Originally posted by svann

Its kind of like if you had a front door with no lock and a burglar walked in one day while you were gone, took your tv and left a note saying "Dude, you should get a lock lol".  You can blame the burglar for taking your tv but the fact that you have to wait 5 hours for a locksmith to come out is your own fault.

Not a good analogy, there's nothing that indicates SOE had its doors wide open.  The correct analogy would be SOE had a standard home-style door with the standard locks on them.  But hackers found a way to pick the lock and got in fairly easily.  What people want SOE to do is to install bank-style metal security doors.  To be fair, people have the rights to demand it.  But to say SOE left the doors wide open is wrong.

Are people seriously believing the words of Anonymous?  Those who find joy in causing headache for others?  Those who find joy in taking services down for whatever ideological reasons they have, where they are disrupting services for millions of people who once enjoyed using?

Yeah.. I'm sure all corporations are evil to some, but being anarchists aren't much better either.  Majority of the people in this world is somewhere in the middle.  If Anonymous wants to redeem themselves and show they are trustworthy (lol), they would be going after the hackers that actually stole the data.  You know, do something good for once and show the world they aren't just a bunch of people who like to cause problems. 

People take this "sandbox" and "themepark" too seriously.  Many games on the market today are actually a cross between the two.  I think most people don't give a rats rear whether a game is deemed a "sandbox" or "themepark".  They just want a fun game that will last them quite awhile.  Specific design decisions will always make it or break it for people.  Like many have mentioned before, some developers choose to implement such & such which alienates the playerbase. 

Things such as FFA PvP, instance vs open world, fast travel vs slow travel, exp penalties, etc..  I think you'll find that people are for the most part moderates, they want a bit of everything and they want the choice.  They want to choose whether they want to participate in PvP or not.  They want to choose whether to do instance or to stay in open world.  They want perhaps a tad instanced PvP while other times they feel like world PvP.  They want equal opportunity in terms of getting loot inside an instance as opposed to outside an instance.  People want the choice of quest-on-a-rail system to level and have the option to grind mobs if they get tired of questing.

The problem with games today is they are either/or, kind of like our political system.  But what companies fail to realize is that people don't always want either/or.  Some days I want world PvP, but other days I want instanced PvP.  Some days I may want to raid inside a dungeon with a guild, but other days I'd love to contest for a world raid boss.  Some days I don't feel like dying and losing my gear when I just want to craft, other days I'd love me some ganking.  Some days I just want to quest on my own and not bother with grouping or grinding mobs, other days I just want to grind mobs in a dungeon for exp.

People should realize Vanilla WoW had a bit of both worlds, and it was popular.  Even Burning Crusade expansion had a bit of both worlds, and it was also popular.  Remember instanced BG's and world PvP, including a very popular contested PvP zone Isle of Quel'danas.  Vanilla WoW also had contested raid mobs as well as instanced raid mobs.  Also I remember questing to level up while the last 10 levels I was grinding inside instances and had a blast.

I just don't get why we can't have a bit of both worlds, and I don't get why it has to be "sandbox" or "themepark".  It doesn't have to be either/or, I believe gamers like to have the choices.  So the question are there enough gamers out there for an AAA Sandbox MMO?  Sure there are, but you can attract a LOT more gamers if you mix a bit of sandbox and a bit of themepark into one MMO. 

All in all, make a good game, that's content filled, fun, and give people the OPTION on various controversial subjects such as PvP, death penalty, exp gains, etc..  So if it means to create a special ruleset server for those that want FFA PvP + loot, then by all means do it to satisfy those that want it.

Facebook users be aware, Facebook may have leaked your info.  Kinda shows you in today's age, nothing is safe.  Simple outdated API on facebook would've allowed any advertisers to obtain personal info.  Hackers don't always need to hack into the servers to obtain personal info.  And you wouldn't believe the things people put on their facebook

So in other words, if you are a U.S. customer, change your passwords when SOE services come back up.  If you happen to have used the same password for other accounts/games, it's best you go and change those passwords right now.  Hashed password they got  is encrypted password, but given time, it can be cracked.  You shouldn't use the same password for gaming, cc/bank accounts, forum accounts, facebook, etc.. anyway.

For non-U.S. customers, man I feel sorry for you guys.  Contact the credit card company you used to pay for SOE accounts, get them to issue you a new one.  It should be free to do so, and you'll get a new card within 30 days.  Banks will also issue you new debit cards no problem, but you'll want to talk to them about hackers having your bank account numbers.  Find out the options you have, they can either place a fraud protection on the account, or just change the account numbers altogether.

It sucks, but it's not the end of the world.  Chances are this won't be the last time hacks of this magnitude happens in your lifetime.

Originally posted by krenalor

On this website it is okay to bash World of Warcraft and not Everquest, I am the one breaking the mold.

