of looking into the game and releaized from the start that there was NO way you would be happy with ANYTHING they could have done.

Just treat these situations like going to a movie of a book you read and really liked. Go to the movie to see the movie interpertation of the book you like but if you only wont to see the book as you read it on screen ... save yourself the trouble of seeing a movie that cant possiably please you. 

  noblot

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/01/05
Posts: 287

Today is a good day to Pwn someone

2/08/06 3:00:18 PM#28

I have been a Warhammer player for nearly 20 years; and I have been a DAoC player for around two years.

I had hoped that Mythic were going to make it a massive Realms v Realms fight with all races against all races. However I guess the practicality of this would defeat decent RvR. As well as supportable player number per server (2500 on Mythic current servers) divided by realm would limit PvP encounters and rather reduce the realm action.

Given the line up, actually I rather like the mix. Chaos is always a popular choice - very evil; orcs and dark elves - as an Orc player I can live with that. Then a mix of the good guys, which I suspect is going to be the primary realm (much like Albion is in DAoC).

First expansion for the three realms have got to be Skaven, Undead, and Wood Elves (IMHO).

Personally, I have always found the three way DAoC RvR fight tactically interesting since it is very difficult for one realm to have superiority. When one realm takes over alot of territory, it then has to defend on two fronts from the opposing realms.

  Anofalye

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/19/03
Posts: 7442

The enemy is so dumb! They believe that WE are the enemy! - A famous orc commander.

2/14/06 8:10:19 PM#29

*shrug*

 

Verant and Smedley also think in a similar way.

 

Look at any FRANCHISE which was successfull as a FOLLOW UP!  They stick to the rules books.

 

If the Empire and the High Elfs are locked into a static RvR alliance unable to fight each other, that's deter from the setting.  I am not even a PvPer.

 

Now I see fanbois who are happy to defend and cheerish their devs.  See, I doesn't hate or want to hurt anyone, I am speaking my mind.

 

Why do you think Baldur's Gate II is a benchmark?  Because they freaking respect the franchise AND previous D&D computers products.  Why do you think Neverwinter Night is somewhat successfull and somewhat prospering?  They somewhat respect the franchise.  Why do you think DDO is going to belly splash and never be a benchmark?  Because they can't respect the franchise.

 

DDO is a wonderfull game, but considering the poor treatments they do of the franchise, they are going to fail.

 

Why do you think the MOVIES about LotR are a big success?  Because they respect the franchise pretty well!

 

Can the High Elfs and the Empire roots a CHAOS army?  Yes.  Should they be stuck into a rigid RvR alliance that they can't broke, NEVER!

 

Go read back those books and you will see that often, the Empire or the High Elfs betray the other side, often making a carnage or abandoning them to the front.  Mixing units completely (which is what we are talking about now) and be in an inconditionnal alliance?  Never!  The Empire troops are to be used as cannon fodders and you will never see the High Elfs sacrificing themselves for the Empire scums, they may sacrifice themselves in a battle, but it won't be to save the Empire, there is going to be another reason as to why they make that sacrifice.  If the battle is won and they can save 10 Empire units by sacrificing 1 of their, forget it, it won't be happening.  Yet, this setting put them all, in a rigid alliance, in a "melting pot".  Forget the "melting pot" between Empire and High Elfs, forget it, don't even start thinking about it.  It is not going to happen.

 

The High Elfs are not going to accept a melting pot...forget it.  The High Elfs who usually impact the Empire a LOT are usually...LAWFULL or NEUTRAL.  But if you look at the race, they are GOOD.  Which mean, they have been influenced by MINORITIES groups inside the High Elfs.  Anyway, I am not making those decisions and they can even put Sonic inside the game if they want, Pac Man and Captain America.  Why not?  But I won't be playing it.  If you advertise a product to be Warhammer, it has to be more than a superficial skin, it needs the feeling of Warhammer.  A melting pot between High Elfs and Empire...forget it, it has 0 feeling of the world.  High Elfs are racists.  An elf life is worth a lot more than any other creature for them, thereby mixing completely, like we will see in those RvR setting, is simply unacceptable and unlogical.  The Eldarrs are even worser, so the futurists fans are going to be unhappy even more about a mixt.

- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - René Levesque about the denial NO on the poll to his dream, project and goal. (Free translation)

  Volkmar

Novice Member

Joined: 3/04/04
Posts: 2508

2/15/06 1:58:45 AM#30

i think you are taking this the wrong way, Anofayle.

No Developers spoke of union between the empire and high elves. you won't see happy elf farmers in empire lands, this is merely a military alliance to fight a overwhelming chaos. Think of Shrouded islands expansions for DAoC and how the small blue guys (no, not the smurfs, their evil cousins) are treated by the albion's human races: with disdain and untrust. their is a alliance merely of convenience and this will be the same, the tensions between the various races will be represented in game, i am sure of it... but up to a point.

Sadly, dynamically changing relationships between 6 factions is not feasible to do in such a mmorpg, compromises have to be made.

