Originally posted by siresper

If they implemented permadeath I would fully support full player looting. That would actually be worth playing.

People are less likely to put themselves at risk by blindly attacking everything they see if they know they can permanantly die. Just like the real world omg.

But full looting without true death? Naw, too fake. Too easy. Too slanted in favor of the random psycho personality. You just get people farming players the same way people farm npcs. You get random violence with no real repercussions for it. You say 'well they can die and lose their stuff too' well the same people that say that are the same ones saying losing your stuff can always be replaced so its not a big deal.

Anything less than permadeath in pvp is easy mode. Consentual pvp is diapers. Full looting is huggies pull-ups. Permadeath is men's underwear. The choice is clear. 

Perma death... you lvl to 80,  at 10oclock your guild want to raid a castle, you go there and help them, at your surprise, the enemy rush all on you and wack you up to the ground. You're perma death'ed . Bye bye lvl 80 forever? You've worked 5month to get there. Good Job. That's how you want it to be?

Originally posted by bingo69

Perma death... you lvl to 80,  at 10oclock your guild want to raid a castle, you go there and help them, at your surprise, the enemy rush all on you and wack you up to the ground. You're perma death'ed . Bye bye lvl 80 forever? You've worked 5month to get there. Good Job. That's how you want it to be?

Isnt that Darkfall's premise?

Personally im just happy with the blood coin.

Originally posted by bingo69

 

Let see, You get mugged irl and lose a precious ring gaven to you by you decess(or however it written) Grand father. Even if you try to look arround forever, you won't find any other like it anymore... it was unique.  In game, You get item, from monster, from shop, from crafter. You lose one, you remember the place you got it from and you get it back from there, Simple as that. If it was crafted, then ask a crafter to make you a new one, if it was a drop, you go back to where it dropped and seek a new one, if it was from a npc you head over to him and buy it back. Obviously, you lost a item, it suck,  but you can get it back either  by those way or even simple, kill the guy who killed you. That's called revenge :)

 

Hemorrhoid huh? I don't know which kind of sick game you wan't to play but oh well.. for that, there would be medicine to cure it, simple as that.. all the " unfun" thing for loser like you are what make a game good and not a cookie-cutter. Go back to Wow or something please. I mean, I want this game to be challenging, you trying to make ti easy as hell, wtf?

Sex is fun , yet everyone don't want it? lol~

Btw, You're pathetic if you're scared to counter the  " unfun " thing of  every game. That's called challenge and this is what make the game worth playing.

Stop being a scaredy cat. This is a game, it has to be risky and challenging, that's where the fun is.Dying is part of the game, losing item should be as well, a Thief should eb able to steal from other player, as a Assassin should be able to take from the corpse of his prey. A barbarian that conquer a throne and take the enemy crown to himself. it's all logic man. If that's not your point, please, go back to wow and do battleground, there you're safe from looting... or warhammer when it come out.

How about you try to act like an adult with this discussion.  Challenge how is loosing all your stuff a challenge?  Challenge is a tuff fight won or lost not getting jumped by some juvenile that wouldn't know challenge if it smacked them across the face.

Sex is fun if you and your partner know what they are doing.  I guess you're speaking from experience I feel sad for you.  Don't worry keep practicing you'll get it.

BTW you're an idiot if you think aggravation and challenge are the same.

Stop being a sterotypical I'm a leet pvping retard.  I don't have to go anywhere.  Sounds like it is pretty much set in stone there will be no player looting in AoC.  Maybe you'll get one ffa server that is lootable if you're lucky.  But that will probably be merged into one of the other non loot ffa pvp servers in a month or two because there are only like 10 people on the whole server.

Originally posted by Venger

 

Originally posted by bingo69

 

Let see, You get mugged irl and lose a precious ring gaven to you by you decess(or however it written) Grand father. Even if you try to look arround forever, you won't find any other like it anymore... it was unique.  In game, You get item, from monster, from shop, from crafter. You lose one, you remember the place you got it from and you get it back from there, Simple as that. If it was crafted, then ask a crafter to make you a new one, if it was a drop, you go back to where it dropped and seek a new one, if it was from a npc you head over to him and buy it back. Obviously, you lost a item, it suck,  but you can get it back either  by those way or even simple, kill the guy who killed you. That's called revenge :)

 

Hemorrhoid huh? I don't know which kind of sick game you wan't to play but oh well.. for that, there would be medicine to cure it, simple as that.. all the " unfun" thing for loser like you are what make a game good and not a cookie-cutter. Go back to Wow or something please. I mean, I want this game to be challenging, you trying to make ti easy as hell, wtf?

