I agree with a lot of the points made in here. First off I think it may be a select few of us that are openly looking for a change. I think most of us are long time MMO players and some of us even from EQ/UO/Camelot era. As with a discussion I had with another member in a Tera posting I believe we are a Niche.

Companies/Stock Holders are looking at the numbers of games like WoW, Rift and now SWoTR and thinking to themselves we need to model that and make money ourselves. I dont believe for one moment that Devs want to make the same games over and over but they too need jobs.

I hope that a company or two will step forward and make some sizable changes to test the waters for a smaller player base that will play a game for mulitple years with the opportunity to bring in new gamers looking for something they have never experienced before.

What I would like to see is someone start a post and let us list features we would like to see. I think you need to keep PvP out of a PvE game but that would be for posters to vote on. I would like to see features voted on and a final list be made.

I think so many of the newer MMO gamers were former Console gamers and they tend to be use to linear and thats why its been so succesful. Many of us older gamers that started on EQ and such dont have the time we once did. I am just looking for a happy medium in the right direction.

Originally posted by Fadedbomb

Originally posted by Kankan

Look, I have been a member here for a long time and I dont usually post, I imagine I had way too much caffine this evening. It really sounds like you and I are looking for the same thing but it also seems like we are a select few uhtil a company goes against the current grain and takes a chance. 

I lay my hope as you do in some upcoming games, mine being EQNext and really I hope that 38 Studio's does something different considering the companies founder was a heavy EQ player. 

Until then I know that I will spend 50  bucks here and there and pay a few months sub but in the end its my entertainment and really its not all that expensive as many other things are. I keep my eye out for new games and hope that they will not be swayed by share holders but keep thier original ideas alive. 

Here is my complaint list in one little post..

 

People bad mouthing or being negative about a game not even out of beta and that was open about certain elements being gone or not operational. I myself dont even know if there will be multiple starting area's, I hope so. 

People not understanding that many of us are the few, the niche. 

People complaining that a PvE oriented game has sucky PvP, really?

 

Anyway, thats it and good night. 

 

 

 

You are complaining about elements that they never said wouldnt be in the game. Why complain about something nobody promised they would change. If you followed the game for the 2 yrs  as you said you did you would know it was only Combat and the Political System, at least thats what I understood.

You can be as critical as you want about a Beta if the elements being complained about are IN the beta & ARe operational.

They didn't just "take out" the non-linear elements of the game. THAT IS the first 1-20 levels of the game. More importantly, TERA has been out in KOREA for over a YEAR and it failed hard. Now, the failure COULD be blamed on the specific "Korean" market that doesn't really conform to western ideals. However, there is talk of them revamping the 1-40 area.

 

Again, i've done this "song & dance" before with MANY BETAs in the past. "Sweeping" changes just simply do NOT occur before launch of a product. Quite frankly, TERA being released in the EU & US is a "More Content" version of what the Koreans were given.

Now, as for the US & EU's version of TERA releasing in May all I have to say is that so far the 1-20 experience is a Linear Hand-Holding piece of Themepark HappyFunTime. If YOU like Themeparks then this game is definitely for you in its current iteration.

 Again, where did you read that it was such a different experience as far as leveling progression. I myself followed the game and reailized that it wasnt all that different from everything else out there. I went into this beta knowing it would be the same level progression, linear if you would, so I had an open mind to focus on other things.

HOWEVER, if you were like me (as many TERA fans were in the same boat in the West) expecting a Non-Linear Non-HandHolding Quest MMO then you should be warned. If the 1-40 "revamp" does NOT drastically change the dynamic of the 1-20 experience TERA isn't a non-Themepark fan's cup of tea.

 I agree with your OP to some degree just not the fact that we complain about things that we knew would be in the game. If the combat system mechanic was screwed up and didnt work I would agree  and have no issue with someone complaining.

Lots of derailing going on here suddenly :(. I think many of you need to re-read my OP :/.

 

Look, I have been a member here for a long time and I dont usually post, I imagine I had way too much caffine this evening. It really sounds like you and I are looking for the same thing but it also seems like we are a select few uhtil a company goes against the current grain and takes a chance. 

I lay my hope as you do in some upcoming games, mine being EQNext and really I hope that 38 Studio's does something different considering the companies founder was a heavy EQ player. 

Until then I know that I will spend 50  bucks here and there and pay a few months sub but in the end its my entertainment and really its not all that expensive as many other things are. I keep my eye out for new games and hope that they will not be swayed by share holders but keep thier original ideas alive. 

