Depends on the type of player really. Complex can be fun, but also boring. The same could be said about simple.

It's always a debate much like it has been in art and music like with Nirvana to the Beatles.

I can't win, but I want to join the fun! Here is one from a random player submission I loved.

 

I play MUD's when not playing MMO's or I play other genre of games that rock in my opinion like Street Fighter (toss me a PM if you want to play on XBOX Live).

Outside of games, I'm pretty country having lived in North Carolina (Funcom US Offices) all my live, minus a short stop in Oslo, Norway. Thus, I love to fish during my summer days at the lake where I have a boat and Jet Ski's.

I think it depends on what you consider innovative? I mean, some define innovative as taking an existing idea and making it better. Others may consider it as more or less invention where it's a completely new idea.

When you talk about taking something existing and making it better, then most try to take that approach. The main reason for that is because invention is hard to pull off in a game sense. Good example would be a entirely new approach to your user interface. Although it may be something entirely new, the concept may be so unfamilar or foreign to the player because they played MMO's that had similar user interfaces that it actually is unattractive where they don't play the game. Thus, taking an existing idea, making it better can sometimes be a good option to helping keep things on track while being in term, innovative.

One of the things I've noticed over the years is that sometimes innovative approaches are not innovative enough for players to take notice. Game Designers pride on the fine details of their creations when sometimes those fine details are not examined enough by the players who play their games. Using the user interface example again, many players will simply judge the user interface by how it looks rather than how it actually functions at first glance. The innovative aspects of that system may not just be in the looks, but rather in the functionality (the fine details of the system).

But as above, I think it really depends on what you define terms into overall. I'm super oldschool from the MUD days and I've seen a lot of things in my time.

Heya,

I just wanted to mention that your post was not deleted from the forums, it was closed - http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=239612

We do not delete threads from the forums. We may move them to a moderated section depending on the case. Your issue however, like many others relating to private account matters from customer services, are always closed on the official forums. The reason for this is because customer service does not provide in-game or account related support on the official forums. We instead, close threads on support related issues like those to direct matters to support directly. Otherwise, it would just turn into a big venting thread where no resolution can be found other than others chiming in with assumptions from one side of the story (as stated in the forum rules).

I will take a look at this matter tomorrow morning and see what I can do. I did see your emails on the issue and it does seem the policy is to verfy a mistake happened. In this case, the verification of a mistake happening cannot be proven as it was due to lag. Timestamp wise, it's hard to detect lag if they are like it was said, one after the other. However, I can't see why we couldn't assist more with the refund if it's in your inbox either. I will surely check on that because if it's in your inbox, it shouldn't be character bound unless you went and picked up the items on your other character and soul bound them and it was not clarified from our end that's why we can't assist there.

I'll poke ya with your ticket on my findings for you tomorrow EST time.

I support this thread! ;)

Originally posted by Zeblade

Well it does happen with Funcom. I had the same thing happen. I happened to have the EMAIL of my Cancel and yet they started billing me a few months later. My bank was to happy to make sure I got my refund. And the person I talked to..lol EMAIL helped. See what helped me was there was no hack yet I was getting billed and NO ONE every logged into the game. So they new it was their fault.

So OP if you got billed and there was someone logged in and playing and NO password was changed how can FUNCOM know it was not you? You CANT blame them for something like this. I could for no one ever logged in. Sorry

Yepyep, if there is a mistake on our end, we will fix it. Thanks for bringing in that example.

Indeed, but in reference you have less or more to fear account compromises over time with various other games. Thus, policies are a bit different when it comes to character restoration depending on the game. In most cases however, they are the same and we do restored hacked accounts unless something else is funky.

I can understand the frustration for sure. I mean, I don't think anyone is saying your wrong in cases like these. They are more about facts than anything else. I can tell you just from personal experience that anyone will say anything to avoid punishment. I think you can see that from your own gaming experience, everyone is innocent and no one is guilty. However, the GM's still try to be fair when possible and look at all the facts.

But like I said, I'll be happy to look into it further for you. Even if you don't play again, we should be able to find some middle ground in the long run. But if not, I'll make a note of this case to the CS Manager in order to gain some valued feedback in order to improve the process if possible.

