people will say try eve now,

and the list you showing there i cannot offer any help but single players games at the moment until something different comes along in mmo genre

Originally posted by Deathstrike2

Cancelled.

same , alltho last time i said something liek this i got warning on flaming. =)

cheers,

Originally posted by Senadina

What? No trolls yet? They will come, to tell you to play a single player game if you want to solo, or that solo plyers are killing MMOs. But I agree with you. The first thing I look for is the ability to solo effectively. I do not want to be at the mercy of others when I feel like gaming. But i like the format of an MMO. Questing, looting, levelling up. Some single player RPG's offer a similar experience, but not enough. And they can't compete with the size of an MMO, and of course crafting and chatting.

SW:TOR is the #1 MMO I am looking forward to, followed by The Secret World ( fingers crossed on that one).

 yeah,  it always makes me laugh about when i see those kinda comments. it dont need alot of brainwork to understand why casual gamer who dont care much for grouping or raiding plays and mmo game then, while the answer is , world is alive full with other players not just programmed npc's. looking forward this game if theres much of a solo content!

cheers

i agree with op, also like to say it would not be big thing to make different looking armors and weapon skins, so the next 10 warriors standing next to me looks exactly the same. item remodeller in wow thanks.

cheers

Originally posted by Ginkeq

Originally posted by Caleveira

I would disagree. Im not saying you dont have a point, but well done instances are a nice thing to have, and you really cant entirely concentrate on the PvE if you know a fight with a boss can be broken up by KSers at any time. We had an uninstanced dungeon in PWI which became infamous as griefers would use it to gank lowbies trying to complete quests. Sure, the fights that broke out between those of us trying to help them and the guys camping it were fun, but the low levels we couldnt keep alive through AoE and it really got annoying after a while. The game has a system that rewards you with xp for helping them so we werent in it just out of the kindness of our hearts... All wannabe PKers would zerg over you just to up their counts. 

As a PvPer who does enjoy PvE, my solution would be to work out instances in such a way others could get in but wouldnt find it easy to catch up. Im all for open world PvP, but we really need to come up with a better solution than antiPKers to deal with griefers and KSers. Give the carebears a fighting chance. Instancing could become a part of it if done smartly, several routes, for instance, with varying difficulty levels and having elites with better AI that could follow you and strike at the best time. Imagine an instance wont open until theres at least a group at every entrance, then its both a race and a fight. The shortest way has the toughest mobs. Open world dungeons do sometimes work, but being trapped in there waiting for the boss to spawn and relying on guildies and allies to hold numerical advantage is something of a drag. To me the best PvP is done with a friend or two and a PUG, not relying on whatever mood your guildies are in to run a dungeon so you can gear up. Guild you should only call for the big fights, the ones theyll thank you for doing.

So, to me instancing can be an amazing tool if used right, as it could balance situations that devolve into whos got the body count. Imagine running away from a large group into an instance only a few can follow in. Or using them to set up an ambush against your KoS. The strategic potential of instancing is yet to be exploited. WAR scenarios, although flawed, were also a step in the right direction. And its easier for developers to do.

 

What is wrong with ganking lowbies?  Isn't that PvP?  Why should levels protectpeople from an integral part of an MMORPG?  Low levels should level in fear of a high level coming by and killing them, that just makes the game more interesting.  I remember in Everquest trying to level on Sullon Zek, certain teams controlled certain zones and the other teams could hurt each other by killing low levels on the other team & taking over their zones.  

I don't understand what is wrong with that.  Sure, they are at a disadvantage, but doesn't open PvP with no rules just encourage more PvP?  If high levels were to come in and gank low levels, then your team would be able to come in and protect the low levels as well.  It really encourages teamwork & socializing with other players. 

Imagine being a newbie, someone who is really low level on a PvP server, and having higher levels on another team attacking you + taking over your leveling area.  When those low levels ask their own team for help, and are helped by their own team, with no artificial rewards.. that is a great thing.  That person that was helped will want to level up and help their own team fight against the other teams.