Here is my complaint list in one little post..

People bad mouthing or being negative about a game not even out of beta and that was open about certain elements being gone or not operational. I myself dont even know if there will be multiple starting area's, I hope so. 

People not understanding that many of us are the few, the niche. 

People complaining that a PvE oriented game has sucky PvP, really?

Anyway, thats it and good night. 

Originally posted by Fadedbomb

SOME of you have missed the point of my OP ENTIRELY.

 

To the Point itself: A player should NOT have to wait until they're more than a 3rd through the game to find it "fun". By level 20 the game SHOULD have "pulled" me in, but it did NOT. You're saying because I saw the 1-20 part of the game in as little as 5hrs (last 3hrs was rerolling characters) that I shouldn't be judging the game.

 

HOWEVER, I've been playing MMOs long enough to know when a game pretty much is like the first half of it (save for raiding, pvp etc). With that having been said, I CLEARLY stated I did not get past 20 because 1-20 was so boring, linear, and Quest-HandHolding that I lost interest with every class I played. Quite frankly, that is a poor model for gaming, and many of you need to sit back and rethink what you're talking about.

 

Now please, stop derailing the topic :(. I already touched on many of these aspects in my OP, and not to mention being critical about games that require critisism is a GOOD thing.

 

To quote Teala: "When I go pick out a new TV I expect it to be as good or better as the one that I currently have.  If not - why buy a new TV?"

 

Thank You

When you go buy a new TV is it still in a factory with half the components on the tables. Thats what this is, many things are still missing. 

The issue i have is seeing so many people post about a new game sucking because they experienced it all in a day of beta. 

As for this being a poor model and throwing it in peoples faces do you really think you know better than all these huge companies pooring money into these games? Yea, a niche few of us dont like them but apparently the millions of others that continue to buy them and come back do. You want stock in a companey that caters to thousands or millions?

I laughed when I read you think of Themepark MMO's ( which all  pve centered mmo's have become if your referring to the linear questing/leveling ) as "Niche". I dont see how you can call games with well into the millions of subcribers / players as niche when you compare it to sandbox games such as MO ,  Fallen Earth and such. Those of us that read this forum, reply to topics and start our own topics for the most part are the "Niche". We are many of those that started playing MMo's like EQ, Camelot and UO and we hunger for some type of return. 

I too played Tera this last week end and I have to say I did enjoy myself a bit. I started off as an Archer and found the first 9 levels too easy and chose to start a Mystic on the other server. I found it a little more challenging, almost a reminder of what it was to be a shaman in EQ just with the utility and being a valuable group class.

Did I know what type of game I was going into, yes. I think the fact I havent really played an MMO in over a year or more helped. I actually took the time to read the quests and not just click and hammer them out, did you? Story wasnt ground breaking but did add something to it. I also didnt just go grab one mob at a time, as it was mentioned earlier in this topic I grabbed multiple mobs. It added to pace of the game, made me move around more and utilize my skills/spells and such. 

I wont disagree with you that this game will not have a large player base and after the first few months it will lose sub's and be left with its own Niche playerbase. I also felt the same way you did when I tried out SWoTR, I didnt even get through a day with that game. I dont care if you voice over the quests givers the game looked like it came out 5yrs ago and wasnt anything new that I saw except for the NPC voice overs. Way too many NPC's just standing around with no interaction, I am hoping GW2 is going to take that extra step to really immerse you. 

Getting off topic, but I think you and I think alike in regards to what we may be looking for. In my opinion though we are the Niche and we have to depend on someone to take a chance and say hey, im ok with a 500k player base with the opportunity to pull from the millions of newer players that have only played WoW, Rift and SWoTR. 

Anyway, here goes to hoping Tera will hold me out till GW2 and hopefully EQNext will be that combination of EQ/Vanguard and some new elements. 

I dont know if this has been mentioned as I didnt take the time to go through the 11 previous pages, but I would love to see 'John Carter of Mars". I loved these books growing up and I find myself very excited about the upcoming movie, though I really hope they dont screw it up and ruin my great memories. I even got my oldest son to read the books recently and he enjoyed them as well. I only wish ERB would of written many more of this particular series.

You have a wide range of races, factions and classes. The only issue I see is you could not include the human race since we would obvously have an advantage, ala the books. I guess you could have earthlings if we took a hit in some stat.

Anyway, that would be my favorite IP.

