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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 11:24:11 PM
Originally posted by Vinterkrig
you don't say? and then they updated all the other water in the game with the same thing, no big deal... new frontiers was a bigger expansion then this, shit TOA was huge and way more work then this expansion Yeah :P And I know they fixed the water =D I was just using that release point to prove Zorn's point.And no NF/ToA were not in the same scope as this, ToA was considered a let down by the players in terms of content ect, many consider this the downfall of DAoC. ToA was a big expansion yes,Before release it was hyped a lot yes, but no where near the size/magnitude of Catacylsm, I don't even have to mention NF, the closest expansion DAoC had that had similarities would have to be Catacombs I would think. ToA just added ML/arti raids and an underwater Continent, and took the games PVP to hell. Who knows Catacylsm might be in the same boat as ToA and bring WoW to its knees, I'm just saying the expansions are not comparable :P
ya, but my point is they didn't re-design all of the original zones/si zones/and anywhere else with water to add a water you could dive into and we aren't talking about let downs or players not liking the game, and i don't need your history of daoc, i played from day one with a breaks here and there, but more or less its entire life toa/nf were huge expansions, we are talking about size and content of expansions are we not? i mean otherwise we shouldn't be talking at all, because this wow expansion isn't out and whats known is very little. these aren't really game altering things blizzard is doing, unlike what daoc did, game altering, and it didn't work out... mainly because they tried to make the pve people happy and in turn most of the players didn't want all that pve (they would have been playing everquest) and your right, i shouldn't have let catacombs off the hook there, that changed the entire look of the game (which i still think looks great despite what people say about the graphics) raiding aside, DAoC still has more depth then WoW ever will, thats pretty bad considering its the end all be all of mmos according to everyone fact of the matter is, its a nice thing WoW is doing, changing the original zones, and its something more themepark MMOs should do to make it more interesting for re-rolls and new players, but the size of the content is minimal, this SHOULD be a free expansion Yeah I understood your point, and we are obviously talking of content/size of the expansions, I was just saying the expansion's are not comparable, and mentioned their downfall because a ton of the content they promised in ToA was delayed until furthur "free expansions" NF was huge yes ( But they're still working on their class "dedicated class balancing/RA's" that came with NF all these years later ) so was TOA but they were both standard addon expansions that add a new content/quest ect, not changing the core part of the world drastically, this is huge, DAoC attempted this with the dragon campaigns, those were incredibly lame however. Yes I agree with you that WoW 's depth will never be what DAoC's was....I have not played an mmorpg that had the true world/depth feeling of DAoC. And I'd love for this to be a free expansion, but no mmorpg out there offers that much content for free ( aside from Lineage 2 which comes very close ) Either way, we seem to be 2 stop signs arguing with each other :)
P.S. they claim NF/housing were "free expansions" but do you remember after SI was launched NF/player housing/player mounts were promised in the next expansion, Instead, one expansion went retail lacking that specific content then future "free" expansions came with it.
your point about the class/ra balance is really a useless point, as nerfs and love happens in ALL mmos o_O It was an added note and not the subject of my post. |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 10:41:37 PM
Originally posted by Vinterkrig
Being an avid DAoC player and having played since release I can comment on this, you seem to have confirmed what he was saying, as DAoC did have a waterworld in 2003 yes, but trials of atlantis added a completley new continent in which this "water world" was ( and was made from scratch ). Remind you, although swimming was allowed in this new zone, in the classic DAoC water was still NOT able to support underwater swimming.
