D&D Online Forum » The Rusty Nail (General) » Is DDO worth playing now that it is F2P ?

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

If the Mobs are not actively keeping up then they should not slow me down. Turbine is once again wasting time on a system that is simply unneedede. Even as Sarr says they are making changes because MANY players do not like it. Personally I see this as an attempt to get vets to leave because Turbine figures they can make more money if the vets are not here to screw up all the new players flooding in to try to F2P. Of course this requires enough people coming in and paying to make losing them a profitable experience.
 

Purpose behind it, due to very numerous stress tests in beta (one each week), is reducing the lag. People zerging in one quest, alarming armies of monsters, create server-wide lag. Phax explained that it's mostly because DDO has very developed collision system an AI. When there's an army of monsters, each of them tries to find path around each other monster. Number of calculations if going nuts.

Previously they tried in beta other approach - doors in some quests which cause lag. You couldn't get past them before you've cleaned some monsters. This approach is less restrictive, as many rouges complained they can't do stealth quests anymore with those doors.

Other thing worth mentioning is an improvement to Stealth and how it works. You can now hide again once you're found, and monsters lose path to you in time. It needs some tweaking, as I've seen personally Kobolds with GPS and sonar systems to find my rogue, but rogue players are pretty psyched about it : ).

Originally posted by Sarr

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

If the Mobs are not actively keeping up then they should not slow me down. Turbine is once again wasting time on a system that is simply unneedede. Even as Sarr says they are making changes because MANY players do not like it. Personally I see this as an attempt to get vets to leave because Turbine figures they can make more money if the vets are not here to screw up all the new players flooding in to try to F2P. Of course this requires enough people coming in and paying to make losing them a profitable experience.
 

 

Purpose behind it, due to very numerous stress tests in beta (one each week), is reducing the lag. People zerging in one quest, alarming armies of monsters, create server-wide lag. Phax explained that it's mostly because DDO has very developed collision system an AI. When there's an army of monsters, each of them tries to find path around each other monster. Number of calculations if going nuts.

Previously they tried in beta other approach - doors in some quests which cause lag. You couldn't get past them before you've cleaned some monsters. This approach is less restrictive, as many rouges complained they can't do stealth quests anymore with those doors.

Other thing worth mentioning is an improvement to Stealth and how it works. You can now hide again once you're found, and monsters lose path to you in time. It needs some tweaking, as I've seen personally Kobolds with GPS and sonar systems to find my rogue, but rogue players are pretty psyched about it : ).

I will believe if helps lag when and if it actually does. Until then this is a mechanic to force players to play a certain way. Almost all of DDOs monsters are on a leash so the reality is after a certain distance monsters path back and are unhittable during that trip. So the reality is you never really have an army of monsters after you since DDO added leashing.  While this may cause some of the lag I highly doubt it is what is causing all of the lag since the lag on Thelanis was very hit or miss and was happening at 3AM EST with 100 people in game and the same lag would hit on a Saturday prime time with 750 people online.
 

Turbine has "found" the cause of lag multiple times so far and each time they were wrong. Sarr we have been running past these same parts of the same quests for a couple of years but the lag started much later then the zerging of the quests. Sorry but I am not buying their excuse since one started way after the other.

I don't really feel like re-hashing all the many valid critiques by various people that are already on the DDO forum.  Suffice it to say that these critiques are not only valid but that the design can never adequately address the problem it is attempting too.

This is not a matter of "details" or tweaks.  This is a matter of not addressing, or even understanding the problem.  This will not address 50% of the behavior of "zergers"  many zergers don't herd, some do.

It causes a number of problems and solves almost none.  Its crap.  And yes that is a technical term.  And its not a pile of crap.  This is like a bad case of fisherman's crack where you can never have enough toilet paper but you just keep wiping.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Sarr 

Purpose behind it, due to very numerous stress tests in beta (one each week), is reducing the lag. People zerging in one quest, alarming armies of monsters, create server-wide lag. Phax explained that it's mostly because DDO has very developed collision system an AI. When there's an army of monsters, each of them tries to find path around each other monster. Number of calculations if going nuts.

Previously they tried in beta other approach - doors in some quests which cause lag. You couldn't get past them before you've cleaned some monsters. This approach is less restrictive, as many rouges complained they can't do stealth quests anymore with those doors.

Other thing worth mentioning is an improvement to Stealth and how it works. You can now hide again once you're found, and monsters lose path to you in time. It needs some tweaking, as I've seen personally Kobolds with GPS and sonar systems to find my rogue, but rogue players are pretty psyched about it : ).