Best yet, I haven't played EQ in 6+ years, never played World of Warcraft except part of a free month, and actually play DDO.

The worst feature in EQ was the lack of instancing, made me play with the pricks training and behaving badly. I prefer DDO type instancing and only being with guildies.

What does any of that have anything to do with this thread?

Some facts (read more from soe.com):

If you are a U.S. customer, your credit card / debit card / bank account info have NOT been stolen.  If you are a non-U.S. customer, a foreign customer from Austria, Germany, Netherlands, and Spain, your credit card and debit card info may have been stolen.

For stolen U.S. accounts, here are the info they got:

The personal information of the approximately 24.6 million SOE accounts that was illegally obtained, to the extent it had been provided to SOE, is as follows:

• name
• address
• e-mail address
• birthdate
• gender
• phone number
• login name
• hashed password.

Originally posted by Pawn01

Perfect that's exactly what I was looking for on the pricing info! I appreciate it! Also, thank you Mardy, thats pretty much what I was curious about. So in your opinon it would not be too late to start on say, Fippy? And do you guys know, if I already own EQ1 through ... well I am not sure, I have a lot of the exp. but not nearly all. Is there a package that picks up the rest of them or a majority of them? I don't mind rebuying some of them if its cheaper, but obviously with SOE down I am having a hard time finding their pricing. (looking to purchase DLC versions rather than run out and buy a hard copy).

 

Thank you again for the info guys! I am hoping to find a server that has the same feel to it as Mithaniel Marr did so long ago!

Definitely not too late to start on Fippy or Vulak, both servers were populated before the SOE services went down.  It's really too bad, because people have been waiting for timelocked progression servers for many years.  And now we finally have them, and the countdown to Kunark vote was only a month away, and bam SOE got hacked.  So no, it's not too late to start especially since everybody is still between level 1-50, and only have access to classic era zones.  This makes for easier grouping, easier to bump into people, crowded cities, crowded dungeons, etc..  It'll be interesting to see how the servers will be when services go back up.  I do predict people will slowly come back if anything, it's to utilize the free 30-60 days we'll be getting due to this outtage.

As for what expansion pack you need, on the progression servers, you only need the expansion pack that the servers have progressed up to.  So since it's still at classic, all you really need is classic or EQ trilogy to play.  You don't need to buy the latest or have any specific expansions yet.  When Kunark opens, you would of course need to have Kunark flagged on your account.

One thing of note is that Amazon has the latest expansion House of Thule for sale at $19.95.  So if you think about monthly subscription being $14.99 already, you can get a brand new SOE account setup with House of Thule, and get the first 30 day free.  In many ways it's cheaper doing it that way.

Originally posted by Pawn01

Can someone tell me more about the subscription packages? I own EQ,EQ2, and SWG, I don't think I have any more Sony MMO's if their are any. But I have a friend of mine interested in revisting the old days of EQ1 and I always liked EQ2 also. We would be looking at the time locked servers. How often does an expansion release on those?

 

Thanks ahead for the info!

Timelocked progression servers go by whenever an expansion's objectives have been killed, then a grace period kicks in, then once the grace period is over a vote comes up for everybody on the server above lvl 30 to vote whether they want the next expansion to open or not.  The players get to choose how fast/slow these servers advance.

So for the classic era content we're on right now, people have killed all the raid mobs and completed the objectives for the unlock.  A 90 day grace period kicked in, we were in the middle of that when the whole hack thing happened.  When 90 days is up, for Fippy it'll be in June, for Vulak it'll be about a week or two after that, the vote will come up.  If majority votes "yes" to advance to Kunark, then Kunark will open within a week of voting.  If not, then kunark will not open and another vote will come up in a week.

For expansions after kunark, the grace period will be 60 days instead of 90 days.  So nobody knows how often an expansion will release on the timelocked progression servers.  We just know at what minimum they'll go by.  So for the classic content, it'l be at a minimum of 90 days plus a week for voting.  For Kunark and all expansions after, they'll be at a minimum of 60 days of grace period plus a week of voting.  This isn't counting the time it takes for guilds to defeat expansion raid objectives, and this will vary depending on the expansion of course.

Hope that helps.

For a game like Vanguard where it cost them very minimal amount of money to turn "on" and keep running, there's less chance of it shutting down.  All they have to do is turn it on, and they make some money off it.  No development staff, no extra resources spent.  It'd be dumb for them to not turn it back on.

What may hurt as a result are games that have a development team, games that cost them money.  Chances are we'll see some more layoffs.

I do predict with the free month + however many days the game is down in May, gamers will flood back into SOE games and take advantage to those free play time.  Gamers love free stuff, so I wouldn't look too much into people who are spouting off stream on the forums right now.  When servers come back up and they're offered over a couple of months worth of free play time, they'll hop back in no doubt.

