Originally posted by Seytan

Originally posted by Sarg01

You people are crazy. Evidence isn't evidence because the person doing the writing "might" be associated with the developer, or is a company with a business agreement with the developer. Sure, the video is faked, sure, the leaks are faked, sure, the download screenshots are faked, sure, the press releases from the other companies involved are all fake (despite them being companies that sell products that aren't Darkfall). You, of course, have no real reason to believe any of this is fake, other than the fact that they said something about Darkfall. Basically, as far as you guys are concerned, nothing can be trusted unless it trashes the game, because that's the only way you can be reasonably sure it didn't come from a friend of a dev?

 

Do you really go through life this paranoid? Do you really think people set up an 8 year scam to get 50 bucks out of you? Even if they scammed 5,000 people for 50 dollars and produced absolutely nothing at all - that's only $250k - about $32,000/year. I don't know what the median income is in Greece, but in the US, that's well below it. People who have the necessary skills to produce such a deception can pretty easily make 4 or 5 times that working in sales or marketing and not have to worry about any legal issues.

Huh? How do you know either way? Besides most of the sentiment here has to do with the fact that there isnt any beta test exposure...how hard is that for people to understand? All they got to do is let out some info to quell peoples apprehension regarding the game. Further as people here have stated its the lack of said information FROM THE BETA that is pissing em off. At any rate I wont preorder, as I have many many questions about DFO and after shelving WO I dont want to screw around with another broken POS game. MAKE SENSE? Thats the issue here.
 

to quell peoples apprehension
 

Yep, angst.  Don't get so emotional about a video game and you will have no issue.

Originally posted by cosy

i dont reply for each of you
you tell me that you get a game in beta and you dont know on what system will run(estimated) then you dont got a beta you are in alpha

ooh so i have to discover things myself, when a game got a FEATURE that should be clear before you buy the game just take your time and read feature section on DFO website is very very very vague

is a pvp game and you have to understand very well how things works because you can lose stuff if you dont have the basic knowledge, city and city siege is one of them

also if i am a possible customer do i have to read interviews to find out details about a game or read it on game web page FAQ section ?

like i told you lack of communication skills (marketing ?)

btw yes slash commands are important i want to know how many things can be executed on that way is a easy "find" if the game is vulnerable to macros/bots

OK, but all of these things can be found out from people that don't care as much as you and play at launch.  If this stuff is gamemaking for you, don't buy it til you find out.
 

And a clear feature does not mean they are going to spoon feed you the details.  Again, feel free to wait to buy if these things are gamemaking for you.

There's no 'lack of comm skills/marketing' if it has always been their intention to develop this game this way.  To leave the game a mystery to be discovered while playing.  It's just not the marketing you are used to.

Originally posted by winter

Originally posted by Jessonater

Originally posted by throckmorton

100% agree.

Shadowbane is the most revolutionary MMO out there, and it's 5 years old.

 

Everyone complains about modern WoW clones. I'd love to see a Shadowbane clone.

Sadly, the lack of success that Shadowbane has had scares away developers.

 

Darkfall anyone?

lol

 

 Sadly not even close. Untill they actually show something more then a video with a few goblins or release so players can actually discuss facts over the current wall of dev promises DF is just Hype. At the very least in comparison Shadowbane had several more races and more interesting races choices (Centuar, Minotaur, Vampyre) then DF's 4 standard fantasy races.

 

Vamps were an xpac race.
 

DF - human, dwarf, elf, alfar, mahirim, orc (1 "different" race mahirim)

SB - human, dwarf, elf, half-elf, HG, Mino, irekie (1 "different" race irekie)

SB was great.  Burning cities was great.  Putting people in therapy b/c you burned their city was great.

DF could surpass SB.  We shall see.

Too true.  Any links to the negative leak?

Originally posted by ProfRed

I think every problem can be offset by the benefits.  The reason small studios usually exist is to fill a niche market that large publishers and companies aren't filling.  Publishers and producers across all genres are huge creative cloning facilities where they try to rehash and rip off anything successful.  Every once in a while something good comes along, but within months to a year it is so overdone it is forgotten.  Almost any truly classic and memorable song, movie, or game is done by indy organizations, or small scale projects.  Once they blow up they lose the magic.  This is where selling out comes from.  It is sad that this is happening so adamantly with games now, but it is a cycle that rapes any creative venue.

Don't become a machine, a zombie, or lose your individuality.  Support creativity over cloning and ripping off, and hope that these companies that get rich off of destroying creativity and originality don't take over the world because that would not be a world that I would want my children and grandchildren to grow up in. 

