So maybe I'm just not looking in the right place, but I haven't been able to find an answer to this question.

If not, I gotta say that's kinda of a bummer. I know it took them a while to add that to CoH, and I kinda didn't like how they all existed seperately from the heroes for the most part. From what I've heard it sounded like DCUO is taking the right approach with this, but I was wondering how this game would be handling it.

Ambush Bug! But seriously, that's hard to answer. I think Green Arrow is probably my fav Justice Leaguer.

As for the whole Marvel/DC debate, I think they both have awesome characters but lately there has been some awful writing on both sides.

Also, I just gotta say I hate it when people say Superman is overpowered. Superman is supposed to represent the ultimate superhero archetype. I mean, he's where the term "superhero" comes from. He is supposed to stand out among the rest. And it's not like he doesn't have his weaknesses.

So wait, only with new accounts?

I don't know what's worse, SOEs disregard for their playerbase or their refusal to admit their mistake even as their game is dying. None of it really seems like sane behavior, even from a business viewpoint.

Originally posted by Valeran

Pre-CU was unique.  You could skill yourself within reason.  250 points to do with as you pleased.

You could be a crafter and combatant and be viable.  Not any longer.

You could be a BH and be melee or any ranged specialized.  Heck...you could even be a jedi/BH.  Not any longer.

IMHO the removal of the skill system was the largest coffin nail other than never learning the one thing Blizzard does well and that is polishing what you have.

 

 

I was a Smuggler/Commando and also had some Artisan skills so I could build swoops and stuff. I don't think I've ever had a toon in a game that I've liked as much as that one.

The only thing I really minded about the NGE was the removal of the skill system. I actually kinda liked how they made the combat twitch based. Still, I think that if they had just worked on polishing what they had instead of drastically changing everything the game would have been more successful.

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Some friends of mine found something similar in Ryzom.  I was tempted to try it out, but when I read up on the game it seems to be about magic and plants lol.  Maybe that's cool, but it's not my cup of tea.

I've also heard that EVE has some kind of interesting system that appeals to SWG vets.  I'd try that one if I could walk around.  I like space sims, but enjoy walking around and meeting people "face-to-face" too, at least virtually :).

Yeah, I have played both of those. They are both both are pretty cool, but still don't quite compare to what SWG was for me. In EVE I didn't really care for only getting to play as a ship, and one that you don't even feel like you're directly controlling at that. Ryzom was a lot of fun but I just got kinda bored with it after a while.

I've tried both the Paypal and Click2Pay and neither seems to work properly. Click2Pay says I'm in the wrong country, but I'm in the US so wtf? This game looks kinda interesting but it doesn't seem to be worth the hassle.

I'm sure I'm not the only one that felt that before the NGE, SWG had the best skill/class system I've seen in an MMO. It allowed players to create the most interesting and diverse combinations of skills, and when you got bored with one thing you could drop it and try something else, with no need to roll a new toon.

While it still boggles my mind that they decided to do away with this awesome setup, I'm also surprised I haven't seen more attempts to do something similar. If another sci-fi MMO came out with something similar I'm pretty sure I'd play it, providing that the other aspects of the game were good as well.

Anyway, I'm sure I'm not the first person to bring this up, but I'm just lamenting about the game that I still miss to this day. I think the reason I haven't been able to stick with any MMO for very long since then is because there really just isn't anything out there that compares to what SWG was before they ruined it. I know that even then it was far from perfect, but it was a truly unique experience nevertheless.

Originally posted by nolf

 

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Originally posted by eccoton

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Originally posted by nolf

 

One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle.
That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.

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You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.

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That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.

While the smaller ships didn't allow you to walk around(which makes sense), they did offer a pretty good cockpit view. In fact, I rarely ever used the exterior view.

Originally posted by eccoton

Originally posted by nolf

One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle.

That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.

 

You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.

Good point. I threw some pretty bitchin yacht parties back in the day before I quit SWG.

Originally posted by OddjobXL

It was my faulty memory that STO had multiplayer ships (perhaps it did in some previous incarnation) that brought me to the game in the first place.  I will never stop pointing out that games with multiplayer ships can and do work and I will keep pointing out examples.  I agree Cryptic will miss the essence of Star Trek without crewed ships.  The ship, what happens inside amongst crew that are interacting, is the very heart of the show.  What makes combat in Star Trek unique?  The bridge scenes.  Captains calling out orders, bridge crew confirming and relaying information, explosions, panels and screens blowing out, bodies getting knocked around. Now, Saturday Night Live might make fun of how goofy they can be but that only makes the point how iconic they are to the experience.  It's not some some weird fetish it's a basic touchstone of identity.

All that said, I'm in STO regardless.  What they're doing with procedurally generated worlds/missions and competative PvE is fundamentally exciting, should be exciting, to anyone that plays MMOs.  These are ideas that will make PvE replayable.  Could well turn it from the grind we all know and hate into a game we actually enjoy playing.  Doing something for the experience, enjoyment, of it rather than for the bribe of a reward at the end is a wonderful idea.  Dynamic gameplay without being dependant on PvP could be a big tipping point in how MMOs are designed.  If it works.

There are crews in the game.  They're bridge crews/away teams.  It sounds like they'll be every bit as important and customizable as the player-character captain himself.  I like this.  The fact is that even with multiplayer ships in the game most of us, most of the time, even if we're on a big ship will be flying solo when our friends aren't around.  Having a functional ship player crew is a task that does require some organization (no more than getting a party together for dungeons) and practice as a team.  This means organized guilds, small or large.  When your buddies, the 'regular cast', isn't around you're probably not going to want to just sit around or join a pick-up group.  Instead you can take your own ship, and your own NPC crew, out for adventures.  And...I like pet classes.  If beastmaster or mastermind is cool how much cooler will having a whole party of customizable characters under your control?

