For the love of god turn on the SOGA models!

Everquest 2 and LoTRO have some of the best graphics bar-none, WoW on the other hand uses a dated engine that has all the armor graphics textured on to the character model - seriously outdated.

Character Animation, hands down goes to EQ2 - they have simple the best motion capture/character animation in the industry.

Yeah, I do like their animations.  Another nice positive is the ability to choose your characters voice.  You get a variety to choose from. 

As for the soga models, if you turn them on can you turn them off later?  Also, if you have some soga screenshots that you think are great, I'd love to see them.

And the argument of graphics < gameplay is a tired one.  We are not talking about gameplay we are talking about graphics.  Personally, I expect graphics and gameplay to be good in a game.

The SOGA models can by toggled on and off per race whenever you like.

If you like the Original model of one race or a SOGA of another, you can pick and choose, It's not all or nothing.

Go under Option - SOGA Models - then select the ones you like or all of them, completely up to you.

Originally posted by Terranah

Just because you're an art instructor doesn't mean you have good artistic taste.  Why not throw up some examples of your artwork.  Maybe then it will become clear to the rest of us why you think EQ2 graphics are so great.

 

I would have to agree with many of the posters above.  I think the art style itself is very poor, and I think the artists are to blame.  There are moments when it is tolerable though...it's not a total wash.  But, I would have to list the graphics as one of the primary things I was disappointed in when I played the game. 

 

 

No need to be nasty about it. The reason I mentioned I was an art instructor in a gaming program was to point out I know what state of the art graphics are. I also know computers and what the artist are capable of. I did not say that to make it like I knew all there is to know about art or what is great or not. Since that is a matter of taste. Not a single response of mine has put down anyone elses feelings about the graphics in anyway. The point of the post was to get a discussion on the graphics in EQ2. Which it did. Why so bitter?

Not sure what this is suppose to prove to you about why I like EQ2 graphics. Here are a couple of my paintings. The Dancing girl and paper airplane painting is about 6 feet tall and the pattern is about 6ft by 4ft both acrylic on canvas. Not the best picture I just took them for this post.

Originally posted by eccoton

Originally posted by Terranah

Just because you're an art instructor doesn't mean you have good artistic taste.  Why not throw up some examples of your artwork.  Maybe then it will become clear to the rest of us why you think EQ2 graphics are so great.

I would have to agree with many of the posters above.  I think the art style itself is very poor, and I think the artists are to blame.  There are moments when it is tolerable though...it's not a total wash.  But, I would have to list the graphics as one of the primary things I was disappointed in when I played the game. 

No need to be nasty about it. The reason I mentioned I was an art instructor in a gaming program was to point out I know what state of the art graphics are. I also know computers and what the artist are capable of. I did not say that to make it like I knew all there is to know about art or what is great or not. Since that is a matter of taste. Not a single response of mine has put down anyone elses feelings about the graphics in anyway. The point of the post was to get a discussion on the graphics in EQ2. Which it did. Why so bitter?

Not sure what this is suppose to prove to you about why I like EQ2 graphics. Here are a couple of my paintings. The Dancing girl and paper airplane painting is about 6 feet tall and the pattern is about 6ft by 4ft both acrylic on canvas. Not the best picture I just took them for this post.

I really like your paintings, but at least to me they explain why you like the EQ2 art style so much. The two paintings shown have a clean & vibrant use of colour with influences from oriental art. EQ2 artwork also has a similar style, especially the recent expansions. I am fairly certain that SOE used the same team that produced the Anime style SOGA character models for the recent expansions, hence the obvious japanese influences in Neriak & other new areas.

I am a big fan of this Art style, but many others are not. Players that dislike SOGA complain that because of the way it was implemented, SOE prevent them from customising their characters properly, i.e. other players with SOGA turned on see an Anime style model when they prefer the originals. Whilst this might sound like another issue, actually it directly relates to why many people find the EQ2 artwork plastic.

The simplest way I can put it is this, in movies CGI has not yet reached the standard that it is indistinguishable from real images. Whilst MMOs are all CGI, the same subliminal visual issues apply & for many people the combined lighting, colouring, texturing & surface effects in EQ2 just look odd. It doesn't matter that they are rendered in high quality, something about their execution puts many people off.

There is no intellectual argument to combat this, because ultimately it is just a matter of personal taste.