As the title says i'm a returning player looking to find a clan. I'm currently using the free reactivation to play L2 again and find myself enjoying my time. Unless something changes my mind in the next week i will be subbing for at least one month to get a good feel. I played  during beta and for a couple of months after. I have returned a few times in the last few years. This time I really like the fact that leveling doesnt seem to be so painful. I'll have to see how the leveling plays out once the double exp ends but it seems nothing like the past imo. 

Highest level toon is a 54 BD, just leveled my Destroyer to 42 as well. Im trying to get two other toons to 40 as well before this free trial ends so I can figure out what class to focus on. Id like to find a guild with a west coast play time. Im really just looking for a mature clan with a decent amount of people to chat with. I'll have a lot of questions and wouldnt mind having clanmates to bounce those off of. Im not looking for some kind of hand outs or PL, just some decent chat to help the leveling sessions go faster and in hopes of even grouping and learning about the game post 50.

Just reply if interested or post links to other forums I could check for clans. 

Thanks

Well i just found my login in info for Vanguard and would be willing to give it another shot. This would be shot #3. I am at a point that I really want to play something different to whats available at the moment. I only stopped playing because people i started with moved on. 

I question why SOE isnt supporting Vanguard as well as everyone else. Seems to have a lot of what gamers are looking for. It may be a small niche of people but enough to be profitable. It dawned on me today that maybe its because of EQ Next? They have stated that EQ Next is going back to some of its EQ roots. I know many of us feel and think that Vanguard should of been the sequel to EQ and not EQ2. If SOE is going back and using some of the elements that you can find in EQ and Vanguard maybe that is a reason not to push and support Vanguard?

See you in game.

Kyldariann 7 Bard 

Have at least one other toon but wont know until I get in the game. Im sure i'll start a new toon as well if thats where people want to start. 

I had same concern with the so called Dynamic "Rifts" in the game. I think many will grow tired of the same event over and over. If you do it for the first 30 levels what makes you think I want to continue to do for another 20 levels and once expansions hit and level cap is lifted, yipee more Rift grinding. 

I hope the rewards improve for participating in the rifts. The starter area's really only offered one really nice reward as far as armor/weapons went. You did get a few things for crafting but I cant comment on how valuble they are as I never did crafting. 

I was under the impression that the "Rifts" would not spawn as much as they did in Beta, can anyone give me an answer on that?

Im kind of at a point where im not currently subscribed to a MMo and really wondering if I want to pay to play this for a few months.  I would just like to see the use of the rift events be less than they were in Beta, otherwise they will not seem that special. 

These browser based games are being aimed at a different crowd. These games are not being aimed at the type of gamers that frequent this site. 

I also watched the interview with Richard Garriot and as he said its really a whole different audience. Except they feel the audience is so much bigger than your standard MMO crowd or your console gamers. With the success of games like farmville it showed there was a lot of potential to make money. 

So I wouldnt get all worked up thinking that MMO's are going the way of browser base gaming, its simply another audience for these companies to make more capitol. There is more than enough PC Gamers, Console Gamers and now according to people like Richard Garriot Social Gamers. 

Seems like a really "Bad" hard sell on Rift. It seems your main point to buy Rift is because its New and Trion will make lots of money and expand it, by the way all MMO's work that way its not new, and it will eventually kill WoW.  

I played in Beta's 5,6 and 7 with multiple toons to the 20's and 4 different classes and paid to have a second spec so I could change back and forth. The only thing I didnt get involved in was the Crafting.

The souls/talent changes are kind of nice but I forsee everyone running the same specs/trees/souls if they are going to raid which is a real turn off. If you dont care about high level instances or any raiding you can spec/soul anyway you want and enjoy yourself im sure. 

My opinion is if you like the WoW playstyle and are looking for a change from Azeroth ( which is why Trion uses it as a selling point in all their ads ) but dont want to learn anything new then Rift is for you. Its not a challenge and you will have some fun for about 2/3 months exploring some of the different souls/specs.

The problem with those Mix of Souls is you 'll still find yourself using the same keys over and over. Those souls you sink more pts into will be your main focus and your lesser soul trees will be of little matter. Its really no change from the 3 Trees in WoW, its just packaged in a better looking box. Once you get all the paper off and pull out those crappy popcorn fillers its the same thing. I really wished you at least had the option of pulling one soul from another class.. like Beast/Paragon/Justicar... that would make a much more interesting game. 

Enjoy your experience in Rift. 

I'll be waiting for a different experience. 

What kills it the most for me is the Mods that most guilds require you to run in order to join/raid /group and this even includes random pug groups anymore.  I managed to play EQ for 4 yrs with out the help of any Mods.