Originally posted by rap87

Whelp, part of being fair and equitable is being able to see both sides of the equation.  Funcom here is only seeing the side that supports $'s in their pocket.  A customer is calling within 1 day of this charge being made and making a complaint about unauthorized charge...the timing of this should help the customer's case.  Also, in being able to see your side, if you saw mine we might have been able to say alright we'll charge you $1.5, or something like that.  1 day of logging in for who knows what time doesn't justify a months sub, especially when the authorization is contested.

It's a difficult issue for sure and I can relate to issues like these, but it hurts us in the long run because we have to be fair as well consistent with our policies. Not having you for a customer does more damage than a 1-time payment in that regard. It's hard to stand on that side and say, "supports $'s in their pocket".

On the logging is really where the consistency has to kick in. Looking at it from our side for a moment, we don't offer that type of subscription plan to everyone else. The reason it wasn't an option is because it's not an option for everyone else. You have to remember, where does it end after you? But on the otherhand, I do understand your concern there. If you didn't log in, then who did? That's what's going through the GM's mind most of all I think. Again, moving back to our side there, it's not uncommon for people to trade their accounts away, let friends use them and all of that jive. So in return, it's hard to come to a conclusion on what really happen, even after seeing IP logins.

I'm not trying to point fingers here. I'm just trying to shed some light on why you got the result you received to better help you understand the result. There are many conclusions to consider that neither side, you as the customer, or us as the provider can conclude. It doesn't mean we are intentionally trying to move you away from the game because as above, it does more damage than good.

If there is anything I can do for you, hit me up with a PM and I'll surely look into it further. Or better yet, toss me some feedback on how we can improve the policy better. I'll ensure it gets somewhere, preferably the CS department.

Oh, I guess you did speak to someone afterall.

It's really hard to say. I mean, you have to look at this from our point of view.

1. Someone reactivated your account.
2. Someone logged into the game with your account.

Log into the account page and click on the "Live Chat" icon. You can talk with a customer service representative fairly quickly. It's open 24-7 and all that goodness.

Alternatively, you can email support at account@ageofconan.com

Cheers!

Indeed, too much innovation will leave you with a game and no players. As someone mentioned, there has been a lot of tweeks to the wheel. But, it's the wheel everyone is seeking. If you buy a game and get a piece of wood, then you may be disappointed. It's not what you were looking for and everything feels well -- funny.

It's something a lot of MUD developers faced in the 90's. Many developers were doing crazy innovative things with MUDs. However, their numbers were very small because everything felt so foreign to the players that played MUDs. There was too much innovation -- change -- and things got crazy.

If you ever fall into those discussions about how to do things right. It's mainly because things are done wrong in someones mind. What exactly is right, is what's already been accepted in one players mind. The right thing is not always about being right or wrong -- it's about what's accepted AS right. Acceptance goes hand-and-hand with what's familiar and or proven to be right. Then changing something that's consider right in order to be more innovative (i.e.: taking a different approach to combat for example) could lead you to many discussions on how things are wrong.

Just my 2 cents!

It sounds like the card was flagged for being a fraud. You may have to wait until Monday in order to receive some assistance on that issue. We do offer 24-7 support, but normal GM's will not be able to assist as much on cases where the card may be stolen or being rejected by the bank as a stolen/fraud card. Thus, I would try to see what happens on Monday via email support. If nothing does happen, try live chat again and see if you can get some assistance on the progress.

In most cases where it was just incorrect information, you should be able to correct the info with a fraud specialist. Then everything should be back to normal. :)

If I had the chance to make a sandbox game then I certainly would include SOME degree of direction. However, it would be an option for those who need direction in order to find interesting things to do in-game. I say this because even though the sandbox element is very open in it's core, many players still become bored or lost when it comes to finding things to do. Thus, the direction would act as a supporting role to giving players a push in the right direction that could lead to more open ended content that's true to the sandbox nature. Sort of like a sandbox system on training wheels.

One of the biggest problems I've seen in sandbox games is a lot of freedom and mindsets that are anti-directional. Although you want that open ended feel, you also need to teach players what paths are available to them or even how they can create their own paths. It's important to at least have that direction in the game because it can be very confusing for new users when they first come to the game compared to experience players rolling alts.

