All Posts by CreamSoda

Originally posted by PatchDay

I know most will disagree with me because we are all deeply entriched in grinding up to our ears. But I personally feel that "Levels" are contrary to what MMO should be about. People always say they are here for the community, etc but really how do you factor in "Levels" into this?

I join mmorpgs to play with friends. If my friend advances too quickly, now I am left behind. That my friend is crappy in my book

So then what I would like too see is the Level treadmills removed. There are surely other ways to reward players and keep them around. But I guess MMORPGs have to deal with massive latency issues huh. Thus, they have to keep dangling carrots infront of our faces to keep us from noticing how dull the game really is

 

I think Levels made sense in the context of single player RPGs, coops, and pen & paper but in MMORPG setting they are holding the genre back I'd say (actually Levels fubar coop RPGs as well)

Actually so what I desire is an MMO, a pure MMO that either detaches the RPG altogether and/or merely has minor RPG elements where you design a template upfront that s fully leveled, and from that point forward you can experience the real game

 

Levels are a way of giving people a unified goal when done correctly.  In past games big gaps between levels would not make your going out with your friend irrelevant.  At the same time a game with many levels gives a main long term goal. 
 

I feel that not having levels in contrary to RPGs.  You don't just assume the character you are.  You grow them over time and you need a number of some sort to show your devotion and hard work on a character.  Once you just give everyone max level what are you playing for?  If the answer is gear or money and not friends then levels are not the problem, it's you.

An MMORPG to me with no levels would just be silly.  Why? because you have yourself a game which has instant gratification like a console game.  I don't want to pick 1 game to use as an example but if you were to give me one I could spin some analogies that might make sense. 

So let's look at what you want an MMORPG with 0 levels.  You log in and group with friends you may have a certain goal you may not.  Questing, treasure hunting, what ever it is.  It has to be fun right?  How would you excel at things with no levels?  Wouldn't everything be accessible to everyone if there was no levels?  Even if it was for menial tasks like picking a lock?  My point is there would be no challenge, there would be no sense of accomplishment.

I think of games with out levels I think of stuff like Fight Night, Madden, GTA4, MGS4.  To me an RPG is defined by levels on all scales.

Originally posted by banthis

Originally posted by Emotions

Originally posted by thekid1

How many players will there be in the biggest fights?
I've read 100 vs 100, but that's not a whole lot.

 

NOT ALOT? to be honest thats to much imo

have you ever been in alterac valley in wow?? Even that was to much people. You were able to kill one person (maybe 2 max) and then you get 10 people on your ass. GL in 100vs100 then.

 

Thats why you work as a dream instead of Joe Blow out killing for whatever activity.  If your team works together  the chances of a ton of people focusing on just you is lower.

Game mechanics always play a role when fights that big take place.  100 vs 100 may be hard in one game and more tolerable in another.  In my last few months in Shadowbane I was at a seige to defend UDL's Sapling city.  The number was around 175 - 84 the 84 won.  Planning, skill, good character builds, it all went in to beating the numbers.

Ampris you seem like a decent person and I respect you for that.  I am not a fanboi of AoC or one of these hardcore this and that guys but I will say this - what happened to you sucked but why post about it?  Is it really surprising that there are complete and utter scumbag tools who happen to log off Xbox live for 10 minutes to gank?  These people do exist and most of them are very immature but you can't let it bug you.  Coming on to these forums to discuss it is your right.  But I am seeing this as more of complaint than a discussion.  There is nothing to discuss that guy was a douche, but your on a pvp server and should eat it like everyone else.

Want to know what I would do?

I would have come back and slayed his ass.  Then I would ran to the nearest res point and camped him 3x for being a f*ck stick.  I know that doesn't detract from what he did, but trust me it will make you feel better.

Originally posted by iamct2327

Wow takes the win, great AI (you know they heal, grow larger, chase you around corners stop heal themselves buff themselves etc etc), terrific animations (top of the line if you ask me) and well just overall fun factor IMO. Though everyone complains here and there about WOW (its because they are jealous that its number one and that blizz rocks). The blizz devs are having a field day with this release its a laughing stock to them most likely.