I will believe if helps lag when and if it actually does. Until then this is a mechanic to force players to play a certain way. Almost all of DDOs monsters are on a leash so the reality is after a certain distance monsters path back and are unhittable during that trip. So the reality is you never really have an army of monsters after you since DDO added leashing.  While this may cause some of the lag I highly doubt it is what is causing all of the lag since the lag on Thelanis was very hit or miss and was happening at 3AM EST with 100 people in game and the same lag would hit on a Saturday prime time with 750 people online.
 

 

Turbine has "found" the cause of lag multiple times so far and each time they were wrong. Sarr we have been running past these same parts of the same quests for a couple of years but the lag started much later then the zerging of the quests. Sorry but I am not buying their excuse since one started way after the other.

I know what you're talking about, but you don't understand what exactly is being done, that's the problem.

DDO will have more players then it ever had. Stress tests were done to minimize the server-wide lag, and with each tests, players report less lag. So it works, but it's not only thanks to "DA" system.

There are different reasons for lag. I will mention only some examples:

1. Quest specific lag: There is lag in Shavarath, which is mostly raid-exclusive issue. It's being actively worked on, according to Devs.

2. Lag caused by too many players in one Hube - for example, Marketplace. Having 6 Instances of Marketplace, while most were doing new quests there, caused server-wide lag. Or at least Marketplace-wide, since different instances may be on different servers in DDO. It's possible that Market overload has no impact on Korthos or Harbor, for instance, not to mention Gianthold, etc.

This lag is being addressed by many things. Firstly, Devs rebuild combat hit & damage system behind the scenes. This is a change they did on the code size, not impacting gameplay. Well, in fact it impacted gameplay - I was playing after the patch introducing this change, and noticed less lag, faster monster / hit responses, etc. My friend noticed it too. Few days later they explained that they rewrote the code behind melee combat, to make it lag less.

3. "DPS lag", look above. Turbine bought new hardware again last week or so to help with server capacity and lag even more.

I don't think Turbine has much interest in changing playstyles. More obvious is reducing the lag, and it seems to work, can't deny it. But, if they wanted to reduce rushing / zerging, I applaud to that. That's the worst thing newcommer can encounter in groups, rushers.

Person below says it won't change zerging at all, because it's still possible. Well, then you should be happy. Zerging and rushing just got more elite and rare, those who can do it may be proud of thesmelves. At the same time, 50 noobs rushing the same dugneon in 70 groups won't be the case, beacuse it got harder, more challenging. And this surely reduces server load.

Keep in mind people, that DDO:U will have much more players than you could imagine on old DDO. Or at least, game must be prepared for it. Login queues were even on the first stress test, and now population of Lamannia (beta server for those who not know) is much bigger. This means that if lag is slightly reduced each time, capacity of servers must grow rapidly thanks to Turbine's efforts.

Well, I was a beta and Founder member for DDO so my recollections are mainly from their first year but I found the quest structure, combat style and character creation to be top notch. Might be the best combat in any mmo actually. The graphics seem to have kept up (dx10) and still have a look that I enjoy. I could go on about specifics but suffice it to say that I liked the general tone of the game yet...I left because of a few simple reasons.

My friends did not want to pay another monthly fee for a weekly gaming night (for which I find DDO a perfect fit) and honestly I always thought DDO should have been $9.99/month with some occasional paid expansions.

Another thing that disturbed me about DDO was also one of its best features. The ability to create a very specific character template from choices in multiclassing, weapon specialization, racial abilities, spell selections, etc. allows for creation of an individualized vision of your character. It also prompts an elitist attitude toward min/maxing that pervades the forums and many groups/guilds. While this attitude is not specific to DDO I found that it was more entrenched there than in many games.

Along with this attitude is the awful realization that most of them are correct because of the game mechanics. There are some splash based (1 or 2 classes giving 1 or 2 levels to a build) classes that are simply beasts. They are the flavor of the month demigods that set the tone for every group. Usually 2 levels of rogue for Evasion or 2 levels Pally for the saves. Many times both. There is very little reason to stay pure classed unless you are a sorceror (again, just popular theory)

Make a ranged specific character - gimped (and you will be told so)

Make an even split fighter/wizard - gimped (you may enjoy it and it may seem powerful enough but you are gimped. They will tell you)

Heck, choose the wrong stat allocation at character creation and you are gimped.