Sex is fun , yet everyone don't want it? lol~

Btw, You're pathetic if you're scared to counter the  " unfun " thing of  every game. That's called challenge and this is what make the game worth playing.

Stop being a scaredy cat. This is a game, it has to be risky and challenging, that's where the fun is.Dying is part of the game, losing item should be as well, a Thief should eb able to steal from other player, as a Assassin should be able to take from the corpse of his prey. A barbarian that conquer a throne and take the enemy crown to himself. it's all logic man. If that's not your point, please, go back to wow and do battleground, there you're safe from looting... or warhammer when it come out.

So if someone gets mugged and they only loose replacable cash it that ok?

 

How about you try to act like an adult with this discussion.  Challenge how is loosing all your stuff a challenge?  Challenge is a tuff fight won or lost not getting jumped by some juvenile that wouldn't know challenge if it smacked them across the face.

Sex is fun if you and your partner know what they are doing.  I guess you're speaking from experience I feel sad for you.  Don't worry keep practicing you'll get it.

BTW you're an idiot if you think aggravation and challenge are the same.

Stop being a sterotypical I'm a leet pvping retard.  I don't have to go anywhere.  Sounds like it is pretty much set in stone there will be no player looting in AoC.  Maybe you'll get one ffa server that is lootable if you're lucky.  But that will probably be merged into one of the other non loot ffa pvp servers in a month or two because there are only like 10 people on the whole server.

The whole idea of an FFA server is the challenge. The "FFA" part of it IS the challenge, and looting just amplifies it. If you lose a piece of your equipment just trying to get another one is part of the challenge. Its all about freedom. A thief should be able to steal....I find it outrageous that you have these games with a thief class or a rogue class and yet theyre not able to steal from other players. Haha, ridiculous. The challenge is to survive, the challenge is NOT to walk into a town without thinking twice. The challenge is to find different routes to travel. The challenge is keeping your equipment in check when you die. The challenge is finding that sword that you lost maybe off another mob or *GASP* maybe another player that you can kill easily? But obviously you cant see this, you cant see past the part of "oh no boo hoo I lost my sword." "Oh boo hoo he ganked me while I was farming mobs in the SAME PLACE, OH WHAT DO I DO!?? *CRY*) give me a break. If you cant see the challenge in survival, then go back to WoW or WAR or whatever where killing people really doesnt matter.

I think you should stop being a stereotypical snobbish carebear who trolls in Pro PvP threads. It is not set in stone that there will be no looting in AOC, where do you get that? Developers have hinted that there may be item loot in the PvP servers. Ironically, there are many guilds out there that do plan on going to the PvP servers instead of the normal ones. So uhh, yeah, stop spouting crap please.

You got a piece of it on your lip. Better wipe it off.

Oh you're back I thought I shut you up a while ago.

Well what you twits can't seem to grasp is stealing and/or getting your stuff stolen is not challenge.  Ducking the reds was not a challenge in old UO it was an aggrivation and a waste of my time and money.  It is however acting out your anti-social behavior is a safe setting where you have no fear of punk ass smacked to the ground like the little bitch that you are.

I truely hope that do have a ffa loot server.  Then you'll have a bunch of wolf personality type all hiding waiting to jump someone.  Only problem is everyone on the entire server will be hiding waiting for someone to come that never will.  You will all eventually get bored move regular ffa server or move onto the next flavor of the month bitching and moaning about getting  ffa full loot throwing abour catch phrases like "you're chicken or carebear".

permadeath will never work unless there is no way to advance your character. you start as good as you will ever be, and your live/die based off of your skill as a player.

Like FPS games.

pvp looting will never work unless gear doesn't mean a thing. in that case what's the point?

UO worked with player looting because gear didn't matter much, it was about player skill and tactics.

perma death works in FPS games because you have nothing invested (over the long term) in your character

For those who want to see what it is like to really play a perma-death game or a PVP loot game. Do this.

Seriously, try it out and see what you think of it. Seriously. To the supporters of these idea do it, for real.

Make a character on some game, on a PVP enabled server of some sort. Play.

If you are a item loot fan, if you die in PVP combat to another player, destroy all of your equipment when you respawn. Go buy new stuff.

If you are a perma-death fan, delete the character when you die and start over. Make a new character.

I can 99% garauntee you'll cheat. "He was 20 levels higher! Doesn't count." "I got DC'd, doesn't count!" "I didn't see him coming, doesn't count." "That's only the first time I died, it doesn't count!" etc.

