Vanguard: Saga of Heroes Forum » General Discussion » SOE sitting on GOLD MINE!

Originally posted by todeswulf

Originally posted by CristianCeo

  Prolly like you i played most of the mmos on the market, including betas, alphas etc.

 But Vanguard manages to top them all in one way or the other. I definitely got caught by it. Funny thing is that in this period AOC, WAR and LOTRO sent me mails to reativate my account giving me some free days.(you know what i mean). And from those mmos i chose Vanguard.

     I hate it that Sony sits on their a** and don't realize what they got here. I mean they could tidy it up a bit and relaunch it world wide because the game is def no the game that was launched back in 07.

    If you didn't try it i recommend u go here http://vanguard.station.sony.com/ and try the trial!

     The game is free u only pay the subscription wich is 15$

Yeah SOE is sitting on a gold mine...with Free Realms and the upcoming DCUO.

Vanguard sucks the sweat off dogs balls. The concept is dead The EQ Raid model is dead, Archaic Guild structures are dead, folks don't have time for complex social networks in their real lives (those of us who actually have real lives) much less in our virtual ones. Four hours to Raid? WTF?? If I don't have Four hours to do something meaningful I certainly don't have it to spend with a group of people I can hardly stand but need to get my phat lewtz.

MMO's have evolved, smaller groups (Five or less..think old school D&D group) shorter Epic encounter times (an hour to an hour and a half tops) easy in easy out.. Entertain me I have a job already mother fucker. The developers who don’t get this are doomed for failure, the ones that see the writing on the wall may be able to catch enough scraps from Blizzard to survive.
 

 Again that is you POV and it is your opinion that the model, concept, structure is dead. It's only in your vision because you haven't made a huge survey with thousands of people whom said that you are right.

   I also have a full time job but i still play.

There might be some merit to the concept that SoE is choosing to resource EQ2 heavily and brought Vanguard into the portfolio to eliminate the competition from what most people believe is the 'true' successor to EQ1.  If this is their intent, then I believe they are making a strategic mistake. 

I have played Vanguard since launch (2.5 years), played EQ1 for 6-7 years and played EQ2 for 6-7 months.  Where EQ2 failed, Vanguard succeeded.  You'll find many people that believe Vanguard is the best PvE MMO available today.

With the big caveat that it is only speculation on how SoE is managing it's product portfolio I'll offer the following:

1) EQ2 and Vanguard are very different games on almost every level.  If SoE is treating these two games as similar products with similar markets, they are making a mistake.

2) EQ2 people seem to come to Vanguard, but Vanguard people don't seem to go to EQ2.  Our guild spans both games, and some folks maintain a station pass and play both, but most that have crossed over from EQ2 to Vanguard have made VG their single game.  In general it seems like when people choose to leave VG they don't go to another SoE game, they scatter to multiple different games of different types, but they aren't going to another SoE game for the most part.

 3) Oddly, I've never received a "Please Come Back" promotion to return to EQ or EQ2.  Although our EQ2 players always get the "Please Come Back" promotion to return to Vanguard. 

SoE may not realize they've got golden opportunity to reach a MMO market with Vanguard that no other MMO competes in.  It's a chicken and the egg question.  More resources and more content at a faster pace would mean more players.  But from a financial perspective, I'm sure SoE would like to see more players before making a bigger investment. 

  You know i just don't get it! You guys keep saying this is a conspiracy theory because sony is evil and they want to keep vanguard as low as possible in order for it not to compete with Vanguard BUT i tell you this:

  Sony gets the profit from both games! Why would sony care if VG has more players than EQ2 or vice versa since they get the money from both of the games! Sony owns both games!

  There is no real competition. My take is that Sony just don't care about VG and they don't realise they are sitting on a GOLD MINE!

Originally posted by CristianCeo

  You know i just don't get it! You guys keep saying this is a conspiracy theory because sony is evil and they want to keep vanguard as low as possible in order for it not to compete with Vanguard BUT i tell you this:

  Sony gets the profit from both games! Why would sony care if VG has more players than EQ2 or vice versa since they get the money from both of the games! Sony owns both games!