Yeah, I'm in.  Cryptic has promised that they aren't shutting the doors on multiplayer crews just focusing on what needs to work to get the game out first.  And they're right.  If there aren't functional dynamic missions and strategic PvE then nobody will be warping around either in solo ships or multiplayer ones.

Keep on fighting the good fight, never let Cryptic forget they need the multiplayer starship to truely create a "Star Trek" experience, but try to be realistic in your expectations in the short term.

We do know bridges will be in at some point, possibly at or shortly after launch, and we've been told that when they figure out how to make ship interiors functional rather than decorative they'll be in as well for regular use.   Once that happens how long before the obvious?  More people will want to play on their friends ships if only "just for fun."  I think they must know how this is likely to play out themselves and they should damn well be planning for it.

Great Post! I feel pretty much the same way about this game. I think it still sounds like it could be a fun/interesting game, but I really think they need multi-player crewed ships with interiors to create an immersive Star Trek experience.

Originally posted by Hagonbok

Originally posted by kingfelix

Originally posted by Hagonbok

Originally posted by kingfelix

I remember JTL was considered the most fun part of SWG by many players I knew, myself included. Even after the atrocious NGE, it managed to keep several people I knew playing, for a while at least.

I think it's pretty foolish to write off features that enhance the immersive aspect of a game as "fluff". If that were really the case, you might as well just go play Asteroids, because everything since then has just been "fluff". A lot of people play MMOs because they want to interact with other players in an immersive world, not just play a single player game with a chat room.

Yes JTL was popular, and guess what? Pretty much everyone prefered solo ships. Thanks for offering yet more evidence that player crews would never be desirable in STO.

 

Um, could you maybe explain how what I said proved that, because it sounds like a bit of a stretch. Single player ships were used more frequently because of a number of reasons(cost, skill level, convenience), not necessarily because of preference. The people I played with still loved to get a crew together on the bigger ships.

Oh give us all a break. Very few used anything else besides the solo ships because that was all that was fun. The rest was just plain dull for most people. The only ones that liked the multi player ships were a very few little egomaniacs and heir mindless followers. They were a major fail, even the devs say so.

Yeah, I guess people that enjoy the concept of teamwork are egomaniacs. Unlike people who go around stating their opinions as if they are facts and jump all over anyone who dares to disagree with them.

This seems to be a pretty heated topic on these forums, so I thought I'd see where the majority stands. And to certain fanbois out there who shall remain nameless, try to remember that everyone is entitled to their own opinion, so let's try to keep it civil.

reposted

Originally posted by Hagonbok

Originally posted by kingfelix

I remember JTL was considered the most fun part of SWG by many players I knew, myself included. Even after the atrocious NGE, it managed to keep several people I knew playing, for a while at least.

I think it's pretty foolish to write off features that enhance the immersive aspect of a game as "fluff". If that were really the case, you might as well just go play Asteroids, because everything since then has just been "fluff". A lot of people play MMOs because they want to interact with other players in an immersive world, not just play a single player game with a chat room.

Yes JTL was popular, and guess what? Pretty much everyone prefered solo ships. Thanks for offering yet more evidence that player crews would never be desirable in STO.

Um, could you maybe explain how what I said proved that, because it sounds like a bit of a stretch. Single player ships were used more frequently because of a number of reasons(cost, skill level, convenience), not necessarily because of preference. The people I played with still loved to get a crew together on the bigger ships.

Originally posted by sktslime

Originally posted by kingfelix

I remember JTL was considered the most fun part of SWG by many players I knew, myself included. Even after the atrocious NGE, it managed to keep several people I knew playing, for a while at least.

I think it's pretty foolish to write off features that enhance the immersive aspect of a game as "fluff". If that were really the case, you might as well just go play asteroids, because everything since then has just been "fluff". A lot of people play MMOs because they want to interact with other players in an immersive world, not just play a single player game with a chat room.

 

This is a really dumb comparison. We are only talking about SWG one of the most awesome mmorpgs to ever exist's expansion. (pre nge) We still dont know if STO will be a good game aside from the flying, obviously the flying will make or break it. Just dont act like JTL did it all easily, the game before JTL was totally awesome and JTL changed it all for the better.

I'm not quite sure what exactly you're inferring from my previous statement. I loved SWG before the NGE. I was just saying that JTL was my favorite part of the game, as it was for many other people I played with.

Originally posted by Hagonbok

Of course it's going overboard, but no more than 90% of these people do when trying to ebully Cryptic into designing the game for their little niche.  After all these years I've learnt the only way to fight these kinds of flame stokers is to hit em hard with the same tactics they use.

Wow, Cryptic should be paying you. If they aren't already...

I remember JTL was considered the most fun part of SWG by many players I knew, myself included. Even after the atrocious NGE, it managed to keep several people I knew playing, for a while at least.

I think it's pretty foolish to write off features that enhance the immersive aspect of a game as "fluff". If that were really the case, you might as well just go play Asteroids, because everything since then has just been "fluff". A lot of people play MMOs because they want to interact with other players in an immersive world, not just play a single player game with a chat room.

Don't you know they're called labtops? Haven't you seen that guy in the Blue Hippo commercials?

Seriously though, laptops aren't really very good for MMOs from what I've experienced. However, if that's your only choice try to find something with a decent graphics card and a good amount of ram.

You know, these threads really seem to bring out the worst in people. The "better" game is all just a matter of opinion, so play them both make your own decision. Also, having more players doesn't make a game better, just more popular. There is a big difference between these two things. It's why awesome shows like Firefly and Arrested Development get canceled while piece of shit reality shows get tons of viewers. The masses as a whole don't necessarily have extraordinary taste.