Originally posted by Drachasor

Originally posted by JYCowboy

To follow up whats been posted:

The Nightwing name is not unused, now that Grayson is Batman.  The original Nightwing has made a comeback in the Superman comics along with his companion Flamebird.  They are involved with the whole New Krypton story arc.

It's not like Bruce is going to stay dead.  Seriously.
 

 

Anyhow, I am unmoved by this "revelation."  We already know they are going to have iconic DC heroes and villains.  I'm a lot more interested in the gameplay at this point.

I think he's definitely going to stay dead. Grayson has moved in and even rebuilt the Bat Cave. I think Grayson will stay on as Bats until Drake gets old enough to take on the Mantle.

I don't understand this because... (MAJOR SPOILERS FOR BATMAN FANS)

Seriously, if you haven't read a Batman comic in the last year or so, don't read the spoiler unless you really don't care.

Last chance to look away.

Dick Grayson is now Batman. Bruce Wayne is dead. I was under the impression that they were going to work the whole DCUO into the DC cannon somehow, but maybe this will be like an alternate DC universe where Bruce is still alive and the Blackest Night stuff hasn't happened yet.

Anyone know what you are supposed to do after the scan?

The scan pops up my system specs and just sits there. Is that the end?

Did I get all the way through?

Is there something that I'm missing?

Originally posted by DeadlyJames

Originally posted by Bodeus

WTF why not use the Black Green Lantern!

 

look at all the screen shots You will see both lanterns fighting together

Not to mention that the current big story arc revolves around all of the latern corps. Black Laterns shouldn't have been the evil undead army of darkity dark darkness.

Originally posted by Elyod

Originally posted by Kryogenic

Originally posted by TibMonkey

Originally posted by Kryogenic

Not to mention when you did hit one of the instanced missions and do it with a group, when you exit the instance group members get seperated into different instances. It's not a solution to the problem.

er no they don't, 100% of my beta time was spent in a group.

I didn't play at all during open beta and I didn't log in to the last 2 closed beta tests, but up until then grouping was always a crap shoot.

I didn't group in Alpha and I only grouped up a few times in CB and everytime we ran into issues.

All that aside the way they have the servers set up is exactly how Guild Wars has their game set up? In fact Guild Wars' combat system is much more engaging and fun to play and is infinitely more conducive to strategic and tactics based group combat than Champions is. Guild Wars also doesn't require a monthly fee to play.

What's so different about Champions that requires a monthly fee? The ability to jump? The option to choose different travel powers? Yeah... that warrants a monthly fee and a cash shop.

Sign me up please. I'd also like to purchase the brooklyn bridge and some ocean front property in Kansas.

 

 Now this is why i don't  try to think twice before buying a game when this guy here is giving you bad things from the game and he didn't even spent a lot of time. What lvl did you reached, 8? you just spent time in the tutorial and desert/canada crisis? did you even join a supergroup and took down Dr destroyer? doesnt look like. I spent a lot of time i grouped up a lot of times, no issues about finishing a lair and the group split in different instance of the zone, you always end up in the same instance since there is an option to keep you all together and a checkbox that doesnt make the game chose an instance for you, you have 30 sec to decide wich one join and it even tell you where are you team, supergroup players and friends.

 Pls dont judge a game you didn't spent more than 48 hours or reached at least lvl 25 for your nemesis, people are complaining about running out of content when even lumeria and Moster Island were closed for Open Beta. This game give you the choise to go solo or group and let me tell you something you will never ever take down Legendarys or cosmic alone they can basicly one shot you and if you get a build to try solo them you will spend more than 1 day to finish them off. The game is great, the articule is great and i invite you all to try it.

Look I started playing the game in the alpha phase, Oct of 2008. I'm pretty damn sure I spent more time with the game than you did.

I'm also I little tired of having to defend my point of view from people who were in the open beta and didn't really see what happened before then.

Not to mention most of the people who are talking so highly of the game never spent enough time with it to wear away the newness and to take off the "this is a new game and super cool" rose colored glasses.

Play the game for a few months and then come back and see if you aren't singing a different song.