This can be good or bad in that the system can be rather complex and that it requires some research, some knowledge of endgame and some experimentation (which is a good thing imo) in order to flesh out a build. However, the system is unforgiving, if you listen to the vet crowd, and equally dependent upon very specific pieces of gear which you will have to run specific quests MULTIPLE times to acquire.

Now, after saying all of that, much of this can be dismissed if you play with a more casual crowd or some friends that just want to adventure. So I am hoping that the free to play model will bring in some fresh blood and my friends that have a renewed interest in the game can find a home here for some occasional dungeon delving. As they add quests and prestige classes perhaps the 'grindy' aspects will become less noticeable.

In other words I'm going to give it a shot and if the money works out in favor of subscribing for what I want to do in-game then I will gladly pay. Otherwise I'll probably keep it on the harddrive for some solo play and random pug questing for a bit.

I don't have a problem with min/max stuff.  In fact I rather like it.  But unlike Guild Wars you are very much stuck with what you have in DDO, even to the point of no respecs on key things like skills.

The problem with the elitist Min/Max'ing in DDO is that some people basically get treated like crap.  Elitist BS is tolerable if you can swap specs around like in Guild Wars.  Then it is only a matter on if you are up on and able to execute a certain number of good builds.  

But in DDO there are these rather deep divisions that don't cross over, some of whom have no facility other than a re-roll to cross over.

I personally like min/max'ing and i have no real problem with a significant portion of the playerbase striving for excellence in their characters.  However due to the way DDO compartmentalizes groups of players you tend to get people also acting like A-holes because of it and that is certainly not ok.

One of the things people who frequent these forums should constantly strive to be aware is the mob psychology that grips playerbases.   As soon as they get divvied up into "groups" empathy for people who are part of the "other group" tends to go out the window.  And it becomes an excuse to behave however you like.

DDO suffers from this in many ways not just min/max'ing

---

Originally posted by gestalt11
*snip*
DDO suffers from this in many ways not just min/max'ing

---

Agreed on all points. Again, I should say that I don't mind min/maxing either although DDO allows for the creation of some truly powerful builds that so far eclipse the average player build to the point that you copycat or risk getting excluded. In most MMOs the build difference can be significant but I feel that in DDO it is rather extreme.

The community can be helpful and is fairly mature considering but there is an underlying current of "this is our private playground" but we will see as I am judging by forum posts and second hand player experiences.

Originally posted by Sarr

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Sarr 

Purpose behind it, due to very numerous stress tests in beta (one each week), is reducing the lag. People zerging in one quest, alarming armies of monsters, create server-wide lag. Phax explained that it's mostly because DDO has very developed collision system an AI. When there's an army of monsters, each of them tries to find path around each other monster. Number of calculations if going nuts.

Previously they tried in beta other approach - doors in some quests which cause lag. You couldn't get past them before you've cleaned some monsters. This approach is less restrictive, as many rouges complained they can't do stealth quests anymore with those doors.

Other thing worth mentioning is an improvement to Stealth and how it works. You can now hide again once you're found, and monsters lose path to you in time. It needs some tweaking, as I've seen personally Kobolds with GPS and sonar systems to find my rogue, but rogue players are pretty psyched about it : ).

I will believe if helps lag when and if it actually does. Until then this is a mechanic to force players to play a certain way. Almost all of DDOs monsters are on a leash so the reality is after a certain distance monsters path back and are unhittable during that trip. So the reality is you never really have an army of monsters after you since DDO added leashing.  While this may cause some of the lag I highly doubt it is what is causing all of the lag since the lag on Thelanis was very hit or miss and was happening at 3AM EST with 100 people in game and the same lag would hit on a Saturday prime time with 750 people online.
 

 

Turbine has "found" the cause of lag multiple times so far and each time they were wrong. Sarr we have been running past these same parts of the same quests for a couple of years but the lag started much later then the zerging of the quests. Sorry but I am not buying their excuse since one started way after the other.

 

I know what you're talking about, but you don't understand what exactly is being done, that's the problem.

DDO will have more players then it ever had. Stress tests were done to minimize the server-wide lag, and with each tests, players report less lag. So it works, but it's not only thanks to "DA" system.

There are different reasons for lag. I will mention only some examples:

1. Quest specific lag: There is lag in Shavarath, which is mostly raid-exclusive issue. It's being actively worked on, according to Devs.

2. Lag caused by too many players in one Hube - for example, Marketplace. Having 6 Instances of Marketplace, while most were doing new quests there, caused server-wide lag. Or at least Marketplace-wide, since different instances may be on different servers in DDO. It's possible that Market overload has no impact on Korthos or Harbor, for instance, not to mention Gianthold, etc.

