If you're Male, sex is never free.

Originally posted by Ozmodan

The entire staff is made of up of a bunch of unknowns, at least to me. 

Jeff Strain [Founder of Undead Labs] is a game programmer and one of the three founders of ArenaNet. He served ArenaNet and NCsoft as the leader of the Art and Production teams and President of Product Development respectively. He was previously the lead programmer of Blizzard's MMORPG World of Warcraft; he also created the StarCraft campaign editor and worked on Diablo and Warcraft III. He is credited as a programmer and executive producer for Guild Wars.

Uknown? K...

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Originally posted by Sinsation

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Originally posted by Exterminos


nothing persistant and no guild content either, any literally any decent online shooter has more to offer, migt as well team up with a buddy or two and play a shooter on your xbox, you will get more out of it

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Actually there is Clan content. I can't remember what the hotkey is but if you check the control settings there's a button for clans / guilds, whatever. Clans are gonna be a huge thing in this game.

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'U' for the Group/Friends/Clan menu.

Here's a post I made on the official forums. I think I s hould keep it on my clipboard as I'm seeing these threads pop up everywhere. Is it worth the subscription fee?

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As long as they add content consistently and in sufficient quantity and quality, then the sub is worth it. Regular FPS games don't add much free content after release, and don't offer this kind of open world. That is, the large 80 person free-roaming maps, a graphical social zone and extreme customization. There is also a decent level of long-term character development along with world persistence.

I think it qualifies. If you don't, that's ok. Remember, it's your money. You can spend it on whatever you deem valuable.

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Text must always remain. Are we to just forget about deaf people who enjoy playing games?

 I loved Runescape. Yeah, it was a grind, but what MMO isn't in one way or another? I only quit because all my friends quit. If they had more gritty graphics, I think it would appeal to more people. They kinda went with the whimsical fantasy look.

Either way, I'll jump back in from time to time. There's always something to do. Playing/competing with friends is a must to really enjoy this game. I was a member for 4 years, before I finally quit. (and I still haven't quit entirely).

Also, you forgot to mention that they have PvP worlds.

 Thank you for the reply. I submitted an email form asking them to do this.

 When I try to log in, it errors and says the game isn't activated on my account. I go on my account and all it has is a product key box. I've been searching for an answer for almost an hour. No product key, no instructions. Just links that take me in circles. I can't post on the forums or email support since I can't find that information either.

Originally posted by Nikopol

The zombie apocalypse is a fantastic setting for an MMO. You just have to let go of what's becoming a stagnating attachment to the Diku paradigm. A zombie-infested world is a dynamic and hectic place  where being equipped with the right skills is vital (har har). So, at the outset, this type of setting should lend itself very well to variety in character setup and crafting.

Also, the definitive story for the zombie apocalypse setting is in fact not one of the zombie movies. It's a vampire story: Richard Matheson's novel, "I Am Legend". It may not be a zombie story, but in terms of narrative tradition it has influenced, even defined the genre like no story ever has. Even "Night of the Living Dead" can be thought of as a derivation of it. So someone taking on the genre in a fresh medium would do well to analyze it. How Neville gets through the day there, his daunting daily routine and his semi-long-term plans. And of course, his ultimate hope and ultimate fear which make up the heart of the lore. So we have a setting that's big in both routine and constant change and it surprisingly has a horizon as well... It's pretty fitting to a persistent world.

The thing that's really going to be a pain in the rear end for any developer making a zombie MMO is the concept of infection itself. Just having a vaccine for it pretty much negates the whole point of a zombie-infested world. That's like having a Twilight vampire in place of a real vampire (Twilight vampire meanin: the vampire with no true inconveniences but a lot of brooding over what looks to be residues of real inconveniences of its ancestors in the genre). You just can't ditch the contagious nature of the zombie condition, or you have next to no concept. Anyone who's going to tackle the zombie MMO has to go for broke on this, in my opinion. Hard, yes, but fun and original ideas thrive in hard circumstances and unlikely setups.

After all, who in their right mind would think a FPS with no killing and just puzzles could be good? And then came Portal. :)

 

 THIS.

Justin, I like that you have at least a basic understanding of zombie lores, but you're being a little close-minded. A zombie MMO has to differ from this formula formula you speak of. In fact, there should be more games doing that. Why do you think the genre is at such a stand still? No one wants to do anything different.

You're absoutely right, it NEEDS to be about survival. But there isn't a lack of progession as you claim. To survive in a zombie outbreak you need to develop skills that will help you and others survive. It is a very community oriented idea. Isn't that what MMOs were about in the first place?

Just because you're not working towards the next Blue Awesome Possum Sword of Power with + 5 Mana, doesn't mean the game doesn't have progression.  I like that you wrote an article on this, I just wish you didn't put it in such a negative light.