Originally posted by TibMonkey

Originally posted by Kryogenic

Not to mention when you did hit one of the instanced missions and do it with a group, when you exit the instance group members get seperated into different instances. It's not a solution to the problem.

er no they don't, 100% of my beta time was spent in a group.

I didn't play at all during open beta and I didn't log in to the last 2 closed beta tests, but up until then grouping was always a crap shoot.

I didn't group in Alpha and I only grouped up a few times in CB and everytime we ran into issues.

All that aside the way they have the servers set up is exactly how Guild Wars has their game set up? In fact Guild Wars' combat system is much more engaging and fun to play and is infinitely more conducive to strategic and tactics based group combat than Champions is. Guild Wars also doesn't require a monthly fee to play.

What's so different about Champions that requires a monthly fee? The ability to jump? The option to choose different travel powers? Yeah... that warrants a monthly fee and a cash shop.

Sign me up please. I'd also like to purchase the brooklyn bridge and some ocean front property in Kansas.

Originally posted by MikeB

Originally posted by panictmind

What I really want is a teleportation either travel or combat or both.

 

Already in the game!

lol CO's version of teleportation is that you turn into a glowing orb that resembles a dead night elf from WoW and zoom around real fast until you pop back out as your character which is stuck in a forced hover.

Seemed like a step backwards from CoX's teleportation.

Not to mention it really irks me that they chose to add combat suppression of travel powers.

Originally posted by Zeblade

Originally posted by qbangy32

Originally posted by TibMonkey

Originally posted by Kryogenic 

If it has any staying power and they revamp the combat system, switch to multiple servers instead of multi instanced copies of each zone, through out the cash shop, and add in secret identities,

Then I'd quit.

 

Ditto.

Ppl constantly complain "Too many empty servers" and "My server is dead, when are they going to merge servers" now you got a guy here complaining when a company tries to solve that issue.

 

 

Well they didnt solve anything here. Its worse. If you play alone then its wonderland for you. There were to many times in beta that my friends and me could not play together because the super tiny instances were ful  100people. you cant cue, wait inline.. nope you have to go to a smaller one and hope it dont fell up fast before your other friends get there.

 

Anyway nice write up.. but did everyone read the END GAME! Oh gee cant wait to get there

Not to mention when you did hit one of the instanced missions and do it with a group, when you exit the instance group members get seperated into different instances. It's not a solution to the problem.

Originally posted by kalebfrost

Great Write up!

Yeah it was. That guy actually made Champions seem like a fun game to play.

If it has any staying power and they revamp the combat system, switch to multiple servers instead of multi instanced copies of each zone, through out the cash shop, and add in secret identities, I'd seriously consider subbing up for a few months or so, but I'm pretty sure that none of that will happen other than secret identities which a few of the developers hinted at and teased that that would eventually be added to the game.

I hate that the game looks so good, but plays so horribly. I think the reason why the game seems good on paper is because it sounds awesome on paper, but it just seems so sterile and bland when you play it.

I love comics. I'm 31 and I'm subscribed to a few titles still. I love video games. I have and play on every current gen system (admitedly I play my 360 more than anything else. The PS3 seriously needs to get some better titles and a more streamlined and functional way to play games online. PS Home sucks.). I've played just about every MMORPG that I could possibly get my hands on.

You would think that this game would be a no-brainer for someone like me. I just can't get into it and it's frustrating to see a good concept  fall so short of the mark.

In the end, DCUO will come out eventually and I hope that they can deliver.

Originally posted by xaldraxius

 

---

Originally posted by grimfall
 
Well there's a couple of things that bother me about this post.  The first thing is that he says he was an alpha tester, but he was posting critiques on a forum which was then moderated.  That's the first time I've heard of an alpha test that took input in this manner .  At the Alpha stage you should be so open to feedback that a forum shouldn't be used.  If you're using a forum and filtering the content with moderators, you've got way too many alpha testers.
 
The second thing is, that bothered me is that someone let this jerk into alpha and closed beta of their game.  If you can't be mature enough to post in a reasoned manner when playing someone's game for free... maybe you shouldn't be a tester.  You're doing a job and being compensated, act like a grownup.

---

 

He's telling nothing but the truth. Hell, we didn't even open up to having more than two days a week with limited times to test until open beta.

