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WAR (Warhammer Online) Forum » General Discussion » How do you think release will affect WoW? (poll) and not a flame war.

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54 posts found
  Digna

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/19/05
Posts: 2014

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.

7/08/07 5:47:15 AM#21

One thing to note is that WAR is PvE and PvP. You don't have to do either/or, you can do both (or neither I suppose). I think a large percentage of folks will migrate right off and either close or not use their WoW accounts. Some will stay with WAR and some will go. We'll see WoW with a healthy chunk of market 5 years from now (unless something unforeseeable happens) but declining rather than growing going forward.

  anubisss

Novice Member

Joined: 6/09/05
Posts: 348

7/08/07 6:28:59 AM#22

 

Originally posted by impulsebooks

Personally I don't think Blizzard will lose too much money over this launch of WAR. What will happen is that a lot of WOW players will open WAR accounts but they won't close their WOW accounts. They won't play WOW very much, except to attend a planned raid once or twice a week with their old guild freinds, the rest of the time they will be dwarfs killing al you greenskins in WAR.

War is coming, but not fast enough for me 

I don't think Blizzard will lose much money at  launch of WAR either.Warhammer has its biggest following in Europe and the UK.DAOC was really big in Europe so Mythic are well like for their previous mmorpg.

 

As for 3 months into going gold i predict  WAR to be freaking massive and a SERIOUS threat to ANY PVP-PVE mmorpg out there.You really wont have time for 2 games once you realize how an RVR game works.When you are logged off you are not thinking up a new trick on how to take out that uber boss to acquire that uber loot.

In an  RVR game you log off and  you are thinking about the enemy and how far he has pushed forward.You have that feeling, you being logged on might make the difference to that long drawn out battle for that key position on the battle field.

If anyone does try to juggle both games  they will soon realize the rewards from RVR and the feeling of involvement you get far surpasses anything that 40 man spacial raid does.

WAR IS COMING

Ghost Squad

  R3DD3RS

Novice Member

Joined: 4/22/04
Posts: 42

All your base are belong to us!

7/08/07 6:50:15 AM#23

I voted for 1 to 2 million because of the simple fact is that, although 8mil + accounts are active around only 3.5mil of these are legitimate players and the rest are farmers.

  sepher

Novice Member

Joined: 6/10/06
Posts: 3561

7/08/07 7:25:26 AM#24

I believe Warhammer won't cannablize Warcraft's market at all. I mean it might a little at first, but if Warhammer is successful, then the best result will be the industry growing. I'd be happy to see Warcraft with 4 million+ subscribers in North America/Europe with Warhammer having 2 million+.

On a personal note, I gotta say as much as I loved Dark Age of Camelot and believe RvR to be superior to anything I experienced in Warcraft; like 90% of my friends who play MMOs, played Warcraft as their first MMO and haven't a clue what the heck RvR is. They believe Warcraft is the most competitive PvP experience ever...nevermind getting into Ultima Online with them. So what I believe will benefit Warhammer best is surprising folks like that with a thorough open-beta experience. Mythic's obviously using RvR as a platform to promote the game, but a lot of WoW players haven't played DAoC, so it'll be important to give prospective players a chance to see what it's all about.

  User Deleted
7/08/07 7:35:37 AM#25

Originally posted by R3DD3RS

I voted for 1 to 2 million because of the simple fact is that, although 8mil + accounts are active around only 3.5mil of these are legitimate players and the rest are farmers.

So 50% of the population of all 500+ western servers are gold farmers... rofl... or are you one of these that dismiss the entire Asia player base as if they don't count... just where do people get their figures from?

Anyway on topic, WoW will see another expansion just before or around the time of WAR's release and if blizzard are smart it will be somthing to stop people going to WAR, i.e PvP based, we can see little experiments of World PvP in the last expansion with capturable towens, zone based PvP objectives and dropping bombs from flying mounts.

We realy cannot judge until blizzcon in august when blizz will give details of the expansion, and I can bet some attention will be given to PvP.