Then you will see that "pvp looting will never work unless gear doesn't mean a thing. permadeath will never work unless there is no way to advance your character. "

Originally posted by Venger

Oh you're back I thought I shut you up a while ago.

Well what you twits can't seem to grasp is stealing and/or getting your stuff stolen is not challenge.  Ducking the reds was not a challenge in old UO it was an aggrivation and a waste of my time and money.  It is however acting out your anti-social behavior is a safe setting where you have no fear of punk ass smacked to the ground like the little bitch that you are.

I truely hope that do have a ffa loot server.  Then you'll have a bunch of wolf personality type all hiding waiting to jump someone.  Only problem is everyone on the entire server will be hiding waiting for someone to come that never will.  You will all eventually get bored move regular ffa server or move onto the next flavor of the month bitching and moaning about getting  ffa full loot throwing abour catch phrases like "you're chicken or carebear".

I played Asheron's Call on Darktide (the pvp server) for 3 years and that was the best time i've ever had pvping in a game, Sometimes you lost one of your really nice pieces of armor or one of your weapons and maybe you had to replace it with a crappy weapon and go out and kill some MOB's for a few hours to find a good one again or you could just go and keep pvping and hope you find a good weapon off someone else. It was all apart of the fun to alot of people on the server. So what i'm saying is that alot of people actually do find FFA pvp with item drop upon death fun and it adds an extra aspect to pvp. You may not find it fun so all i have to say to you is if you dont like it dont play on the server kinda thought that might be common sense but I guess not....

Originally posted by Venger

Oh you're back I thought I shut you up a while ago.

Well what you twits can't seem to grasp is stealing and/or getting your stuff stolen is not challenge.  Ducking the reds was not a challenge in old UO it was an aggrivation and a waste of my time and money.  It is however acting out your anti-social behavior is a safe setting where you have no fear of punk ass smacked to the ground like the little bitch that you are.

I truely hope that do have a ffa loot server.  Then you'll have a bunch of wolf personality type all hiding waiting to jump someone.  Only problem is everyone on the entire server will be hiding waiting for someone to come that never will.  You will all eventually get bored move regular ffa server or move onto the next flavor of the month bitching and moaning about getting  ffa full loot throwing abour catch phrases like "you're chicken or carebear".

This post made me laugh

Oh, I see how it is. Youre definition on fun and challenging is really the only one thats valid and everyone else is wrong. I mean, if it isnt challenging to you, instead its aggravating, then you know the rest of the world must think it too. Your word is law.

Sorry to bust your balls (if you have any) but the world actually DOESNT revolve around you. I know its hard to grasp, just hold on to another snobbish carebear's hand and Im sure you'll enjoy it more ;). Some people may like the idea of running around killing people over and over with no penalty, others like killing in a more dire enviorment where there are penalties to make it more exciting. It really all depends on what they enjoy. Again, like I said, there are guilds in AoC that are planning to go on the PvP servers so hardcore Pkr's are not exactly the minority for this game.

So please, if anything, stop wasting precious bandwidth space on your bitching and moaning. It isnt going to change anything. Here, let me get you a pacifier. Waa waa, boo hoo, Venger cant understand  why people are different than him.

Yeah please will be good if people can loot player corpses and steal from the peeps around, it will be so real.

anyway, I will not play AoC

Shadowbane have the best looting system, backpack items u can loot, equiped items u cant and theres banks all over the place where u stash your cash/spare items so when i go out to farm i always find a XP grp, pwn them and take whatever thay have found, also theres a skill that u can use to see if theres any enemies close to you and if u are a wuz like most ppl u can use a Scroll of Recall and just flee but everyone doesnt have that skill and everyone doesnt always have a SoR, best system that i know, also, shadowbane have Theif class that u can actually stealth up to a player peek hes backpack and steal something with a % chance to fail, like 10-20 chance to fail when u have that skill maxed but u turn visiable once u steal something, getting ready to steal something from someone really gets your heart pumping :)

Originally posted by Venger

Oh you're back I thought I shut you up a while ago.

Well what you twits can't seem to grasp is stealing and/or getting your stuff stolen is not challenge.  Ducking the reds was not a challenge in old UO it was an aggrivation and a waste of my time and money.  It is however acting out your anti-social behavior is a safe setting where you have no fear of punk ass smacked to the ground like the little bitch that you are.

I truely hope that do have a ffa loot server.  Then you'll have a bunch of wolf personality type all hiding waiting to jump someone.  Only problem is everyone on the entire server will be hiding waiting for someone to come that never will.  You will all eventually get bored move regular ffa server or move onto the next flavor of the month bitching and moaning about getting  ffa full loot throwing abour catch phrases like "you're chicken or carebear".

