What ever the numbers turn out to be, the tools to make quests could be pretty fun in effect.

My worry is more to the point that a new star wars mmog is around the corner. Is this game even going to be around after that.

I mean it has low pops now on every server. only 2 toons per server sucks  really bad. and many bugs remain in many of the quests, from npcs shooting through floors and cave walls to stuck mobs in rocks and buildings. not to mention driving around and having a building spawn, or finally load and you get stuck inside it cause the server is lagging behind.

I have been looking at the steam release of the games complete set but  with the above issues, i left worried id be wasting my time.

Been in the scene for about 14 years.

Got into exclusive testing of AAA titles for about ten years

Microsoft Game Studios Beta Tester

Tested for SOE titles

Atari beta testing program

and Activisions Visioneer program

after Activision shut down the team we formed betafreaks.

Located here www.betafreaks.com

Ive been doing game reviews here since 2004. Not for mmorpg.com but through the review panel. I don't have the patience to apply as a writer, though ive seriously thought about it. But since ive had children ive all but stopped testing and writing.. its been over a year since ive done much of any writing.

So whom to whom i am, im just another gamer that gave a bad review another shot and enjoyed myself.

So in short, to you im nobody, to others who knows. It depends on if you've traveled the scene as much as i have. The internet is a big big place.

I loaded up a buddy key for FE. i haven't played since beta.

SO far the only issue that's bugging me about the game since beta is the 10 meter melee attacks from a rat. or any melee based nps or human.

i haven't seen that type of crap in an mmog in like 3 or so years. i mean i could see 4m swing range but 10+ meters is a long ass way.

Thats like standing at the free throw line on a basketball court and a guy under the rim and hes beating your ass with a butter knife. Dont make no sense and for me its ugly and breaks the immersion aspect of the game.

That and no real physics to speak of for anything. Dont care at all for the way factions are implimented, nor city taking mechanics. Im a huge nut when it comes to this type of game mechanic.

That aside. i can set my own pace to play, the quests rock, the storyline pulls you in ( and i hardly ever worry about storyline in games), people are really enjoyable to play the game with. Excellent designed graphics for what the game is about. Always something to do and look forward to do. I have two kids and i can relax and play the game and tend to them when the need arises without worrying much about missing something.

The games devs have alot of wiggle room for the future if they can afford to keep the game running with only 100 players playing at once.

AT least 100 when i did the " /who " ingame.

Im really thinking about buying the game from the FE website. Its a great game that could only get better. And is great for gamer parents if you can overlook some of the mentioned flaws.

The game could use a respec system, not limited but all the time functional... why not. it doesnt hurt anything.

Or a redesign to the ap system. to a if you do it you gain in it system. This will help to stop the feel like you have to grind the ap missions, For the stats and the skills.

Yea ill throw my support behind these devs, as long as they keep fighting the good fight and push the bar forward.

***Quite hatter****

I did a 360 on the game sure but i thought id give it a fair go this time around. (grins).

PC Gamer.... anyhow..

yea,  i just really think it had to be off hours i mean, not much air combat at all, just a few planes and only a few tanks on the biggest attack/defend mission on the map. i played for a good 4 hours but only found a handful of allied troops to do mission with. Definitely doable but even the resistance was only a max of 6 guys and i had what at the most on any mission  or battle 11-13 against the same numbers. We only had the pop to do one AO at a time, leaving one active while we did the first, then the second.

The chatter about the pops wasnt much better so this is an issue thats folks have been seeing go through the motions for  some time now.

The games great. still has some issues on how the game handles fps and sync issues with infantry fighting when your in close as itsa always had, i mean i was worried because i got a pretty darn good system

gforce 285 gtx 1gig

quadcore q6600

4 gig ram

vista 64

680i mobo

12mb broadband connection

i got like 16-40 fps in the bigger battles, but in  close with enemy infantry my movements would get all wobbly and guys were semi warping around. Like they use to. 20-30 feet away everything works as it should.. You shoot a guy he died no sync lag.

Thats the engine of the game and its age and how it handles players in such a close proximity to each other with different internet speeds, it cant find a common ground. Im sure i was warping around to him just as much as he with me. But he had a smg and i a rifle so he sprayed and i got a single round off. Im hoping they are addressing these types of issues in the next patch, for if not then its not really worth the time to even think about playing. Or you can just live with these shortcomings and enjoy the rest of the game, and the rest of the game is quite fun, even though there are the horizontal aiming issues like rounds hitting  30 from you and you blowing up or dieing. cause the engine was drawing the animation wrong and the round actually hit you but you didnt receive it correctly...