  Elgareth

Novice Member

Joined: 3/09/07
Posts: 593

7/08/07 7:43:53 AM#26

Originally posted by cupertino

 


Anyway on topic, WoW will see another expansion just before or around the time of WAR's release and if blizzard are smart it will be somthing to stop people going to WAR, i.e PvP based, we can see little experiments of World PvP in the last expansion with capturable towens, zone based PvP objectives and dropping bombs from flying mounts.

We realy cannot judge until blizzcon in august when blizz will give details of the expansion, and I can bet some attention will be given to PvP.

IMO that'd the be worst mistake WoW could make. Trying to tack on proper PvP on their PvE game won't work as good as a planned PvP Centric Game, and all that'd be left in WoW would be sub-optimal PvP, and not much new on the PvE front, so in the end they risk losing both playerbases at once.

IMO Blizz should absolutely focus on their PvE now, as big as WoW might be, they can't serve anyone, and with the release of PvP centric games like AoC and WAR, they'll lose a big part of their PvP crowd anyway, no matter what they add to WoW's PvP, it'll still have the same flawed game mechanics in PvP. By focussing on their PvE Part, they at least can be sure that they'll keep most of the PvE Players , but if they don't give their PvE some love soon, they'll quickly be left with a game which is worse in it's PvP to some other MMORPG, AND worse in it's PvE to some other MMORPG (not necessarily the same other MMORPG though).

  anubisss

Novice Member

Joined: 6/09/05
Posts: 348

7/08/07 8:40:19 AM#27

Originally posted by cupertino

 

Originally posted by R3DD3RS

I voted for 1 to 2 million because of the simple fact is that, although 8mil + accounts are active around only 3.5mil of these are legitimate players and the rest are farmers.

 

So 50% of the population of all 500+ western servers are gold farmers... rofl... or are you one of these that dismiss the entire Asia player base as if they don't count... just where do people get their figures from?

Anyway on topic, WoW will see another expansion just before or around the time of WAR's release and if blizzard are smart it will be somthing to stop people going to WAR, i.e PvP based, we can see little experiments of World PvP in the last expansion with capturable towens, zone based PvP objectives and dropping bombs from flying mounts.

We realy cannot judge until blizzcon in august when blizz will give details of the expansion, and I can bet some attention will be given to PvP.

Blizzard will have a hard time matching anything RVR-PVP sentric to there game.WOW is a PVE game and no matter what the back of the box says it will always be that.

The most you can see is more battlegrounds and a few more outdoor objective but nothing that matches WAR.WOW bigget problem is its gaming engine was never build to handle 200v200+ people all in one place.If you look back at such gatherings there servers have crashed.

One of the main reasons for its vast player base is anyone with a 10 year old pc can playe it with the right card.WAR will IMO  be more greedy on your pc than WOW ever was and i can see people coming unstuck.I not saying you will need a vanguard busting pc but it will help to have a good card and plenty of ram...2gig if you can.

WAR IS COMING

Ghost Squad

 

 

 

  Anofalye

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/19/03
Posts: 7442

The enemy is so dumb! They believe that WE are the enemy! - A famous orc commander.

7/08/07 8:56:14 AM#28

50k to 200k sound about right with the current developpment of the game.

 

The game will probably rise to 1 million sub total, but most have already quit WoW or are playing other games.

 

To get more...they need to give PvE a focus.  But they are in denial, they think PvE has a focus...so this is not going to happen.

- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - René Levesque about the denial NO on the poll to his dream, project and goal. (Free translation)

  sepher

Novice Member

Joined: 6/10/06
Posts: 3561

7/08/07 9:00:13 AM#29
Originally posted by Anofalye

50k to 200k sound about right with the current developpment of the game.

 

The game will probably rise to 1 million sub total, but most have already quit WoW or are playing other games.

 

To get more...they need to give PvE a focus.  But they are in denial, they think PvE has a focus...so this is not going to happen.

What don't you like about Mythic's PvE focus for Warhammer? Not to derail the topic, I'm just curious, because everything in that Quest video podcast seemed pretty ground breaking to me towards advancing PvE for the genre.

  Sramota

Novice Member

Joined: 5/18/04
Posts: 759

-Even samurai have teddybears and even teddybears get drunk-

7/08/07 9:03:19 AM#30

There's a large amount of PvP lovers in WoW. I'd imagine they'll be moving over,
the rest, well, say a few 100k not too much.


