Interesting - I've not thought about it recently, but I do that, too. In fact, I purposely choose appearances for my character inappropriate to what the character's role is. For example, a muscular caster, a puny tank or a grossly overweight thief.

Alternatively, I go with the opposite sexual identity - a muscular female warrior or a hyper-puny male caster.

Edit: Thanks, cyrana - that's going in my bibliography. :)

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Originally posted by Ilvaldyr
True, a choice is always demanded. I would suggest that gender neutrality would be to mirror ones own; i.e. make no preferential choice, but to subconsciously default to ones own gender without thinking.

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@Ilvalydr:
You're right, the avatar is being sexualised either way. Although, when you're making a character, and you are faced with having to choose male of female, isn't the sexualisation of the character being forced on you, either way? I mean, unless you have a gender neutral choice, or unless you can customize your character's looks to the point where it's impossible to tell which gender the character is, you have to make a choice of preference - complete indifference to the character would result in not playing the game at all, no?

@disownation:
Agreed, for the most part - it takes two to tango. See below. :)

@Sensai:
Agreed, but the thing is, it's not just an interaction between pixels. In fact, it's only minimally an interaction between pixels, as the interaction between two game objects is limited to those defined within the game rules. When you start interacting with someone on a level deeper than stat points and spec trees, it becomes, for some, an important issue as to the sexual / gender identity of the person you're interacting with. For example, if I played a female and didn't tell you I was male, you might have assumptions about me based on my presumed gender identity. Further, if I withheld my true sexual identity from you, I may be guilty of unintentionally giving you a false perception of the nature of our interaction. As to the former, your sexualisation of the situation would cause negative feelings on both parts, as I know I wouldn't like to have anything thrust on me simply because of my sex. As to the latter, I'm sure that neither of us would like that situation, from your 'omg you're a guy?!' to my 'omg you wanted to what?!'! Really, until everyone in the world stops associating traits and expectations with sex and sexual identity, the issue of sexual identification in-game will remain a widely debated one.

@silverreign:
I don't think that this thread is fail. There is an abundance of reasons why males would make female characters, and some of them are even valid! You don't speak for all men, mate. :) Although, I happen to agree with you - I've never made a female character, except for when I was trying to convince my wife to play with me, or even play at all!

And, I think that the hyper-sexualized female toons are more a result of the image of females with which the media presents us than they are a result of men being perverts. Let's just agree to leave imposed gender identity out of this, 'kay? lol

@Ilvaldyr:
It's valid for him, in any case. My mate's primary stat is charisma, and it's part of his self-identity to like the ladies, as he's very good at attracting them. His reason for playing female characters is an attraction towards the female form, not a repulsion from the male one. Further, he plays to play, not to date, so his in-game gender is ultimately inconsequential.

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Originally posted by Vhaln
Think it comes down to a difference of intersocial personalization - is my character supposed to represent ME, or is it just a character I'm controlling?

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That still implies that you care what gender other players are. Why? What difference does it make?

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Y'know, I remember back when Darkfall was rated fairly high. This was because the Darkfall community was spamming the rating system - I know, I was one of them. Darkfall's current state is due to all those who left when the game was released, due to not finding what they were looking for. In their disappointment, many, many of them came back here and changed their rating. Again, I know - I was one of them.

Whether Darkfall's current rating reflects the state of the game or the state of the community, I don't know. I do know, however, that there are likely very few botnets dedicated to voting this game down, which means that the majority of those downvotes represent the opinions (informed or otherwise) of actual people.

Personally, if I could put up a big 'do not play' sign on any game, it would be Darkfall. It's the kind of game where either those who have absolutely no real life reign supreme (which is a huge draw for addicts) or those who partake in RME / account sharing to have a character being trained 24/7 benefit most.

It's like Tibia, but not as cute.

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Originally posted by Sensai
I really dont get the logic behind labeling people who dislike men playing females toons as young.  Its even more absurd to opine its due to sexual insecurity.  You dont like men pretending to be women so by default you are insecure?  That's some impressive pop psychology.  My experience is the exact opposite.  Its usually the kiddies playing the scantly clad elf with assets that bounce when they jump. 

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And regarding females playing male avatars, in my 8+ years of mmorpg experience, all of the females that I have encountered playing male avatars have done so to avoid harrassment.  I think thats very understandable.  Ive never met or heard of a female playing a male avatar for "kicks."  While Im sure there are some, its nothing like the flip side.

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Yet, the golden rule still holds true: Everyone is a guy until they prove otherwise in vent.

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That's OK. Really, I wouldn't expect you to understand.

Did I say social status? Did I say age? No. I said priorities and commitments. Your priorities and commitments match those of who you play with.

Specifically, your priorities and commitments are primarily game-related, when you're playing. Those who are adults and have spare time (ie/ unhappy housewives) and those who are outcasts from RL society (ie/ the overweight and grossly unattractive) use the game world as an escape. This escape involves pretending that the game world and game rules, while they're playing, matter more than other things, such as a happy marriage, weight loss and/or grooming. In fact, you outlined it fairly clearly for me!

"From experience which I've stated repeatedly already these wankers and wackjobs get into groups and start babbling about their stupid lives."

Stupid because it doesn't apply to the game, your class or your ability to out-dps or out-heal whatever it is you're fighting. Stupid, perhaps, because you yourself lack any semblance of life to talk about.

It's only by discarding the priorities of the people you prefer to ignore that you can make yourself feel happier, even for a little while.

Also, reverse psychology is when I say "You could never have a real life, because you're a loser" in an attempt to get you off the computer. I'm not doing that.