Anyhow ill check the game out again after the 1.31 patch.

Buffs and crowd control spells in pvp. Poor city layouts and sorry broken siege mechanics.

Full loot drop without a good crafting system to cover my losses. poor company support. And hacking...\

edited to add

Mouse click movement and targeting.

scam cash for item shops.

hrmm so far hooked up a trial sub, not many people playing anymore.  off hours... maybe, but it doesnt sound like it from others i asked about it. guess ill wait and check the game out again after 1.31 gets released. Bummer im bored as hell.

I loaded up the game and played offline to get use to playing.

I noticed alot of changes. First the keysettings are in for mouse or controller. That is a big big plus.

The ground troops feel like something has changed, it feels more crisp and less wabblie. Is this just me?

I am on a new built pc made by myself.

I run a quadcore intel cpu do i need to turn on sse ext... to get the full power capability from my cpus in game?

How is the pop, a ball park is ok i can judge from there.

Yea ive been looking forward to the 1.31 release since i sat down and really looked over the previews and vids.

Even looking over the website ive noticed many changes since ive last played.

Ive been playing off and on since 2006 but i havent played since jan of this year.

I quit because i got pissed that  German High Command was listening into Allied High Command chat. Countering long range spec ops bridge destruction missions i was running alone. Every mission i went on or was directed to go on had the same damn guy in a pzr waiting for me... some missions took 20 min to drive to. So i got frustrated and quit.

It sucks that the enemy side can have a trial account sitting somewhere logged in to the allies side monitoring intel...

I realize this is something CRS cant control currently..Unless they track the IP of every client logged in. But then again you blackball couples playing through a router.. I dont know it just didnt seem fair at the time. Like a legal cheat. And at the time we had issues with people cheating so it just added to the flames.

I hear that alot of these issues are squashed, i mean there will still be intel monitoring but the cheats are something you dont see anymore. I can live with that.

Originally posted by Label_This

CoD games have the biggest community of hackers of any other online game. So you can expect a wealth of wallhacks, aimbots and many other cheats to be available for anything EA releases.

Really, i mean really... You have never played Call of Duty in your life have you.

(Grabs the soap box from Label_This)

  "Get off the stage!  Booo Boooo! "

Originally posted by gtnbtfte

Urm what made you think they made me 'upset' or anything like that? I didn't buy the game, I am playing dragon age on PC and loving every minhttp://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3221540/postAction/reply/quote/trueute and still have CoD4 on my PC in case i want a good shooter. Also BC2 is looking good for the PC but we'll see.

I was just giving my opinion about a possible CoD mmo and the way that the company treats the PC community. That's all.

 

EDIT: as for hoping that Tryarch will bring the game back to the PC crowd, nobody knows for sure, but I highly doubt it will stray from the company policy. That is, the PC market isn't worth making even a decent port and the game will sell bazillions on consoles either way.

Like i said i was disappointed too, i mean i was looking forward to the possibilities  alot of the features  in a multiplayer setting.

When i read the press release i nearly chucked my desk chair into my monitor... I preordered it and told my wife to cansel it.

then after searching the net and reading all the petition posts.. i  got discused with the community..

They demanded this and demanded that and dog Activision for this and that  blah blah blah i was like its just one damn game... and let it go.

Im not harpin on you  or your opinion, thats why i didnt quote you when i made my comment. Your view is yours and wasnt in poor form. Others may not be so humble.

All im saying is it could have been worse, and that is we could have loaded the game up and found these issues after paying the full price for the game.

If that was the case i would be at best buy with a new box on the counter saying something like rca monitor or something, and my wife bitching  about me getting so angry all the time... and that lasts longer then a few weeks.

Yea but the same argument was raised when cod 3 hit and was a console only release, with modern warfare 2 they went and released it for pc too this time. But we all know its a console port in everyway.

I didnt buy it for that fact. i mean 9v9 didnt do it for me. Ill wait for the next cod game to get released by teyarch, if its like mw2 then i wont buy it, and yes it will piss me off, almost as much as mw2's console port idea did.