And WAR is a pvp centric game, will you stop bitching about your pve soon enough?


"Well, I like this, so obviously, the game can't succeed if I don't get that" Geez.....

Played so far: 9Dragons, AO, AC, AC2, CoX, DAoC, DF, DnL, DR, DDO, Ent, EvE, EQ, EQ2, FoMK, FFO, Fury, GW, HG:L, HZ, L1, L2, M59, MU, NC1, NC2, PS, PT, R:O, RF:O, RYL, Ryzom, SL, SB, SW:G, TR, TCoS, MX:O, UO, VG, WAR, WoW...
It all sucked.

  Anofalye

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/19/03
Posts: 7442

The enemy is so dumb! They believe that WE are the enemy! - A famous orc commander.

7/08/07 9:05:54 AM#31

Originally posted by sepher

What don't you like about Mythic's PvE focus for Warhammer? Not to derail the topic, I'm just curious, because everything in that Quest video podcast seemed pretty ground breaking to me towards advancing PvE for the genre.

It is neat and nice.  But why would someone do PvE in WAR?  They are subpar, they are weakling...the only reason to do PvE in WAR is to advance the cause of the WAR itself, which is a PvP focus, not a PvE focus.  Basically, this is perfect for someone who loves to PvP, he will enjoy the PvE.  It is also perfect for peoples who don't care much about progression (ultimate casuals).  But for a real PvE player...you will be a weakling among other peoples in the PvE because you don't go "Raid the enemy capital".  Same flaw as WoW endgame, just PvP-oriented instead of nasty raiding-PvE, which are equally bad.

 

Peoples are in denial.  They think this is enough for PvE.  It is PvE without a goal, without a focus, without a soul.  They need to give PvE a focus, a holy grail.  The holy grail atm is razing the enemy capital, even in PvE.  That doesn't work.  Been in denial doesn't solve this.

- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - René Levesque about the denial NO on the poll to his dream, project and goal. (Free translation)

  Sramota

Novice Member

Joined: 5/18/04
Posts: 759

-Even samurai have teddybears and even teddybears get drunk-

7/08/07 9:08:57 AM#32


Originally posted by Anofalye

Originally posted by sepher

What don't you like about Mythic's PvE focus for Warhammer? Not to derail the topic, I'm just curious, because everything in that Quest video podcast seemed pretty ground breaking to me towards advancing PvE for the genre.



It is neat and nice.  But why would someone do PvE in WAR?  They are subpar, they are weakling...the only reason to do PvE in WAR is to advance the cause of the WAR itself, which is a PvP focus, not a PvE focus.  Basically, this is perfect for someone who loves to PvP, he will enjoy the PvE.  It is also perfect for peoples who don't care much about progression (ultimate casuals).  But for a real PvE player...you will be a weakling among other peoples in the PvE because you don't go "Raid the enemy capital".  Same flaw as WoW endgame, just PvP-oriented instead of nasty raiding-PvE, which are equally bad.
 
Peoples are in denial.  They think this is enough for PvE.  It is PvE without a goal, without a focus, without a soul.  They need to give PvE a focus, a holy grail.  The holy grail atm is razing the enemy capital, even in PvE.  That doesn't work.  Been in denial doesn't solve this.

That is enough for the PvE.
It's a PvP game.

Besides the "raiding" in WAR isn't guildforce, it's open RvR.

Veeeeery different from WoW's half-arsed 25man 'prance around the blob' idea of end-game.

Again : THIS IS NOT A PVE GAME, GO HOME!

Played so far: 9Dragons, AO, AC, AC2, CoX, DAoC, DF, DnL, DR, DDO, Ent, EvE, EQ, EQ2, FoMK, FFO, Fury, GW, HG:L, HZ, L1, L2, M59, MU, NC1, NC2, PS, PT, R:O, RF:O, RYL, Ryzom, SL, SB, SW:G, TR, TCoS, MX:O, UO, VG, WAR, WoW...
It all sucked.

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 18996

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

7/08/07 9:10:37 AM#33

I went with one of the lower numbers...say 200-500K players moving over at best.  I recall back to the days when EQ was king, and DAOC was released.  Many of DAOC's player base came from EQ, and were drawn to it because of its RVR combat.....

