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EVE Online Forum » Jita (General) » Revival of the space sim genre - tougher times for EvE incoming?

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63 posts found
  User Deleted
4/20/13 5:42:06 AM#61
Originally posted by Lobotomist

EvE could have been great.

But it got too focused on PVP , and slowly neglected world simulation element.

 

This is why its only suited for PVP minded players.

 

Both Elite and (to lesser extent) Star Citisen , will cater both to pvp players and more peacefull - looking to enjoy trading and crafting.

Plus they will both have vastly superior gameplay -

So yes , EVE will still have seniority , but it will be very challenged.

World simulation element lacking in EVE? o.O we have ongoing live events which are one off, PVE and PVP comprised which permanently shift the world of EVE (the battle of caldari prime for example changed quite a few things about the planet itself not to mention sparking off another chain of events which are still ongoing and I have a feeling will ignite into another massive event during fanfest). And the NPCs while stationary in terms of missions and PVE stuff in general still have a few more dynamic things (if you've got the balls you can raid a convoy of gallente NPC industrials leaving a station with a fleet while checking and fending off the NPC police long enough to retrieve the cargo and bolt it, these things can be done, I've seen them done).

 

The only thing Elite and Star Citizen will have over EVE in a tangible way will be the differing control schemes but speaking as someone who's played EVE for 7 years (going on 8) and who's played X2 and X3 (the only games I've played which place anywhere close to what Elite or SC seem to be though Darkstar One is sorta closeish too) the control scheme for EVE is allot more friendly to deeper end gameplay than simulation games, Elite and SC will be more engaging I have no doubt but I doubt they'll be games you can play 12-16 hours like you can with EVE without feeling mentally exhausted afterwards.

 

Also if I hear another dolt call EVE PVP centric or catered towards PVP I will throw a dictionary at them which contains the definition of "virtual world" in it. EVE is the only space-based virtual world game with the balls to actually be what it says on the tin, limited PVP => not a virtual world, PVP with consequences (both player and NPC) => virtual world, get it around your heads gents because while Elite and Star Citizen look good if they limit PVP they'll be at best sandbox singleplayer games at worse Open World MMOs.

  Bladestrom

Elite Member

Joined: 4/04/11
Posts: 3355

4/20/13 5:58:41 AM#62
Originally posted by Dihoru
Originally posted by Lobotomist

EvE could have been great.

But it got too focused on PVP , and slowly neglected world simulation element.

 

This is why its only suited for PVP minded players.

 

Both Elite and (to lesser extent) Star Citisen , will cater both to pvp players and more peacefull - looking to enjoy trading and crafting.

Plus they will both have vastly superior gameplay -

So yes , EVE will still have seniority , but it will be very challenged.

World simulation element lacking in EVE? o.O we have ongoing live events which are one off, PVE and PVP comprised which permanently shift the world of EVE (the battle of caldari prime for example changed quite a few things about the planet itself not to mention sparking off another chain of events which are still ongoing and I have a feeling will ignite into another massive event during fanfest). And the NPCs while stationary in terms of missions and PVE stuff in general still have a few more dynamic things (if you've got the balls you can raid a convoy of gallente NPC industrials leaving a station with a fleet while checking and fending off the NPC police long enough to retrieve the cargo and bolt it, these things can be done, I've seen them done).

The only thing Elite and Star Citizen will have over EVE in a tangible way will be the differing control schemes but speaking as someone who's played EVE for 7 years (going on 8) and who's played X2 and X3 (the only games I've played which place anywhere close to what Elite or SC seem to be though Darkstar One is sorta closeish too) the control scheme for EVE is allot more friendly to deeper end gameplay than simulation games, Elite and SC will be more engaging I have no doubt but I doubt they'll be games you can play 12-16 hours like you can with EVE without feeling mentally exhausted afterwards.

 If Elite is more PVE centric then it is a totally different prospect. 

Also if I hear another dolt call EVE PVP centric or catered towards PVP I will throw a dictionary at them which contains the definition of "virtual world" in it. EVE is the only space-based virtual world game with the balls to actually be what it says on the tin, limited PVP => not a virtual world, PVP with consequences (both player and NPC) => virtual world, get it around your heads gents because while Elite and Star Citizen look good if they limit PVP they'll be at best sandbox singleplayer games at worse Open World MMOs.

dolt/carebear blah blah insults...  Eve is PVP centric.  PVE is hampered by having to avoid ganking: gate camping, Hulkageddon type events, multiboxing, carebear attitude etc, 'If you cant afford to lose what your flying then dont fly it they say'  A lot of this does not appeal to PVE players.  For E.g I would love to trade in the whole universe without having to deal with this crap. If a game came out with the same quality as Eve (it is an amazing sandbox) but with a pve centric world it would be attractive to pve players.

 

rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW (1000 hrs on main mage)> oblivion > LOTR (480 Hunter) > Rift (230 hours mage) > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(900 elementalist), Wildstar

Now playing GW2, AOW 3

  User Deleted
4/20/13 6:18:35 AM#63
Originally posted by Bladestrom
Originally posted by Dihoru
Originally posted by Lobotomist

EvE could have been great.