 

Also Vanguard is much more fun to play lately and runs much better. Though it can use a char and spell overhaul (that should be coming soon I think).

Your post is not only that of a fan boi, but of a fan boi who is extremely insecure about the implications AoC could have on WoW.  Like so many others you have convinced yourself that Blizzard is a great company,  I find this hilarious.  Blizzard is a terrible company that treats their fan base like crap by updating the game as little as possible and ignoring common knowledge of over all performance, balance, and player needs.  Blizzard has set the tone for itself as a company that is so beyond professionalism that they could never be wrong.

Blizzard's latest description of what was to be WoTLK was is a great example of how they are trying to make their game sound more appealing and at the same time offer no real example.  WoTLK will do way less sales than BC did because of two reasons. 

1. BC was and still is a downgrade from the original WoW content. 

2.  People saw the bait and switch of BC knowing full well WotLK will have the same problems. 

3. Because of 2 mixed with 1 people will have AoC to fall on and not have to put up with Blizzard's bullshit tactics.  AoC is a great alternative to WoW and is better. 

I play a HoX, simply nuts.  They have so much going for them in pve and pvp.  I do not know from personal experience but I hear that bear shaman are a pain in the ass to level 1-20.  Not that it's impossible but hard.  My HoX is level 30 atm, but at 29 I could 2 shots 4 mobs at level 31.  Yes they are that good.

I have been playing AoC since early access started.  Besides the downtime for server fixes the game is soo much fun.  I haven't played a game that was this good since Asheron's Call, and WoW 1-59.  I would recommend it to anyone who likes more mature content with quests that have serious tones.  Plus combos rule, guilds are very fresh in options, and player cities + guild pvp looks like it could be a huge success.

Originally posted by Pappy13

Originally posted by CreamSoda

It would be unfitting for them to change their “I couldn’t give a f*ck what the players want” attitude now.

I for one don't want player housing.  Maybe their just listening to the wrong players?

No no I don't mean that as, that attitude only applies to houses.  I mean everything.  My point is, I don't even know if the majority of people want houses, but it wouldn't matter because Blizzard does not care.

Originally posted by scorchshin

I see people talking about wanting something new from WoW, but if they do some major changes to the game they will upset the majority of the players. I'm not currently playing since I'm in the WAR beta, but a major change would cause more problems.

Also look at games that revamped there games.

DAOC Trials of Atlantis - Made a lot of the pvp community mad when this was release

Star Wars Galaxies - Just look at the forums on this site for info.

 

First let me say one thing (something new in WoW) does not necessarily equate to (major changes in WoW).

You really believe a multibillion dollar company can not make new things appear with out upsetting people?  I know you don't believe that.  You and I could think up some new things for WoW that would upset no one, and improve the overall gaming experience.

This is a trick question there has been no better MMO than AC, now or previously.

It will be fun to see the WotLK expansion sell a lot, and then one month later WoW subscriptions plummet.  BC was forgiven by most people because it was Blizzard’s first expansion.  Second expansion built around the same rubbish will have a much stronger negative response.  It gets me excited!

Originally posted by Nomatica

I played many mmorpgs and i think blizzard is the only company that really perfected the talent system. And still does, i have yet to play a mmorpg with a AA/Talent system like WoWs, because for one reason.

When we play WoW from 1-40 40 talent points in there really is a TRUE change to the class it makes it feel like playing a whole class all together kind of like a new class. Once at 40 you can tell a major difference between a Prot war/ fury war/ arms war , Holy priest/Shadow priest, etc. I think talents are a must have in any mmorpg because it really allows you to be more unique to your class WoWs system is ALMOST skill based mixed with a level based system.

I Tried EQ2 talent system and for some reason it just doesnt hit the spot like WoWs does.