But EQ dwarfed DAOC in terms of subs, something I could not fathom, but then again, I'm not of the PVE mindset. 

Let's face it, most PVE players don't want their leveling interupted by random pvp combat, so this game won't appeal to them.  Heck, even on WOW's PVP servers there was an awful lot of complaining any time someone started to gank on people.....

"In these forums 'honest' seems to be a symonym for 'hates the game just like I do'" - ohioastro
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  Anofalye

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/19/03
Posts: 7442

The enemy is so dumb! They believe that WE are the enemy! - A famous orc commander.

7/08/07 9:14:08 AM#34

Originally posted by Sramota

 

 

That is enough for the PvE.
It's a PvP game.

Besides the "raiding" in WAR isn't guildforce, it's open RvR.

Veeeeery different from WoW's half-arsed 25man 'prance around the blob' idea of end-game.

Again : THIS IS NOT A PVE GAME, GO HOME!

Blood for the Blood God.  

 

I was on these forums a whole 6 months before you, so go home yourself all you want!  I see a HUGE PvE weakness in the game, and I intent to underline it until release or until corrected.  This is the purpose of online forums with a love toward MMOs.  I would fail them as a fan if I would stfu as you want me to.

 

RvR, Raiding, whatever, this is trash and I don't want it, as a PvE player.

- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - René Levesque about the denial NO on the poll to his dream, project and goal. (Free translation)

  Sramota

Novice Member

Joined: 5/18/04
Posts: 759

-Even samurai have teddybears and even teddybears get drunk-

7/08/07 9:19:53 AM#35


Originally posted by Anofalye

Originally posted by Sramota

 
 
That is enough for the PvE.
It's a PvP game.
Besides the "raiding" in WAR isn't guildforce, it's open RvR.
Veeeeery different from WoW's half-arsed 25man 'prance around the blob' idea of end-game.
Again : THIS IS NOT A PVE GAME, GO HOME!



Blood for the Blood God.  
 
I was on these forums a whole 6 months before you, so go home yourself all you want!  I see a HUGE PvE weakness in the game, and I intent to underline it until release or until corrected.  This is the purpose of online forums with a love toward MMOs.  I would fail them as a fan if I would stfu as you want me to.
 
RvR, Raiding, whatever, this is trash and I don't want it, as a PvE player.


Now, you don't want raiding and RvR.... Because you're a PvE player...
What the HELL does end-game PvErs do then?

Besides, you might notice:
This game isn't for you.

The last... What? 25 years, of Warhammer, this game hasn't been for your kind.

GW has always done games putting players against eachother,
Warhammer has always been about WAR, fighting and butting heads between Chaos and Order.

I'm sorry, but, I must tell you,
it might hurt, but this isn't an anofalyecentric universe.

You are far from the center, or even in the radius of a center, of the universe.

If you want a PvE game, there's tons of them. Go ahead, play them, they're all there for you.

WAR has always been about the struggle between Chaos and Order, both sides controlled by players. If that doesn't suit you, don't play it.

And what was it that end-game pve was about again? As you don't want raiding...........

Played so far: 9Dragons, AO, AC, AC2, CoX, DAoC, DF, DnL, DR, DDO, Ent, EvE, EQ, EQ2, FoMK, FFO, Fury, GW, HG:L, HZ, L1, L2, M59, MU, NC1, NC2, PS, PT, R:O, RF:O, RYL, Ryzom, SL, SB, SW:G, TR, TCoS, MX:O, UO, VG, WAR, WoW...
It all sucked.

  mokona

Novice Member

Joined: 1/10/04
Posts: 51

Come back hear meat.. (Luffy D Monkey to Tony Tony Chopper )

7/08/07 9:22:41 AM#36

There will always be diehards who fallow any mmo out there (Heck there are some ppl claiming they will never play another mmo becouse Auto Asssult is going down). To think War will kill WoW I dont think will happen but I think it will deffently take a good amount of players way from them. I voted for the 200k -600k. Im just hoping that WAR will not get any of WoWs f@#% gold farmers. Blizzard can keep them.

If god loves the fools ,and god loves every one, dose that mean we are all fools.