you don't say? and then they updated all the other water in the game with the same thing, no big deal... new frontiers was a bigger expansion then this, shit TOA was huge and way more work then this expansion Yeah :P And I know they fixed the water =D I was just using that release point to prove Zorn's point.And no NF/ToA were not in the same scope as this, ToA was considered a let down by the players in terms of content ect, many consider this the downfall of DAoC. ToA was a big expansion yes,Before release it was hyped a lot yes, but no where near the size/magnitude of Catacylsm, I don't even have to mention NF, the closest expansion DAoC had that had similarities would have to be Catacombs I would think. ToA just added ML/arti raids and an underwater Continent, and took the games PVP to hell. Who knows Catacylsm might be in the same boat as ToA and bring WoW to its knees, I'm just saying the expansions are not comparable :P
ya, but my point is they didn't re-design all of the original zones/si zones/and anywhere else with water to add a water you could dive into and we aren't talking about let downs or players not liking the game, and i don't need your history of daoc, i played from day one with a breaks here and there, but more or less its entire life toa/nf were huge expansions, we are talking about size and content of expansions are we not? i mean otherwise we shouldn't be talking at all, because this wow expansion isn't out and whats known is very little. these aren't really game altering things blizzard is doing, unlike what daoc did, game altering, and it didn't work out... mainly because they tried to make the pve people happy and in turn most of the players didn't want all that pve (they would have been playing everquest) and your right, i shouldn't have let catacombs off the hook there, that changed the entire look of the game (which i still think looks great despite what people say about the graphics) raiding aside, DAoC still has more depth then WoW ever will, thats pretty bad considering its the end all be all of mmos according to everyone fact of the matter is, its a nice thing WoW is doing, changing the original zones, and its something more themepark MMOs should do to make it more interesting for re-rolls and new players, but the size of the content is minimal, this SHOULD be a free expansion Yeah I understood your point, and we are obviously talking of content/size of the expansions, I was just saying the expansion's are not comparable, and mentioned their downfall because a ton of the content they promised in ToA was delayed until furthur "free expansions" NF was huge yes ( But they're still working on their class "dedicated class balancing/RA's" that came with NF all these years later ) so was TOA but they were both standard addon expansions that add a new content/quest ect, not changing the core part of the world drastically, this is huge, DAoC attempted this with the dragon campaigns, those were incredibly lame however. Yes I agree with you that WoW 's depth will never be what DAoC's was....I have not played an mmorpg that had the true world/depth feeling of DAoC. And I'd love for this to be a free expansion, but no mmorpg out there offers that much content for free ( aside from Lineage 2 which comes very close ) Either way, we seem to be 2 stop signs arguing with each other :)
P.S. they claim NF/housing were "free expansions" but do you remember after SI was launched NF/player housing/player mounts were promised in the next expansion, Instead, one expansion went retail lacking that specific content then future "free" expansions came with it. |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 9:37:27 PM
Originally posted by Wizardry
You MEAN,technological limits of the Warcraft engine ,don't you?That engine is so far behind the rest of the gaming world it is not funny.Square Enix has spent their money over the last several years upping their tech of their engine,while Blizzard continues to show NO effort in raising their standards or give anything back to their fanbase.So now even the ancient FFXI engine is going to leave the warcraft engine as maybe the cheapest product out there amongst legit games. You know of course ,reading into their OWN PR marketing hype about the expansion is "GOING to ROCK WOW" is foolish.Do you expect them to say anything else? They are basically doing something ,VERY similar as to what FFXI did in what i called one their laziest expansions ever.They are just taking already in place maps,zones and just going to rework them.This takes VERY little effort,and NO you will not be getting any new technical advancements in gaming,Warcraft is ancient,the engine is ancient and frankly Blizzard has no ability to CREATE NEW ideas.Their lack of creativity and their ALWAYS cheap approach,is why this design works for Blizzard,but not for the fans.However i think it has been VERY obvious that WOW fans have become bored[they frequent all other games lately],so Blizzard could feed them pretty much anything and they will be all over it. I am MOST interested to hear ,what the fans who are all excited,actually think this is going to deliver for "new" OR "creative"?Other than just buying into Blizzard's usual PR hype?2 new races?yep FFXI did the same thing in the EXACT same type of expansion,i really do not see the same hype ,so many others are gaining from this.Geesh if i wasn't sold into Blizzard copying SOE,i would swear this idea stems from FFXI's expansion of a couple years ago,that would be just about the right amount of time to do it as well...hmmm.