WoWs talent system is ok.  I don't think its "customizable".  The talent trees do not allow you to have a gimped character.  There for they are wiping your ass.  Games that allow you to make a gimped character feel "real" to me.  Why?  With no penalty or risk it just seems like a free be.  As does much of WoW but thats another story.

When you factor in WoW's character visual customization, item diversity/customization, skill sets.   I think it is the least customizable game out.  My old character looked like a clone to every other toon of the same class/race.

Originally posted by Mithrandolir

 

Originally posted by andmiller

 

Originally posted by Mithrandolir

For some, like me, the game is actually awesome. I was there for the launch of Meridean 59 (after years of MUD'ing) and was also there for the launch of UO. I was foaming at the mouth for the beta and launch of EQ1. I have played every mainstream mmorpg to date since then, and some that aren't so mainstream at at all. Some I have liked, some I have hated.

PotBS is a gigantic breath of fresh air to me. This caught me by some surprise because I am not a gigantic fan of pirates in general, and I honestly never could get intop EVE, even after 4 serious attempts (giving it more than 30 days each time). And yet... here I am... played to level 38 in open beta and then to 50 with the exp books at the end, and now have a level 21 in pre-boarding and I honestly can not get enough of it. I haven't even barely scratched the surface of the economy so I have that whole side of the game to look forward to at launch.

I absolutely love the ship combat system, but that's not news to many. I see some folks here that absolutely despise the game and even some of them liked the ship combat system, so no surprises there. What is a surprise, I guess, for me at aleast, is that i honestly like the avatar combat as well. I like the arcade feel of it. I love the skill selections. It's extremely "niche" but that's exactly what it was suppose to be. So how can somebody who loved EQ1 and AC1, AO and Camelot, EQ2 and LotRO... love the avatar combat in PotBS? I don;t have an answer for you. But I'd be lying if I said that i am not having a complete blast in this game and that included Avcom. When i forst read about avcom, I winced, seriously. I mean, I love meeting with 40 guildies for Planes raids (at least back in the day when Fear and Hate were in their infancy), I love huge explorable worlds and the more seamless the better as far as I am concerned... and yet again, here I am and loving PotBS... even after sinking 80+ hours into the game, and it's so different from those other experiences that I loved. It makes no sense that I would love this game so much when I am generally an explorer at heart, and yet I do.

I loved what I have seen of the economy and can't wait to dwelve deeper into it. I love the port contention and RvR aspect of the game as well. I love taking into account wind direction and ship positioning. I love having many different types of ammo to choose from depending on the situation and what i am trying to accomplish (de-masting... punching holes in sails, destroying a ships armor from afar, crushing the structure itself or just knoicking the crew into the drink a few at a time! I love it!

Boarding needs some TLC. It needs some balancing, especially at low levels. I got to 38 in beta and by 35 I had not died to any NPC's aboard a ship. We can generally win the boarding fights in about 10 seconds if done in a certain way. But the actual combat itsel is great in my opinion. Like I said before, I love the arcade type feel to it and I think it;s a great thing in a genre of pretty common and predictable combat mechanics. I think a big part of the issue is that people want the combat to be more like what they are use to. I am glad it's not, I have a billion mmorpgs I could play if I wanted that type of combat (and I still do play some of them, for that very reason), but PotBS is not like the rest, it's drastically different and with that comes quite a bit of disgust from those who simply weren't looking for this type of game. I have quite a few rl co-workers and friends who i have talked into playing this (they all play mmorpgs quite a bit), not one of them has expressed an issue with the avcom aside from some animation issues that are being worked on by the devs as we speak, and the fact that "it's so different". We are all enjoying the hell out of it.