  TheMaelstrom

Novice Member

Joined: 7/02/04
Posts: 395

Nobody loves you.

7/08/07 9:26:57 AM#37

I voted 1 to 2 million.

 

There's no question WoW has out-done any mmo that preceded it, and good for them. However, the more people you bring into a genre, the more people you're likely to have feeling like something is missing. So, even if PvP-centric players are the minority, if WoW has anywhere in the vicinity of the 8 million subscribers it boasts, it stands to reason that 25% of said subscribers will be looking to try something new by the time WAR is released.

 

Let's face it, Blizzard brought mmo's to the mainstream, which is great for those of us who want to see more and better titles coming out in this genre. Arguing that Blizzard didn't break through to millions of new mmo players would be like bailing water on the Titanic with a bucket. It's fact, whether you like the company/game or not.

 

What's going to really tell the tale won't be the impact WAR has on other mmo subscriptions initially, but the impact it's still having on them after 6 months.

No godless person can comprehend those minute distinctions
in doctrine that provide true believers excuse for mayhem.
-Glen Cook

  Sramota

Novice Member

Joined: 5/18/04
Posts: 759

-Even samurai have teddybears and even teddybears get drunk-

7/08/07 9:31:37 AM#38


Originally posted by mokona
There will always be diehards who fallow any mmo out there (Heck there are some ppl claiming they will never play another mmo becouse Auto Asssult is going down). To think War will kill WoW I dont think will happen but I think it will deffently take a good amount of players way from them. I voted for the 200k -600k. Im just hoping that WAR will not get any of WoWs gold farmers. Blizzard can keep them.


Sadly the farmers aren't game-specific.
They spread like a plague rather.

But I do believe mythic has something in their backpocket for that

The whole PvP-centric gameplay will probably hurt them quite good, as they can't really macro their PvP and there's hardly any crafting as most things (The best) are gained from PvP and everyone can get in there.

Feels like they'd be trying to farm CS or something *smirk*

Played so far: 9Dragons, AO, AC, AC2, CoX, DAoC, DF, DnL, DR, DDO, Ent, EvE, EQ, EQ2, FoMK, FFO, Fury, GW, HG:L, HZ, L1, L2, M59, MU, NC1, NC2, PS, PT, R:O, RF:O, RYL, Ryzom, SL, SB, SW:G, TR, TCoS, MX:O, UO, VG, WAR, WoW...
It all sucked.

  Thavas

Novice Member

Joined: 7/06/07
Posts: 2

7/08/07 9:33:25 AM#39

WoW did a good job drawing people into the mmorpg genre - easy to handle, average computer requirements, etc.

In the end - those WoW players are nothing less then potential WAR players. Now it really is up to Mythic to convince this crowd that their game concept is superior to WoW.

WoW is not going to die because of any games released in the near futur - but those players who feel that the permanent struggle between two forces - RvR - offers a lot more fun and challenge to the end game content then doing pve instances over and over again - they should and hopefully will leave WoW without even thinking.

They can keep their pve crowd - I don't care... cause I hope Mythic will focus on RvR and not on handing people a WoW clone with pointless pve content just to draw away Blizzards subscribers.

 

  Distaste

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/03/06
Posts: 668

7/08/07 10:58:32 AM#40

Honestly I hope it is only 200k or lower. The WoW community is HORRID so why would I want them to switch over? Out of a server in WoW I think I found like 8 people that I actually could have a good conversation with. I do think you will see a good bit of people from wow though as much as I hate it. I beleive WoW will see a BIG drop in active players for the first month of WAR then some will trickle back.

Really though it is all about how both companies play the MMO game. IF Blizzard releases an expansion just before WAR then obviously less will jump ship. If WAR releases before a WoW expansion then a moderate amount will join up. If Blizzard doesn't release an expansion then a lot will jump ship which is most likely the current situation. WAR could also step up the hype near the release by dropping the NDA and keeping the closed beta. Friends will tell friends and the "cool" stuff in the game will be spread around gamers like wild fire.

The biggest thing that will hurt WAR is keeping things secret near the end like Vangaurd. People want to hear if it is a good game or not and I find it hard that WAR wont be good so they shouldn't cover that up.

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