  There is no real competition. My take is that Sony just don't care about VG and they don't realise they are sitting on a GOLD MINE!

Much wisdom do you say, maybe they will wake up and smell the the thought. I guess maybe what the heck send an Email to corporate tell them to take alook at the posts here about Vanguard.

Originally posted by CristianCeo

 I also said that, played the stress test but now i don't really care about Fallen Earth it is way behind Vanguard.

  And what do people have with the animations? I have no problem with the u get used to them they are not THAT BAD!

I actually love the animations... tanks swinging big weapons actually look like they are swinging something that weighs 50 lbs as opposed to swinging something that looks like it is as light as a feather as in WoW for example. Monks twirling staffs and jump kicking around look like real martial artists....

My problem is the actual character models. The characters when standing around and doing nothing actually look like robots and not living creatures. NPCs seem dead inside. I doubt it would take too much effort to have an npc gasp or cup their hands around their mouthes shouting for help when they offer a quest. Instead, NPCs stand there with their arms dangling beside them waiting for you to talk to them. When you talk to them you find out that their kids were abducted by a vampire cult and the entire life savings were stolen and maybe the vampires are planning to take over the city hubs and eventually the world if I don't step in and do something to help.... all while their arms idly hang beside them.

Maybe I just need a little bit emotion from the characters I interact with.

I gotta say, I'm having a Hell of a time in the game this time around....I don't know if the game has changed a lot, or just my perception of it, or what..but I'm actually really enjoying it this time. I might stick around for a while.

I agree. VG is the best PvE game up to now. Most freedom and best mechanics out there. Maybe it will great step to compleatly fix video issues and rerelease the game with different name...

Originally posted by CristianCeo

 My take is that Sony just don't care about VG and they don't realise they are sitting on a GOLD MINE!

The horrible way they introduced RMT into the game makes be believe you're right. The guys at SOE are kinda clueless about their business.

Originally posted by Adamantine

Originally posted by CristianCeo

 My take is that Sony just don't care about VG and they don't realise they are sitting on a GOLD MINE!

The horrible way they introduced RMT into the game makes be believe you're right. The guys at SOE are kinda clueless about their business.

 

Its one of the reasons why other games don't consider VG a threat. Sure everyone claims VG is the best PVE there is but Blizzard, NCSoft, nor Turbine would ever trade their games for VG because they know that the entire mmo community has seen what VG was put through and wouldn't dare want to put the game under their portfolios. Basically its like "hey, you guys have this so-called best mmo, but we'll save our money and pass...and make more money while we're at it".

 I wonder where should i send an email to SOE the division that works on VG and send them a bitch slap message maybe it will be a wakeup call!

Originally posted by CristianCeo

 I wonder where should i send an email to SOE the division that works on VG and send them a bitch slap message maybe it will be a wakeup call!

I remember when I thought soe cared and would listen to the customers.  My best advice to you friend is to just play the game and don't go campaigning it after only a few days of playing it.

Just to throw my 2 cents in, I have to say Vanguard is the game I most wanted to see succeed in the past few years.  It truly did give me the experience that I craved after leaving EQ1.  However no matter what there is just noone around anymore to play with, which has killed the experience for me every time I have tried to go back.

As long as the game is owned by SOE, it won't get the resources it needs to improve.  As many have said before, VG competes with EQ2, and SOE made EQ2 from scratch.  So EQ2 is always going to be mentioned in place of Vanguard.  Just look at the SOE community address at the fan faire, 2 years in a row they didn't even bother mentioning Vanguard.

There's just certain things people need to accept.  Take the game for what it is, accept the low population, and have fun with it.  Wishing for more resources and/or a change of development staff & direction is going to get you frustrated.  Unfortunately, that's exactly what this game needs.  It needs to be bought out by another company, and have its dev team replaced.

I , for one, am sick of worrying about business concerns. I want to play a fun game, period. VG is fun. If you doubt this, I encourage you to (for free) download and play the Isle of Dawn.

