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CCP Games | Official Site
MMORPG | Genre:Sci-Fi | Status:Final  (rel 05/06/03)  | Pub:CCP Games
PVP:Yes | Distribution:Download,Retail | Retail Price:$19.99 | Pay Type:Subscription
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11 posts found
  freejackmack

Novice Member

Joined: 2/06/08
Posts: 379

 
OP  12/29/12 10:55:44 PM#1

I think this game could benefit from a simulator option to lessen the learning curve and test fits before u lose millions just figuring out what works.

It might be a good way for new ones to get courage for pvp faster and if there is a statistic rating system it might make an interesting recruiting platform.

Also it could serve as a testing ground for new content.

Interested on your thoughts.

  Garkan

Gurista

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 544

Thug, Thief, Killer, Pirate

12/30/12 8:01:30 AM#2

There has always been resistance from the players about any kind of simulator, some players feel its getting a bit too close to being an arena for them to be comfortable with the idea. Which is an understandable concern. Personally it makes sense to have a VR training tool, its supposed to be the future after all. It would need to be limited in some way though, only using the ships and modules you can fly and so on. Just the same as in the game. I think there would need to be design limits too, wouldn't want players preferring to spend time in a game, in the game. Maybe limit it to wireframe graphics. Having a corp VR training sim would be cool, having a way for players to constantly PvP and not participate in the economy and have all the reward with no risks wouldn't be cool.  
  
You can use the test server to do everything you suggest though, you can test ships out, hang around with your corp and try new tactics and its used to publicly test features. Having an "in character" and in game way of doing some of those things would be better though.

Currently playing:

EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.

  Muke

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/07
Posts: 1637

12/30/12 8:14:41 AM#3
Originally posted by freejackmack

I think this game could benefit from a simulator option to lessen the learning curve and test fits before u lose millions just figuring out what works.

It might be a good way for new ones to get courage for pvp faster and if there is a statistic rating system it might make an interesting recruiting platform.

Also it could serve as a testing ground for new content.

Interested on your thoughts.

there are multiple outgame fitting tools like EFT available, as for the testing grounds, there is a test server up where you can buy everything for 100 isk.

 

"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  User Deleted
12/30/12 8:20:58 AM#4

EVE is kind of a dinosaur amongst more streamlined and modern MMORPGs but that's part of what makes it special. The various fitting tools available typically help me create a good loadout for a ship before spending a single ISK. I liked the EVE HQ fitting tool with its links to the character planner myself as it allowed me to fit to my character skills. It would be nice to test some of the loadouts in a simulator in both combat and scanning before actually fielding them in game though. Some well done PVP combat tutorials with such a sim would be great for helping the new get going too.

 

The fact that so many fear the inclusion of an arena or simulator as an instrument that would keep people from playing the actual game because it would be more fun is indicative of a problem that CCP might should consider working on though...

  Garkan

Gurista

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 544

Thug, Thief, Killer, Pirate

12/30/12 8:33:21 AM#5
Originally posted by Crazy_Stick

 fact that so many fear the inclusion of an arena or simulator as an instrument that would keep people from playing the actual game because it would be more fun is indicative of a problem that CCP might should consider working on though...

Not because it would be "more fun" but because of the decreased risk, usually people start bleating about arenas because they want risk free PvP.

Currently playing:

EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.

  User Deleted
12/30/12 9:04:37 AM#6
Originally posted by Garkan
Originally posted by Crazy_Stick

 fact that so many fear the inclusion of an arena or simulator as an instrument that would keep people from playing the actual game because it would be more fun is indicative of a problem that CCP might should consider working on though...

Not because it would be "more fun" but because of the decreased risk, usually people start bleating about arenas because they want risk free PvP.

 

I disagree with you here in that I do not feel "risk" is the key or only objection  in the case of considering the impact of an actual arena combat system for EVE (and not just a ship testing sim.)  A winner take all arena system would open up a lot of PVP possibilities that might take away from the current oppurtunities for good fights and ISK making in low and null which in my view are problematic already unless you love blobs. It could be very popular and change the way people play when you have a sure chance for a good fight in ten minutes of queue time (either solo or gang) right now rather than having to hunt an easy kill for an hour or three in low or null while dodging the bigger blobs.  I have joked in the past that it would threaten to make EVE a more popular MOBA than sand box. I am not sure thats a change CCP could risk. O.o

  freejackmack

Novice Member

Joined: 2/06/08
Posts: 379

 
OP  12/30/12 1:46:14 PM#7

Yeah the fitting tool is great and should be in game imo but you can not test out strategies to see if that is your play style or if you need to refit for something your good at, with Eve fitting tool. To find your talent is expensive as the game is now and as for the test server that is cool but not user-friendly especially for new players. It's not an integrated feature that would increase player retention, it is a big hassle that could definitely be streamlined. What is up with the need to post on a forum for account activation for the test server any way?