I was mad and still am but one game is not the end of the world for me, its just pixels and Activision has treated me to some excellent play time in the other titles that are marked Call of Duty.

I really have no reason to hold a grudge. They released info on the MW2 before it was released, folks  got to choose if they wanted those features for the price or not, i didnt so i didnt buy plain and simple.

I didnt run to a petition site and cry like a fricking school girl that Activision took my cookie, they didnt. I lost nothing at all.

They didnt promise you anything and they told you what they were doing before they released the game. So im not getting where the foul was made and how they screwed the whole pc community.

Common sense told you after reading the feature release that it was made for console first then ported to pc.

Hell folks act like the world owes them something just because they own a damn pc.

News flash it doesnt,  get over it. Game on!!

Originally posted by Vaske1984

-I think we have enough garbage mmofps games.....why cant they just leave CoD like it is (sigle player) its really awesome game....dont ruin it by turning it into mmo.....why the heck every game need to be mmo jeez....

? What  do you mean enough mmofps games? We have 2

Planetside and ww2online thats it the rest are 3d chat lobbies with instanced multiplayer maps that you pay for or pay for items in a scam shop...

Originally posted by Rulero

 The Cod franchise has been a downfall in the shooter genre since cod 2.  the game introduced a feature that imo destroyed the whole shooter genre. and that is health regen. this feature takes away any tactic or caution. as you can always hide behind a wall and recover. many games took this over. and it spreads itself like a virus. 

The problem with the new generation masses is that they almost only want realistic settings in a shooter. but not realistic gameplay. they want explosions , and more of the hollywood stuff. and that closed the door for Oldschool shooter fans. who liked Quake. unreal. and doom like games and for realistic shooter fans who like the old rainbow six. and swat games.  it got a bit of both genres.  but its not loved by oldschoolers nor realistic fans. and those 2 genres are long dead. there are some exceptions like Arma 2. and ut3 but the skill cap between the masses and the original community is big. and the masses do not seem to have the patience. to learn a real FPS.

and thats why they play cod.  perks. health regen. and grenade counters. just a few things that shows how shooters are these days

the games are. linear. have invicible walls. trys to be dramatic but arent and so on.  i have no problem with people playing it.

but i don get the fuzz.  i do not mind linearity or generic gameplay but why do these games recieve a 10 or 9 on sites..  thats for games that raise the bar in a genre or set a standard.  not a generic shooter thats 13 in a dozen..  yes the games are polished i agree.  but its not revolutionary. 

a cod mmo is pure marketing. wich is smart ofcourse. people buy it ofcourse

but in my opinion. it will suck and i dont want it to infect the mmo genre

Yea i was a big deta force fan when novalogic was a sombody. And i didnt like the health regen and the radar and granade icon  either. They implimented a Hardcore server option that removed most of that.

The hp regen grew on me the more i played. And it wasnt so bad, you got a red screen you couldnt aim hardly and if someone farted near you you died. And the more i think about it its cool since in the old games you could get hit and still aim and play just fine with a quarter hp. even arma2 you get shot you fall over bleeding if not dead and a corpsman can come flip you over and your on your feet. gunning like nothing ever happened.

Call of duty just kept the action going  kept it hectic and keeps campers at bay, though its still possible to camp. And they killed the bunny hoppers..

Originally posted by denshing

Originally posted by Omali

 Call of Duty's gameplay + WW2 Online's massive persistant world = Cash machine.

I would so play that.

 

It would be more like guildwars campaign where you form up a group and do a certain part of the missions for story mode. The only difference from the normal call of duty multiplayer is that you will have virtual spaces to stage before you set out into each chapter. PVP would be more like..... Think Huxley/Global agenda...

Activision will not by any means be making anything like WW2 onlines world. I know this because A: It's activision, these guys practically invented the term, "Following industry standards"... I mean, I accept and fully understand that MMORPG's are big business in the industry, but as it stands, what a current "MMOFPS" is being defined as, I don't feel the worth in putting monthly payments down for.

No matter how good call of duty's gameplay is, in a MMOG setup, the fact is, it would just be another call of duty game with a few more freedoms. Activision is just again, poking it's head into mainsteam marketing by following suite with all the other guys who are attempting to make MMOFPS...

