My guess is they are waiting for Warhammer to come out to drop the hammer on DaoC.

I like the NF, or did for a long time. I've long since stopped playing DAoC.

ToA killed DAoC for most people, not spellcrafting.

---

Originally posted by fungistratus
I posted this here because I'm still waiting for WAR...
Should have titled : AOC will not tide you over till WAR arrives. Dont waste your money.

---

I disagree with your statement, besides it's not like you have any choice. You can't get into WAR till you can.

AoC isn't a bad game and hardly as linear and non-group oriented as these people make it out to be. Least no more so than WoW. You can group, or not. Your choice.

Though if WAR was out right now I wouldn't be playing AoC.

---

Originally posted by eggthief
this career is probably gonna be to overpowered and overplayed.

---

I could have sworn someone said the same about the Shadow warriors as well. I guess all the elven classes will be. Good thing I'm gonna be an elf!

---

Originally posted by vmoped

---

Originally posted by Celestian

LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!
Well moderated? Laugh! Not only is moderation a misnomer on this topic is also a joke considering every person on the planet will be able to invade the forum and fill it with garbage.

---

Yea we all know how helpfull the WoW forums are, and to be honest I find no help on the AoC forums as well. Only a bunch of opinions, whines, and flame threads. Kinda like yours. Just a bunch of people trying to see how many times they can type LoL.
Cheers!

---

You've not ever read the WoW forums nor the AoC forums if you can't find helpful class advice. All of them have both and that's not including general advice. Most of which isn't on random fan websites.

If you somehow think a forum where anyone can post will be better than forum were only the people with active accounts can post will be any better I have to suggest your grasp on sanity is tenuous at best. Typing LoL is hardly the worst you'll see on a open forum.

---

No forums is the best thing Mythic could have ever done from both a business and customer perspective.

---

Would be nice if you had backed that up with facts but you didn't.

---

First off what are forums good for? Game discussion which can already be done here, WHA, and half a dozen other Warhammer sites. They are good for game news and information which is where the Warherald comes in and Dev posts are already being done at multiple of the previously mentioned fansites.

---

The discussions on forums are hardly organized or even centralized here or any fan website. Please suggesting that these forums contain even 1/4 of the USEFUL posts of the WoW class forums is just silly.

---

So since the main functions that an official forum are covered what left is there? Trolling. So you are saying they need to have an official forums just for trolls? Sorry it is a bad business move. When dealing with hundreds of thousands if not over a million come release you need a lot of people to monitor forums. Most kids and heck even adults these don't know whats aproprate anymore. Think of it in a classroom type setting. 1 teacher for every 20 students and still have problems controling them. Now imagine that but on a forum where there is almost no accountability for your actions. That is why most of the internet is a cespool of horribleness. So Mythic would have to hire a team of probably 20-30 people to keep forums moderated and thats probably even on the border of the forums still being bad. So with no forums they aren't wasting cash or time on trying to keep forum order.

---

Again most if not ALL of this is not based in fact or true.

---

From a customer standpoint you should be happy. No forums means that you will have a tighter knit community that is by and large 1000x better than an official forum. People will actually ask other people questions in game instead of jumping directly to a forum page with no interaction. Community forums will be better moderated by volunteers that actually read the forums.

---

This is just a complete pile of manure. How on earth you come to the conclusion that random forums on fan based websites creates a "tighter knit" community is beyond me. Server based official forums do FAR MORE to promote community than random fan based websites.

---

BTW anyone that played WoW and used their forums can tell you that those forums are not used for information gathering. You go to say elitest Jerks forums to get class information or Boss Killers to get boss killing info. WoW forums are whine fests about PvP, Arena, Raiding, lore, etc on a GOOD day. On a bad day they are racist, sexist, and any other type of discriminatory, hateful behavior you can think of.

---

I played WoW, I used the forums. I found a WEALTH of gaming information on those forums. The people claiming that there is nothing but flames and trolls there are the people that are clueless. So I guess your "anyone" theory isn't to accurate.

