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Originally posted by finnmacool1

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Originally posted by Zippy

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Oh and nice job Vengeful pointing out that 600  concurrent beta testers means something close to 5k active players.  Glad to hear that people are liking and enjoying beta 3.

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Lol give it time, they just got in. It happened with every new batch, numbers would spike then 1-2 weeks later it was back to 60-100 prime time.

If on the other hand they can retain some of those being invited, than perhaps they resolved some of the issues driving people away. Either that or they found a batch of people to test under harsh conditions with little fun.

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Valid point.  The new people will always be more excited.  There are three big reasons that people were not playing before in beta 2.  The client was optimized so poorly the game would run very poorly on even the best of computers.  Even now with what they have done to optimize the client the specs to run this game are very high according to Brads lastest posts.  I am thinking this will always be an issue just as not as big an issue in beta 2.  I would imagine that a good % of the people that got accepted to beta 3 probably don't have the specs to run the game now.  I have no idea its 20% or 30% or what % who got accepted will not be able to run Vanguard.  But I would bet its a very large percentage as specs needed are still very high.

The second reason is almsot all of the content had not been added to beta two.  Brad has said a few times their focus was to tweak and perfect group combat and the core systems then add in the rest of the content later.  Content such as solo mobs, raid mobs, quests, filling in the world with monsters had simply not been added yet.  The only thing it seems there was to do in beta 2 as far as content was grind in a  group and groups were scarce.  Which makes one wonder if they do have enough enough time to add all the content they want to in this game duruing the time left in beta.   It is quite an ambitious game.

Point three is there is no none to group with.  Thanks to point one and two people were not playing and onl;y a small amount of people were invited to beta two.  But making that even harder was people needed groups to play as there was no solo mobs and crafting and diplomacy basically were not working so all there was to do was grind in groups.

BTW this information is not from beta leaks but from reading dev posts, Fanguard interviews, previews and the beta newsletters and are only my assumptions and conclusioins for whatever they are worth.

As one can see all three problems here contributed to people not playing.  They needed to stabilize trhe client and make it work on enough machines to so more people can play.  They needed to finish their work on group combat and start adding more content so people could do more than simply grind for experience and they needed to add enough beta testers so people will have others to group with.  Did they accomplish all these goals?  I have no idea.  That they have 600 people playing concurrently is a good sign.  But from all reports they needed to do a great deal of work between mid beta 2 and beta 3 to make beta 3 work.  I am generally a bit doubtful and I would guess they are somewhere in the middle here.  Progress on all areas but not where they want to be.  People love to reach deadlines and the fan base has been screaming for beta 3 for almost 8 months now.  I am sure its pretty raw.  Hopefully they are making progress.  But I still wonder if they can overcome all the obstacles in their path.  They have an amazing amount of work left to do.

I want a new game to come out badly lol i can't wait for Vanguard. WoW..well sucks. EQ2 is fun but gets boring at time. EQ1 seems fun but don't want to start such an old game.

Anyone who's actually  bothered to read up on VG and follow the game's progress would have a hard time making the claim that it will be "exactly like EverQuest" with a strait face.  Considering well...that its not remotely the same?  Combat, classes, continents, content, races, crafting, dip, AI, movement...all different.

In fact many people actually paying attention who were hoping for just that voiced their dissapointment on the official forums...which tend to have much better informed people then here...go figure.

My wife and I played EQ for 4 years, we also played COH, WOW, L2, RO, etc.

Each one has their own community loaded with idiots and good people.  Some more so some less, and some just different.  To each their own but its more a matter of your personal flavor in people. 

Vanguard will play very similar to

Vanguard. 

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Originally posted by ghoul31

This is just an exact Everquest copy. We already have Everquest. We don't need another one. If you are going to make a MMORPG , make something new. Don't just make the exact same game over again.

I've given up on MMORPG's going to the next level. The only ones with the guts to to that are the small companies that can't pull it off. But at least make something new!

I suppose the die hard EQ fans will like it. it will be like another expansion pack to them. But most of us want something new. ANd we aren't gonna get it.