This lag is being addressed by many things. Firstly, Devs rebuild combat hit & damage system behind the scenes. This is a change they did on the code size, not impacting gameplay. Well, in fact it impacted gameplay - I was playing after the patch introducing this change, and noticed less lag, faster monster / hit responses, etc. My friend noticed it too. Few days later they explained that they rewrote the code behind melee combat, to make it lag less.

3. "DPS lag", look above. Turbine bought new hardware again last week or so to help with server capacity and lag even more.

I don't think Turbine has much interest in changing playstyles. More obvious is reducing the lag, and it seems to work, can't deny it. But, if they wanted to reduce rushing / zerging, I applaud to that. That's the worst thing newcommer can encounter in groups, rushers.

Person below says it won't change zerging at all, because it's still possible. Well, then you should be happy. Zerging and rushing just got more elite and rare, those who can do it may be proud of thesmelves. At the same time, 50 noobs rushing the same dugneon in 70 groups won't be the case, beacuse it got harder, more challenging. And this surely reduces server load.

Keep in mind people, that DDO:U will have much more players than you could imagine on old DDO. Or at least, game must be prepared for it. Login queues were even on the first stress test, and now population of Lamannia (beta server for those who not know) is much bigger. This means that if lag is slightly reduced each time, capacity of servers must grow rapidly thanks to Turbine's efforts.

Sarr the biggest problem you and I have is your first line. You always think you understand everything and no one else does. It makes talking to you and debating points with you a worthless attempt.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Sarr 

I know what you're talking about, but you don't understand what exactly is being done, that's the problem.

DDO will have more players then it ever had. Stress tests were done to minimize the server-wide lag, and with each tests, players report less lag. So it works, but it's not only thanks to "DA" system.

There are different reasons for lag. I will mention only some examples:

1. Quest specific lag: There is lag in Shavarath, which is mostly raid-exclusive issue. It's being actively worked on, according to Devs.

2. Lag caused by too many players in one Hube - for example, Marketplace. Having 6 Instances of Marketplace, while most were doing new quests there, caused server-wide lag. Or at least Marketplace-wide, since different instances may be on different servers in DDO. It's possible that Market overload has no impact on Korthos or Harbor, for instance, not to mention Gianthold, etc.

This lag is being addressed by many things. Firstly, Devs rebuild combat hit & damage system behind the scenes. This is a change they did on the code size, not impacting gameplay. Well, in fact it impacted gameplay - I was playing after the patch introducing this change, and noticed less lag, faster monster / hit responses, etc. My friend noticed it too. Few days later they explained that they rewrote the code behind melee combat, to make it lag less.

3. "DPS lag", look above. Turbine bought new hardware again last week or so to help with server capacity and lag even more.

I don't think Turbine has much interest in changing playstyles. More obvious is reducing the lag, and it seems to work, can't deny it. But, if they wanted to reduce rushing / zerging, I applaud to that. That's the worst thing newcommer can encounter in groups, rushers.

Person below says it won't change zerging at all, because it's still possible. Well, then you should be happy. Zerging and rushing just got more elite and rare, those who can do it may be proud of thesmelves. At the same time, 50 noobs rushing the same dugneon in 70 groups won't be the case, beacuse it got harder, more challenging. And this surely reduces server load.

Keep in mind people, that DDO:U will have much more players than you could imagine on old DDO. Or at least, game must be prepared for it. Login queues were even on the first stress test, and now population of Lamannia (beta server for those who not know) is much bigger. This means that if lag is slightly reduced each time, capacity of servers must grow rapidly thanks to Turbine's efforts.

 

Sarr the biggest problem you and I have is your first line. You always think you understand everything and no one else does. It makes talking to you and debating points with you a worthless attempt.

Yes, there's no point in arguing with me if you don't have constructive arguments. As I have those. I will agree with anyone who proves I'm wrong, by speaking constructively. I have no purpose in being "right", I like to be wrong as that way we learn.

What I have written in this long post were facts from DDO forums. I just wanted to explain it to you, so you could get bigger picture (as I understand you didn't know those things). There wasn't any offense meant, if you took it, I apologize sincerely.

There's some news on lag-fixing today:

Phax:

"Hey all,

Quick update. First, thanks for all your contributions to this thread and for taking the initiative to test this stuff! It did help.

After some more internal testing yesterday we're pretty confident we've located the issue as a graphics problem on the client (likely with particle effects).