But it got too focused on PVP , and slowly neglected world simulation element.

 

This is why its only suited for PVP minded players.

 

Both Elite and (to lesser extent) Star Citisen , will cater both to pvp players and more peacefull - looking to enjoy trading and crafting.

Plus they will both have vastly superior gameplay -

So yes , EVE will still have seniority , but it will be very challenged.

World simulation element lacking in EVE? o.O we have ongoing live events which are one off, PVE and PVP comprised which permanently shift the world of EVE (the battle of caldari prime for example changed quite a few things about the planet itself not to mention sparking off another chain of events which are still ongoing and I have a feeling will ignite into another massive event during fanfest). And the NPCs while stationary in terms of missions and PVE stuff in general still have a few more dynamic things (if you've got the balls you can raid a convoy of gallente NPC industrials leaving a station with a fleet while checking and fending off the NPC police long enough to retrieve the cargo and bolt it, these things can be done, I've seen them done).

The only thing Elite and Star Citizen will have over EVE in a tangible way will be the differing control schemes but speaking as someone who's played EVE for 7 years (going on 8) and who's played X2 and X3 (the only games I've played which place anywhere close to what Elite or SC seem to be though Darkstar One is sorta closeish too) the control scheme for EVE is allot more friendly to deeper end gameplay than simulation games, Elite and SC will be more engaging I have no doubt but I doubt they'll be games you can play 12-16 hours like you can with EVE without feeling mentally exhausted afterwards.

 If Elite is more PVE centric then it is a totally different prospect. 

Also if I hear another dolt call EVE PVP centric or catered towards PVP I will throw a dictionary at them which contains the definition of "virtual world" in it. EVE is the only space-based virtual world game with the balls to actually be what it says on the tin, limited PVP => not a virtual world, PVP with consequences (both player and NPC) => virtual world, get it around your heads gents because while Elite and Star Citizen look good if they limit PVP they'll be at best sandbox singleplayer games at worse Open World MMOs.

dolt/carebear blah blah insults...  Eve is PVP centric.  PVE is hampered by having to avoid ganking: gate camping, Hulkageddon type events, multiboxing, carebear attitude etc, 'If you cant afford to lose what your flying then dont fly it they say'  A lot of this does not appeal to PVE players.  For E.g I would love to trade in the whole universe without having to deal with this crap. If a game came out with the same quality as Eve (it is an amazing sandbox) but with a pve centric world it would be attractive to pve players.

 

You can trade with the entire Universe but just like in any actual simulation game there are risks to running your goods into lawless territory, you just need to set up trade connections with people in certain areas where trading would be more lucrative and welcomed (for example in NPC 0.0 space I remember there was a cronic lack of items in certain regions). The only reason you're saying EVE is PVP centric is because you feel entitled to have only NPC pirates jump on top of you demanding your goods ;).

 

Also in order:

1) If you can't afford to lose what your flying don't fly it-  Unless it's a shitty, shitty simulation game you will have ship loss in both Elite and Star Citizen so good luck flying goods everywhere without thinking of risks (christ you get jumped in X3 if I remember by pirates demanding your goods if you're unlucky enough in slightly lawless areas). One of the best unknown space sims in recent years, Space Rangers 2, features perma death on ship destruction.

2) Gate Camping - Check the gate with a cloaking frigate or check EVEeye for stats on that system to see if there are any indications of gate camps. I've not died to a gate camp in over 4 years and I regularly have to dodge them :).

3) Hulkageddon is a dying event, they fixed ship insurance last I checked so if you gank someone in high sec (or try to) you no longer get the insurance for your ship, couple this with the mining barge rebalance ( a skiff is now in mining output only marginally worse than a hulk but has a obscene tank for its class of ship and sig radius) and you have only the ghost of the event still lingering with hardcore pvpers but again if you have a skiff, jet a secure can, anchor it, then orbit it with every tank module on while you mine then nothing can kill you without losing them more money than they've destroyed (ergo they get no point in hulkageddon).

4) I only have one character and one account and I do whatever I damn well please, it's easier to multibox I grant you but to be a pure bred trader with top of the line ships for trading (tech 2 haulers) would require...2-3 months of training (you need the specific industrial skill to level 5, train transport skill to level 4, train electronics to level 5, train cloaking up to level 4 and presto you have all you need for a cloaky hauler which is a bitch to catch in gate camps if you know how to fly it, train up tanking skills and support skills for your trading ship, basically armour tanking for gallente or amarr ships and shield tanking for the other two, and you have yourself the most secure large hauling ship, the deep space transport, with fittings and enough of a tank to survive most solo or small group gank attempts in high sec... did I also mention that the cloaky hauler, IE the blockade runner, has a cargo hold which cannot be scanned and is agile as fuck for a ship its size and can fit a covert ops cloak?).

 

TL;DR version: If you're lazy no game you're in will satisfy your needs, EVE requires you knowing a few things to be safe 99.9% of the times from the "dreaded ganking pvpers!" but I doubt any PVE "sandbox" (open world more like it) MMO worth it's weight in storage space you find won't have commerce raiding NPCs which will look at your fat ass and shoot it out of the spacelanes. Be smart, be wise, don't be entitled.

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