Open PvP without instancing really builds unity among the teams, it's something you don't get in games like WoW.  Because in WoW, everything is basically instanced, and you can level without being attacked, no one cares if you get randomly PKed in a zone.  On top of that, it's not like the players lose anything in PvP, so your own team will care even less if you get killed by someone.  The view in WoW is that PvP should take place in instances, so no one does World PvP anymore (because World PvP is meaningless in instance games like WoW)

So I don't have a problem with griefers.. even if I was the person being griefed I don't have a problem with them.  Because if you were getting griefed, you would probably just want to get revenge on that person eventually.  It builds a healthy PvP system imo.

Now I understand not everyone can handle griefing, but that's why they should have multiple servers with different rulesets.  It's just hard to comprehend how games like WoW can call their instanced servers PvP servers when there is no healthy PvP on those servers because of the instancing system.  Their game would have been playable had they built a server without instances, with open PvP and no battlegrounds.  It would have been a real PvP server that is driven by server politics rather than artificial rewards that encourage farming other players for points (mindlessly.)

In EQ, KSing wasn't that huge of an issue.  If a guild showed up at an NPC first, then they basically have a time limit to kill it in.  It means that raids require more skill and require getting right.  If you take too long in a certain zone, another guild might show up and try to kill it.  But what is wrong with that?  It's not like the guild that was there first deserves the NPC because they were there first.  If another guild puts up a fight over an NPC, isn't that a healthy PvP system?

There were a lot of big fights over important NPCs in EQ, 50-100 people from each team fighting each other.  There is just nothing like that in any new MMORPG, because people don't have a good reason to fight each other in newer MMORPGs.

The only reason I ever did World PvP in WoW was out of sheer boredom.  There was never any meaning behind World PvP in WoW, because there was never any conflict between the teams.  Teams can't fight over anything in WoW, because they each have their own copy of everything. 

Instances are a massive failure on PvP servers.  To label a WoW server as "PvP" is a joke and Blizzard should be ashamed for labeling blue servers as red.  WoW is just a PvE game with no PvP system to speak of.  Not even their Battlegrounds or Arenas are PvP to people like me, because where I'm from PvP was actually meaningful and not based on artificial point systems where you farm each other.  

 

 

I recently read this on Wikipedia:

Instances were first proposed by Richard Garriott in the late 1990s as a way to solve a set of related problems which had become obvious in Ultima Online. The problem can be stated as follows: everyone wants to be "The Hero" and slay "The Monster", rescue "The Princess" and obtain "The Magic Sword". When there are 2,000 and more players all playing the same game, clearly not everyone can be the hero. The problem of everyone wanting to kill the same monster and gain the best treasure became obvious in the game EverQuest, where several groups of players would compete and sometimes harass each other in the same dungeon, in order to get to the monsters dropping valuable items. The creation of instances largely solves this set of problems, leaving only travelling to and from the dungeon as a potential risk in player versus player environments. There are few examples of boss camping and kill stealing in World of Warcraft - because a copy of the dungeon (instance) is always created on demand each player or party.

Richard Garriott, the same guy who was responsible for the massive failure of Tabula Rasa.  And people wonder why MMORPGs have been going downhill for the past 10 years?  When idiotic ideas from this guy are used in every new MMORPG to date?

"Leaving only travelling to and from dungeons as a potential risk in PvP environments."  What a joke that is... And once people are in those dungeons they are magically protected from PvP, what a fucking joke...  Whoever thought PvP and instancing should be used together is an idiot

 

i like mmo i like pvp i like doing quest and freedom of choise without forcing and im sure im not alone with this opinion,

i like free world to do whatever you want but one thing i dont agree is the red highlighted, if i have time to play like 1 to 2 hours a day for example everyhting else im doing outside gameworld and i like mmo games cause there is people around not just programmed stuff. the last thing i would like to experience as a new player that some uber elite guy come and gank me while im on a quest just because he needs to raise hes virtual *****. 