I'll try and keep you informed as things progressed.

Thanks again!"

Source: forums.ddo.com/showthread.php

As we can see, lag is a priority issue to fix for Turbine.

About the elitism:

I'm a D&D veteran. And I DON'T Min/Max at all. Playing this game for more than 1,5 year now. Yes, I could do it, but find no fun in it. People who would call me a gimp, or something like that, are ingored and it was always like that. I find no better value in having an Uber-Monster Slayer, than having great fun with average character (they can call them gimps, to me that's silly).

In other words, elitism isn't a mature thing by any means. As it's not mature, I don't see any reason to feel bad when elitists criticize me. It's worthless anyway, we all have our ways to play and should respect them.

But to be honest, while I can find elitists on forums, in real game that's rare. I often create LFMs, and if someone is behaving rude or something like that, he's kicked out from the party. That's the best way to teach elitists some manners .

Originally posted by Sarr

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Sarr 

I know what you're talking about, but you don't understand what exactly is being done, that's the problem.

DDO will have more players then it ever had. Stress tests were done to minimize the server-wide lag, and with each tests, players report less lag. So it works, but it's not only thanks to "DA" system.

There are different reasons for lag. I will mention only some examples:

1. Quest specific lag: There is lag in Shavarath, which is mostly raid-exclusive issue. It's being actively worked on, according to Devs.

2. Lag caused by too many players in one Hube - for example, Marketplace. Having 6 Instances of Marketplace, while most were doing new quests there, caused server-wide lag. Or at least Marketplace-wide, since different instances may be on different servers in DDO. It's possible that Market overload has no impact on Korthos or Harbor, for instance, not to mention Gianthold, etc.

This lag is being addressed by many things. Firstly, Devs rebuild combat hit & damage system behind the scenes. This is a change they did on the code size, not impacting gameplay. Well, in fact it impacted gameplay - I was playing after the patch introducing this change, and noticed less lag, faster monster / hit responses, etc. My friend noticed it too. Few days later they explained that they rewrote the code behind melee combat, to make it lag less.

3. "DPS lag", look above. Turbine bought new hardware again last week or so to help with server capacity and lag even more.

I don't think Turbine has much interest in changing playstyles. More obvious is reducing the lag, and it seems to work, can't deny it. But, if they wanted to reduce rushing / zerging, I applaud to that. That's the worst thing newcommer can encounter in groups, rushers.

Person below says it won't change zerging at all, because it's still possible. Well, then you should be happy. Zerging and rushing just got more elite and rare, those who can do it may be proud of thesmelves. At the same time, 50 noobs rushing the same dugneon in 70 groups won't be the case, beacuse it got harder, more challenging. And this surely reduces server load.

Keep in mind people, that DDO:U will have much more players than you could imagine on old DDO. Or at least, game must be prepared for it. Login queues were even on the first stress test, and now population of Lamannia (beta server for those who not know) is much bigger. This means that if lag is slightly reduced each time, capacity of servers must grow rapidly thanks to Turbine's efforts.

 

Sarr the biggest problem you and I have is your first line. You always think you understand everything and no one else does. It makes talking to you and debating points with you a worthless attempt.

 

Yes, there's no point in arguing with me if you don't have constructive arguments. As I have those. I will agree with anyone who proves I'm wrong, by speaking constructively. I have no purpose in being "right", I like to be wrong as that way we learn.

What I have written in this long post were facts from DDO forums. I just wanted to explain it to you, so you could get bigger picture (as I understand you didn't know those things). There wasn't any offense meant, if you took it, I apologize sincerely.

There's some news on lag-fixing today:

Phax:

"Hey all,

Quick update. First, thanks for all your contributions to this thread and for taking the initiative to test this stuff! It did help.

After some more internal testing yesterday we're pretty confident we've located the issue as a graphics problem on the client (likely with particle effects).

I'll try and keep you informed as things progressed.

Thanks again!"

Source: forums.ddo.com/showthread.php

As we can see, lag is a priority issue to fix for Turbine.

 

About the elitism:

I'm a D&D veteran. And I DON'T Min/Max at all. Playing this game for more than 1,5 year now. Yes, I could do it, but find no fun in it. People who would call me a gimp, or something like that, are ingored and it was always like that. I find no better value in having an Uber-Monster Slayer, than having great fun with average character (they can call them gimps, to me that's silly).

In other words, elitism isn't a mature thing by any means. As it's not mature, I don't see any reason to feel bad when elitists criticize me. It's worthless anyway, we all have our ways to play and should respect them.