Originally posted by LondonMagus

Originally posted by eccoton

Originally posted by Terranah

Just because you're an art instructor doesn't mean you have good artistic taste.  Why not throw up some examples of your artwork.  Maybe then it will become clear to the rest of us why you think EQ2 graphics are so great.

I would have to agree with many of the posters above.  I think the art style itself is very poor, and I think the artists are to blame.  There are moments when it is tolerable though...it's not a total wash.  But, I would have to list the graphics as one of the primary things I was disappointed in when I played the game. 

No need to be nasty about it. The reason I mentioned I was an art instructor in a gaming program was to point out I know what state of the art graphics are. I also know computers and what the artist are capable of. I did not say that to make it like I knew all there is to know about art or what is great or not. Since that is a matter of taste. Not a single response of mine has put down anyone elses feelings about the graphics in anyway. The point of the post was to get a discussion on the graphics in EQ2. Which it did. Why so bitter?

Not sure what this is suppose to prove to you about why I like EQ2 graphics. Here are a couple of my paintings. The Dancing girl and paper airplane painting is about 6 feet tall and the pattern is about 6ft by 4ft both acrylic on canvas. Not the best picture I just took them for this post.

I really like your paintings, but at least to me they explain why you like the EQ2 art style so much. The two paintings shown have a clean & vibrant use of colour with influences from oriental art. EQ2 artwork also has a similar style, especially the recent expansions. I am fairly certain that SOE used the same team that produced the Anime style SOGA character models for the recent expansions, hence the obvious japanese influences in Neriak & other new areas.

I am a big fan of this Art style, but many others are not. Players that dislike SOGA complain that because of the way it was implemented, SOE prevent them from customising their characters properly, i.e. other players with SOGA turned on see an Anime style model when they prefer the originals. Whilst this might sound like another issue, actually it directly relates to why many people find the EQ2 artwork plastic.

The simplest way I can put it is this, in movies CGI has not yet reached the standard that it is indistinguishable from real images. Whilst MMOs are all CGI, the same subliminal visual issues apply & for many people the combined lighting, colouring, texturing & surface effects in EQ2 just look odd. It doesn't matter that they are rendered in high quality, something about their execution puts many people off.

There is no intellectual argument to combat this, because ultimately it is just a matter of personal taste.

LondonMagnus, Interesting ideas and well thought. I think your last statement is correct. Ultimately your likes and dislike in mmos comes down to your own personnel tastes. Most of the big guns in this arena are well made. The types of budgets offered to the developers are huge now so we expect good quality products. For the most part I feel the industry delivers on this. So among the top games it really comes down to taste.

Originally posted by LondonMagus

Originally posted by eccoton

Originally posted by Terranah

Just because you're an art instructor doesn't mean you have good artistic taste.  Why not throw up some examples of your artwork.  Maybe then it will become clear to the rest of us why you think EQ2 graphics are so great.

I would have to agree with many of the posters above.  I think the art style itself is very poor, and I think the artists are to blame.  There are moments when it is tolerable though...it's not a total wash.  But, I would have to list the graphics as one of the primary things I was disappointed in when I played the game. 

No need to be nasty about it. The reason I mentioned I was an art instructor in a gaming program was to point out I know what state of the art graphics are. I also know computers and what the artist are capable of. I did not say that to make it like I knew all there is to know about art or what is great or not. Since that is a matter of taste. Not a single response of mine has put down anyone elses feelings about the graphics in anyway. The point of the post was to get a discussion on the graphics in EQ2. Which it did. Why so bitter?

Not sure what this is suppose to prove to you about why I like EQ2 graphics. Here are a couple of my paintings. The Dancing girl and paper airplane painting is about 6 feet tall and the pattern is about 6ft by 4ft both acrylic on canvas. Not the best picture I just took them for this post.

I really like your paintings, but at least to me they explain why you like the EQ2 art style so much. The two paintings shown have a clean & vibrant use of colour with influences from oriental art. EQ2 artwork also has a similar style, especially the recent expansions. I am fairly certain that SOE used the same team that produced the Anime style SOGA character models for the recent expansions, hence the obvious japanese influences in Neriak & other new areas.

