All Posts by Suvroc

Originally posted by Obraik

Originally posted by AveBethos

ummax and these other people who are trying this little advertising campaign on behalf of SOE/LA are destroying a bit of MMO gaming for everyone when they do these things...

They are rewarding companies who treat their players unethically.  It's Stockholm Syndrome at the worst.  Why would ANY company hesitate to act the way SOE/LA did when people will go out of their way to do advertising for them?????

Anyone who financially supports SWG today is slapping the face of everyone who once got burned by most likely illegal and most certainly unethical business behavior.  I don't care it is has been 100 years since the NGE was secretly coded and then pushed on the world, corrupt business is corrupt business.  SOE used misrepresented subscription money to code and develop a new game while advertising and flat out lying about the existing one. 

ummax and the OP should be very proud of supporting a company that participates in this, without apology atonement.

I don't think they're destroying MMO gaming at all, quite the opposite.  You're looking into the situation far too far.

The point of MMO games is to get together with other people, develop a community and have fun.  By the sounds of the OP, this is exactly what they're doing.  It's what MMO game discussions should be about.

If MMO gaming isn't being destroyed it's because of people taking a stand against things like this.

If the NGE brought in 1 million new subs that would have sent a clear message to the entire industry that doing things like this pays off.

I have no doubt that the only regret SoE has about this is that it wasn't successful.  I also believe that given a chance, particularily with a very high probability of success, they will do it again.

Originally posted by ummax

Originally posted by Suvroc

Originally posted by ummax

 

why then in the life I have described which is all about compromise whether you choose to actually compromise or not is the expense of a 15 dollar subscription fee so danged important to a small community of veterans who no longer play the game because they now hate it.  

 

If your credit card was double billed for a months sub would you "compromise" by letting it go?

Or would you do something to remedy that issue?

 

this doens't make sense  so I dont understand

If my credit card is double billed I would call about the mistake BECAUSE its a mistake and get it fixed but its still a choice if that is what your getting at but an obvious one that one makes when a mistake is made.  If the next statement is that your mad at sony cause they double billed you once then okay but does it make sense to scream it from the rooftops for 3 years?

I just found it interesting that you would imply that a $15 sub fee is "so danged important" to vets but you'll make an effort to retrieve $15 if it was taken from you.

But that is completely unrelated to this conversation.

You make some interesting points(albeit a little confusing in it's delivery). But the thing that I'd like to point out from all of this is that compromise, on the part of gamers, is apathy - and apathy is destroying this industry for everyone who wants more out of their online experiences.

Some things we have to make compromises on as it affects our lives in profound ways. As so many have pointed out this is just a game - and not compromising on this shouldn't have a profound affect on our lives.

Rather it should have a profound affect on the industry.

Originally posted by ummax

 

why then in the life I have described which is all about compromise whether you choose to actually compromise or not is the expense of a 15 dollar subscription fee so danged important to a small community of veterans who no longer play the game because they now hate it.  

If your credit card was double billed for a months sub would you "compromise" by letting it go?

Or would you do something to remedy that issue?

It's interesting Unmax that you would equate making compromises in real life and how those compromises relate to this game when so many others here have said "it's just a game - get over it" or "get a life".

But still, you are right in that life is about compromises. But wouldn't it also be true that it's also apart of life to minimize those compromises?

Some of the things you mention as compromises in life are things well beyond your control - you cannot control the weather, you cannot control how others may vote.

A subscription to a game is something totally within your control. You have the power to make that choice.

I do understand where you guys are coming from. I can appreciate your perspective.

But I feel that this is a kind of exploitation. You are denied what you bought, and in fact what you really want, and all the while they reap the profits of a lesser experience simply because it offers a taste of what you initially had in a supierior product.

I just cannot understand why people would want to make compromises to their online experiences - even when they're paying for it.

Originally posted by hosal

Originally posted by Suvroc

Originally posted by blondeh

I resubbed the other day. My toon is on Eclipse. Althlough the population is doing bad im having fun.

Dont confuse me for a fanboi tho. I was as heart broken as the next guy/girl when the CU and NGE hit. I ranted and raved on the boards. I protested...... damn i wanted to fly to the states and kick some ass. But to be honest there is nothing on the market that fills the hole SWg left. The only thing that comes close is.... thats right NGE SWG.