Notice how almost no MMOFPS ever existed, then all of a sudden in what? The last year or so? You start hearing about MMOFPS projects. First it was Tabula rasa supposedly, then Huxley's announcement, then global agenda, then crimecraft which has already failed to give a purpose to having a large empty city to roam..

All these MMOFPS trends are complete and utter fails because they are going the route of insanely heavy instancing. There will be no dynamic exploration, and all it will be is a regular single/multiplayer shooter with virtual lobbies and purchasable outfits/customization/xp slapped on.

I hope planetside 2 doesn't do this. Because IMO, I'm much happier off just playing a deticated server hosted FPS with no monthly than one that barely goes beyond that. The only true MMOFPS that I accept as true MMOFPS are WWII online and Planetside. And I prefer planetside as it's easier to get thrown into the action.

In regards to those so called mmofps games you mentioned..

Those are scams plain and simple. And i see you basically agree later in your post.

Just because a company takes a single player  fps and throws in a 3d lobby doesnt make it a mmo  at all.  so they fail before the first year mark hit why... cause people arnt that stupid// sure a few are, but those are the few that go play these f2p games and spend money on these cash shops instead of going and playing a sub based game with all the features..

Crack kills yet people still smoke it.  Would you? Id bet no why? Cause your not that stupid. But some people are but not enough.

Activision isnt  your run of the mill scam company. Every call of duty game was crisp and clean out of the gate. The story lines were epic. As of late infinity Ward has been focusing on heavy story line releases as Treyarch has big big focus on the multiplayer experience.

Call of Duty has always followed its own path and it blazed it. Its the best selling series ever for pc. Enough for EA to call Call of duty its rival publicly. But we have always known EA and Activision were rivals. And EA couldnt buy them out. ( I bet that pissed them off a ton).

I didnt buy codmw2 cause it was mainly made for the console, ill wait for Treyarchs release and i know it will be epic for multiplayer gaming as World At War was..

I cant sell Treyarch short though cause COD WAW had a really epic story. Hell i cried a little after the air battle chapter, thinking of how real people in ww2 may have felt living the very chapter i just fought. it was a seriously epic chapter in the game.

I know for a fact how Activision feels about the call of duty IP and the series, I was a member of the Activision Visioneer testing team. a exclusive team that ran ten years testing game after game  for Activision.

Now whats left of us is located here at

www.betafreaks.com

Planetside and WW2 online in the Call of duty world...

No it wont be instanced, nor small maps... it will be a full world model.

Finally some real competition to planetside and ww2online.

And blizz/activision will be behind it so you know it wont be abandoned like SOE did  with Planetside.

Im not sure how WW2online will fair with this release, that game has been around for a long  long time. And they have the largest single world map in any mmorpg ever made to date. ( eve holds the biggest space maps).

Most of us that have been in the scene have known about the possibility of call of duty online from previous comments from Activision. The  one before this was what a year ago..

Ive been looking forward to seeing just what and how they will handle  this undertaking since i first heard about it.

For those that think its not possible that  the lag would kill the game etc etc...

WW2Online has been doing it for decade with no issues. Now with a modern engine and the tech in modern pcs this is no issue.

I could see hit location dmg, crisp movements on the ground and in the air, hoping the sea also.. as weve seen in all of Call of duties titles.

In ww2online every vehicle has a ton of hit locations that do a number of things from knocking a wheel off a panny or a truck, to detracking a tank.

with my modern self built pc i can turn up all the fun graphics and never lag with my comcast broadband connection.

So i can expect a modern day call of duty title to run just as smoothly, and so can you with constant support.

I dont own nor play on a console for any games... my wife likes them.

But  the PS3 is way way more powerful then the 360. If there are mmos to be played on both id go with ps3 for this reason alone.

Microsoft built a system that can be replaced after a few years to cash in on it, ps3 was built to last much much longer hence the tech that was included in it. It was revolutionary and still is in comparison to anything in a pc or in a console. Problem is that game devs arnt making use of that kind of power yet since they  want to make games for both systems for the payday.

Plus the online component for ps3 is free, and microsofty charges you on top of buying the title of your choosing.

I know the hate folks feel for SOE on the pc but the console is another story . They really went all out on the ps3 and took a loss so that folks could afford buy the system and buy the games. They make their loss up with the games... Plus the blueray player is nice. Try buying one for the pc and it will cost you .