No, I meant the technological limits of "current" mmorpg's I was just saying that so he wouldn't give me an unrealistic idea for an mmorpg expansion. |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 9:32:29 PM
Originally posted by Vinterkrig
negative lol and daoc had underwater worlds in 2003, with a much smaller dev team then the games you listed... jus saying , free flying doesn't fit into most of the lore of the games you speak of if any at all (i'm no expert, i may be wrong on 1 of them) and as far as aion, i think ncsoft is just a shitty company that put in a feature here and there to limit their work, and make the most possible profit with the time involved regardless neither of us will get any push on each others opinions, so it is what it is <3
Being an avid DAoC player and having played since release I can comment on this, you seem to have confirmed what he was saying, as DAoC did have a waterworld in 2003 yes, but trials of atlantis added a completley new continent in which this "water world" was ( and was made from scratch ). Remind you, although swimming was allowed in this new zone, in the classic DAoC water was still NOT able to support underwater swimming.
you don't say? and then they updated all the other water in the game with the same thing, no big deal... new frontiers was a bigger expansion then this, shit TOA was huge and way more work then this expansion Yeah :P And I know they fixed the water =D I was just using that release point to prove Zorn's point.And no NF/ToA were not in the same scope as this, ToA was considered a let down by the players in terms of content ect, many consider this the downfall of DAoC. ToA was a big expansion yes,Before release it was hyped a lot yes, but no where near the size/magnitude of Catacylsm, I don't even have to mention NF, the closest expansion DAoC had that had similarities would have to be Catacombs I would think. ToA just added ML/arti raids and an underwater Continent, and took the games PVP to hell. Who knows Catacylsm might be in the same boat as ToA and bring WoW to its knees, I'm just saying the expansions are not comparable :P |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 8:27:03 PM
Originally posted by Vinterkrig
Just one example: To make a zone 3D fly-able means it takes around 3 times more resources to accomplish this. Instead of "fake" 3D/2D borders to create mountains that can't be surpassed, you DO need to redo the original code from scratch. BTW, that's one of the reasons ... AoC, WAR, LotrO don't have ANY free flying in their lands AND why Aion only has limited zones where you can stretch the wings. Underwater worlds is just an extra that is skipped by those MMO's (just to save money ... and development time...) Earlier discussions with Blizzard developpers showed that creating FULL 3D passable landscapes takes indeed 3 times more money to create. So if that's not "big" to you, no problem, it shows you don't have a clue of world designs and just how costly it is to make it FULL 3D without loading screens or the dreadful "zoning".
negative lol and daoc had underwater worlds in 2003, with a much smaller dev team then the games you listed... jus saying , free flying doesn't fit into most of the lore of the games you speak of if any at all (i'm no expert, i may be wrong on 1 of them) and as far as aion, i think ncsoft is just a shitty company that put in a feature here and there to limit their work, and make the most possible profit with the time involved regardless neither of us will get any push on each others opinions, so it is what it is <3
Being an avid DAoC player and having played since release I can comment on this, you seem to have confirmed what he was saying, as DAoC did have a waterworld in 2003 yes, but trials of atlantis added a completley new continent in which this "water world" was ( and was made from scratch ). Remind you, although swimming was allowed in this new zone, in the classic DAoC water was still NOT able to support underwater swimming. |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 7:44:25 PM
Originally posted by jonrd463
honestly, its not that big of a deal what they're doing here, don't fool yourself into thinking its more then what it is the "New Frontiers" free expansion in DAOC was far larger and more difficult then what blizzard is doing with this expansion, you are all mindless drones controlled by strings thanks to blizzard/wow ... and i feel bad for you all
yet, you'll defend this game's honor like its your mother/sister/wife/girlfriend/imaginary friend being harassed in the worst ways, its funny Relax, cupcake. What I like or dislike will not affect you one bit, I assure you. Plus, unlike some here apparently, I'm physically able to keep an open mind without it exploding. Yeah I get the feeling no matter what Blizzard will add in this expansion or future expansion, the haters and closed minded will hate it simply because it's WoW :) |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 7:34:51 PM
Yeah I agree here, Blizz has a ton of money other companies do not have and those companies can not afford to pump out expansions with the amount of content and as quickly due to their company being smaller in size and with financial limitations. I'm sure it's not hard for blizz to create features for the expansion because of their financial backup. But I'm not looking at how hard a company worked for their expansion or how it compares to another companies expansion taking financial limits into concern and giving them a handicap to judge them both by, I'm looking at the end result, the expansion itself. People are quick to shoot it down, but can anyone name an expansion of an mmorpg that has surpassed what they claim to be attempting? Thats one of the advantages of playing an mmo developed by a company with extreme financial backing.