I think the only thing I d/l was a mod to change the style of the EQ Icons to use the World of Warcraft II Icons. Other than that we had individual channels and made hotkeys to deliver info during raids to the appropriate channels. Example being, I was a shaman and delivered debuff calls to shaman channel and the tank channel in guild raids. That was more than enough, didnt keep us from progressing not using some mod to tell me when to pound on some key. You just read emotes or watched the boss/mobs and used the appropriate spells. 

Second thing I dont really care for and think kills Immersion is Vent/TS or any Voice Chat. Mainly because you hear so much from people other than the game. I dont care how your day was at work or how much homework you have. i dont want to hear you watching some horrible tv program in the background. I met some very good people during my 4yrs in EQ and I never had to hear them in Vent. If it was to the point that we wanted to talk I would call them on the phone or i even  emailed some of the IG Friends and if I could of I would of taken trips to hang out. Vent/TS seem to be used to much for things other than game related. 

Mods/Vent have killed the Immersion the most for me. 

Wow, I'm glad I happen to see this today. I had no knowledge of SOE starting a classic server. I've been bouncing around games and mmo's for the last year. 

BIg Question is: Will my Troll Shaman have his original Home back? I so hated the fact that SoE gave Frogloks my starting area.

Also will it be the original graphics or the updated. Im referring to when they updated graphics the first time. My Troll when from looking really slovenly and hideous to a "I just got out of Jenny Craig and saw a Chiropractor".

Really looking forward to playing with a really great community and hoping to find some old friends there as well. Maybe I'll get my wife to play as well. 

Hey There,
Looking for a Buddy Pass. Havent tried out FFXIV at all yet. I passed up purchasing a copy at release with so much negative reviews and bad press from the beta's once the NDA was lifted. I really enjoy the FF series and have played them over the last 10years.
I had played FFXI when it first came out for about 6 months and eventually moved on as it didnt offer enough solo content for when I wanted to just be on for an hour or so and some IG friends from EQ had left as well.
I was really looking forward to FFXIV since it seemed to be a little solo freindlier. Dont get me wrong I love to group but sometimes you dont have 3hrs to invest and just want to get something accomlpished in an hour of free time.
Anyway, Looking for a Buddy Pass please. Im really looking for something new to get into. WoW is too bland anymore, done with Aion and even though Rift beta is fun its really nothing new.

Thanks
 

I have been watching the development of FFXIV for over the last year and really steered clear of it after reading so many of the reactions during the beta.

My question is to any current players, is this game worth a try. It looks like I could purchase FFXIV and anticipate at least 2 to 3 free months of play.

Im not a huge fan of the  FF series but I have played numerous console FF and really enjoyed them. I played FFXI  for about a month. I did enjoy it a bit  but found it very difficult to find groups all the time and really grinding leveling.

Thanks  

Im interested in recieving a buddy key. I kind of shy'd away from the game with all the negative feedback that came at its launch. After reading that they are making some changes I am again interested in checking it out. I played FF 11 for a year and have played many of the console rpgs and enjoy the games/story/cutscenes and music.  Send me mail via these forums if you have and are willing to part with a buddy key.

Thanks

Very interested in joining a beta again. Looks to be a great game.

Looking to get into the beta. Heya!

Just downloaded the trial from Fileplanet using their downloader, I have used the downloader many times in the past with little problems. Opened the file and went through the patching and tried to launch the game. Pretty much all I get is the my screens blinking. I does seem like the game is trying to open, I actually saw a login screen.

Im wondering if its because im using two moniters. I am currently running a 21' that I use to play my games and the 17' to surf the web or watch movies while I game. Im running 1680 x 1050 resolution. I am also running Win7 on a Black Edition AMD x4 965.

Any suggestions? Do I need to change my screen resolution for L2 or is it an issue with dual monitors?

I was in beta and played for a few months and have come back a couple different times for a change of scenery and would like to give it another run until Oct. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

Kankan

I'll give you my general opinion of both games.

As for my experience I played AoC at release for about 2 months and ended up leaving after many people I knew left the game. i had a lot of issues with bugs like many, though I never reached end game so I cant comment on that. I went back about a year later to check it out and did see a few changes but not enough to stay and the population seemed low. I have to say that I just came back to AoC as of 3wks ago. After reading a lot of positive posts from different forums and seeing what Funcom had changed and with the new expansion I felt it was a good time to give it a go again.