But to be honest, while I can find elitists on forums, in real game that's rare. I often create LFMs, and if someone is behaving rude or something like that, he's kicked out from the party. That's the best way to teach elitists some manners .

Sarr I know more about the lag then you seem to or think I do. The worst lag started right when they farmed out the servers instead of keeping them in house. Coincedence? I think not. As far as being a priority fix, Turbine spent as little time and money trying to fix lag and for the forst few months claimed it was everyone computers. Please stop trying to bring me facts when I read the DDO forums as well.
 

Your constructive arguments are and have always been nothing but fanboy fluff. To this day you swear DDO was gaining population. You and facts rarely meet.

"Is DDO worth playing now that it is F2P ?"

IMO, no.  I downloaded, installed, created a character (with the limited options available, you have to pay for some classes, races, etc., logged in and played for a while, logged out, and deleted it. 

It's still DDO (I played beta and release for a while), it hasn't changed much.  Even for free, it's a stinker...

And here new DDO:U got 9/10 in review:

www.girlgamersuk.com/2009/07/dungeons-and-dragons-online-eberron-unlimited-part-1/

Way to go.

Originally posted by Sarr

And here new DDO:U got 9/10 in review:

www.girlgamersuk.com/2009/07/dungeons-and-dragons-online-eberron-unlimited-part-1/

Way to go.

Very professional review.

Originally posted by TwystedWiz

"Is DDO worth playing now that it is F2P ?"

It's still DDO (I played beta and release for a while), it hasn't changed much.  Even for free, it's a stinker...

It's comments like this that really deserve a laugh.

A person tries it during Beta, over 3 years ago, and claims it hasn't changed "much" to go even further by proffessing experiance with the game while not ever playing it by their own account. haha!

I suspect people reading these forums can see right through it. 

:)

Originally posted by mindspat

Originally posted by TwystedWiz

"Is DDO worth playing now that it is F2P ?"

It's still DDO (I played beta and release for a while), it hasn't changed much.  Even for free, it's a stinker...

It's comments like this that really deserve a laugh.

A person tries it during Beta, over 3 years ago, and claims it hasn't changed "much" to go even further by proffessing experiance with the game while not ever playing it by their own account. haha!

I suspect people reading these forums can see right through it. 

:)

 

 

Anyone who says I played beta and a little after release and then says it has not changed much 3 years later can safely be ignored as a source of information.
 

Hello, I`m new to D&D (played only 4 sessions since I bought the books) and very new to DDO (just got into beta for DDO:U), but I wanted to share my impressions about the game (excuse my English, its not native). I`ll be quick.

First off, I was surprised by the graphic quality of the environment and character detail. Played on maximum and there barely was any strain on my mid-level machine. I created a Halfling Rogue (yay, available for free edition), and proceeded to tutorial.

Action bar quite simple and efficient, very manageable learning curve, took me just a few clicks to adjust my controls and settings thanks to an intuitive interface. I was able to get things going in no time.

The thing that surprised me in quite a good way was the voice-over for characters and events. Next pleasant surprise was the ease with which I have 'mastered' combat controls. No keyboard spamming, no cycles of spells and countdowns to take into account. And, as some may have noticed, no LMB spam. It suffices to keep the button pressed and the attacks are automatically performed.

Tutorial area contains enough elements to introduce you to game mechanics, concepts and general approach. Its in this area you'll grow to love the game - or hate it. Fortunately (?) for me, I loved it. Or better say liked it. You'll familiarize yourself with navigation, NPC interraction, combat, climbing ladders, fighting monsters, getting and completing quests, using your class abilities etc.

Most MMO gamers will dislike the fact you will NOT get XP for killing monsters but you'll get XP for completing quests (as in real D&D games in fact). But the grind factor is still present - you can run a dungeon multiple times to get XP or to try to get an useful item from the chest if the first time random drop was mean to you.

Starter town is also simple to navigate around. Map and Minimap come in real handy to find your destination (if you have a quest in a particular dungeon, the entrance will be lit up on the map). Class trainers give you all the info you need to advance.