For the record I hated WoW at launch, considering myself a hardcore PVPer I've played every PVP game on the marked, most recently DF, But I'm not blinded by WoW hate either, I'm just giving credit where I think credit is due. I hear people shooting down the new races, claiming its a tauren with a different skin, I suppose its different when other companies add a new race to their mmo?
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 7:13:06 PM
Read my first post again, I think Blizzard chose a risky course of altering the entire game ( as I said especially on a money maker such as WoW ) as people get attached to certain zones ect ect, and it seemed like a risky path rather than just adding a new zone ect thats common with mmorpgs, It just happens the outcome of choice appears to be a good one and I think it will be well recieved. I don't think its strange that I find a risky choice also being a well recieved one. |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 6:53:43 PM
Well I think the game is being fairly shaken up as is by improving/adding on to what it already is ( expansion ), and they are adding new zones, I Guess we'll never change each other's mind here :) But considering mmorpg expansions of late and the past I don't see how this is being practical/safe by any means. But I do agree it's probably going to be well recieved :) |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 6:24:12 PM
Wow really? :) No risk/very safe? What would you have considered a risky step for a new WoW expansion thats within the technological limits of current mmo's? <-----Directed at Axxar btw =) |
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Biggest expansion in the history of Mmorpg's?
General Discussion « World of Warcraft 8/21/09 6:07:18 PM
And risky I think, with as big of a money maker as WoW is this is far from a "safe" expansion, some people grow fond of certain zones the've spent time in, the change could be great or terrible. I've never been a huge WoW fan, I just resubbed last week and found out about the expansion a few days ago from a leak online. I have to say I'm impressed ( WoW haters don't kill me ) But this expansion is essentially WoW2.0 , and offhand I cannot think of a bigger expansion to an mmorpg? Either way I'm "Gasp " hyped :) Can anyone think of a larger "expansion" then Cataclysm? Of course meaning IF they actually add everything. |
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So how's the NA servers holding up? :) Are there many people playing? Is it worth logging in? Are there enough people to find groups/guilds/find various social "stuff to do". Considering buying the NA release. |
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Am i the oldest registered member still active?
Off-Topic Discussion « General Discussion 7/13/09 8:30:35 PM
Ah 02 :) the ancient age of MMORPG's |
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Just returned to AoC to see how its changed ect, Game seems great so far and I'm having fun, just a question though, I'm level 22 now and have not seen a single Demonologist, not one!!! Do they totally blow ass? Or am I missing something? |
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Hibernia calls another hero home...
Round Table Pub (General) « Dark Age of Camelot 3/16/09 12:42:22 AM
Last week after trying almost every other game on the market I have returned to DAoC as my main mmorpg after a 2 year "vacation", I've realized I still enjoy it as much now as I did when I started, which for me is reason enough, it left me wondering why I ever left, its why I play mmorpgs, to enjoy myself. Even If I have the newest FOTM game, because its the thing to do and i'm not enjoying myself its defeating the purpose. I returned to ALB!!!!!! hehe Damn Hibs :) Something about the rolling green hills and land of chivalry, knights and wizards brought me back =)
Alb has called another hero home =)
Hope to see you in game man! |
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I've had enough of other MMOs, call for action!