SOE is going to do what they do, and I refuse to be affected by this. Sure, they dont seem to have too many devs, but that's OK by me. I'm -not- wanting the game to attract all the lewt kiddies, jerkahols, and outright cretins that are rampant in newer games. In fact, I see the current situation as an advantage because:

a) A smaller dev team can be just as productive (if not more) as a larger one. Size does not always indicate competence in development teams, in fact larger ones can actually be less productive under most conditions.

b) It's not all that popular, but it's got enough players. The server I'm playing on has enough, not so many that places are all crowded but enough so that you can get a group or three. This is a sweet spot you dont find in most games.

c) The smaller population incentivizes a polite, helpful, and cogent community. There have even been good discussions on the ooc channels with actual intelligent conversation and without the inevitable "you guys make my head hurt" when someone mentions "epistemology".

d) There is so much you can do solo (crafting, diplomacy, even adventuring if you are good) that you aren't forced to get a group ... at least at low levels. I imagine this may change for certain quests but I haven't had a problem getting one yet.

Businesses ruin games. The only way to be free of that idea is to decide to put your attention elsewhere. I'm having fun in VG. Hope to see some of you there. :)

Originally posted by daktar

I , for one, am sick of worrying about business concerns. I want to play a fun game, period. VG is fun. If you doubt this, I encourage you to (for free) download and play the Isle of Dawn.

Then don't worry about it

SOE is going to do what they do, and I refuse to be affected by this. Sure, they dont seem to have too many devs, but that's OK by me. I'm -not- wanting the game to attract all the lewt kiddies, jerkahols, and outright cretins that are rampant in newer games. In fact, I see the current situation as an advantage because:

Excellent stereotype sir. You "refuse" to be effected by it but you are regardless if you like it or not.

a) A smaller dev team can be just as productive (if not more) as a larger one. Size does not always indicate competence in development teams, in fact larger ones can actually be less productive under most conditions.

That is true but unfortunately the VG dev team is less productive, that is a fact.

b) It's not all that popular, but it's got enough players. The server I'm playing on has enough, not so many that places are all crowded but enough so that you can get a group or three. This is a sweet spot you dont find in most games.

Its not about having "enough", soon that "enough" will turn out to being MxO "enough" and you see where that landed them. Business keeps games afloat and with that, there has to be more subs.

c) The smaller population incentivizes a polite, helpful, and cogent community. There have even been good discussions on the ooc channels with actual intelligent conversation and without the inevitable "you guys make my head hurt" when someone mentions "epistemology".

The same in every game sir. When communities start getting small, they start getting desperate and making it feel like jolly raindrops everytime a new player steps in so they stay. Every game has good folks and bad folks. VG just happen to have the most fanboys then any game I've ever seen.

d) There is so much you can do solo (crafting, diplomacy, even adventuring if you are good) that you aren't forced to get a group ... at least at low levels. I imagine this may change for certain quests but I haven't had a problem getting one yet.

You will be forced to group. That's how it will be. To get anything serious done, you need groups.

Businesses ruin games. The only way to be free of that idea is to decide to put your attention elsewhere. I'm having fun in VG. Hope to see some of you there. :)

When you say 'You "refuse" to be effected by it but you are regardless if you like it or not.'...well you'll have to prove that to me. First, you must prove that it's possible to prove something. Until you do that, I will enjoy the freedom that my decision to not be affected by SOE affords me.
 

I'm not sure about the rest of your post. Are you trying to be an anti-fanboy or a fanboy? Both are the same thing, just a different polarity...so which side do you favor?

Originally posted by daktar

When you say 'You "refuse" to be effected by it but you are regardless if you like it or not.'...well you'll have to prove that to me. First, you must prove that it's possible to prove something. Until you do that, I will enjoy the freedom that my decision to not be affected by SOE affords me.
 

I'm not sure about the rest of your post. Are you trying to be an anti-fanboy or a fanboy? Both are the same thing, just a different polarity...so which side do you favor?