Yep.  I think they are doing a great job despite their limitations in budget/manpower.  I actually prefer the lack of information.  As long as they don't sell out, they can delay b/c of publishers or any other reason.  Just deliver the features when it does launch and maintain the concepts behind the development post-launch.  It costs me nothing to wait for a game to launch.

Better that than signing w/ a publisher that will bastardize the game post-launch for more subscribers.  Keep the game's design, creative, and growth in the hands of the creators.

Originally posted by TypicalDwarf

I'm in no way saying that the conduct of Aventurine is acceptable...but in all honesty I somewhat do feel sorry for him and this grave he has dug for himself...ok not really.

But seriously though this man has a future in some form of bullshiting job!

Because Aventurine has an obligation to give you information?  Do you own stock?  Did you buy something?

They can do what they want.  It's their game, their development, their launch.

Originally posted by cosy

 

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Originally posted by SSRat

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Originally posted by cosy

 

ppl give their opinions based on information released by developers
the crap pop up when things are not 100% clear and is only dev fault
exaggerated example
if a dev say "ork skin will by white like the snow and only white" that is damn clear
but if a dev say "ork skin will look awesome" well awesome for me is pink but for you that colour sux
so developers should apologise for having -1 communication skills [possible explication devs are geeks and geeks dont know to communicate in normal language they use C++]
 
 

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At least give a valid example of what you are trying to say.
Plenty of orc screenies out there so your exaggerated example is not an example.  What information that has been released is unclear?

---

 

city /control/buildings/crafting/bonuses/siege system/city defence repair
guild roles/permissions/ market permission for members
relationship between skills what skills will lover x skills
salvaging weapons and armours for raw materials
UI custom UI/ item linking in chats
slash commands in game/emotes/
system requirements

this are just some of them
 

Much of that is to be discovered by players.  There's is quite a bit of info on cities though.  Salvaging and UI haven't been addressed to my knowledge.  Maybe there is nothing to address there.  When you hire an NPC, you will find out what commands/guidelines you can give them.  Are you thinking 'different markup rates for guild members' when you talk about market permissions?  Good question but not a gamemaker.  Will this ability have a significant impact on the game?  No.

Slash commands?  Seriously?

There's info on system requirements in one of the interviews.  But again, who cares?  Any MMO player will have and/or know what is needed.  If you have a crap PC, you will need a better one.  What MMO minimum system requirements are actually bearable for a player?  We always want the best we can afford anyway.  Knowing the requirements will not enable you to buy a better PC.  As far as platforms go, they addressed this in an interview.

You seem to be interested in a lot of the details that either they want you to discover or that I don't think are important and maybe they don't either.  No way to address every players' wishlist.  I understand the desire to know as much as possible about the game.  I have the same desire but not knowing doesn't really change the fact that playing will be the only true test of the game.

I guess knowing that I can siege is good enough for me.  When I play, I'll figure out how.  We pretty much know all the options available to us in the game.  Figuring out how and/or the best way to go about achieving these things is what playing the game is for (imo of course).  I think we just have different expectations. ;)

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by SSRat

At least give a valid example of what you are trying to say.

Plenty of orc screenies out there so your exaggerated example is not an example.  What information that has been released is unclear?

 

Almost everything said about this game is open to intepretation, they have said certain things are in the game but how these things are actually implemented is not clear.  How I think features will be implemented is not the same as the next person.  

Regarding appologies the most hardcore trolls have gone strangely silent recently so I doubt we will be hearing much from them unless the game sucks.  At least they get to live with the knowledge that whoever laughs last ect.

OK, any examples?  I'm sincerely curious b/c most of the info that has been released is fairly solid and specific.  They have also categorically stated that other information will not be provided as it will be up to the players to discover it.  So, is information truly unclear or are people just expecting the same A-Z layout of game content that other games provide prior to launch?

You would have to wait for additional servers to be added.  Pretty sure they will not have the capacity to host for 300k users at launch.  At least (it seems) they are only going to sell the game to the extent that they can handle the users.  (As opposed to selling as many as possible and implementing server queues).  Who knows though.  I'm sure a lot will depend on what they can get sorted w/ the delay.

If they deliver on the features advertised, it is an enormous increase over UO.

Originally posted by admriker4

I dont need beta access to see if the game isnt a scam.

But what I do require is a reputable reviewer see the game. Tasos has hidden this game from mmorpg.com and others and then asks for preorders.