Round Table Pub (General) « Dark Age of Camelot 1/20/09 6:57:24 PM
Been pondering returning for a while, after reading this I've decided that I will. I would rather play DAoC with a lower sub base, then play any other mmorpg out there atm with their subs. See you in-game :) AND YES I'M AN ALB!!!!! |
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Will you wait to not get burned by DF like the past mmos?
General Discussion « Darkfall 1/08/09 4:11:02 PM
Yeah If the trial comes out i'll try it, if not i'll wait a month and see how its going. |
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Originally posted by Ladrann
Totally agree with every word here. Notably this part. "If you have been playing MMOs for any length of time, you are no doubt feeling somewhat disenchanted with the state of the genre over the last few years, especially if you are a veteran like me who remembers the way things used to be. You might remember a time where a new MMO didn’t look exactly like the one before it, a time when innovation was profitable to a developer."
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thoughts on marriage/children ( Seeking the Truth )
Off-Topic Discussion « General Discussion 1/06/09 12:31:39 PM
Originally posted by ValiumSummer
I think you missunderstand me :) I'm not living this life style to "sleep around" as it were, or have "variety" , as if my whole goal in life is to have random sex,I was simply pointing out studys have shown singles have better sex, Thats not my life tho, My lifestyle is about unprecedented freedom ( with anything ) if I want to move to Japan tommorow, I can. You said you thought It sounded like I needed some sort of validation to my life style. That defeats the whole purpose of my post, I think people should breakaway from needing validation from others for what you truely want. Even the extremely small and pointless things, like what kind of music to listen to because its "normal" ( yeah its off topic but you get the point ) From what i've seen most of the people who have replied to my thread ( and to my surprise in PM's ) who have agreed with me were single, and those that have other opinions, are / have been or intend to get married in the near future. I totally appreciate the honesty in your post, From what I'm seeing newlyweds seem to be flooded with young girls getting married because their friends are doing it and they don't want to be left behind ( Is'nt this the future generation of single Moms?). Also :) Of course the circumstances might be unknown to us. Since I made this post last year, A friend of mine has gotten married and divorced. Now, contrary to popular belief, this may sound corny as hell, But I do believe in "true love" as it were....yeah that did sound corny. But I also think its so extremely rare 99% of people never find it. Is it worth pursuing? Thats up to the individual. Do I wanna be "that" 89 year old guy with a cane hunching over while hitting on 24yo girls at clubs? Yeah I'm in a band now, but do I wanna be the 89 year old bald rocker still pumping devil horns taking excedrin during breaks? Of course not, at that point id rather be dead ( no i'm not joking haha ). But in my eyes its just as sad to see old men going out to "hang out with the guys" just to get away from their wives. Both sides of this story essentially end the same to me, its up to us to choose the path. I'm not saying anyones wrong, I was just expressing the way I viewed it. You see long-term singles as people who end up being sad lonely people riddled with regret. I see married people as I've stated. I guess I'm living in the "now" Not living my life so I'll be happy when I'm 85. I'm sorry if I came off as a "prick" to you, I was never trying to. It just it seems "Taboo" to talk about what we REALLY think, not what other people want to hear. So I'm saying what I really think hehe. Its the whole cookie cutter lifestyle choices ( including marriage ) , doing it just because its normal. Thats part of the point I was trying to get across. To the comment way up the page, Asking me if I would regret not getting married when I was older, finding out my choices only left me wallowing in regret, I can pop that question back, if your marriage goes bad, and you then feel like you wasted your youth, will you regret it? What I've learned from this thread, is there seems to be no definitive answer to the question, to get married or to not. Also, I loved the comment by you Faxxer, "You know what you want in life....." This can be said on behalf of someone getting married, or not. |
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Think DAoC will ever have another expansion?
Round Table Pub (General) « Dark Age of Camelot 1/06/09 11:48:40 AM
Title is pretty self explanatory |
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. I hope it does, it might attract new players, but sadly I don't see it happening unless the player base picks up :(