I do use a 360 controller for my pc i really like the feel of it compared to the Playstation design. Its more comfortable.

My 2 cents.

Originally posted by tro44_1

Originally posted by Kenaoshi

Originally posted by Axehilt

Originally posted by Kenaoshi

Cause they dont wanna please their few diehard fans, they want to bring the large part of the cake of non-rpggamers by making acessible games with no chalenge and grindy tasks (rep,gear...). 

 

Games people like instead of games a tiny minority likes?  Sounds suspiciously successful.

 

Sure thing.

Thats why you,me and all ppl here will have to wait a long time till ppl get burned out with these spoonfeeding games start enjoing a lil more chalenging thing.

And as the other Ryun said: "Successful doesn't mean that it is better" mr Mcdonalds my be succesful stealing money form other countries, but is not a healthy food =)

Thats a bad example. I dislike this McDonald comparsom.
 

McD may not be healthy, but it taste great, which is why people continue to eat it.

And Unlike a P2P MMORPG, McD doesnt have to charge their costumers by the month just for eating a Big Mac, after they done brought it.

Theres three and a possible fourth things that will be on the earth long after man is dead and gone .

1) cockroaches

2) styrofoam

3) Mc' Donalds french fries

4) (wild card) twinkies

Off topic yes my bad mickey d's came up so...

Originally posted by jaxsundane

Originally posted by Wardrop

Originally posted by Nightbringe1

Originally posted by tro44_1

Originally posted by vladww

Originally posted by tro44_1
 

Why havnt any company made a Newer Updated UO sandbox mmorpg game?

Dont you wonder this as well?

 

Darkfall Online

 

Then why so much hate? What does UO allow that DF doesnt?

 

People today are more jaded.

They take things for granted today that none of the old MMO's even dreamed of when they launched, they get pissed when the new games do not have that functionality implemented in a flawless manner.

The old MMO's. They did not have flawless launches. They were not bug free. They crashed for days at a time. People no longer have the patience for a new game to go through the same growing pains that the great games of the childhood went through. They instead hold the new games to the benchmark as games that have had 10 years of development, expansions, and bug fixes.

I think there is some truth to your comments here.

Ill just add that for myself its not the  bugs or launch issues but the very mechanics not changing over the years. There hasnt really been much change  in that respect over these years. The basic core mechanics have remained the same from game to game. Some games such as Darkfall have added the more twitch based mechanics and im really excited about the future of its application in other games to come but  even darkfall fell into the pit when it came to other mechanics and how they were presented such as having a walled city and watching an army of hundreds cast launch and jump over the walls rendering the work it took to build them all for nothing, ruining some excellent seigeing to be done.  These issues turned me away from darkfall, besides the grind crafting was... But thats a whole different subject and  to go deeper into it would make me guilty of a thread hijack so i wont delve any further into that.

 

I will say, as it use to be  when i started mmo's, these expansions use to be added everymonth as a reason you payed the monthly fee, now they charge you the fee, and charge you for the content. and say its all because of the server costs and staff  payroll. I applaud the company behind eve online, they stick to the old agreement and release these content expansions free to subscribers. Even though i dont play eve i will tell anyone whom asks in the circles i frequent that eve has a " Just and Honorable" company behind them that knows how to treat its customer base, and they are always working on something to add to it, and it only costs $19.00 to buy and $14.99 a month and youll never have to buy anything else ever.

 

Wouldnt that be nice if other games did this. Imagine some of the games youd all play but have been put off cause you dont want to spend a ton of cash to get all those damn expansions packs so that you can get the FULL game experience, plus the monthly fee...

LOTR has frequent free content updates.  And if I'm not mistaken aren't they releasing a paid expansion for EVE or is dust going to be free too?
 

But the first part of your statement is in agreement with what again I'l say is an exageration of the truth of the matter.

Maybe it's the fact that "sandbox" games are a niche market like pvp hence the low numbers of companies working on these types of games but the bottom line is if games release like DF did and not like LOTRO no matter what the game people are now going to have problems because we now know there are companies out there who develop on code they understand and have mastered and are going to give us a game we can atleast play.

Do some forget about this and only think of games as they seem now as opposed to when released, well sure but that is analagous to being able to find someone who will beleive or think anything.