Considering the game will be in a period of all out war, the only stretching of reality is that the War, in the warhammer world, would probably last what? a few months? maybe couple years tops, with great changes in the world for it so that at day 1 the land is in a certain condition but on day 400 the land is in a very different condition. No idea how dynamic the land will be, but i doubt we will see Altdorf razed to the ground for example or other such things, plus, if their plans go to fruition, this is a never-ending war.

I frankly prefers to see a Warhammer Online MMorpg becoming a reality, with a few compromises made for the sake of gameplay, than to never see one because to adhere completely means to not do a mmorpg.

Finally, i wish to point out that High Elves travel to the land of the Empire on a regular basis for trades and diplomatic contacts. Elves are surely an uncommon sight in the Empire but not one that would make most people, especially the ones in the big cities, gape. They might not want union and most high elves are proud and arrogant to be superior, but both empires are considered GOOD, like you points out.

High Elves are patronizing, considering themselves a sort of patriarch race of the world. but they do not shy of their responsabilities and they being a race of good means they have very clear their duties and responsabilities to the world and the other "lesser" races.

"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"

- My New World of Darkness Tabletop RPG Blog:
http://realmofroleplay.com/?cat=19

  Anofalye

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/19/03
Posts: 7442

The enemy is so dumb! They believe that WE are the enemy! - A famous orc commander.

2/15/06 9:16:12 PM#31

But, the High Elfs units would not mix with Empire, they may bear them on the battlefield.  But you won't have a unit of 12 High Elfs, 6 dwarfs and 9 humans beside another similar composed unit.  You would usually get a full unit of High Elf, many Empire Units, a few Dwarfs units.  Not a big goofy mix.

 

The farmers and the NPCs are only a PART of the situation.  If I play an High Elf, I expect to spend my time with High Elfs, not Imperials humans...unless I am a rogue High Elf, a minority.  But if I am the Champion of the High Elf and I am ridding a Griffon, forget it, my unit will be exclusively composed of High Elfs, my squad as well.  I wont be putting Imperials in my unit.

 

Now if it was the Wood Elfs, those egalitarian punks, maybe, but it is the High Elfs.  And the High Elfs often shy away from their responsabilities, this is why they get along so well with Brettonia, there is a comon understanding.

 

I really don't get it, Imperial or High Elfs should be NPCs, put the wood elf with Imperials and Brettonia with the High Elfs.  The Wood Elfs are just as fun as the High Elfs, and I can see a Wardancer showing off in an Imperial Unit with no problem, a Griffon Rider, never!

 

If they can't respect the basics rules and setting of Warhammer, I rather see them use a different name and say it was inspired from Warhammer.  Using a "True Name" bear more responsabilities than Turbines was able to understand!

 

Good factions really mix bad with any non-Good faction.  The Empire is Neutral (or Lawful sometimes, yet Neutrals are easy going and bear Lawful), it is not good, not at all.  The Dwarves are neutrals.  Brettonia is Good  (Good in Warhammer is a mix between Chaotic Good and Neutral Good if you must compare to D&D, while Lawful is Lawfull Neutral with "good laws", neutrals are easy going)  There is no way you will make me accept High Elfs in a RvR strong setting with the Imperial anymore than Khorne with Slaanesh or Tzenth (followers could be present and pretending to be something else).

 

Chaos is a faction on it own (well many, at least 2 but that is another topic).  They also put Evil (orcs and dark elfs).  You can't possibly put 60% of the world alignements in the last faction, it doesn't work!  If they stick to Evil and Chaos, than Neutral with Lawful tendancies should be the last and Good should again be hiding and not taking their responsabilities, leaving the Imperial taking the blunt of the onslaught.

 

PS: They could easily have made their RvR setting, with 3 setting, and put a 4th, PvE only setting, put the High Elfs or Brettonian in charge of that setting, hidden behind the Imperials or something...,have some quests to explain why they can groups with other factions but make it more easy to group Imperials and there you go...anyway, just an idea, but sticking the High Elfs under the Imperial tag...bad...very very bad.  Of course, as a PvE player, such a setting would interest far more and I preach for what I like...but it also make sense.  Nobody can argue that realistically.  High Elfs with Imperials, mixing units?  Never.  Wood elfs, would, but not the High Elfs.  You could even put the Chaos factions you discard in the PvP as a big NPC enemy on the PvE front, killing Slaaneesh troops is a temporary excuse to get a Khorne mindless player in your group for sometimes.  See, for some reason, maybe the Chaos troops where split, so now there is no direct contact between the 2 mains factions (Khorne/Nurgles been on the Imperials border and the Slaaneesh/Tzenth NPCs controlled on the Brettonia/High Elf side).  Killing Slaaneesh and Tzenth followers can explain temporary PvE groups of all type (well some are very discutable but, on a group level is a LOT easier to understand than on a UNITS and WAR level, you can even end every PvE group with a full PvP fight with no impact for the fun of it and you even further promote the franchise, Khorne heroes(more intelligents than troops and armies) and High Elfs killing each other after they slaughter some slaaneesh).  But you can also just keep all the Good out of the game if you doesn't want any PvE realm.  Putting the Good inside the Neutral and Lawful factions on such a scale is sooo artificial.

- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - René Levesque about the denial NO on the poll to his dream, project and goal. (Free translation)

  Dark_Lord_13

Novice Member

Joined: 6/12/05
Posts: 248

2/16/06 8:06:39 AM#32

Originally posted by Anofalye

Now if it was the Wood Elfs, those egalitarian punks, maybe, but it is the High Elfs.  And the High Elfs often shy away from their responsabilities, this is why they get along so well with Brettonia, there is a comon understanding.

Actually the Wood Elves are ALOT more standoffish than the High Elves ever thought about being.  They don't get along well with anyone, they simply Tolerate the Brets, because of their assistance with fending off the borders of their forest.

I really don't get it, Imperial or High Elfs should be NPCs, put the wood elf with Imperials and Brettonia with the High Elfs.  The Wood Elfs are just as fun as the High Elfs, and I can see a Wardancer showing off in an Imperial Unit with no problem, a Griffon Rider, never!

High Elves don't ride Griffons now.  They ride Dragons, only the Empire ride griffons.

If they can't respect the basics rules and setting of Warhammer, I rather see them use a different name and say it was inspired from Warhammer.  Using a "True Name" bear more responsabilities than Turbines was able to understand!

They seem to have a more understanding of the basic setting of Warhammer than you do.  I'm sorry to say this because I respect many of your posts, but you are very wrong about the "setting of Warhammer" You're taking the RPG, and trying to say the Entire Warhammer World is only what you percieve it out of the RPG.  Warhammer Fantasy Battles, (i.e. the tabletop wargame) was around a long time before the RPG, and has been updated twice since the RPG was made.  They're basing the MMO off the updated version of the Warhammer World, as it is seen in Warhammer Fantasy Battles.

Good factions really mix bad with any non-Good faction.  The Empire is Neutral (or Lawful sometimes, yet Neutrals are easy going and bear Lawful), it is not good, not at all.  The Dwarves are neutrals.  Brettonia is Good  (Good in Warhammer is a mix between Chaotic Good and Neutral Good if you must compare to D&D, while Lawful is Lawfull Neutral with "good laws", neutrals are easy going)  There is no way you will make me accept High Elfs in a RvR strong setting with the Imperial anymore than Khorne with Slaanesh or Tzenth (followers could be present and pretending to be something else).

Chaos is a faction on it own (well many, at least 2 but that is another topic).  They also put Evil (orcs and dark elfs).  You can't possibly put 60% of the world alignements in the last faction, it doesn't work!  If they stick to Evil and Chaos, than Neutral with Lawful tendancies should be the last and Good should again be hiding and not taking their responsabilities, leaving the Imperial taking the blunt of the onslaught.

Here you are just incorporating D&D functionality with Warhammer, and that doesn't work at all,  Chaos often work together, this includes factions that often fight, but it's because they work together in the respect of fighting for the "Better good" or conquering the opposition in the respect of Chaos.  High Elves and Empire have fought along side each other against Chaos since the first Chaos invasion.  It's in the History.

PS: They could easily have made their RvR setting, with 3 setting, and put a 4th, PvE only setting, put the High Elfs or Brettonian in charge of that setting, hidden behind the Imperials or something...,have some quests to explain why they can groups with other factions but make it more easy to group Imperials and there you go...anyway, just an idea, but sticking the High Elfs under the Imperial tag...bad...very very bad.  Of course, as a PvE player, such a setting would interest far more and I preach for what I like...but it also make sense.  Nobody can argue that realistically.  High Elfs with Imperials, mixing units?  Never.  Wood elfs, would, but not the High Elfs.  You could even put the Chaos factions you discard in the PvP as a big NPC enemy on the PvE front, killing Slaaneesh troops is a temporary excuse to get a Khorne mindless player in your group for sometimes.  See, for some reason, maybe the Chaos troops where split, so now there is no direct contact between the 2 mains factions (Khorne/Nurgles been on the Imperials border and the Slaaneesh/Tzenth NPCs controlled on the Brettonia/High Elf side).  Killing Slaaneesh and Tzenth followers can explain temporary PvE groups of all type (well some are very discutable but, on a group level is a LOT easier to understand than on a UNITS and WAR level, you can even end every PvE group with a full PvP fight with no impact for the fun of it and you even further promote the franchise, Khorne heroes(more intelligents than troops and armies) and High Elfs killing each other after they slaughter some slaaneesh).  But you can also just keep all the Good out of the game if you doesn't want any PvE realm.  Putting the Good inside the Neutral and Lawful factions on such a scale is sooo artificial.

I agree that they could have done a 4th faction, however in my opinion it's more likely that they should have used Dark Elves and Orks as the 3rd and 4th faction instaad of your ideas.  This because it's least likely that the Dark Elves and Orks will have an alliance than it is that the High Elves will have an alliance with Empire....  Mostly because the High Elves DO have an alliance with the Empire.



If you'd like to dispute my responses to your post, that's fine, but I suggest you go to the Games Workshop Website and read up on the latest histories and alliances from the "latest" Chaos Incursion.
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