Additional rules I would like to see is total FFA with semi-looting or item destructional systems based on some sort of open ended faction system created by the community. The dominate forces of the game would become the dominate factions where you could choose to join one of their factions on character creation for that specific server or shard. As the factions become destroyed and replaced, so would the factions when you create your new characters. Then the factions themselves would be hard-capped at 3 to 5 like how the top political parties are in the USA.

That's all I have for now.

Originally posted by Talin

One key area I think is missing is the addition of social-based activities outside of combat. Concepts such as gambling (allowing characters to sit down at a tavern and play dice, cards, darts, etc with their hard earned gold), tournaments (jousting, archery, etc), performance that provides benefits/amusement (remember SWG's dancing/musician system), and other non-combat reasons/mechanisms to encourage social interaction.

Add in some type of farming/pet raising/etc system that encourages periodic (but not necessarily extensive) logging in to maintain/grow something in conjunction with a robust crafting system.

Look at what people love about social online games and integrate them into a MMO to provide an ever deeper experience that transcends dungeon crawling and dragon slaying (while also including those, of course!).

I might help to know that things like gambling or activities that lead to gambling can cause serious issues for the developer or publisher due to the laws around the world. It can also increase the rating applied to the game and cause more conflict on who can purchase and play your games. This applies for all major gaming markets around the world that have certain restrictions and guidelines on the type of content in games.

The developers have already said that new PvP content was on the way. No one has stopped focusing on PvP content at all. Thus, more details to follow.

Originally posted by Riceman

After wading through 18 pages of a discussion on why MMORPGs are "dying," I decided to write a post on what I think the requirements are to make an MMORPG worthy of becoming a hobby instead of just a game.

It became so long that instead of posting it here, I've posted it on my blog. I'd love to hear your thoughts, since it was originally intended to spark a discussion on these forums.

http://www.manatrance.com/2010/an-mmorpg-worthy-of-a-hobby

I'll give  you some industry input if you want. It may give you more to think about for the big picture stuff.

I think a lot of people jam all hardcore players into one category. You see it a lot in discussion with hardcore versus casual players. You got to ask yourself what is really hardcore? One hardcore player may strongly disagree with everything you said where another one agrees with it completely. The point however, is that each segment has their own version of hardcore and casual players. For example, just because a game is PvE doesn't mean there are no HARDCORE players (for those who think hardcore only refers to PvP players). The same applies for those who prefer consensual PvP to non-consensual PvP.

I know it wasn't just on the hardcore player subject, but you didn't define why that's hardcore in wargaming either. To me, I know a lot of people who do things like that as a hobby and they do it maybe once a week. To me, that's very casual and not hardcore at all. Hardcore is someone who is always at the hobby shop playing the games they love to play. I know it's hard to think about it like that, but just because they play a game that very few play doesn't mean they define into hardcore players.

The bit on solutions to fix killing monsters was good. However, it's not really a solution to a problem per say. Solutions refer to things that are broken and there is nothing broken with what some may consider the norm. It's just a matter of taste or opinion on how to diversify something to being more attractable to someone else. It's always good to hear it regardless, but it doesn't mean it's a solution either -- just another flavor to the meat.

Adding on to that subject, adding cool mechanics like you mentioned are very hard. You may have good experience with those epic boss encounters in X-man dungeons, but there is a good reason why the bosses are pretty unique. It's really easy to come up with cool new things for NPC's to do in-game, but not that easy to implement because of time, resources or tech (what your tools can do). You always got to remember that the more detail you add, the less time you may have for other things like immersion, new systems and etc.

I personally love to impact the gameworld. I love being able to change something and leave my mark. A lot of games do support mechanics that allows players to do so. However, a lot of players do hate the idea of others impacting their world. You can see this on the basic harassment issues in a common online game. If one player is annoying another player then they may not like it and report said player. The same will apply to actions you feel are good and it's always a debate before games are made on how much impact players will have on the world, other players and of course themselves. Good reference here: if other players could control who raids, then you may have some big issues as opposed to how other games present it. This is mainly because some players want to experience content instantly without anyone stopping them where others may accept it because players control the content.