Its simple really, show us the game actually exists and works and most of the scam claims will go away. If Tasos has nothing to hide he'll let someone besides his sister review the game

Actually, mmorpg got to play the game.  Just not the one written in a language you understand.

Originally posted by cosy

ppl give their opinions based on information released by developers
the crap pop up when things are not 100% clear and is only dev fault
exaggerated example
if a dev say "ork skin will by white like the snow and only white" that is damn clear
but if a dev say "ork skin will look awesome" well awesome for me is pink but for you that colour sux

so developers should apologise for having -1 communication skills [possible explication devs are geeks and geeks dont know to communicate in normal language they use C++]

 

 

At least give a valid example of what you are trying to say.

Plenty of orc screenies out there so your exaggerated example is not an example.  What information that has been released is unclear?

Originally posted by kabuto202

It seems that the more betas you particepate, the more often you get accepted. So last week I decided to try and sign up for the Darkfall beta, and add it to my giant list. The only problem is when I get to www.darkfallonline.com/cnb, all I get is a white screen. I tried doing this with several different browsers and still it's the same result. Is this a technicall error? Or did they simply close sign ups? If it is a tech error anyone know how to solve it? Also it's the same thing with the forums.

Don't quote me on this, but they may not be taking any more apps.  They already have more than enough to accomodate their testing needs.

Do you really think some investor is going to hand over millions w/ nothing to show for it?  (well, some might.....)

All everyone is doing is speculating based on                               .  (<-means nothing)

NDA is up b/c Av has stated over and over again in interview after interview that the content is to be discovered by players in game and not in wiki or thotbot.

If mmorpg US had play tested the game and posted footage would that make it more 'real'?

As far as leaks go, there have been some and will probably be more if they are inviting more testers.  But the reason the NDA is still up is pretty clear based on interviews (as opposed to angst-filled speculation).  Could there be 'other' reasons?  Sure.  Who cares.  When it launches, buy it if you like it.

Originally posted by templarga

Originally posted by SSRat

Yes, they should have.  But they didn't have a publisher until very late in the game.  Everyone knew that (I thought).   Did they screw up by not landing a publisher sooner?  Probably.  But worst case scenario is a delay in launch which is nothing new in MMO land.

I agree but what I wish (or hoped) is that they had come clean and simply said that. You know, something like, "Hey the game is ready and it could launch now, but we are needing more from our publisher. They came in late and are still working to set-up the infrastructure. This is going to delay launch for X amount of time."

Something like that would have been awesome. I just get frustrated by the lack of information about the stuff that matters.

That's exaclty what they did do.  Sure, maybe they could have let us know about the delay sooner but maybe they were just optimistic.  Does it really matter?  This is the first game I've ever 'followed' through development so I've never been 'burned' but I also don't set any expecations.  I'll play when it's released and either it's worth the money or it's not.  Same as SB, WoW, AoC, Warhammer, etc.

Originally posted by Zayne3145

Things aren't looking great for Aventurine at the moment. The community is restless, the Trolls are rampaging and the days are slipping by. The question is, now that judgement day (Feb. 25th) is rapidly approaching, is it time for Tasos to face facts and reveal the true state of Darkfall?

Unless you have been living under a rock for the past few months, you will know - Troll and Fanboy alike - that the news coming from the Aventurine camp has been less than pleasing (when there has been news at all). The resounding murmur seems to be that the game is not ready. We know it. Tasos knows it. There is only a month left until the misguidedly announced release date, and all but the most optimistic of us know either it won't release, or will be released in a broken state.

Therefore, I feel it's time for Tasos to come clean. I have to admit, as cycnical as I am about the whole development, if he came forward and made a truthful, honest assessment about just how far behind they are, and a REAL estimate of how long they need (be it months or years) then he would go up a lot of people's estimations.

Delays pass by. Lies and broken promises endure. I really think for the sake of Darkfall, Tasos needs to come clean. Swallow his pride, and tell it like it is.

Do any of you agree? Or do you think this will simply be more damaging to an already controversial development?

I for one have had enough of statements similar to those quoted in my sig...

Depends on whether the speculation in your post is more accurate than the news from Aventurine, I guess. ;)

Yes, they should have.  But they didn't have a publisher until very late in the game.  Everyone knew that (I thought).   Did they screw up by not landing a publisher sooner?  Probably.  But worst case scenario is a delay in launch which is nothing new in MMO land.

Originally posted by templarga

Originally posted by SSRat

The point is you can try and group all of these gaming companies to prove that delays do not matter (I point I can agree with) but what you fail to mention is that, with 1 month to go before their launch, we had more information, more develop articles, more quotes, more gameplay footage, more press releases, more media tested interviews, etc.... than we have in 7 years of Darkfall's existence. And that is the problem.
 