Trust common sense folks look around at the companies who are adept at making and releasing games and lobby these companies to offer you a sandbox game and I assure you when they see the monetary potential they will hop on board and you'll see much more clearly what I mean.

Dust on eve online is a console only addition, at least thats the last id heard of it. I quit following it since i only game on a pc. Im sure that will be a buy for the console gamers. As for lord of the rings online im not sure, i tested it in beta and didnt care for it and its mechanics. so i couldnt tell you one way or the other.

Well i didnt agree with everything the quoted poster wrote, i did say i agree with some of the things he mentioned..

As to the rest, i agree with the guy i quoted to a point because its an argument ive heard and read on other boards in the gaming scene. Sure they could be posts by  folks that dont even play mmos etc but the argument has be raised  many times about it so i can see where the quoted poster would form that opinion, its not my opinion, ive been gaming  along time so ive seen the worst releases turn into excellent titles, then ive seen them come out where they are total pay to play betas. And there are justifications on both sides about these companies releasing their titles in such a state. Ive always silently choose with my wallet, on how i feel about these titles.

I wouldnt go as far to say that sandbox games are niche or pvp is niche especially pvp ( huge pvp fan here). I can say that  making such a game  or any game thats different then the trend others follow (cookie cutter games) is very high risk financially as im sure you know.

There is the fact that developers arnt very good at doing something different then what they are adept at so they release these titles over the years that arnt much different then the last. Or whats currently available on the market.

Its like look at asherons call then asherons call 2 then lotr online, in my opinion they retracted their ambitious march forward in pushing the bar to just resting on it. The mechanics and twitch style asherons call offered was refreshing to what Others were doing. I mean you could dodge fireballs man. That was awsome.

     Investors want a sure thing. And development studios want  success and to make some green, the trend is nearly a sure bet that they will make something from their title. Its usually the indie, no name companies that take the big risks and release something new and refreshing to this saturated mmo market.

Many of the games i enjoy besides my fps games are indie games like s2games whom i support with posting of the sig below.

WOW called, they want their orc back...

Im joking, anyhow im glad something like this is taking place. I just hope it captures the character of the fallout world.

Originally posted by Nightbringe1

Originally posted by tro44_1

Originally posted by vladww

Originally posted by tro44_1
 

Why havnt any company made a Newer Updated UO sandbox mmorpg game?

Dont you wonder this as well?

 

Darkfall Online

 

Then why so much hate? What does UO allow that DF doesnt?

 

People today are more jaded.

They take things for granted today that none of the old MMO's even dreamed of when they launched, they get pissed when the new games do not have that functionality implemented in a flawless manner.

The old MMO's. They did not have flawless launches. They were not bug free. They crashed for days at a time. People no longer have the patience for a new game to go through the same growing pains that the great games of the childhood went through. They instead hold the new games to the benchmark as games that have had 10 years of development, expansions, and bug fixes.

I think there is some truth to your comments here.

Ill just add that for myself its not the  bugs or launch issues but the very mechanics not changing over the years. There hasnt really been much change  in that respect over these years. The basic core mechanics have remained the same from game to game. Some games such as Darkfall have added the more twitch based mechanics and im really excited about the future of its application in other games to come but  even darkfall fell into the pit when it came to other mechanics and how they were presented such as having a walled city and watching an army of hundreds cast launch and jump over the walls rendering the work it took to build them all for nothing, ruining some excellent seigeing to be done.  These issues turned me away from darkfall, besides the grind crafting was... But thats a whole different subject and  to go deeper into it would make me guilty of a thread hijack so i wont delve any further into that.

I will say, as it use to be  when i started mmo's, these expansions use to be added everymonth as a reason you payed the monthly fee, now they charge you the fee, and charge you for the content. and say its all because of the server costs and staff  payroll. I applaud the company behind eve online, they stick to the old agreement and release these content expansions free to subscribers. Even though i dont play eve i will tell anyone whom asks in the circles i frequent that eve has a " Just and Honorable" company behind them that knows how to treat its customer base, and they are always working on something to add to it, and it only costs $19.00 to buy and $14.99 a month and youll never have to buy anything else ever.

Wouldnt that be nice if other games did this. Imagine some of the games youd all play but have been put off cause you dont want to spend a ton of cash to get all those damn expansions packs so that you can get the FULL game experience, plus the monthly fee...