I'm in no way saying that I think anybody is wrong for thinking it sucks. I just have a completely different opinion than you. Nobody should buy the game because someone says "it's great, buy it now!" and hopefully nobody will dismiss the game because someone says "it sucks, stay clear of this mess!" Hopefully people will research it thoroughly, check out any free trials that pop up and/or get some buddy passes if there are any in the future, and can make an educated decision based on personal experience at little to no risk (cost). Barring that, it's a gamble for anyone who wasn't in beta or the pre-boarding. If people have the money and the risk seems pretty low to them, try it out, I find it wickedly fun. If you'd rather hang on to your 50 bucks until more info arises, that's totally cool and respectable, the game has some issues and they are working on them feverishly as they prepare for launch and by waiting in the wings you will likely miss any launch issues that arise and should be able to get a look at the first few sets of patch notes and some player feedback based on them. If you have played and hate the game, that's cool too, it's certainly not for everyone. I truly like people and I believe that despite the passionate feeling that happen to be on opposite ends of the gaming spectrum, we all have the same goals, we want to play mmorpgs and have fun. So someday maybe we will agree on a different games mechanics and will end up buddies, fighting side by side... perhaps not... either way it's ok... we don't see eye to eye on a game... it's a pretty small thing.

I think that PotBS will do well for what it's targeting, a niche group of folks who want something different from the norm, even if that means dealing with some lumps along the way until things get ironed out. They aren't going to change the core mechanics here, if you hate the game than chances are you will always hate the game. Some people want things changed that would completely flip this game upside down and make it common mmorpg, just like the majority of what is out there right now. That's just not going to happen, I believe that FLS is a lot like Turbine in the sense that they are creating a game that they themselves love and that's why they are doing it. Sure there's money involved, but I bet that nopt one of them are doing it for the money, call it a hunch. They'd rather have the game they love with a niche 100 - 200k subs than a game that is nothing like what they envisioned but with 1 million subs. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. In fact, it's a nice contrast to what's already out there for the most part.

i can't get into EVE, but they are doing extremely well for what they set out to do. The game isn't a failure because it has under 500k subs. It's a great game that is constantly making strides forward and although it has it's own lumps to hurdle (and how can it not, being as "different" as it is), it's playerbase pretty much love it, as they should, it's a labor of love made for them by people who think like they do... it's what a niche game is all about.

Anyway... I wish you all the best. I'll be here playing for the long haul :) If you happen to like the game, or just trying it out, perhaps we will meet in game either as friends or on opposite sides of the cannons :) Or maybe you hate the game as it stands today and we'll never meet in the Caribbean, but perhaps in the future a game will arise where we agree on the value of it and can play together there. That's what this is all about, right? hanging out with friends and having fun in these games? So as mushy as it sounds, I hope you find a great game that you truly enjoy, and i hope someday to see you in a world where we can have some fun! :)

Peace out guys/gals. Agree or disagree with me, this puppy is launching in 5 days. We've made it!

 

 

 

 

Awesome reply.....however anyone who thinks that a game developer would rather have 100-200 subscriptions vs. 1 million , FOR ANY REASON, is out of their friggen mind.

 

 

Trust me, they would rather have 1 million.  They are not a non-profit company.

 

Thanks. 100 - 200 thousand, not just 100 to 200. And yes, I believe they would rather have the 100 - 200k. But it's not a cut and dry statement like that. Of course they'd rather have a million IF and that's a giant "IF" they could have them without sacrificing the original foundation and design of the game. I'm in upper management at one business and run my own business as well. Both businesses are extremely successful. In both cases we'd much rather have a smaller client base and make less of a profit anually (while still makiung a profit mind you, that's important), if we can stay the course as true to ourselves and true to our actual plan. If we could make more with more clients and maintain that level of integrity than sure we'd go there in a heartbeat. But if "more profit" = "selling out" than guess what... I'll be out. There's a million other avenues I could explore. Obviously not everyone or every company thinks this way, but I truly believe that FLS does. They made this game as a labor of love and they shoul, hopefully, stay that course. If they begin to reach for the masses and spread it out too thin, it won't stand a chance. It's a very niche game, so in order for the subscriptions to explode into bigger number, it's niche market would have to explode into bigger numbers, and that is highly unlikely.

With that said, if they could get a million subs and be true to themselves and the original concept of the game, then I agree :) They'd certainly take that!