I don't really see this as a problem.  What good did all the information, articles, quotes, gameplay footage, press releases, inteviews, etc. do for the quality of those games?  Take AoC for example.  Did all that information make the game good?  No, it created the illusion of quality amidst many promises but the actual game sucked.
Demanding more information is not being skeptical.  Crying vaporware b/c of delays or no beta (for yourself) is not being skeptical.  Being negative is not being skeptical
Many point to the Tasos quote regarding the game being ready as proof of his 'stunts' and lies.  The game was delayed due to logistics as far as anyone knows, not the readiness of the game. 
Most of you are not skeptics, you are angry pigs snorting at an empty (information/beta) trough.  Way too much angst for a video game.  On one hand, you demand information.  On the other, you claim that you will only purchase the game if you or someone you know plays it first.  Well, which is it?  If you insist on first hand knowledge, who cares if there are delays and how much it will cost?  (btw, it's $50ish for the game and $15ish for the sub).  Who cares how much information they give you before release?
The self-styled skeptics are just as bad as those claiming the game is great having never played it.

EDIT - yes I registered in '04 and this is my first post. 
 

Of the stuff in red, are you SURE? Are you 100% positive? Do you have proof?

See, that's the argument. I expect the game to cost a lot more. I think the dollar-Euro conversion is going to be a surprise to many and is going to catch them off guard.

The reason the game was delayed is because (my assumption here) they are having publisher issues. Sure they have a great game but if you do not have the infrastructure in place to handle billing, account creation, distribution and the like, then it doesn't matter AT ALL what your game is like. Just like a car company can build the greatest car in the world but if there is no way to get it to the buyer, it doesn't matter.

What I do not understand is why people believe that these issues just cropped up! I mean seriously, did Aventurine not realize that this stuff wasn't ready or in place weeks ago? Why not tell us? Why wait to the last minute? And given what has transpired up to this point with how Aventurine treats its fans and the continual lack of information (when was the last time the FAQ was updated?) makes me skeptical.

And the sad part is, Aventurine could easily post information to answer a lot of questions that people have, they just don't do it.

It's straight from an interview (Tasos or Klaus I think).  Is it 100% accurate?  Probably not.  The inteviewee was ballparking.

Your assumption is not assumption if we are to believe the delay announcement.  I agree that logistics are important but the Tasos quote being thrown around was clearly refering to the game itself and its playability.

Who knows.  I, personally, don't care.  I love the game concept.  When it's ready, it's released.  I pay and play or I don't.  /shrug

They have stated many times that they do not want to post information on the game and its content.  Their intent is that 99% of game content and game play is discovered by the players.  Probably the same reason for the NDA staying in place atm.  This is how they want to produce their game.  There is no MMO template afaic since many that followed the template you would like to see have failed miserably.

RE: last minute - these logistics are important but they are also much more cookie cutter.  You don't really have to develop a payment platform; it's more a matter of linking everything together.  So, is another month enough time?  That all depends on where they were on 1/22. :D

The point is you can try and group all of these gaming companies to prove that delays do not matter (I point I can agree with) but what you fail to mention is that, with 1 month to go before their launch, we had more information, more develop articles, more quotes, more gameplay footage, more press releases, more media tested interviews, etc.... than we have in 7 years of Darkfall's existence. And that is the problem.
 
I don't really see this as a problem.  What good did all the information, articles, quotes, gameplay footage, press releases, inteviews, etc. do for the quality of those games?  Take AoC for example.  Did all that information make the game good?  No, it created the illusion of quality amidst many promises but the actual game sucked.

Demanding more information is not being skeptical.  Crying vaporware b/c of delays or no beta (for yourself) is not being skeptical.  Being negative is not being skeptical
Many point to the Tasos quote regarding the game being ready as proof of his 'stunts' and lies.  The game was delayed due to logistics as far as anyone knows, not the readiness of the game. 

Most of you are not skeptics, you are angry pigs snorting at an empty (information/beta) trough.  Way too much angst for a video game.  On one hand, you demand information.  On the other, you claim that you will only purchase the game if you or someone you know plays it first.  Well, which is it?  If you insist on first hand knowledge, who cares if there are delays and how much it will cost?  (btw, it's $50ish for the game and $15ish for the sub).  Who cares how much information they give you before release?
The self-styled skeptics are just as bad as those claiming the game is great having never played it.

EDIT - yes I registered in '04 and this is my first post.