Cryptic ran it like they had set in stone what they wanted the game to be and wouldn't budge on anything that was important. Though you should be thankful we fought so long to get the hotbar increased, otherwise you'd have a max of 7 powers available at one time.

Thanks to you and Slackerboy as well.

You have to love how people read what they want into what you post and then accuse you of things that you aren't guilty of.

I really liked the fact that grimfall just assumed that I posted some hostile stuff and a mod swooped in with rational thinking and quelled the flames of my ignorance. hahahaha

I didn't post in that thread until after IronAngel did, and the only reason I posted was to point out that it seemed closed-minded and self-defeating to only pass on what they thought was relevant. If I were mod and I saw multiple threads about the same issue over and over... guess what? It really doesn't matter how the players worded their discontent. The fact of the matter would be that they are not content with that aspect of the game and would therefore be a relevent issue to bring up to the developers.

It's cool that you resorted to personal attacks and aggression, grimfall... it's the last refuge of the incompetent.

I'm going to have to beg to differ with Mr. Roper.

I was in the Alpha and then Closed beta testing phases for this game. I was accepted into the alpha phase in Oct of 2008. One of the most griped about constants through out the whole testing process was the combat mechanic.

Granted there were many posts that had no substance other than frustration and vitriol over how much people disliked the build up to blow up combat mechanic.

However, there were more frank discussions about the ins and outs, pros and cons, ect. of COs combat mechanics than there were empty posts filled with nerd-rage. Furthermore, most of these posts went on to throw out suggestions on how the gameplay could be tuned to be more fun and not so lackluster.

These posts popped up right up until closed beta ended. They may have popped up afterwards, but I had all ready given up on this game turning a corner and being fun to play.

To further illustrate the disfunctional feedback system:

There was a forum moderator named IronAngel. I thought about saving the post, but I didn't so it's all hearsay. Anyway, myself and a few other testers were really put off when IronAngel posted saying that he or she and the rest of the moderators would be less inclined to pass on feedback that wasn't stated in a manner that they deemed appropriate.

This isn't a bad thing when taken at face value, but if you take the time to think about it you realize how counter productive that is insofar as improving on the game through tester feedback is concerned.

Who hasn't posted on an internet forum and been met with hostility because some poster or mod read aggression where there was none? Not to mention the fact that if you are a mod on forums dedicated to testing a game, isn't it your responsibility to pass on all feedback?

It really led me to believe that all of the threads discussing the combat mechanics (almost a year's worth of discussion) just got labeled as "unworthy of attention" and passed up with little to no attention.

There were a few of the developers that would browse the forums now and again and join discussions, but that seemed to become less frequent in closed beta and then petered out to almost non-existant by the end of closed beta.

I also doubt that the developers and publishers that posted announcements on the forums would have completely missed that for months there was always a long discussion about the combat system on page 1 of the general discussion forum and on the combat and gameplay forum.

I don't have anything against Mr. Roper, but let's call a spade a spade... this, my friends, is spin.

I'm really hoping that this game will be all that it's cracked up to be, but I can't get rid of this feeling of tiny dread that it's all smoke and mirrors and will turn out as boring and repetitve as the rest of the MMORPGs that have come out recently.

I had my doubts and then I saw the trailer for the game with one of the coolest Star Wars action sequences ever. I started to give in to the hype, but still remained on the side-lines.

Then I saw the animations for the classes that have been revealed so far. I got even more excited and became a lurking fan... waiting to see what would happen.

I saw the 4 part gameplay vid with like 20 mins of footage. I was floored. I felt relieved because I thought to myself that someone finally got it right. The gameplay looks fun, the animations are cool, the dialogue seemed very well done and even had good voice acting.

The gameplay footage left me with a sense that the game kind of played like Mass Effect in the Star Wars Universe.

Now, hopefully, they are adding  player housing.

I've been on the fence about the whole MMORPG genre for awhile now and was about ready to just turn my back on the whole genre, but now I'm so excited my head asplode.

I can't wait for this game. I really hope that it's all it's cracked up to be.

I registered with the site and got the message stating that I was sent a confirmation email. I didn't receive one so I tried to log into the site anyway... no dice, but I was redirected to a page that told me to confirm my email address or get another confirmation email sent to my email address.