One more 'plus' thing and I'll finish off. Atmosphere in the dungeon is fantastic. I had to run a quest in a zombie infested dungeon. I got goosebumps while navigating the dark corridors, hearing the wailing of the undead in my headphones, fearing for what I'll come face to face around the corner, hoping my Sneak ability will keep me safe. I ran that dungeon three times just for the thrill of it :) 

Conclusion

So far (I only reached lvl 3) all I can say is this game has been fashioned in true D20 style, any D&D fan will have no trouble getting accustomed to the game. I, for one, being a novice in D&D and a somewhat veteran of MMOs, am very keen to get back home and continue my adventures. I recommend this game to anyone eager to try something new. Game is by no means  polished, its still bugged and glitches are present, but if you value gameplay over gamelooks, DDO is for you.

Hope this helps.

Cheers!

/R.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Sarr

And here new DDO:U got 9/10 in review:

www.girlgamersuk.com/2009/07/dungeons-and-dragons-online-eberron-unlimited-part-1/

Way to go.

 

Very professional review.

What is a proffesional review?

<Mod Edit>

Of course, DDO is a game that if you wanted to write a good review of, you'd need to play some big amount of time in it. At levels 4-6 game may completely "get" you, as content is getting much better and more epic. First hint of such things should be "Halls of Shan To Khor" quests. I remember myself going there for the first time - I had NO idea how big and epic D&D dungoens can be, until I went there. Later on, we may forget such "awesome" moments as we get more and more used to it all, but it certainly is something a person who want to review a game in-depth should experience.

So, if first looks are so positive (my weren't!), we can think it's a good way to get players hooked into some "serious" dungeoncraft later in the game : ).

I Like D&DO and wish it would hit big, but as I have said before in other posts. People like to move forward, not backwards. Will it bring people in? Yes. It's a commercial grade game going FTP. Free appeals to allot of people. Especially in this economy.

I think they should think about making a D&DO2 and move forward. I am a fan of the game and will continue playing free or not. And wish D&DO lots of luck, but the reality is it’s not going to make it the next big game no matter how much I wish it would.

Originally posted by Giddian

I Like D&DO and wish it would hit big, but as I have said before in other posts. People like to move forward, not backwards. Will it bring people in? Yes. It's a commercial grade game going FTP. Free appeals to allot of people. Especially in this economy.

I think they should think about making a D&DO2 and move forward. I am a fan of the game and will continue playing free or not. And wish D&DO lots of luck, but the reality is it’s not going to make it the next big game no matter how much I wish it would.

As long as Turbine is not making DDO2 I would be all for that.

Originally posted by Sarr

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Sarr

And here new DDO:U got 9/10 in review:

www.girlgamersuk.com/2009/07/dungeons-and-dragons-online-eberron-unlimited-part-1/

Way to go.

 

Very professional review.

 

What is a proffesional review?

<Mod Edit>

Of course, DDO is a game that if you wanted to write a good review of, you'd need to play some big amount of time in it. At levels 4-6 game may completely "get" you, as content is getting much better and more epic. First hint of such things should be "Halls of Shan To Khor" quests. I remember myself going there for the first time - I had NO idea how big and epic D&D dungoens can be, until I went there. Later on, we may forget such "awesome" moments as we get more and more used to it all, but it certainly is something a person who want to review a game in-depth should experience.

So, if first looks are so positive (my weren't!), we can think it's a good way to get players hooked into some "serious" dungeoncraft later in the game : ).

When you brag about it getting a 9/10 in a review and then link it to a review like that you missed the point. I want a review by someone with more than a week in the game. A review by someone who does not know the game is not of much use.
 

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Giddian

I Like D&DO and wish it would hit big, but as I have said before in other posts. People like to move forward, not backwards. Will it bring people in? Yes. It's a commercial grade game going FTP. Free appeals to allot of people. Especially in this economy.

I think they should think about making a D&DO2 and move forward. I am a fan of the game and will continue playing free or not. And wish D&DO lots of luck, but the reality is it’s not going to make it the next big game no matter how much I wish it would.

 

As long as Turbine is not making DDO2 I would be all for that.

I am for that in distant future, but exactly opposite - if TURBINE was making DDO2 only.

If you think any other company would go the "hard way" and implement so much of D&D system, it's naive thinking. Actually it would be fun to see those poeople who complain how "Turbine go away from classic DDO rules!", just to see another company totally removing D20 system and making something open-world like WAR Online.

I mean, if they did it - they'd be rich. Though most real D&D Pen&Paper players would feel like they've stabbed in the back. In other words, it's sure thing there's not big MMO company these days which would make it really D&D, like DDO is. More important for their buck is just Forgetten Realms setting, licensed characters and places, etc. That's enough to make WoW-clone in popular D&D Camnaign Setting a hit with milions of subscribers.