I'm gonna put my flame suit on and say...apart from the benny hill style combat and lack of 36 proffesions the game isnt actually that bad. The only thing I cant do now is grind out the proffesions that are no longer there. I do miss the old days but aint nothing gonna bring them back not even the bird.

 

I don't want to sound like I'm flaming anyone but by your own admission you'd rather be subbing to a game that they've chosen to deny you.

Instead you've accepted a lesser quality product because it's kind of filling a void left when they took away your game.

As a consumer do you not think you deserve better?

I think he means alot of mmo's on the market don't give him the type of satisfaction that swg does.  I feel the same way.

I didn't say otherwise....

I said that by his own admission SWG now is a lesser product of what it once was.

Originally posted by dreamspeaker

 

nah...you are 100% wrong.  the entertainers have been bitching about this for 4 1/2 years and still there are afk entertainers.  not considered breaking any rules.  never has been.  no dark jedi took out whole cantinas except for player events.  which were amusing but that's beside the point. 

Because it was over-looked by moderators doesn't mean it was legal. 

If a spawn was camped by an AFK farmer then it was certainly delt with when reported. If the same rule wasn't enforced with entertainers then that was the fault of the moderators not enforcing a rule.

Doing nothing about a rule being broken is different then making it legal.

Originally posted by blondeh

I resubbed the other day. My toon is on Eclipse. Althlough the population is doing bad im having fun.

Dont confuse me for a fanboi tho. I was as heart broken as the next guy/girl when the CU and NGE hit. I ranted and raved on the boards. I protested...... damn i wanted to fly to the states and kick some ass. But to be honest there is nothing on the market that fills the hole SWg left. The only thing that comes close is.... thats right NGE SWG.

I'm gonna put my flame suit on and say...apart from the benny hill style combat and lack of 36 proffesions the game isnt actually that bad. The only thing I cant do now is grind out the proffesions that are no longer there. I do miss the old days but aint nothing gonna bring them back not even the bird.

I don't want to sound like I'm flaming anyone but by your own admission you'd rather be subbing to a game that they've chosen to deny you.

Instead you've accepted a lesser quality product because it's kind of filling a void left when they took away your game.

As a consumer do you not think you deserve better?

Originally posted by Esquire1980

Kobie, it doesn't really matter if you agree with  the "former BH" or not.  All that really does matter, is he has found the gamebreaking CHANGE (for him) and canceled.

You, as a current subscriber get 1 less person to kill in PVP, 1 less person to group with  for PVE, SOE gets 1 less 15.00 p/month, Customer Service gets a little less $ every month and cuts the small staff they have, SOE Austin has a little less $ every month and cuts the amount of content or CHANGES (not really a bad thing here) they can add,  and there is 1 more unsubed, disgruntled vet out there.

Sooner or later they CHANGE the game on everyone.  Sooner or later one of these CHANGES will be gamebreaking.

It will even happen to you.

lol I've said it before - eventually everyone becomes disgruntled!  : )

Now that's kind of cool.

I can appreciate people trying to make the best of what they've got. But that's really what it is isn't it - making the best of what you've got? It's not 57 new accounts opened. It's likely 57 new toons from existing accounts or vet trials.

Still, I applaud the effort made.

Originally posted by Evilsam

Originally posted by Suvroc

 I'm sure many people did return after the CU.

But I chose Lowca as my server on June 26/27 because it was mid-way down the server list. The servers at the top were FULL or very close to it so my friend and I wanted to be sure we could create toons on the same server. Even then I think Lowca may have still even got as high as very heavy or heavy, as did so many servers that first month.

 

 

I played on Lowca from day one untill the CU..for over a year there were times Lowca was full..I made char's on a couple of servers to play when i couldn't get on Lowca.Not saying it happened every day,but it did happen enough that i made char's on other servers.

As for those "rumors"..Sadly that person must be hearing "voices" and needs to adjust his tinfoil hat a bit.

You know, I really wasn't sure if that was the case or not. I thought I remembered that happening but wasn't sure.

I too had charaters on other servers that were hardly ever used. I must have created them for that reason.

Who were you on Lowca BTW?