What I am doing is saying that you should live it up while you can, before real life comes along and takes away all your free time. I'm also giving you a reason why your opinion as it applies to the female gaming population is grossly misinformed - namely because the percentage of the gaming population you deem worthy to play with is relatively small.

Your opinion is valid from your point of view, I disagree with it and the above is why. If you don't want people to disagree with your opinion, I advise not posting it on a forum.

I hate to interject here, Skarwolf, but I think that your closeted, bigotry-ridden post could use a fact injection.

By what token do you think, genuinely, that the majority of females (or, at least, female avatars) playing MMOs are 'unhappily married fat bored housewives seeking attention'? Might it, perhaps, be that the aforementioned kind of person is simply the kind which, in your past adventures, you encountered most often? Don't you think that it's a little ridiculous of you to assume that your experience is the standard?

Look, without getting into a long rant here, and without getting into the nitty gritties of sociology and user profile patterns, the people you tend to meet and group with are usually those that fit your play style, yes? That means that if someone has short play times or continually goes AFK - y'know, to deal with RL stuff - you're going to consider them inconsequential, boot 'em and forget 'em. Their playstyle (and, by extension, lifestyle) is not compatible with yours. And, y'know what? That's ok! By way of metaphor, if a really hot, truly bone-able chick wasn't into you because her brother had first dibs, you wouldn't want a piece of that, anyway, as not only is her lifestyle incompatible with yours, your lifestyle is also incompatible with hers!

My point? That MMO players tend to hang with their own. Your group mates, the ones you like, who provide you with a positive playing experience, are likely those whose priorities (and, by extension, real life commitments) match your own. What this means in a nutshell is that if you find yourself grouping with 'unhappily married fat bored housewives seeking attention', their social state is most likely a reflection of your own. Again, no judgements here, I know that if I didn't have a wife, I'd be playing for hours at a time. However, if I were you, I'd think twice about casting aspersions upon those whose play style matches my own.

 Indeed.  They're using Cartman's marketing example.

"We have this awesome game here, but YOU CAN'T PLAY IT!"

I don't understand why it's so important that everyone agrees with the OP or, for that matter, disagrees with the OP.

If you like Darkfall, go play it. You probably think Runescape was a legitimate game, too. Before Runescape, you likely played UO, if you're old enough. These games are unique in that they cater to a specific subset of the MMO community. If Darkfall was meant to be a game for the masses, it would look like WoW, or WAR. It clearly doesn't, ergo it is clearly not. The feature list (which is not to be confused with a clear description of the game) is geared towards those who enjoy what is basically a persistent, online version of Mount & Blade, an equally lackluster release.

But, you know what? It's a good thing that there are fanboys that latch on to a vague hope that a release might be everything the MMO community is looking for. These companies are poking at the uteral wall of game design, trying to find the birth canal of innovation & spawn the next greatest MMO the world has ever seen. Sure, we might end up with a couple of still births. We might end up with a few terminations.

...I'm gonna stop with the birth metaphors now.

My point is that in the end, the MMO genre which we know and love is strengthened by these companies' experimentation. And these companies need money to experiment - this is where the fanboys come in. I'm sure you've heard of experimental titles like The Graveyard and Endless Forest. While these titles may not be your cup of tea, they're making interesting strides down the paths of story telling and social interaction.

So, leave the fanboys be. Let little jimmy sink his birthday money into a copy of Darkfall. It's either that, or he gives his money to Blizzard.

Lastly, @ the people who are whining because they're getting warnings from the mods, try being constructive in your criticisms of Tasos & Darkfall. At the very least, try saying why you believe Tasos is lying. It's all in the Rules of Conduct, handily linked at the top of every post you make.

A game whose major feature involves circling your foe and spamming your regular attack does not, to me, an immersive game make, no matter how your character is built.

That, and the graphics make me want to purge the jelly beans which I am no enjoying very, very much, thank you - so you can imagine how far purging is from my preferred course of action.

Anyhow. No matter how idealistic an image comes to mind when you imagine a game incorporating all those features, all that the game really is, is a group of people circle-trapping & click spamming regular attack on NPCs, and when they're fully geared, they head off to PvP. When they die, they go back to circling the mob.

No to mention, of course, that a large portion of the interface is web-based & horribly implemented (really, browser based guild management, from in-game only?).

I'm glad you're enjoying the game, though. Small companies need our support more than ever in today's troubling economic climate.

Fantastic news!

Darkfall Online's release date has been announced!

As of January 22nd, 2009, the Realm of Kirdain will be playing Darkfall Online! Will you?

Hi, all!

Another update from your favorite Kirdain recruiter!

Beta Tester Reports - Straight from the horses' mouth, how the game plays!
MMORPG Italia Review - There is an english translation, but I think the screenshots speak for themselves.

If you're at all interested, or if you just enjoy FPS games with a degree of reality, check out those links; I promise they won't bite. And, as always, if you're looking for a great crew to play with, click my sig image. :)

Just an update for you good folk;

Nov 11 2008 - Beta has begun.

I'm still trying to spread the good word (recruiting or not), as the larger the initial population is, the better. However, if you're eager to try this game out, at least, and want to have something to do other than run around killing/being killed, pop on over to Kirdain forums and join up. We'd love to have you as a member long term, but failing that, we could certainly find a way to make your trial action-packed. :)

As the second of two dedicated clan recruiters, you can reach me at wizen.trygg@live.com, PM me here, or over at the Kirdain forums at http://www.realmofkirdain.com/forums/.

Great, more crap to fill the toilets of the internet.  Be warned;  If you subscribe to Ankama's game, and then try to unsubscribe from their annoying frenglish letters, they won't take you off their mailing list.  I beta'd this junk, and it's not worth your time.