   Keep in mind UO is still in the top ten of subscription games and top ten rated games. I'll tell you what I'd rather lose my stuff than the sheer stupidity of losing skill points. One more thing, the name venger hardly suits someone afraid of losing the gear, try a new name.

Originally posted by havocthefirs

   Keep in mind UO is still in the top ten of subscription games and top ten rated games. I'll tell you what I'd rather lose my stuff than the sheer stupidity of losing skill points. One more thing, the name venger hardly suits someone afraid of losing the gear, try a new name.

I never said I wanted xp or skill point lose.  Why does challenge have to equate into something being lost.  Life is a challenge everyday and it not a struggle to keep my stuff from being stolen. 

What does my name have to do with anything?!?   Venger was a character in the old D&D cartoon.  You fail try again.

Originally posted by Vagor

 

So what you're saying is that having the chance to lose an item upon death is more of an aggrevation than adding a completely differant aspect to pvp and making it more fun for others. Yea other peoples idea's of fun may not be your idea of fun, I know hard to believe isnt it? Some people actually enjoy the added aspect of losing items when you die in pvp, It makes death really matter and if you lose a good item yea you might get mad, but also if you kill someone and get a good item that might make your day. 

 

I played Asheron's Call on Darktide (the pvp server) for 3 years and that was the best time i've ever had pvping in a game, Sometimes you lost one of your really nice pieces of armor or one of your weapons and maybe you had to replace it with a crappy weapon and go out and kill some MOB's for a few hours to find a good one again or you could just go and keep pvping and hope you find a good weapon off someone else. It was all apart of the fun to alot of people on the server. So what i'm saying is that alot of people actually do find FFA pvp with item drop upon death fun and it adds an extra aspect to pvp. You may not find it fun so all i have to say to you is if you dont like it dont play on the server kinda thought that might be common sense but I guess not....

I never said there is no place for any ffa loot server.  If you have a server like that I'm sure there will be some people that play on it.  Probably pretty low pop but as long as it holds it's own.  I am simple debating the point that tweedil de and tweedil (sp?) dumb beileve that this type of system is in such a high demand.  There is such an underground movement that everyone wants this play style.

Originally posted by Ghost12

 This post made me laugh

Oh, I see how it is. Youre definition on fun and challenging is really the only one thats valid and everyone else is wrong. I mean, if it isnt challenging to you, instead its aggravating, then you know the rest of the world must think it too. Your word is law.

Sorry to bust your balls (if you have any) but the world actually DOESNT revolve around you. I know its hard to grasp, just hold on to another snobbish carebear's hand and Im sure you'll enjoy it more ;). Some people may like the idea of running around killing people over and over with no penalty, others like killing in a more dire enviorment where there are penalties to make it more exciting. It really all depends on what they enjoy. Again, like I said, there are guilds in AoC that are planning to go on the PvP servers so hardcore Pkr's are not exactly the minority for this game.

So please, if anything, stop wasting precious bandwidth space on your bitching and moaning. It isnt going to change anything. Here, let me get you a pacifier. Waa waa, boo hoo, Venger cant understand  why people are different than him.

 

So I'm supposed to abandon my beileve because you say so.  Ah ok I'll get right on that.  OOOOOO whole guilds.  So you're telling me you have actually facts that there are a lot of guilds that want to go ffa loot pvp servers?  Please share that with the class.

How about this.  You stop talking out of your ass bring anything factual to the table to discuss.  You know what I don't understand people make up artificial facts and expect everyone to believe them.

In closing.  There will be pve servers and ffa pvp servers I'd assume more pve servers but that's just a guess.  Will there be a ffa pvp lootable server?  Maybe a small chance, but that has been my point all along.  There simple is not the population to support any more then one server of that type.

Originally posted by Venger

 

Originally posted by Ghost12

 This post made me laugh

Oh, I see how it is. Youre definition on fun and challenging is really the only one thats valid and everyone else is wrong. I mean, if it isnt challenging to you, instead its aggravating, then you know the rest of the world must think it too. Your word is law.

Sorry to bust your balls (if you have any) but the world actually DOESNT revolve around you. I know its hard to grasp, just hold on to another snobbish carebear's hand and Im sure you'll enjoy it more ;). Some people may like the idea of running around killing people over and over with no penalty, others like killing in a more dire enviorment where there are penalties to make it more exciting. It really all depends on what they enjoy. Again, like I said, there are guilds in AoC that are planning to go on the PvP servers so hardcore Pkr's are not exactly the minority for this game.