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Vanguard is NOT an exact copy of Everquest. There are many significant differences. 

The class definitions are different.  The player housing is different.  The combat system is different.  The dungeon instancing is different.  There is the Diplomacy sphere, along with Adventuring and Crafting spheres.  The travel is different.  The ships are different.  The mounts are different.

Vanguard is a fantasy based MMORPG so it has wizards, druids, shamans, warriors, etc.  And yes there are dwarves and elves and humans.  Other than that, there is more different about Vanguard then things that are the same.

Yeah right. Exact copy of everquest hahahha.

Look at this for example to show how it is different.

Counter Spelling:
By now you're probably all aware of counter spelling, but I wouldn't be thorough if I didn't talk about it. Spell casters use their perception skills to detect enemy magic being cast, and depending on the success of their detection, they have one of three options. A simple success means a chance to counter-spell and negate the effect (provided you click on the reaction). A good success means you can turn the spell back on it's caster. It's worth noting this isn't always a good idea. A great success means that the entire nature of the spell can be altered against it's will. The common example given was the fireball being turned into a heal. Casters can expect to have magical duels either in routine combat, or as part of special circumstances (like a quest).
Nullify. This is the lowest-level and least powerful. It allows a caster to simply "turn off" the effect of an opponent's spell.
Natural Divergence. This type allows a caster to change an opponent's spell into something else. It may change into a small heal or a small debuff, or perhaps a shower of daisies. It will depend on the spell being cast by the opponent.
Reflection. This allows, as its name implies, a caster to redirect an opponent's spell. Turning it around on the caster.
Forced Divergence. Much like natural divergence, this ability allows you to change an incoming spell into something else, but in this case you will have control over what it becomes, instead of it being based on the original spell.

And you have boat travel. You can build boats too. Sea battles.

Building your own fully customisable house or city.

Dynamic storyline and GM run Events

Diplomacy. Now Everquest didn't have that.

imagine anything about diplomacy.

Blackmailing/Bribing.

Or you make a wrong move in a meeting with a noble in his castle. he yells: GUARDS!! :P


But seriously this is really different.

Wait till you play it to judge it. It could turn out exactly like they said they want it or it could mess up like WoW did.

Those are all possibilities.

But I do not deny that I have high hopes for this game.

Meh, I think it *did* need to be made... I don't think it sounds amazing, but I know there are no other MMOs out right now that I will play any more of. At least I can try this out and hope for the best.

EQ1 is...older than my gaming life by a fair margin and I tried EQ2 (refused until PvP, joined the first PvP server) and my friends and I lasted about a month...the longest anyone lasted that I know was around two months. There was something seriously missing in that game.

OP ignorance is the worst of the sickness. Take a time to read about Vanguard: Saga of Heroes.

Ok i dont agree with OP on this.

First off, we all as gamer need to remeber ALL MMO's shared a similar likiness rather it  be in gameplay,combat,adventuring and crafting.

What Vanguard is "trying todo" is basically revolutionize these mechinics. Prime example would the teh combat system. I stongly urge doign research in their http://vanguardsoh.com/faq.php FAQ.

There a few ingame vids outthere  about such aspects of the game. So please dotn judge a game til a thorough research before stating such specluation.

LOL Microsoft pulled out of this one.  That's got to tell you something right there. And now Sony's picked it up.  It's EQ3 for sure.  It's been in dev for almost 5 years and still looks like a pos.  And their forums are good for a laugh.  Drop by sometime and see what I mean.

I'm passing on this one for sure.

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Originally posted by Born

LOL Microsoft pulled out of this one.  That's got to tell you something right there. And now Sony's picked it up.  It's EQ3 for sure.  It's been in dev for almost 5 years and still looks like a pos.  And their forums are good for a laugh.  Drop by sometime and see what I mean.

I'm passing on this one for sure.

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Let's see... I'll try to write this how Born would...