Originally posted by TookyG

Originally posted by JustBe

Sure the CU and NGE are worse than pre cu and pre cu could have been a great game but come on people you must all reember how bad the game was back then.

 

No one has been saying that SWG didn't have problems Pre-CU.  What has been said, many times in fact, is that Pre-CU was far better than SWG today.  I'm sure most vets can come up with a laundry list of things that needed to be tweaked, fixed, and added to SWG and despite its flaws it was superior to the NGE.  In my opinion, Pre-CU SWG was the finest MMO ever created even with its flaws.  It was a living breathing entity until it was dragged into the street, curbed, shot, stabbed, disembowled, and quartered.

Yeah, I agree with this. Beside which most of the issues pre-CU had didn't really affect me, at least not beyond a level of reasonable control.

But still I think the underlying message should be that SoE released a product that they didn't stand behind. They've lost my faith and trust in doing the right thing for the consumers/subscribers they have.

If SoE doesn't value me as a customer how am I supposed to value their products?

I was just thinking that maybe it would be worthwhile to give the current subscribers one month free to celebrate 5 years of SWG.

I think you guys deserve it more then anyone!

Well, I just finished another 30 day trial earlier this month and quite frankly I was still bored out of my mind.

Levels and loot just isn't for me.

Originally posted by Rhoklaw

SWG may be dying, but not being part of the E3 show doesn't mean much. Hell, Planetside, Matrix Online and Pirates of the Burning Sea aren't listed either. So from your perspective on things, all 3 of those games are dead too.

Who knows, it could also mean that SCE is looking at streamlining their catelog of MMO's now that the online division is under new leadership.

Trimming the fat so to speak.

I'd also like to note that I believe it was Jestor that pointed out that Smed didn't include SWG in one of his speaches recently.

All I can say is that if SWG was a stock I certainly wouldn't be investing in it right now.

Originally posted by GrandAm

 

One little fact that has me believe NGE was in the works and known about buy devs and suits alike is:

1.  SWG ED came out in a box

2.  JTL came out in a box

3.  ROTW came out in a box

4.  ToOW came out as a digital download only, no box

5.  Starter pack came out in a box

6.  COA came out in a box

First three and last two marketed and pressed boxes expecting sales.

Number 4 digital only because massive demands for refunds were to be expected.  It costs money to press media boxes.  More over it takes time to make, press, and distribute to have the product in place to sale in stores for launch date.  They didn't do this long process because they new they would lose money after pissing people off.  I even remember SOE selling pre-orders for the digital download a month before ToOW launch.  No month ahead pre-orders for it in any stores I went to.  Oh and those stores never received boxes.

You know, I always wondered about that too.

The day ToOW came out I went to EBGames to buy it, and obviously I was surprised that the store clerks had no idea what I was talking about. I had a bad feeling about buying the digital download as everything else I bought was a retail version. That evening something didn't quite feel right.

I should have gone with my gut feeling  : (

Originally posted by Mathos

Originally posted by TeranHawkins

Wait....SWG is still running!!!!

 

Nuke them from orbit i say

It's the only way to be sure  ; )

Originally posted by Stuhero

Originally posted by Suvroc

When speaking of the CU the author says this...

"and (the rumour goes) subscriptions actually rose back to at-launch levels. Perhaps even beyond."
 

lol what?

From my perspective I saw many old friends return during the CU and saw allot of new players too. I don't think it rose to or beyond earlier levels but since SOE never gave out sub numbers we will never know. Almost every single friend who came back and played through the CU left as soon as they saw the NGE.

I'm sure many people did return after the CU.

But I chose Lowca as my server on June 26/27 because it was mid-way down the server list. The servers at the top were FULL or very close to it so my friend and I wanted to be sure we could create toons on the same server. Even then I think Lowca may have still even got as high as very heavy or heavy, as did so many servers that first month.

When speaking of the CU the author says this...

"and (the rumour goes) subscriptions actually rose back to at-launch levels. Perhaps even beyond."
 

lol what?

Originally posted by Gutboy

June 26th 2008 and still here in spite of the vocal minority who just can't kill this game.

lol

Didn't you just point  to the AoC forums in another thread trying to imply that AoC was having problems and people were leaving?

Isn't that hypocritical?