There are some of us (like myself) that are completely dead on fantasy. I just don't feel right unless I'm in a zombie game. I can play other games, and have fun, but I don't feel complete (sounds lame, and maybe it is, but my obsession with zombies is unquenchable). I NEED a zombie survival MMO to come out, or I'll never be able to have a game I can call home. I'm trying to create a simple zombie MMO myself, but it just won't be the same as a AAA quality game. And who knows if I can even get it to a point where I can call it a game.

I hope this new zombie MMO does things right. My future of playing MMOs depends on it.

Originally posted by bloodaxes

Originally posted by KarmaCry7

Originally posted by bloodaxes

There are many people that collect those pets and they were mostly gotten ingame now these fellas need to pay to get them? so nothing has changed? right....

No, nothing has changed. They didn't add a price to the old vanity pets you can still earn in game. To tell you the truth, this idea could have been added in the begining (charging for vanity pets). Vanity pets are pointless but makes more sense if someone actually paid real money for it. I still have the Blizzard Bear and I often have that follow my Hunter around. It changes NOTHING about your charcter's ability to perform in game.

If they made more cool vanity stuff, that would be the only extra merchandise I would consider getting. (Mugs, T-Shirts and all the other stuff is just corny). I would never leave the house with a level 80 Hunter T-Shirt but a cool companion that does nothing but looks nice would be cool. Paying for mounts, items, potions, etc isn't cool, vanity pets are. Pointless, but nice.

So just because you don't care about vanity pets everyone that collects them should agree with you?

Gathering vanity pets is a good way to stop doing always the same things everyday, like people that collect achievements there are others that like the collect the vanity pets what's the problem with that?

I never said the old vanity pets will be in the cash shop but if you really think they wasted hours or days to create a cash shop to have only 2 pets in it you must be fooling yourself they will add more pets in the future and god knows what else. Before the cash shop these stuff were added as extra content for those that like to get everything when playing but now there will be some that will be in game the best ones (cooler,ecc) must be bought talking about greediness....

Aww, QQ. You have obviously lived a sheltered life.

Originally posted by bloodaxes

If you don't like people expressing their opinions don't look simple.

That's a gross generalization. I'm glad we're all so grown up that we make these to try and belittle the argument another person. That's pathetic. You know better than that.

I stand by this, "there are lines that should be drawn", for everything. This includes what is deemed to be plain ridiculous. Crying about a business movement made for the *gasp* purpose of making money, yet still complying to good business, is where the line is drawn. And players wonder why game companies are listening to them less an less.

 I really am getting sick of people complaining about these kinds of issues all the time. It's like sitting in a room crowded with little children and they've all just been told that they can't have sweets. So, they have convulsions on the floor, squirming kicking and screaming. Cry all you want, it isn't going to change anything when the cause is so ridiculous and pointless.

Business is business. Welcome to reality. There are lines that should be drawn and never crossed, but this isn't one of them. Now, go have a nappy.

[ Mod Edit ]

 If I may point out, I don't even think it's the inequality behind it that Jon found sick, it was what they required for proof: webcam appearance. Any feminine guy can dress as a girl, so what proof would they demand? I think he's disgusted by the fact that they may require a shot of sexual organs as evidence for gender. On top of that, any guy can ask his sister or girlfriend to fill in as their "proof" rendering the entire system pointless for practical purposes. And since only females are required to do this, the real motive behind this system should be critically questioned.

 While I'm not a huge vampire fan, I have to say, Dana, this is a brilliant idea. I despise Twilight from every depth of my soul, but vampires do take their root in romanticism. The two paths definitely need to be there. It would be tricky, but a big hit if done correctly. And it would need to be done now.

It would be nice to have a human faction as well so the PvPers can play as vampire hunters. That would make it an epic win. But the two paths of vampires alone would be a lot of work within itself.

 Ahh!! Dana Started a Zombie Survival thread and I'm late to the party!? Preposterous! This is the game I've been waiting for. My life will never be fulfilled if I don't get to play a Zombie Survival MMO. I'm so desperate, I'm even trying to make one myself. This type of game is LONG overdue.

This is exactly how it should be made. Although one point I disagree with you on Dana, is urban areas even resembling safe zones. That's highly unrealistic. Cities would have such a high concentration of infected AND desperate,even psychotic survivors, it would be a war zone. A concrete jungle. No man's land. Or should I say, dead man's land? That might be a decent title.

Other than that, you're spot on.

 Good article! A lot of deep discussion. I completely agree, we need more niche MMOs. I'm one of those people who needs one. A zombie survival MMO to be specific. I don't think I'd ever have to touch another MMO in my life, if I could just have my zombie MMO based on survival instead of being purely combat driven.

It doesn't even need to be a great game. Just based on survival with maybe a player housing system, of sorts, to maintain as a hold out. I'm trying to make it myself, but I'm unsure how far I'll get. I've learned a lot about MMO development and I have a great game engine (that I DO know how to use) to get me there. I'm also an aspiring 3D artist, so my chances are maybe 50/50. Maybe higher?

 I love reading these articles. Getting a glimpse into the industry and how it works is really cool. I think it's very eye-opening for many others as well who think they know how the MMO world turns, despite never going further than an official game forum.