As for Aion, I played in beta though it was limited. I had a lot going in my life and couldnt give it the test that I usually do with a beta. I didnt feel I had to log on and that gave me a bad feeling ( i mean there was no anticipation of, wow cant wait to log on tomorrow ). Aion released and after it had been out about 3wks I decided to give it a shot really thinking that I wasnt able to give it a fair shake since I had limited time with it in beta.

Aion: I really like the character creation, armors and weapons ( its the same thing that drew me to Lineage 2 ) and the World enviroment in some area's is really great looking. First off my higest toon is 42 Assassin and 37 Templar. So no, I did not participate a lot in the Sieges. But I did get a good feel for the PvP. PvP for me was a blast, sure I had my ass handed to me a lot but thats the only way you get better. it made running from one area to another not so boring because you had to be on the look out for either an Asmo Gank Squad or an opportunity to score some PvP pts. There were a couple of area's were leveling was at a standstill and you had to grind out on mobs or you could grind out on Abyss Quests ( Repeatables ) for Pts. I will say that PvP in the Abyss can suck as a melee, its alot about your level/gear against a casters level/gear and a pita since you cant melee while moving/flying. If you cant close that gap your toast or you better make your retreat for another day.

The game is a grind as far as leveling is concerned. You can not argue that. If you compare the % of the population that is lv 50 against those that are not its a huge gap. If you dont mind it, great. I know some changes are/were made with patch 1.9 and we should see more in 2.0. I canceled my account a month ago and will wait for 2.0 to come out and see what happens. Suppose to be adding more instances and quests in the game to help with the gap during certain levels. I still think that unless they lower the exp needed per Level that really wont matter or they really improve on the quest experience rewarded for quests. Crafting is a Huge Time and Money sink, IMO. My experience is with Armor Crafting. It has made a recipe that is needed to advance from 399 to 400+ almost non-exsistant. I have done over 400 Work Orders hoping to receive this recipe as a reward and I have never seen the recipe for sale. If it was it would be many Million Kinah. So thats 400 x 16k Kinah ( thats the mats for each set of work orders ) I have spent over 6million Kinah. Yea lots of fun.

Besides the Grind, the drops in Instance Dungeons from Boss Mobs is so horrible. You spend 35min to 1hr ( depending on group) and kill the boss and get little to nothing. Usually a crappy Grn Hat  or those crappy stones and some Kinah. This is also suppose to be fixed. Not sure if its 1.9 or 2.0.

AoC: Character creating is also very good. I have to say the World Enviroment wins over Aion. I just love the look of the different enviroments. With the addition of the latest expansion it has helped with leveling/instances/quests for many of those level gaps. I am currently running my lv 30+ Bear Shaman through these new area's and its rather enjoyable. My highest toon is a 70 Barb so I have not been part of any Sieges. I have taken part in the creation of a Clan/Guild Town/Keep. I have to say it is a very cool feature. I havent tried Crafting since returning but did it at release. Major changes to Crafting I had read so many bugs were fixed. I do like the fact that I had made weapons that my toon still uses. Crafting doesnt seem like a huge time sink, sure you have to gather like any other MMO. When compared to my Aion experience of Crafting in AoC seemed a little better.

My experience with leveling solo and in groups is a real difference from my experience in WoW and Aion. Solo in AoC is like any other MMO, not always a lot of fun. What I do enjoy is that it isnt always a  walk in the park. I find my self either needing to retreat or just plain dieing. Really taking the time to figure out a game plan sometimes instead of just running in there like i could in WoW and leveling multiple mobs. With the Combat of AoC if you dont make the best decisions your going to find yourself in trouble. Watch where your mobs are shielded, make sure you position yourself so you can hit multiple mobs with your melee.

I havent put in the same time with AoC that I have with Aion. I still read that there are issues with the Sieges and PvP in AoC. I dont know how true because I havent done them. There is a decent population in both games. AoC is seeing a lot of people returning and some new people. Aion from the server i was on seems to be fine. Always see people on and instances dont seem to be a problem to find groups. Leveling in AoC is a lot easier and is less  time consuming. AoC also gives you a free level every 6 days to use on characters over lv 30. You also get a one time lv 50 toon you pick the class. Saves on leveling one toon to 50 at least. Combat in AoC is much better than in Aion, IMO.

Both games are good games. The bugs at release of AoC was a huge turn off for many, but many things have been changed and added to AoC. Aion is a great game as well. Just a very time consuming game as far as leveling. The rewared for finishing dungeons is horrible and needs to be fixed.  I hope to see the future patches fix that and I will be returning to check them out.

Sorta longer than I wanted but hopes it helps a little.