LOL Born is clueless about Sigil buying back their rights because M$ tried to push them and grabbing a different 1/2 publisher, in fact, he's so clueless that he spouted the same exact nonsense in 4 threads.  That's got to tell you something right there.  He's a troll for sure.  He's been a member for 1 day and has made 4 posts saying the same thing and looks like a moron.  But I guess he's good for a laugh.  Dropped on his head a few times maybe? 

I'm passing on his complete lack of commonsense for sure.

Anyone who thinks that SOE would add a game to their Station Pass that plays increadibly similar to and would therefor compete directly with EQ1/EQ2 has no common sense.  Particularily when the idea is percentage based, AKA the more time people with Station Pass play VG the more money Sigil sees and the less money SOE sees.

Additionally many people won't bother with Station Pass and just get a strait up VG subscription.  Most companies would prefer not to loose subscriptions to their other games.

Vanguard is the "true sequel" to EQ1.

Fact is EQ1 is aging.EQ2 was by design meant to attract a new audience rather then replace EQ1 ,thus you will hardly see many EQ1 vets in EQ2 (and those i met quit EQ1 back in 2000 or 2001 ).

So yes the game is needed and thats probably why SoE took it in its stables because it competes directly with EQ1.

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Originally posted by ghoul31

This is just an exact Everquest copy. We already have Everquest. We don't need another one. If you are going to make a MMORPG , make something new. Don't just make the exact same game over again.

I've given up on MMORPG's going to the next level. The only ones with the guts to to that are the small companies that can't pull it off. But at least make something new!

I suppose the die hard EQ fans will like it. it will be like another expansion pack to them. But most of us want something new. ANd we aren't gonna get it.

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Agreed. Vanguard is just Brad looking to re-create the glory of old EQ. Pathetic.

My feelings excatly!

Even though I have not gotten into beta yet, I am amped and ready. All I can hope is that the release date stay Q4 2006.  Its been so long since I felt actual excitment, anticipation and fun of the orginal EQ.  That is until like you said the orginal developers left and they churn out expansion like mcdonalds make cheeseburgers. 

/keeps fingers crossed for beta invite

/keeps fingers crossed for "EQ" experience

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Originally posted by Ceebones

I think this game ABSOLUTELY needed to be made. I am a 6 year vet of Everquest and to this day, nothing is as intriguing, thought out, and detailed on soooo many levels as EQ. I can't tell you how many hours i played in total amazement of community, content and the whole world settings. Sure graphics wasn't the top of the line but everything taken in it was simply the best.

On the other hand, I grew more and more tired of EQ with all the expansions, economy inflation and hard core take over type players. I am now 1 year removed from all games for this reason. Brad had it right when he helped design EQ at it's origin. Oh, how I long for that type of gameplay. EQ, WoW, EQ2, GW, DaoC and others I have played and not one compares to the old EQ as far as ease to learn and play/ group to easy manuvering to scences....Hell I even missed the "long" boat rides cause I felt it added more realism to the game.  With that being said, Brad McQuaid...not sure on spelling... made the greatest game I ever played until he left and corporate guru's took over and over simplified it. What took us 2 months to achieve, now can be done in a few hours, didn't set right with a lot of people. Since Brad is on board with this new masterpiece, I will be coming out of "retirement" to play his lastest creation.

This game is DEFINATELY needed.

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DOH! forgot to hit the quote button, sorry for the double post....what a noob

My feelings excatly!

Even though I have not gotten into beta yet, I am amped and ready. All I can hope is that the release date stay Q4 2006.  Its been so long since I felt actual excitment, anticipation and fun of the orginal EQ.  That is until like you said the orginal developers left and they churn out expansion like mcdonalds make cheeseburgers. 

/keeps fingers crossed for beta invite

/keeps fingers crossed for "EQ" experience

Lol, still people is arguing about the need of such a game?

I don't see the point in doing a copy of WoW or EQ2, you can't do better than them, and if people don't like games like Vanguard, those 2 are great games to play, why do you want another one????????????? (oh well in fact there is another one coming soon......Warhammer)

On the flip side, an updated version of the original EQ, is what lots of people were waiting for ages, since there is nothing on the market like that.