 

Also there is no stat record to go back and examine or allow others to verify or any guaranty that that version will ever make to the live server. I suppose it would be close on somethings or most things depending on the build.

By the way Singularity is not the public test server any more and never down load the installer unless you want your settings to vanish. Always backup your settings and copy your Eve installation in a new directory.

 

“Singularity is currently the production server for DUST 514™ and runs EVE Online in a version enabling testing of the two games in a single server environment. It is important to note that Singularity is no longer the public test server for release candidate versions of EVE Online. Please note that an installation on top of the normal EVE production server Tranquility client might wipe out all user settings.”

 

I do not believe you need any rewards for playing in the simulation, after all your sp builds regardless of what you do. I would like to see different options though. Things to make training a fleet easier.

 

I think if a person feels more confident in their piloting abilities there would be a positive affect on the econ and player participation in pvp and player retention. The test server is not really adequate to accomplish what a simulator could for the game imo.

  kovah

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/15/05
Posts: 695

DaZeD aNd AmUsEd

12/30/12 3:18:28 PM#8

I like this idea and agree that something like it should be available in-game.  Fortunately, as previously stated, there are a large number of out-of-game tools that you can use and there is the risk-free test server as well.  So, with that said, while I would like to see a simulator type feature added sometime in the future there are still other bigger fish to fry by the Devs before they focus on something that is already being provided, albeit it not so easy to figure out - but that is kinda EVE...

GL HF Fly Safe,

-k

  Garkan

Gurista

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 544

Thug, Thief, Killer, Pirate

12/31/12 12:14:15 PM#9
Originally posted by Crazy_Stick
Originally posted by Garkan
Originally posted by Crazy_Stick

 fact that so many fear the inclusion of an arena or simulator as an instrument that would keep people from playing the actual game because it would be more fun is indicative of a problem that CCP might should consider working on though...

Not because it would be "more fun" but because of the decreased risk, usually people start bleating about arenas because they want risk free PvP.

 

I disagree with you here in that I do not feel "risk" is the key or only objection  in the case of considering the impact of an actual arena combat system for EVE (and not just a ship testing sim.)  A winner take all arena system would open up a lot of PVP possibilities that might take away from the current oppurtunities for good fights and ISK making in low and null which in my view are problematic already unless you love blobs. It could be very popular and change the way people play when you have a sure chance for a good fight in ten minutes of queue time (either solo or gang) right now rather than having to hunt an easy kill for an hour or three in low or null while dodging the bigger blobs.  I have joked in the past that it would threaten to make EVE a more popular MOBA than sand box. I am not sure thats a change CCP could risk. O.o

The thing is with an arena is that by its very nature would reduce the risk inherent in PvP, not unless it didn't actually achieve anything other than players couldn't organize themselves. Would people be able to interrupt an arena match and kill/rescue one of the participants? Would players be able to warp in logistics in high sec space to throw the results of the fight? Would yet other players be able to bust in on somebody that interrupted an arena match and kill them or drive them away? 
 
If the answer to these questions and questions like it is no then it represents a decrease in risk and even worse a decrease in the potential for player created content. Even if the Arena had full ship loss its still makes PvP "safer". Player created solutions exist for convenient quick fights, which is how it should be.

Currently playing:

EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.

  Rayshe

Novice Member

Joined: 11/30/11
Posts: 1295

12/31/12 12:18:14 PM#10
I never felt any real Risk anywhere other than Low Sec space. even then if your good enough you can Warp out before getting yourself sploded. 

Because i can.
I'm Hopeful For Every Game, Until the Fan Boys Attack My Games. Then the Knives Come Out.
Logic every gamers worst enemy.

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5506

12/31/12 12:26:49 PM#11
Eve already has a 'simulator' its called the test server, on there your character is 'mirrored' and anything you can normally fly/fit etc, you can do so on the test server, its a tool thats often used for combat training to build up teamwork, test out attack strategies etc. all equipment, ships etc also cost a ridiculously low amount of isk, so there is no bar on the equipment you can 'test' other than your own skill to use them.