Neither. I used to be a fanboy back at beta but most folks were at some point. But I am now at a point of realistic measures.

And what I mean that SOE will effect you. If they shut the game down, it most definately effect you. Such situations like that is how business effects you.

The only problem with Vanguard I have are the player models, as they all look a bit too similar. I think the animations are very realistic, and resemble moves that an actual person could do. The amount of detail and depth in the game is unrivaled, and I find it to be under estimated and under appreciated. The graphics in Vanguard are simply awe-inspiring. The style, look, and feel of the game is based on concept art from the late Kieth Parkinson. Looking at one of his paintings and then playing Vanguard seems to make his paintings come to life. Every blade of grass sways in the wind with the trees, and with the draw distance you can see for miles. The great thing about Vanguard is you never feel like you've been somewhere twice because of the many landmarks the game has. Giving directions like "Take a left at the big tree, then go past the tent to the lake..." are easy to follow.

People are still playing Vanguard, and the community seems to be growing bigger every day. Games like AION sure look shiney, but they have the depth of a fish bowl (Linear quest line, no class specializations, and PVPVE past 25? No thanks...I played enough of Chinese Release to just say no...). And majority of my WoW friends are tired of the direction Blizzard has gone with it and have fallen in love with Vanguard. Community efforts like this thread and www.vgvids.tk also supports the fact that the game is growing. Give it a shot, as it is no where near where it was at release. The development team might be small, but they are continually updating the game, fixing performance and bugs, and adding content for everyone to enjoy. Their page on what's in the works shows their commitment to the game and what we can expect.

Vanguard is an amazing experience, and although the PVP server is mostly dead, Seradon, Xeth, and Halgar are very much active with great communities. Give it a try, or check it out again if you haven't in a while, and I'm sure you'll stay.

If they use the business model Free Realms use they will get a ton of more players and make a ton of more money. Until then, the game will continue to struggle for players.

Originally posted by Typwn

The only problem with Vanguard I have are the player models, as they all look a bit too similar. I think the animations are very realistic, and resemble moves that an actual person could do. The amount of detail and depth in the game is unrivaled, and I find it to be under estimated and under appreciated. The graphics in Vanguard are simply awe-inspiring. The style, look, and feel of the game is based on concept art from the late Kieth Parkinson. Looking at one of his paintings and then playing Vanguard seems to make his paintings come to life. Every blade of grass sways in the wind with the trees, and with the draw distance you can see for miles. The great thing about Vanguard is you never feel like you've been somewhere twice because of the many landmarks the game has. Giving directions like "Take a left at the big tree, then go past the tent to the lake..." are easy to follow.

People are still playing Vanguard, and the community seems to be growing bigger every day. Games like AION sure look shiney, but they have the depth of a fish bowl (Linear quest line, no class specializations, and PVPVE past 25? No thanks...I played enough of Chinese Release to just say no...). And majority of my WoW friends are tired of the direction Blizzard has gone with it and have fallen in love with Vanguard. Community efforts like this thread and www.vgvids.tk also supports the fact that the game is growing. Give it a shot, as it is no where near where it was at release. The development team might be small, but they are continually updating the game, fixing performance and bugs, and adding content for everyone to enjoy. Their page on what's in the works shows their commitment to the game and what we can expect.

Vanguard is an amazing experience, and although the PVP server is mostly dead, Seradon, Xeth, and Halgar are very much active with great communities. Give it a try, or check it out again if you haven't in a while, and I'm sure you'll stay.

You know it sickens me so much how people think VG has so much depth that it makes other games look like crap. The graphics are nice for its taste, Aion's graphics are great for its taste, same with AoC. The depth in VG is nice but they lack in creativity. Then again, someone needs to explain to me the "depth" that we're talking about. If you're speaking of unnecessary details then maybe. But just from speaking off the top of my head:

- VG has the least amount of Lore that ties with gameplay.
- VG's crafting system has depth, but also frustrations that come with it.
- VG's combat is equivilant to every mmo out there.
- VG's classes are the same in concept as EQ/WoW. Where there are no tree/branch offs.
- VG has 3 spheres as most games have 2. Even still the 3rd sphere is neglected like no other.
- VG has art depth. Yes, the game has eye-candy. What's ironic is the games that have less eye-candy are more successful?
- Other games have depth in the pockets. VG doesn't.