So please, if anything, stop wasting precious bandwidth space on your bitching and moaning. It isnt going to change anything. Here, let me get you a pacifier. Waa waa, boo hoo, Venger cant understand  why people are different than him.

 

No there are also people that like perma death but I doubt they will have a perma death server. 

 

So I'm supposed to abandon my beileve because you say so.  Ah ok I'll get right on that.  OOOOOO whole guilds.  So you're telling me you have actually facts that there are a lot of guilds that want to go ffa loot pvp servers?  Please share that with the class.

How about this.  You stop talking out of your ass bring anything factual to the table to discuss.  You know what I don't understand people make up artificial facts and expect everyone to believe them.

In closing.  There will be pve servers and ffa pvp servers I'd assume more pve servers but that's just a guess.  Will there be a ffa pvp lootable server?  Maybe a small chance, but that has been my point all along.  There simple is not the population to support any more then one server of that type.

There may not be enough demand for a server with that ruleset at all.  The FFA PvP audience may not be large enough to justify even one server in Funcom's eyes.  Which will disappoint FFA PvP fans, but it's the problem with a playstyle that as been demonstrated to have limited appeal.  People vote with their feet...and most do not want to participate.

Originally posted by SioBabble

 

 

There may not be enough demand for a server with that ruleset at all.  The FFA PvP audience may not be large enough to justify even one server in Funcom's eyes.  Which will disappoint FFA PvP fans, but it's the problem with a playstyle that as been demonstrated to have limited appeal.  People vote with their feet...and most do not want to participate.

Time will tell.  With the amount of people that WoW brought to the genre, which are now bored and playing WoW because there is nothing better, I'd bet there will be ffa servers.  I doubt that any type player looting has a chance in hell of making it in.

Actually quite a few people do like FFA pvp BUT it must be handled properly in order for alot of people to enjoy it, just look at Morded on DAoC and Darktide on Asheron's Call. Both of which were FFA pvp servers and both of which did very well in their prime when everything was going right and it was actually fun. What ended up ruining them was tweaks here and there, expansions, and nerfs. Darktide never really did die off until Asheron's Call started losing alot of people just in general as the game got older, but that happened to all the servers and not just Darktide. Anyways what im trying to say is there are plenty of people that do enjoy FFA pvp, enough to justify actually having at least one server with that ruleset if Funcom can handle it properly. If not than it could end up being a complete flop of a server, but in the end it's all up to Funcom and what they decide to do.

Originally posted by Vagor

Actually quite a few people do like FFA pvp BUT it must be handled properly in order for alot of people to enjoy it, just look at Morded on DAoC and Darktide on Asheron's Call. Both of which were FFA pvp servers and both of which did very well in their prime when everything was going right and it was actually fun. What ended up ruining them was tweaks here and there, expansions, and nerfs. Darktide never really did die off until Asheron's Call started losing alot of people just in general as the game got older, but that happened to all the servers and not just Darktide. Anyways what im trying to say is there are plenty of people that do enjoy FFA pvp, enough to justify actually having at least one server with that ruleset if Funcom can handle it properly. If not than it could end up being a complete flop of a server, but in the end it's all up to Funcom and what they decide to do.

There may be where those server loot servers or just FFA.  What kind of handling are you talking about?  UO handled it terrible and I never played AC or DaoC.

DAoC had no item drops but when you killed people they would drop a bag of money and the amount depended on their level. That money wasn't actually taken from your inventory but it reflects the amount of money you would have to pay to get your constitution stat back to full because you lost 3 constituition on death. You didn't lose items and only a little bit of money upon death if you chose to get your constitution back right away. The death penalty wasn't very high and class balance was pretty good, which resulted in a pretty fun FFA pvp environment.

Asheron's Call had something called a Vitae Penalty, everytime you died you got 5 Vitae which reduced your overall effectivness by 5% with a max of 40%. You had to go pve and gain experiance to work the penalty off which would keep people from just mindless ganking because after a few deaths you would be considerably weaker. Also there was item droping you would drop x amount of items based on your level and what items you droped was based on the value of the items you had, You would drop the most valuable items first. This meant that many people carried things called death items, just junk items that you dont need but are worth alot to avoid dropping you armor or weapon. Both games did have flaws with pvp that people didn't like, but overall I found them both very fun and enjoyable and so did alot of other people because neither DAoC or Asheron's Call FFA pvp servers had any population problems until the game itself started losing subscribers in general.

AoC blood money system sounds a lot like DaoC system.  Was there level restriction, pentalty for excessive ganking?