Maybe I am wrong about FLS. Maybe they will swing by and speak for themselves on this issue. But this is certainly what I got from them over the past few months.

 

The Realm Online > Meridian 59

Originally posted by Aguy

AOC and WAR both look like they will turn out to be very good games, no question about it.  But saying they are going to completely kill WoW is stupid.  Vanguard was supposed to be the WoW killer, and we all see what an impact it had on it......

What a joke.

I constantly hear that (according to other people) people said Vangaurd was supposed to be the WoW killer.

I never actually saw anyone say that, and yes I was playing WoW like a tool right when Vangaurd came out.

In fact I heard many people talking about how incomplete the game was.

Everyone, please stop referencing what a few stupid children said.  Most people knew Vangaurd was a steaming pile of shit even before release.  It was stated that the game was looking for a fan base to finance the rest of development.

If they do send out invites I hope they come on Christmas and I get one.  I am dieing to beta test WAR.  Some how I already know I will be let down.  I don't think the beta invites are random enough.

Originally posted by Pappy13

Originally posted by CreamSoda

That is the problem with WoW its one or the other.  Your either completely social and don't stress raiding, which doesn't leave a lot to be desired.  Or you raid like a second job which is pretty much the only way to advance because raiding isn't always a walk in the park.

This brings me to my second point.  Why is there no happy medium?  I used to play 2 MMOs in where when there was nothing to do you could go in to a town and bullshit with friends and make trades (you need a real economy for that).  If we were sitting around talking it might come up that hey lets go hit a dungeon for fun, get some money maybe some nice loot.  But in these games you were never max level.  There was always more character progression to be desired.  And gear was not the carrot on the stick.  The carrot was new content through means of levels that you could only get when going out and doing some pve.  In WoW you hit 70 and know your progression is pretty much limited to the determination of your guild in way of raids. 

Could you imagine some guildies getting bored of clan chat and devising a plan to go run black temple? I couldn't cause it won't happen.  Your either a hardcore raider or you kind of float in the 5 mans which can be finished pretty easily.  Once you beat 5 man casuals and you have all your gear but don't want to raid what do you do?  Go pvp.  Great but its crossrealm pvp, its not even personal.  Go fishing lol. You know what nevermind.  So many people are ignorant to the level of depth in which WoW lacks and are too new to MMOs to know any better.

When a game is either or.  It is severely lacking. 

Please prove me wrong.

What you just gave was your opinion.  How can anyone prove an opinion wrong?  I could give you my opinion of your opinion.  Wouldn't make you wrong or me right.  So you have your opinion, others, like me, have an opinion contrary to yours.  Prove me wrong.

Interesting point of view.  Let me start a new thread with what I am trying to say.

That is the problem with WoW its one or the other.  Your either completely social and don't stress raiding, which doesn't leave a lot to be desired.  Or you raid like a second job which is pretty much the only way to advance because raiding isn't always a walk in the park.

This brings me to my second point.  Why is there no happy medium?  I used to play 2 MMOs in where when there was nothing to do you could go in to a town and bullshit with friends and make trades (you need a real economy for that).  If we were sitting around talking it might come up that hey lets go hit a dungeon for fun, get some money maybe some nice loot.  But in these games you were never max level.  There was always more character progression to be desired.  And gear was not the carrot on the stick.  The carrot was new content through means of levels that you could only get when going out and doing some pve.  In WoW you hit 70 and know your progression is pretty much limited to the determination of your guild in way of raids. 

Could you imagine some guildies getting bored of clan chat and devising a plan to go run black temple? I couldn't cause it won't happen.  Your either a hardcore raider or you kind of float in the 5 mans which can be finished pretty easily.  Once you beat 5 man casuals and you have all your gear but don't want to raid what do you do?  Go pvp.  Great but its crossrealm pvp, its not even personal.  Go fishing lol. You know what nevermind.  So many people are ignorant to the level of depth in which WoW lacks and are too new to MMOs to know any better.

When a game is either or.  It is severely lacking. 

Please prove me wrong.