Who cares for D&D PnP players? They are easy to upset, and not numerous enough to cover those issues. PnP players are those easiest to lose, and with highest demands. I'm still impressed with Turbine's implementation, they could stray from D&D much more and get more money as a gratitude.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

When you brag about it getting a 9/10 in a review and then link it to a review like that you missed the point. I want a review by someone with more than a week in the game. A review by someone who does not know the game is not of much use.  

Firstly, I don't brag about it very much. I express that I'm happy with such good note, and I know other sites tend to be positive too.

Sure it wasn't great, detailed review. But it's only beta now anyway, so in this category it's fine by me. And I know the game, I don't need a review. If that person found DDO worthwhile, that's good - I find it a great game too. This review encourages people to try the game for themselves, and since it's going to be free, nothing wrong in that. But there will be other D&D reviews, and there is one other I can think as of now:

Reading: "10 Things I Hate About DDO - MMORPG News - MMO HUB.org"

mmohub.org/news/10-things-i-hate-about-ddo/447/

Reading: 10 Things I Love About: "Dungeons & Dragons Online" - MMORPG News - MMO HUB.org

mmohub.org/news/10-things-i-love-about-ddo/446/

I hope you find it better for a short form review, I do.

i could give you a beta key for the ftp  

Originally posted by Sarr

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Giddian

I Like D&DO and wish it would hit big, but as I have said before in other posts. People like to move forward, not backwards. Will it bring people in? Yes. It's a commercial grade game going FTP. Free appeals to allot of people. Especially in this economy.

I think they should think about making a D&DO2 and move forward. I am a fan of the game and will continue playing free or not. And wish D&DO lots of luck, but the reality is it’s not going to make it the next big game no matter how much I wish it would.

 

As long as Turbine is not making DDO2 I would be all for that.

 

I am for that in distant future, but exactly opposite - if TURBINE was making DDO2 only.

If you think any other company would go the "hard way" and implement so much of D&D system, it's naive thinking. Actually it would be fun to see those poeople who complain how "Turbine go away from classic DDO rules!", just to see another company totally removing D20 system and making something open-world like WAR Online.

I mean, if they did it - they'd be rich. Though most real D&D Pen&Paper players would feel like they've stabbed in the back. In other words, it's sure thing there's not big MMO company these days which would make it really D&D, like DDO is. More important for their buck is just Forgetten Realms setting, licensed characters and places, etc. That's enough to make WoW-clone in popular D&D Camnaign Setting a hit with milions of subscribers.

Who cares for D&D PnP players? They are easy to upset, and not numerous enough to cover those issues. PnP players are those easiest to lose, and with highest demands. I'm still impressed with Turbine's implementation, they could stray from D&D much more and get more money as a gratitude.

You make posts that are pure opinion try to sound like facts when the truth is you have no clue. An open world D&D game that removes the D20 system would not be a D&D game and you have no proof it would make anyone rich. Do you not think zturbine wanted millions of subscribers? Do you think they kept DDO small because they liked knowing all their customers on a personal level? Can you be this naive?

Please explain to me why if there was a game that most D&D PnP players hated because it went away from the rules it would be a hit? You understand that most people who come to DDO have played or at least know of D&D right? So if the game completely went away from D&D how the hell would it appeal to millions and still be a D&D game. Your example makes as much sense as most of your posts and trust me when I say that is not much.

Sarr only people like you want to see Turbine take the D&D name and bury it further. How can you want to see Turbine get another shot at ruining D&D as an MMO? Or does the fact DDO is going F2P Hybrid because it failed as a pay per play simply ellude your astute observational powers?

I'll keep this one as brief as possible.

Is it worth free play ?- most definitely.

Do I feel the same attachment that I have with WOW, EQ, LOTRO  or even the ill fated Earth and Beyond? - no.

Would I now continue to play DDO? - yes.

Is the shop (pay to play) idea a good one for the Eberron world of DDO? - hell yes and a smart move by Turbine who apparently have a small group of haters in the crowd here. Met some of the LOTRO and Asherons Call staff in the past and they are a great group of people who do contrary to "opinions" (which are as profuse and related to a part of the human anatomy) listen to their public with constructive criticism.

Should they adopt Forgotten Realms? Yes, but be careful with that baby as it's a world where people have truly become attached myself included. They've succesfully handled Lord of the Rings so I do trust Turbine wouldn't screw that one up. I couldn't imagine the flame session that would erupt if they fouled that world.

Should they do the same with LOTRO? HELL NO - that would kill Tolkiens world

Thus ends a quick summary