In closing, don't take this as a bunch of cons to retort the article. I think it's all good stuff, but you have to also remember that games appeal to specific people. There are some good reasons on why things are not done and some not so good reasons on why some things don't get done. All in all, it's all about how you approach it and make a kickass game! :)

Originally posted by Yamota

Haters gonna hate? What a bunch of nonsense. Gamers dont like some games because they are no good, not the entire genre in itself.

You see alot of us gamers were around before WoW arrived and hijacked the genre and before greedy P2P game developers flooded the market with cheap WoW ripoffs. So dont assume we dont like the genre, we dont like all the garbage that is being released in the genre.

F2P was out before WoW though. The first major announcement was in 1999 when Everquest was launched. Other than that, you have pay-to-play and micro-transaction text based games that were doing well. You also had gamer shops all around the world that allowed D&D campaigns, Magic The Gathering games and etc. Hobby Shops are your modern day free-to-play models where caffeine and sugar were your virtual items on top of selling D&D books, MTG packs and so on. It's free to play, but they hope you buy something in the store while you play.

Originally posted by Vespers

Famine, is there a particular reason that Funcom doesnt let players instantly reactivate their accounts and begin playing AOC once the player places his credit card information into the system?
I have played the majority of Western MMOs and a few Eastern/Asian MMOs and Funcom is the only one that I have encountered that doesnt allow for instant reactivation once the players credit card information is given.
Is it that Funcom needs to manually activate each account after they manually verify each credit card?
I have heard from other players that it may take anywhere from 1 hour to reactivate their account to as many as 5 or 6 days to reactivate the accounts.

A company is only as good as it's weakest link and for Funcom, that would be the billing dept and customer service depts. Perhaps focusing of improving these 2 areas would help AOC a great deal more than developing an expansion.

Sure, because it can be abused. For example, if you enter in your billing information and it's not verified on both ends (ours and your banks). Then it could lead to users entering in false information to merely play the gamefor a few days until it's frozen. That will allow bots and all sorts of bad news into the game without being able to pay for the services they were signing up for. In the long run, it can allow players to gain free access while we are stuck with the bill (bandwith usage, server usage etc cost money to maintain).

It's very possible that accounts could be frozen due to a bug in our system. But, we maintain a large amount of users as a MMO. When you look at the trend or average subscription many customers are able to enter their information, pay for the game and have no issues while doing so. Thus, it's always safe to bet that it's something on your banks end (or however you're paying to play the game).  However, we will look at all ends to ensure it's indeed not something with our billing software.

In most cases, it's something on the banks end because it makes no sense on why we would deny new or existing business on accounts in good standing (not banned or temporarily suspended) unless it's a bug.

You have to keep in mind that not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Yes, some players will enjoy the game or the theme of the game a lot more than you do. It doesn't mean they are right or wrong and that you are right or wrong in your opinions. It's always easier to remember that everyone enjoys a game for their own reasons. Not every player is the same because otherwise, it would be that much easier for developers to please everyone when no one has 100% approval rating across the board on their changes.

You also can't easily dismiss other players opinions because they simply disagree with you. If you state something one way and everyone under the sun states something another way. Then it could be hard to not sway towards the majority when it comes to beta testing the game. The point of the community is to talk about your findings or feedback with everyone. The input gained there can be useful, but it's not the end of all resource for tweaking the game. For example, if you post how the food tastes and you  get flamed by 30 players saying they simply love the game. Then you shouldn't worry at all about the reactions as much because that's very subjective. The food tastes different to everyone and sure, those who love the food will always tell you that you're freaking crazy. It doesn't make your opinion any less valid to the developer.

Beta's in general can be a real pain in the ass when they hit that open state. It's not easy for the developers to filter thousands upon thousands of bug reports or feedback from the community. Those developers who actually implement bug reporting systems in their games have to deal with 10x more. We're talking about reports in all types of language styles and duplications on issues from beyond the grave. Thus, you should also bear in mind that beta's for developers can be blood-sucking mind-numbing processes where they are trying their best to consume your input and make it happen.

In closing, most developers do have smaller more focus beta phases that are considered closed beta's. The beta's where they focus test on a much smaller scale leading up to the big beta phases. But, when you're talking about MASSIVELY multiplayer online games -- nothing is easy!