---

So if you actually think that having no forums is a pitfall then maybe you should think about maybe learning to communicate in a civil manner and get the information from your realm mates.

---

When you have to deal with the people that don't even play the game on forums randomly moderated by the whim of the administrators and then claim you need to be civil and ask your realm mates... that just says a volumes about how much of a clue you actually have on this topic.

---

All major information will be available on Warherald and anything else you can get from people on your realm by just asking. If you feel so inclined to discuss things you can use a fansite. There is no downside to not having forums.

---

There are tons of downsides to not having official forums. You just neglected to read anything anyone has ever posted on the topic and proved it by this post.

---

Originally posted by Pheace

---

Originally posted by hardy83

EA is a big business. A successful one at that. Their marketers and heads in that company know better then to screw around with a companies game

---

This just proves you know little of EA

---

That sounds cute and witty but actually doesn't mean much when backed up with absolutely no facts. I'd be interested to see what makes you say that.

My only exposure to EA is Battle Field 2 and a few other FPS games and other than the EA downloader being a mess I've no reason to suspect them of anything.

---

Originally posted by Ascension08

20? Divide that by 10. That's how many fansites I can find answers at. You want Mythic to waste time and money trying to moderate forums that will be filled with garbage anyways? While fansites do it for free because they're people like you and I, who get sick of the stupidity? AoC forums aren't useless I'm sure but they're close. And fansites provide a simple place for FANS (Fansite, fans, WHAT THE HELL?) to meet.

---

20 or 2 doesn't matter they still allow people that don't even play the game to post and if you somehow think that removing that restriction will somehow allow a "fan site" to moderate itself then you're sadly mistaken.

It doesn't cost much at all to run forums and with decent moderation tools (3 day bans, full bans for ACCOUNTS/etc) and limit the access to post to customers with accounts is easy enough. Mythic isn't some mom-and-pop shop anymore. The excuse that it costs to much is just that, a lame excuse these days.

If they can't keep some asshat from posting in their own forums they have other issues that will exist in their game anyway. I dunno about you but a threat to ban my account from the posting and/or the game would keep me and probably anyone from being an asshat. You can't do that on any fan site.

---

Originally posted by Ixnatifual
Not having an official forum is one of the smartest things Mythic have done. Players will spread over various well-moderated fansites where garbage can be sorted out.
And no, you don't need a forum to get support. A simple form will do.

---

LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!LoL!!! LoL!!!

Well moderated? Laugh! Not only is moderation a misnomer on this topic is also a joke considering every person on the planet will be able to invade the forum and fill it with garbage.

DAoC didn't "prove" you could do it without Forums, they just did it because they said they couldn't afford it which is laughable.

Please, don't suggest that "fan sites" are well moderated, that is the biggest joke.

There are a lot of reasons a official website/forums is a good idea and they've been posted about a lot.

Suggesting AoC forums are useless and believing it based on this one nit posting is just ignorance at it's best. I've already picked up good tips from those forums specific to my class, my machine setup and how I play the game. I got the same information from WoW's forums as well. If you think fishing through those forums is hard try doing it now spread across 10-20 websites of random quality and uptime and not a single one of those require you to be subscribed to the game to post.

Good luck with your "great idea".

Frankly I'd love to see a game that completely ignored the hard core raiders and focused solely on the casual players.

There are enough games out that already focus on hard-core raiding as it is. Besides, there are far more casual players than hard-core as can be seen by the numbers blizzard posts regarding the amount of folks that have been into and/or completed their "end game" raid zones.

Flip everything you said around regarding "ignoring hard-core" and put in casual and you'll see how the majority of the "end game" has been for casuals.

Casuals will eventually take over and I long for the day those guys from EQ1 that ruined WoW's end game can't find anything else to do. Thanks to them the end game turned into a PVE mess when it should have been a huge PVP battle like DAoC.