I am a big fan of this Art style, but many others are not. Players that dislike SOGA complain that because of the way it was implemented, SOE prevent them from customising their characters properly, i.e. other players with SOGA turned on see an Anime style model when they prefer the originals. Whilst this might sound like another issue, actually it directly relates to why many people find the EQ2 artwork plastic.

The simplest way I can put it is this, in movies CGI has not yet reached the standard that it is indistinguishable from real images. Whilst MMOs are all CGI, the same subliminal visual issues apply & for many people the combined lighting, colouring, texturing & surface effects in EQ2 just look odd. It doesn't matter that they are rendered in high quality, something about their execution puts many people off.

There is no intellectual argument to combat this, because ultimately it is just a matter of personal taste.

I also enjoy the Oblivion art style (but needed the updated models for the NPC's..)

I think that explains my overall feeling towards various games...like Ecco I need the character to be the better part. This is the reason I really wanted to like L2, but did not enjoy LOTRO...the models were key. As to WoW's models, I actually think their movements are fluid, and the art style is neat. But, it did get old after a while as all games do.

Guild Wars though always amazes me everytime I log in and look at the models and the landscapes..If they keep that style and upgrade the graphics for GW2, I will be there Day 1..

Reason I like AoC better than WAR as my next game to check out...art direction for models is more my style...of course Aion looks even better to me (but the gameplay does not)

Thanks for sharing the art, and yes EQ2 has the feel right...the models feel like they should and weapons hitting feel right, and characters ducking ...feels all right,...

Later

I'm going to ammend what I said, the graphic  engine as far as shadows and light seem fine. But the more I look at my screenshots and these I have to say that the art design is a bit dissapointing to me. The landscapes (as can be seen above) are really drab. Just plain bland.

Some of the items in EQ 2 as well as some of the characters are "ok" but even with SOGA models (which I used and it helped a lot,) it just lacks. For me that is.

As far as dragons, shame you didn't have the Lineage 2 Valakas dragon... truly impressive. However, the Turbine D&D dragon doesn't look good. The final fantasy one surprised me. It is exceptionally good

i guess a lot of this character model and art direction discussion is depending on personal preference.

if you like asian anime style graphics lwith oversized weapons, overstyled often very sexy looking armors and such then you won't like eq2 character arts. 

original eq2 art direction was more aimed at a realistic look with armors and weapons based on real medieval looks. Eq2 now is a bit different to how it was at start as they added items with expansions that are more fantasy style with expansions and regular updates.

wow has definitely a good art direction but i personally don't like that cartoony style.

Lotro has definitely nice environments but i really have a problem with the character arts in that game which got me to the point that even with lifetime sub i never got past level 30 with any of my chars (i somehow cannot connect to the character and thats really important for me playing the game).

Vanguard has some really good looking places and architectures, but overall the world and characters were lacking for me.

looking at my played times in fantasy mmos in the last 1-2 years i have eq2 on top, followed by wow. Lotro and Vanguard both got some time and money from me too, but while I tried a lot otthers too i just could not get into the other games (especially not the asian ones).

Originally posted by quaiky

i guess a lot of this character model and art direction discussion is depending on personal preference.

if you like asian anime style graphics lwith oversized weapons, overstyled often very sexy looking armors and such then you won't like eq2 character arts. 

original eq2 art direction was more aimed at a realistic look with armors and weapons based on real medieval looks. Eq2 now is a bit different to how it was at start as they added items with expansions that are more fantasy style with expansions and regular updates.

 

wow has definitely a good art direction but i personally don't like that cartoony style.

Lotro has definitely nice environments but i really have a problem with the character arts in that game which got me to the point that even with lifetime sub i never got past level 30 with any of my chars (i somehow cannot connect to the character and thats really important for me playing the game).

Vanguard has some really good looking places and architectures, but overall the world and characters were lacking for me.

looking at my played times in fantasy mmos in the last 1-2 years i have eq2 on top, followed by wow. Lotro and Vanguard both got some time and money from me too, but while I tried a lot otthers too i just could not get into the other games (especially not the asian ones).

I tried all of these games as well and put significant time into each and have the same feelings about them. For me LOTRO was the biggest let down. Not sure how they could have made such fantastic enviroments but missed the mark on characters. Vanguard has so many problems we all know about but I really liked the look of both the enviroments and characters. I am giving Vanguard another chance and going back this weekend. As usual I do not expect to stay but I want to see if things are getting better, It has been about 3 months since I tried last.