I chose to have another confirmation email sent to me, but have yet to receive anything.

Anyone else experience a similar issue and/or know how to get this sorted out?

Originally posted by Rabenwolf

The controls in the game are horrid... clunky and badly designed. I like how they give you a few different control sets, but regardless they are bad. Attacking enemies tends to be very slow and awkward. The character customization is fun, though it wont take long for a player to recognize many of the commonly used visuals such as large wings or claws. Quests so far have been boring, though they make up for that with an active world. Really annoying enemies tend to appear out of no where, again mixed with the combat system and targeting... it can be a pain in the butt.

I would have to say the quality of the game is average. It could have spent more time in production, could have been much better designed. Will make a fun console game, but a mediocre PC title.

Overall impression is that this game ranges between a 6.5-7.5/10  give or take. CoH/CoV definately had the controls down better, the design and appeal seemed better thought out and developed. I cant help but feel champions is a mimicry of better games, but is meant mainly to be an entry into the console mmorpg market...not necessarily a very good one, just an entry none the less.

I can tell you right now that it won't be a successful console game. I'm not trying to be insulting or anything, but I think you and obviously the CO devs aren't really in touch with online console gaming.

Insofar as console gaming is concerned, Xbox Live is king. Xbox Live gamers won't play a game with an added subscription fee because everyone who plays on Xbox Live pays a yearly subscription all ready. Do you really think those same gamers would be willing to pony up the money for the game, the cost of the monthly sub, and be willing to purchase content from an item shop?

The gamers on Xbox Live won't support games that require more thought than kill. Even in the games that have objective based gametypes, the majority of the players play Deathmatch and Teamdeathmatch exclusively.

CO is too stat dependent and is definitely not an action RPG. It's not a console game. It's not even close.

I agree with the rest of your post, I just think that too many people blame consoles instead of blaming the developers.

Look at the game's history. Marvel and Microsoft were both on board until they started to see the game and then they both pulled out. Cryptic was left stuck with code for a super hero MMO and instead of starting from scratch like they should have, they flocked to the closest IP they could find to shoe horn into their game.

Marvel obviously didn't pull out because they changed their minds about having their IP associated with an MMORPG because a Marvel MMO is being developed by a new company.

Both Marvel and Microsoft have been in business for a very long time and have both been successful. Why would they pull out if they had faith in Cryptics design?

I seriously don't see what the hand full of people who are defending this game see in it. There are just too many sketchy things surrounding this game's history and the business model is more than enough to make me not want to support it.

Originally posted by Irishoak

"Subscription fee is not socialism. But demanding everything be free is. The fact that a company wants to add an MT just means they are trying to make money a different way. If it fails then its not a good product but having it does not make them greedy.

 

Thinking companies are greedy when they try and make money is a socialistic ideal. Don't condemn them for their business model just don't pay for the service."

You are a fountain of amusement, I'll grant you that. Do you even know what socialism is, or are you spouting it because you heard it on TV once? The largest amount of our "socialist welfare" by far goes to corporations, greedy corporations. They are the main cause of our economic woes, it's common knowledge.

"It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest." Adam Smith

We owe corporations nothing, they owe us if they want to fleece us, to think otherwise shows a great lack of self-interest. Capitalism has only recently become about acquiring wealth at the expense of all else, which insures it will in the end destroy itself because it has become unsustainable. Greed is not a virtue, regardless of how much it has become a religion in our nation, there was a time when it was considered a vice.

I whole-heartedly agree. Corporate greed and irresponsible consuming have sucked the life and vitality from this country.

When you spend money as a responsible and informed consumer and refrain from supporting questionable business practices you are showing that company and, through extrapolation, other companies that we the consumer will not be sucked in by this kind of stuff.

The problem with the video game industry is that the majority of the consumers who support it are too young to know the value of a dollar and/or are just plain ignorant insofar as how their actions as consumers affect the industry as a whole.

The greed and exploitation in the video game industry is the microcosm of the greed and exploitation that has been going on for quite some time in this country.

Look at what corporate mentality and greed did to the music industry. It's happening to the video game industry, and it's embaressingly apparent in the MMORPG genre.