 Damn, I was kind of hoping it would be a metropolitan island infested with zombies.

Originally posted by Turel_Azure

Mequellios, I get the feeling you didn't fully read my initial post.

 

I did go to school for an aspect of game development, and I learned 3d art and Animation.  I finished it with high marks, and was basically dubbed a technical artist by my teacher.  But, I have not had the good fortune of finding work in my area, which is supposed to be an okay one for game developers (Seattle, WA).  It would have helped if most of them stayed open through this recession hitting.

 

Also, the MMO concept is not my only idea, nor is it the one I'd hope to start with.  And when I say the engine won't support it, I'm referring to RealmMaker, which I tried.  I got a tip on Game Maker 7 just for a proof-of-concept, and I'm working on learning that now.  A good point was made, considering it's game design:

Use the Game Maker to make your core game alive.  If it's fun without fancy 3d graphics, you should have a winner.

You repeated this goal, so it's one I plan to work on.  Shooting for something OTS with sprites, or an isometric.  I may start making a more basic demo that's just a final-fight style. 

 

And yes, you're right, I would need a team, but I'm not at that point yet.  I made this post to find out a way to get started since GETTING A JOB didn't work out.  Heh.  And hell, I am still looking, and maybe I'll get work in a local studio while I'm working on this.

 

As for engines, I'm most interested in the modern engines that are easy to use, which instantly pulls me to Unreal3, which I'm more familiar with than others.  It's the closest to what I know: 3ds Max.

I second the post above me. You might need to look for smaller, freelance jobs like advertising (which is a big one) or if you're up for it, low-budget films. Along with that, you can make your own animated models and sell them online on a site like TurboSquid. Do this to fund your project if funding is needed.

And it wasn't quite clear to me, what your education was (it sounded like something slighty unrelated to game development directly), so I assumed none for the point fo the post. Apologies for that.

All in all, it comes down to getting a version of your game created. You won't need a very big team to get started. You can begin by yourself if you need to. Engine hopping can be exausting, but there should be something you can use out there. Another engine you could look at, if you haven't heard of it already, is Torque

Good Luck.

 So one game get's more subscriptions than another, it automatically kills it? I don't understand. Why isn't Everquest dead? Or any other MMO for that matter?

The prospect of a game competeing with WoW is interesting however. But, I won't play it because it's more popular. What a stupid reason to leave a game. Most people play WoW because of the low requirements and the ease-of-play. I'm personally sick of fantasy games all together. So just because the rest of the herd is flocking to it, doesn't mean I will mindlessly follow.

 Now here's the hard part to hear. If you are working on this alone and you have little experience in game developement (wiriting down ideas is not experience) than you are not going to make a ground-breaking MMO. I don't mean to discourage, I'm just giving you the truth.

When I said start small, that means starting modest as well. Sure, you could find a team, but lacking MMO organization skills (wiriting down ideas is not organizing MMO development) and money to pay this team, your results aren't going to be much better. MMO development takes experience. I wanted my game to be amazing and everything I ever wanted, too. But, sooner or later, you're going to have to face a harsh reality just as I did. You can't always get what you want. Sometimes, you need to make tough decisions. The lesser of two evils. Sometimes, you just need to settle with a modest game. If you love game development and you're passionate about bringing your game to life, you can come to terms with this.

Having an amazing idea that will find it's niche into the industry, doesn't mean jack shit if you don't have the tools, or the man power to get there. As I said, start small. Build from the ground up. Gain the experience you need and someday, you might just find yourself with those tools and a dedicated team to bring your game into fill swing. Remember, you can update the game. You can make more than one version of it. You need patience.

Also, If we don't know you're plan for these "core mechanics", how do expect anyone to help you find the right engine to build them in? You're not going to be working with the Hero Engine or Big World Tech (If you're asking for MMO advice here), so why doom yourself to failure before you even start, with statements like, "And the core alteration of the systems I am going for may not be supported well by these engines."? Assuming you mean smaller, Indy engines. As I said, you may need to humble your idea if you want to see it come to life. And you might not. I don't know, you're keeping secrets.

You have two other options. One's going to school for a field relavant to game development and work your way up a ladder (be careful the first few steps can be years apart). Then once you're up, and you have close to a decade of game development experience, and success to build on, you will be able to lead a project.

The other, is to build your own corporation from the ground up. This will most likely require the same eduacation as the other option. Not doing so, will require all the steps about "modest game development" I spoke of before. You also need to have a working demo of your game to pitch it to a publisher for funding. Many middleware engines offer demo licenses. But you need a company, and a team (most teams start small, sometimes as little as 3-5 people). And no, showing them a rendered movie of the things you want, will not work. It needs to be a real-time demo. They need to know you're capable of making a game before they give you a lot of money to create one.

All of these are achievable with varying difficulty and waiting time before working on your game. I hope this helps you. You asked us to "get real", so I did. I wish you good luck, and hope that your dream game materializes in your future.