so i say its everyhting wrong in ganking players at that state! if you not even gona benefit anyhting from it ingame world.

cheers,

instanced pvp like for example world of warcraft and autoraidparty ( play whenever you feel like pvp )

open world pvp you fancy go alone to face enemy players end up being ganked most likely a group anyway.

a pvp is best to be instanced without forgetting the option to do that in open world also.

cheers

Originally posted by Gestankfaust

MMO does NOT mean group...period. It means a lot of people doing what you would do in a persistant world. Which is whatever the hell you want.

get over yourselves.

amen, key feature is that world is moving and real people is running around you, forcing to group to get something in these games are only poison. freedom of choise!

cheers

 make money soulbound, when you pick it up you can only buy.

 community is horrid every game in someway always, i would pick warhammer also.

music is brill in aion producded professionally by professional

true , every new game is killed by every new game only wow remains always and thats sad =p

 toughts and toughts feelings and opinions, im playing the game at the moment and im 30 years old working parent.

i havent yet reached level 25 wich they say the game starts to be more interesting , i havent yet having a need of grind. and kinda enjoy the game, playing it until something else in mmo frontier comes out. there is couple good single player rpg also coming soon so need to check them out.

anyway my fears of aion pvp gona be group ganging in the abyss and ifits something like that i most definetly leave the game.

cheers,

 game needs item remodeller npc like couple games already have. that way there would be a change of looks other than next 20 warrior wearing excatly the samelooking armor and sword. dull

Originally posted by Praetalus

Correct me if I'm wrong, but these are farm bots? Just farming? Or are people rolling buff bots and stuff also? Back when I was playing shadowbane it really started to suck when every person playing had three accounts with buff bots preist and bards running with them. Made them hard as hell to kill.

i saw this in world of warcraft , you encounter with 5 shamans named killyou, killyjou, killedyou etc , one played by you others repeating your actions. great isnt it?!

 yeah it is a problem in everygame nowadays, dont think there is a good solution to prevent it, take the money as it is away totally in games or make it soulbound. 

nor but a one gamemaster in everymap freeflying invisibly to seek bots and delete em.

cheers,

 content is was makes the playing interesting and keeps you coming back.

good game content dont forget all the player types, and gives the same reward to those types depending what they do.

one good note that comes my mind now is from vanguard and the diplomacy minigame thats a hellagood bonus content for game.

cheers,

Originally posted by Mattyb710

I'm LOL'ing at anyone who thinks a single person played each character.

me too, gold farmer boys characters. def

 people think mainly that grinding is another word of repeat, if you need to do something more than once its grinding they say.

if you lack of quests and just kill monsters to gain levels people call that a grinding also.

but yeah just like previous post said, if you dont enjoy what you are doing in game stop it.

cheers

Originally posted by Ginkeq

Just was curious what other people thought.  I played the open beta and realized that the game was pretty horrible.  I mean the camera system wasn't too useful when it comes to PvP, seems like a clunky interface and the PvP is going to consist of people hitting chains mindlessly.  

Also, Is their whole endgame really going to be PvP?  It really annoys me when these carebear games come out and try to act like they are some kind of hardcore PvP game when they are basically catering to this audience: The people who suck at PvE so much they PvP.  Really, if the game was for PvPers then why isn't there a hardcore server where you can kill anyone at any level in any zone?  Currently it looks like there is a certain level restriction on PvP and also much of the PvP is focused in instances/artificial zones or specific zones.

What happened to games where you could PvP anywhere at any time?  That would be a real PvP game.

how can someone suck at pve? heh i think op suck at pvp so this is hes way to destroy the pvp players skills.

pve is allthe same as pvp if you only gona blame whacking chain skills mindlessly is allthesame hitting chain skill mindlessly on pve. or in raids or big groups you end up hitting few buttons only and if you do anyhting else you fail. this is how the mmo games are today accept it. 

cheers,

 sorry but i want elder scrolls 5, fallout3 didnt do me anyhting ...wait... funny posters.

anyway. gimme es5 bitches!