---

Originally posted by Satarious

---

Originally posted by Alienovrlord

Intersting post. It sounds like Treekicker is really bothered by Instanced but found other parts of the game enjoyable. Perhaps someone who isn't bothered by Instanced as much would find AoC entertaining.
That's the nice thing that happens when companies start actually release stable games that don't turn into train wrecks. More choices for everyone.

---

I'm in complete agreement with Treekicker on the instancing bit. Instancing is nothing but a cheap trick to make people pay $15 a month for a single player game.

---

So I guess you feel the same about EQ2? Please tell me you do... cause if you've not played AoC and noticed it's no different than EQ2.

And it's not remotely like GW. Get this one little bit you guys keep ignoring, instances are private for single group or a solo player, clones are just duplicate zones, like 3 North Karana's and only happens when there are just to many people for that one copy of the zone to support and people have fun.

You want a game w/o that? Go back to EQ1, thank gawd we've moved up in the world. I for one like the fact there aren't a 1000 people in a single zone all fighting for the same mobs.

Give it a few months or weeks and those clones will be gone because the levels will spread out as the population does.

---

Originally posted by pkSlayde
Get rid of that system. and bring back the murder system

---

No thanks.

If you know anything about Mark Jacobs you know he's not for anything that allows this sort of behavior.

I suspect they'll probably add a FFA server and like in DAoC it'll fade down to the 2 people that like that sorta thing in no time.

---

Originally posted by perendengue

that is precisely the definition and terminology that got guildwars in such heat on 'is it an mmorpg or not'

copies of areas depending on the population.

---

Difference here is that every zone (besides "cities") in GW was instanced for every single group or solo player. There are no other players in those zones. EQ2 does the same cloning of zones when populations are huge and I don't see anyone saying that's not a mmo ;)

GW is a different monster all together.

---

Originally posted by Satarious

---

Originally posted by Ixnatifual

Cloning and instancing are two words for the same function - a function that allows you to copy the same area. WAR tries to do as little of that as possible, but they do use it for Scenarios, PvE boss fights in dungeons (the dungeons themselves are not instanced), and capital city raids. Instancing brings a lot of benefits if used right, which is why most MMOs employ instancing in one way or another.

---

EXACTLY. The word "clone" and "instance" are synonyms, as far as I'm concerned. It's putting clumps of people in their own little rooms, basically. Which destroys the immersion for me. I think AoC decided to invent a new word for it because of the negative connotation the word "instance" gives off for people. It's basically another way of saying "sh it." ;)

---

AoC I don't think coined the term cloning. I used it because it's not the same as instancing. Instancing implies every single group or player gets their OWN copy of the zone. This is not the case in "zones" in AoC. They spawn off a clone zone when they reach XX players in one zone.

Yes they function similar to instances and you can just as easily call them instances but they are not the same as what most people would term instances.

In any case people wishing instances would go away, I don't see that ever happening... at least not on any game that is remotely popular. The majority of people will not want to fight other players for spawns or "content" because there just to many people playing.

---

Originally posted by altairzq

Then I'm right, what you call a "spawn of clones for over crowded zones" it's what I call instanced zones (and everyone else). I hope WAR does not have that feature.

---

It's clones not instances. Once the population has evened out they won't be around.

You'll wish you had them when you have 1000 new people trying to kill the 5 mobs you need for X quest, or the 10 berries you need to pick to feed the starving.

Have you ever played a MMO at release? Did you play DAoC at release? Do you know how extremely boring it was running around trying to find something to kill because there were so many people in the newbie areas?

---

Originally posted by altairzq

---

Originally posted by Celestian

---

Originally posted by altairzq
It seems they had to pay a big price for the pretty (depends on taste) graphics. Linear zones, instanced zones limited to 100 players, constant zoning, a powerful computer... looks like a bad deal to me.