Originally posted by CristianCeo

  Prolly like you i played most of the mmos on the market, including betas, alphas etc.

 But Vanguard manages to top them all in one way or the other. I definitely got caught by it. Funny thing is that in this period AOC, WAR and LOTRO sent me mails to reativate my account giving me some free days.(you know what i mean). And from those mmos i chose Vanguard.

     I hate it that Sony sits on their a** and don't realize what they got here. I mean they could tidy it up a bit and relaunch it world wide because the game is def no the game that was launched back in 07.

    If you didn't try it i recommend u go here http://vanguard.station.sony.com/ and try the trial!

     The game is free u only pay the subscription wich is 15$

Gold mine yeah, that is why they fired 41 people.

Originally posted by Xeonsoldier

Originally posted by Typwn

The only problem with Vanguard I have are the player models, as they all look a bit too similar. I think the animations are very realistic, and resemble moves that an actual person could do. The amount of detail and depth in the game is unrivaled, and I find it to be under estimated and under appreciated. The graphics in Vanguard are simply awe-inspiring. The style, look, and feel of the game is based on concept art from the late Kieth Parkinson. Looking at one of his paintings and then playing Vanguard seems to make his paintings come to life. Every blade of grass sways in the wind with the trees, and with the draw distance you can see for miles. The great thing about Vanguard is you never feel like you've been somewhere twice because of the many landmarks the game has. Giving directions like "Take a left at the big tree, then go past the tent to the lake..." are easy to follow.

People are still playing Vanguard, and the community seems to be growing bigger every day. Games like AION sure look shiney, but they have the depth of a fish bowl (Linear quest line, no class specializations, and PVPVE past 25? No thanks...I played enough of Chinese Release to just say no...). And majority of my WoW friends are tired of the direction Blizzard has gone with it and have fallen in love with Vanguard. Community efforts like this thread and www.vgvids.tk also supports the fact that the game is growing. Give it a shot, as it is no where near where it was at release. The development team might be small, but they are continually updating the game, fixing performance and bugs, and adding content for everyone to enjoy. Their page on what's in the works shows their commitment to the game and what we can expect.

Vanguard is an amazing experience, and although the PVP server is mostly dead, Seradon, Xeth, and Halgar are very much active with great communities. Give it a try, or check it out again if you haven't in a while, and I'm sure you'll stay.

 

You know it sickens me so much how people think VG has so much depth that it makes other games look like crap. The graphics are nice for its taste, Aion's graphics are great for its taste, same with AoC. The depth in VG is nice but they lack in creativity. Then again, someone needs to explain to me the "depth" that we're talking about. If you're speaking of unnecessary details then maybe. But just from speaking off the top of my head:

- VG has the least amount of Lore that ties with gameplay.
- VG's crafting system has depth, but also frustrations that come with it.
- VG's combat is equivilant to every mmo out there.
- VG's classes are the same in concept as EQ/WoW. Where there are no tree/branch offs.
- VG has 3 spheres as most games have 2. Even still the 3rd sphere is neglected like no other.
- VG has art depth. Yes, the game has eye-candy. What's ironic is the games that have less eye-candy are more successful?
- Other games have depth in the pockets. VG doesn't.

 

I drive a 84 Honda!!! How dare you slander my game. When you come and complete everything in this game then and only then are you aloud to speak your lies again.

HONDA!!

Actually SOE is sitting on a goldmine, but its not vanguard..

Its Free Realms, they are bilking money outta parents hand over fist out of this game.

I've been watching real closely at my local walmart, target, and 3 local 7-11's that stock the gamecards, and they can not seem to keep them on the shelf.

But seriously they are sitting on a great game atm if they can pull if off right.