Look at all of the worthless cash-in attempts that have no soul, no depth, no consideration for the consumer's wants.

I would never turn my nose up at free stuff, but I also have no problem paying for the things that I want. I have no problem paying for a quality game that would bring hours, days, weeks, and months of enjoyment.

The problem is that when people like BioNut support lackluster games it then becomes ok for other companies to flush out garbage. Why should they rethink the grinds and timesinks when there are always more suckers lined up to pay for their subpar entertainment.

It's up to us the players to hold the companies responsible for making the games we play to a higher standard and therefore raise the bar to a new level of emmersion, enjoyment, and fun. As long as we keep buying crap they'll continue to make it.

If however, we stand united against subpar games and questionable business models, we can help chnge the state of the industry.

Originally posted by monkey_butt

Originally posted by BioNut

Originally posted by Kryogenic

Originally posted by fervor

Originally posted by monkey_butt

Solid review. Answered a lot of my questions. MTs are relevant. They bum me, but I don't see many MMOs releasing w/o them in the future.

 

What are you talking about?  Other than the vague press releases, no one knows anything about the MT's.  No one has seen the Cryptic shop.

The OP was just guessing and since he seems to have a negative bias, his guess is negative as well.

 

I beg to differ. The first day the game was in open beta I read multiple posts on the forums from people who were pretty upset because costume parts that they used in alpha and closed beta weren't available in open beta.

I wonder where those costume pieces are going to be? The cash shop? No... they would never do that. (Please note that this forum has no Times New Sarcasm font so you'll have to use your imagination.)

I really wish that gamers in general would start wising up to all of the sheisty business practices that have been getting worse and worse.

If you support these questionable business practices those same shady practices will be picked up and adopted by other companies.

It's even happening with console gaming as well. You "superior" PC purists can look down your runny noses at all of the "unwashed masses of console cavemen", but one day PC gaming will be just as bad if not worse. Developers are releasing games on the 360 and holding back content or locking content on the disks to be sold piece meal to who ever is willing to part with even more cash than they all ready paid for the "full" game.

The Modern Warfare 2 developers even entertained the notion of charging a subscription fee for players who wanted to level up faster by getting more exp than the people that aren't mindless pleeebs and are unwilling to pony up a monthly fee for some smarmy questionable horse hockey.

Back to Champions Online:

The whole game is based around combat. They're combat mechanics suck. Full box price, plus a monthly sub, PLUS a cash shop on top of all that? Boo-urns, good sirs... Boo... urns.

A lot of these companies are having to fight to stay alive my friend. They have employees to pay that have families to feed. The reason why MTs are becoming the norm is that the subscription model just isn't getting them enough money to keep them in business. I have no problem paying for a product I enjoy know that the proceeds will go to help someone better their life.

Its people like you that are bringing this country down. This I want it now and I want it for free mind set is destroying everything. Look at Obama's healthcare plan, bailouts, socialism, they all have their roots in the same mindset that gamers use when they bitch about DLC or MTs.

Capitalism is about making money at all costs. To make money you have to have a good product that is resonably priced. Adding MTs to a game does not make a company greedy it is just part of the capitalistic system that has made America great. If you must hold on to your socialist ideals then please leave and go live somewhere in Europe cuz I am sick of it here.

 

 

Guffaw...

The subscription fee pricing model = socialism? Remind me to steer clear of any HMO you chair bud.

Capatilism will settle this. If Sub+MT is unpalatable to the majority of the target audience there is not sufficient demand. If it is palatable to a majority then it is in demand. It's that simple. Kryogenic's points are not remotely based in socialism. In fact his opinions as well as yours are proof that capatilism is alive and well in this society. Kryo didn't ask for anything for free. Some of us have an aversion to paying specificly for a set of pixels as opposed to a recurring fee for a medium of entertainment.

To me it's no different than  Watching Battle Star Galacitica on Sci Fi and them saying, hey if you want to see the show with full special effects, pay this 10.00 fee. I'm not missing out on the plot, but the product as fully designed is not delivered as a whole so that they can nickel and dime me for what is already there and I have paid for in my cable subscription as well as watching their damn commericals.

I LOVE gross generalizations and sound bites...they make the world go round.