---

I dunno why people have such angst against instancing and zoning. As long as it's fast zoning I could care less. As to instancing I've always loved it. Keeps me from having to fight other people for the same monster. Dunno about you but I HATED sitting and waiting for someone else to stop camping a spot for some item I wanted/needed.
When it comes to world RVR though that's when I draw the instancing line. Small battle grounds and such, perfectly fine.
If more people wanted non-instanced and no zoning then they'd all be lapping it up in VG. We all know how that worked out.

---

Hmmm... it's not instanced dungeons, they have whole instanced zones, like in EQ2.

---

Who does? Warhammer or AoC? Because if you mean AoC you're not right. They spawn off clones for over crowded zones (good idea for a new game and a flood of people) but I've yet to play a private instance outside of the "night time" starter quests in Tortage.

I wouldn't be surprised if WAR did the same thing so that the newbie starter areas at release were not cram packed and nothing for people to kill.

---

Originally posted by Consensus

---

Originally posted by Celestian

---

Originally posted by Pheace

I'm confused. Are you talking about WAR or AOC with the culture thing? Since WAR only has two realms and they can't talk with eachother as far as I understood it? And if you did mean war and was talking about the 3 racewars then your chatcomparison is simply wrong.

---

I dunno what the guy was talking about but AoC does have a culture pvp server or 3 now. Sorta like WAR/WoW a little I guess. Although you can still group with them too which I think is a good change. At least then you're not forced to play a race/class you don't like to play with your friends.
Be interesting to see how it works out.

---

what? your claiming AoC has a server which is culture vs culture?
I going to have to say thats bollocks until you provide a link.
thats exactly what FC have tried not to do. anyone can attack anyone, even guildies vs guildies!

---

Hum, well here is your link:

http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=4

Although since I doubt you have a AoC login it won't work so here is the cut/paste:

Tarib
Senior Community Manager

Tarib's Avatar

Default New PvP Ruleset: Culture PvP
As part of celebrating the release of Age of Conan we are happy to unravel a brand new PvP ruleset that has not previously been disclosed: The Culture PvP ruleset! Note that this new PvP server type is experimental and players on these servers must expect an ongoing change to the ruleset.

The goal of this PvP server-type is to stimulate war behind the three cultures of Cimmeria, Aquilonia and Stygia. As a player on a Culture PvP server, you are shielded from lone travelers of your own culture, however you may still group with any culture and form a group and attack anyone.

The Culture PvP ruleset is an evolving ruleset that will be tweaked and polished based on player-feedback in the months to come. Although it is, at least currently, possible to make guilds across cultures, pure culture groups and guilds will be endorsed on this server, and as such players on the Culture PvP servers must prepare that the future will hold continued changes to the ruleset.

We have changed to ruleset on two servers that were previously flagged as full PvP. The homes for the Culture PvP servers are:

Bane (US)
Twilight (EU)

With best regards,

Funcom

AoC till Warhammer is released. I'm sick of what is out there right now.

---

Originally posted by altairzq
It seems they had to pay a big price for the pretty (depends on taste) graphics. Linear zones, instanced zones limited to 100 players, constant zoning, a powerful computer... looks like a bad deal to me.

---

I dunno why people have such angst against instancing and zoning. As long as it's fast zoning I could care less. As to instancing I've always loved it. Keeps me from having to fight other people for the same monster. Dunno about you but I HATED sitting and waiting for someone else to stop camping a spot for some item I wanted/needed.

When it comes to world RVR though that's when I draw the instancing line. Small battle grounds and such, perfectly fine.

If more people wanted non-instanced and no zoning then they'd all be lapping it up in VG. We all know how that worked out.

---

Originally posted by Pheace


I'm confused. Are you talking about WAR or AOC with the culture thing? Since WAR only has two realms and they can't talk with eachother as far as I understood it? And if you did mean war and was talking about the 3 racewars then your chatcomparison is simply wrong.

---

I dunno what the guy was talking about but AoC does have a culture pvp server or 3 now. Sorta like WAR/WoW a little I guess. Although you can still group with them too which I think is a good change. At least then you're not forced to play a race/class you don't like to play with your friends.

Be interesting to see how it works out.