I got to F&F.. The Agency, and its got some good potential, just kinda sucks its in the hands of the leader in screwing up good games.

Time will tell but hopefully SOE has learned if it aint broke don't fix it.

HOPEFULLY SOE takes that gold mine in FR and spread the money around to there other games :)

SOE is sitting on a good game in vanguard but there problem is they need cash to invest in a real dev team that can take the game over and make it great.  The PROBLEM is this economy sucks and Smed has his ass in a grinder because EQ is dieing off slowly and EQ2 has a limited playerbase to.  That is the problem guys there is no $ to put into the game because the risk is to great.  He would risk his job if he diverted the resources to VG and it didnt work out for him he has no leeway anymore because this isnt the SOE Pre wow they just dont have the revenue to justify puting the 10s of millions into the game to make it great.

Oh and FR is a gold mine why ?  Because its free and parents will buy ANYTHING to buy there kids love I.E RMT shit i bet some kids who play it spend a hell of alot more per month on it then a monthly subscription would bring .

Originally posted by Xeonsoldier

You know it sickens me so much how people think VG has so much depth that it makes other games look like crap. The graphics are nice for its taste, Aion's graphics are great for its taste, same with AoC. The depth in VG is nice but they lack in creativity. Then again, someone needs to explain to me the "depth" that we're talking about. If you're speaking of unnecessary details then maybe. But just from speaking off the top of my head:

- VG has the least amount of Lore that ties with gameplay.
- VG's crafting system has depth, but also frustrations that come with it.
- VG's combat is equivilant to every mmo out there.
- VG's classes are the same in concept as EQ/WoW. Where there are no tree/branch offs.
- VG has 3 spheres as most games have 2. Even still the 3rd sphere is neglected like no other.
- VG has art depth. Yes, the game has eye-candy. What's ironic is the games that have less eye-candy are more successful?
- Other games have depth in the pockets. VG doesn't.

You know it sickens so much me when people who haven't played Vanguard make a response like they have. You obviously have no idea what you're talking about, which anyone who plays Vanguard can plainly see. Allow me to counter your points.

Vanguard has a overwhelming amount of lore, ALL of which ties in with the gameplay. A short look at www.vgtact.com will show you the depth and some of the storylines for Diplomacy, which does in fact directly tie-in with gameplay. You can play the Isle of Dawn yourself and see how wrong you are.

Crafting in Vanguard is given the same attention as Adventuring and Diplomacy. They take time and dedication, just like anything in an MMO. Adventuring can be frustrating at times, thus so can Crafting and yes even Diplomacy. They all have their own story lines, quests, equipment, and progression paths.

Combat in Vanguard uses hotbars for skills, but the variety of skills, abilities, finishers, counters, rescues, stances, commands, battle cries, forms, judgements, boons, blessings, endowments, songs, and buffs keep the combat fresh and exciting. The difficulty of Vanguard also makes for some great times in a dungeon or just out questing with friends.

Vanguards classes might be named similar to classes in EQ and WoW, but their gameplay styles, skills, and abilities differ greatly and give a very unique experience. A Necromancer is a spell caster with a pet, but in Vanguard a Necromancer harvests parts from corpses to modify their abominations with stats, skills, and buffs. Bloodmages are healers that use their blood to cast many of their spells, and symbiotes to control enemies and fortify allies. Classes also have branching trees, such as Ranger and Shaman, but you also have Attribute points you can freely distribute to any stat you want.

Diplomacy is far from neglected, and is one of the most fulfilling experiences in Vanguard if you're into lore, novels, stories, riddles, and mysteries. It's very exciting to manipulate NPCs and follow the story, befriending someone only to betray them later, or have to assassinate someone and blame it on a village of brute attempting a peace treaty. You've never experienced it, so I can understand why you might think it neglected.

Your last two points aren't points at all, as they don't support your argument. I could go on and on about what makes Vanguard a deep and involving experience but you can play it for yourself instead of posting what you think the game is like. Play the Isle of Dawn and quit talking out your ass.