Well said good, sir... and thanks. I was sure I was going to be swamped by posters like Rush Limbaugh... I mean BioNut. lol

Originally posted by fervor

Originally posted by monkey_butt

Solid review. Answered a lot of my questions. MTs are relevant. They bum me, but I don't see many MMOs releasing w/o them in the future.

 

What are you talking about?  Other than the vague press releases, no one knows anything about the MT's.  No one has seen the Cryptic shop.

The OP was just guessing and since he seems to have a negative bias, his guess is negative as well.

I beg to differ. The first day the game was in open beta I read multiple posts on the forums from people who were pretty upset because costume parts that they used in alpha and closed beta weren't available in open beta.

I wonder where those costume pieces are going to be? The cash shop? No... they would never do that. (Please note that this forum has no Times New Sarcasm font so you'll have to use your imagination.)

I really wish that gamers in general would start wising up to all of the sheisty business practices that have been getting worse and worse.

If you support these questionable business practices those same shady practices will be picked up and adopted by other companies.

It's even happening with console gaming as well. You "superior" PC purists can look down your runny noses at all of the "unwashed masses of console cavemen", but one day PC gaming will be just as bad if not worse. Developers are releasing games on the 360 and holding back content or locking content on the disks to be sold piece meal to who ever is willing to part with even more cash than they all ready paid for the "full" game.

The Modern Warfare 2 developers even entertained the notion of charging a subscription fee for players who wanted to level up faster by getting more exp than the people that aren't mindless pleeebs and are unwilling to pony up a monthly fee for some smarmy questionable horse hockey.

Back to Champions Online:

The whole game is based around combat. They're combat mechanics suck. Full box price, plus a monthly sub, PLUS a cash shop on top of all that? Boo-urns, good sirs... Boo... urns.

Originally posted by ravare

Originally posted by Shreddi

Its SOE so think of the best SOE game out there today and DC might be a little better.   By the way what is the best SOE game out there today you think to compare DC with,  not excact comparison just a general feeling.   thanks.   by the way CO launch had its problems the first day but after they released the client patch without having to use their joke of an installer it worked fine.   If  and Big "IF' after installing the new client your computer was restarted to kick all the old co files out of mem.   That was lack of communication from CO.   Fortunately the kind people in forums would share their remidies and fixes.    I can not comment on CO or almost any mmo till lvl 20+ is reached.    Some do kick ass right away but some are graphics impressions while your still playing whack a mole or mob or squirrel grinding up to run to trainer hoping for something cool.   IMO gameplay holds my attention, graphics and cool dungeons for some but gameplay for others.  Both would be nice.

 

Champions Online is not launched, it is still in Open Beta, the official launch is Sept 1st.

 

Eventhough they had issues with their patcher and the files that Fileplanet had, they stayed online all night (Devs were speaking to us testers) and they fixed the issue with the patcher and created 2 work arounds within a day.

It doesn't matter how efficeint they are at fixing bugs and addressing issues that could potentially keep paying customers from playing a game they are paying for, in the future.

The gameplay is what matters and COs gameplay just isn't there. It's not fun and it's too darn repetitive.

Not only that, but I've been playing the game since Oct 2008 and in the face of piles and piles of negative feedback the developers won't let go of the one thing that their whole game revolves around... the combat.

The combat mechanics are horrible. It's not an action-RPG by any stretch of the word.

DCUO's gameplay is physics based and much closer to an action RPG.

I'm not saying that Cryptic can't make a good game or won't. I'm saying that in Champions Online they have most certainly not done so.

Originally posted by Ozryk

Originally posted by Kryogenic

Originally posted by mmcguire2

I hope this game turns out as good as they say it will.  its looking great

 

It'll definitely be better than Champions Online. Tic tac toe is more fun than Champions Online.

 

Sigh... people should be forced to add an "imo" to the end of every one of their posts on these forums.

The trite opinions expressed here can wear on a person's soul.

Why hello pot. I see that you live in a glass house... off ya go now, back to myopnionisbetterville.

Originally posted by mmcguire2

I hope this game turns out as good as they say it will.  its looking great

It'll definitely be better than Champions Online. Tic tac toe is more fun than Champions Online.