Are you looking to join regular servers or a timelocked progression server?

Don't worry about that guy, he comes here every once in awhile to rant about warriors.  Heck the first thing he posted in another forum category when SOE took the services down was something about the warriors.  Just ignore him and definitely ignore any advice he gives, warriors are a good class both in the group game and raid game.

Originally posted by bezado

Vanguard was not his fault.

Yes it is.  While I agreed with parts of your post, the fact that his design opened the door for a lot of other companies to jump in.  But Vanguard was totally his fault.

Mark Jacobs need to go buy the IP rights back and form a new company, with some of the previous talents that used to work on DAOC, and give us a real DAOC 2.

I don't know why companies suck at making sequels, especially sequels for old classic games.  Is it really that hard to live up to people's expectations?  Turbine made AC2, completely changed the game, so they never got the support of AC1 players.  It bombed.  SOE made EQ2, completed changed the game so it was nothing like EQ1, they never got the support of EQ1 players.  While it didn't bomb or get shutdown, it never reached half of EQ1's peak subscription.  Mythic made WAR, something that was half WoW, half DAOC.  It turned out to be half as good as WoW in PvE, and half as good as DAOC in RvR.  It bombed hardcore.

Why can't these companies just make revamps of the classics, better engine, better graphics, better UI, better AI.  But change less of the core concept of the originals, less is more, less is better!  I'd jump in DAOC right now if it was given a facelift while retaining the same gameplay, just as I'd jump in AC right now if it was given a facelift while retaining the same lore & gameplay.

I'll cut them some slack, sequels are never easy to make.  Look at movies, a lot of the sequels of good movies turned out really horrible.  But every once in awhile you'll find a sequel of a movie that is better than the first.  I don't know if we've seen that happen in MMO's yet.

They're literally printing money in Irvine, it's insane.  People have been hoping and wishing for a WoW decline but I say Blizzard is still in charge, they got the upper hand and if they want to improve their game and draw people back as well as attract new gamers, they can.  They got the cards, they're still the leader in the U.S. market and a well known force in the world market.  So if they at anytime think they're going to lose money, they can and will do more to make their game more attractive.

This is coming from someone that isn't playing WoW, but I've always respected Blizzard as a quality gaming company.

All comes down to the rewards.  People will take the path to least resistence when it comes to loot/rewards in games.  So if you can get better loot at shorter time spent doing instances, then people will do instances.  It was the only reason WoW's world PvP disappeared, it was due to the loot offered in BG's and the fact that BG's could net you more honor points.

So while the argument that some people play for fun is true, some do.  But majority cares about their loot and they'll do whatever it takes to get more for less time spent.

Originally posted by therain93

Originally posted by Markn

Vanguard isnt his fault I remember chatting with him during the development and his vision for the game was amazing the problem is reality set in and pressure from deadlines by microsoft then a forced release by SOE destroyed any chance the game ever had.

Can anyone imagine what type of game he could make with no pressure no deadlines and enough $ to get it done ?   That is what new MMOs are slowly figuring out when you rush the development you end up with a pile of crap.

 Without constraints, anyone can do anything......  McQuaid suffered from overpromising and underdelivering because he only knows about games and not business.

Yup, Brad would've made a great Producer, someone who oversees the actual development of the game, someone who can give inputs and make final decisions on design.  Unfortunately, he was the CEO of Sigil, and no matter how you spin it, or who you want to push the blame off to, CEO is always the one to blame.  He was given $30mil and 5 years to work on a game.  He couldn't finish it ontime, within budget.    You just don't do that, and he has nobody else to blame as the CEO is supposed to make sure that doesn't happen.

It's too bad, I still would like to see him hired as a Producer or createive designer of a decent sized MMO.  He needs to stay far far away from being a CEO or a businessman as possible.

We should send John McClane in to make the hackers work for us, and if they didn't actually steal the info as they say, make them track down who did heh.  Reminds me of this clip:  http://www.moviesonline.ca/TheFeed/index.php?id=diehard-warlock

It's 2011, no.

Originally posted by JeroKane

And I expected SOE to take good care of that sensitive information to the best of their abilities. And they did not and now it ended up in the wrong hands!

I hear ya, I really hope they completely redo their infrustructure, and secure their network both on the PSN side and SOE side.  I don't play playstation but I would imagine Microsoft is now digging though Xbox Live making sure the same won't/can't happen to them lol.

Originally posted by MurlockDance

That's a bit cheaty since there aren't that many people in Oslo, Norway (!).

lol I don't even know where that is! 

But eh, it kinda shows you people get so angry about their name, address, phone, email, DoB get leaked.  Yet in 5 mins I got that all from his forum Username.  Imagine what I can find if I spent more time on it.