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All Posts by eldaris

All Posts by eldaris

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317 posts found


Originally posted by Beatnik59

Originally posted by eldaris  

Originally posted by Beatnik59

Originally posted by eldaris Lost any interest in big guilds as soon one of them in classic wow wanted an "interview" and a "probe period". I only care about small friendly guilds with people I like to chat with, I don't care about how good players are them as long they are nice and able to have a nice chat.So I am quite glad that gold era of guilds in mmos is over,I can't wait for a mmo with no guilds at all,a friend list is more than enough.
Yeah, I think once guilds got to that point, the publishers had to do something to make them less relevant.
  Some of the most social people I meet while playing online games were in small guilds or in no guild at all so I don't think the problem is new games are not encouraging guilds or socializing but that online gaming got so popular that it's harder than before to meet the right people.
Oh I agree 100%.  Some of the best roleplayers I met were tagless.  Some of the funniest people I met were tagless.  The most interesting characters were tagless.

Guild folks from the bigger, more elite guilds tended not to have much imagination or personality.  You'd crack a joke and they'd go:  "???".  You ask them where they're from, and they'd say "Tulsa, Oklahoma" instead of "Nothram."  They just were playing a different game than the rest of us, I suppose.

Then again, the random loot generator and the combat engine really didn't care about things like humor and roleplay skill.  Hence, why guilds didn't have much of an incentive to encourage humor and roleplay skill back in the WoW era.


Very true, not sure if certain night elf rogue is still around but I miss the fun I had on your birthday party in Ironforge,buying ice cream and wine for all the guests and then logging in my mage for the special effects show.


Originally posted by Loktofeit

Originally posted by eldaris

Originally posted by YoungCaesar maybe in trash themeparka, but in sandbox games guilds are pretty much everything, you could write books with all the guild history.
And they will be as interesting as a gang history book, probably even less.
Either you've never played a sandbox MMO or you just have some odd bias against them. Rolled, maybe? :( 

 


I think eve is quite the sandbox,some of the most friendly people in that game were in a npc corp not in a player made guild.Sadly ffa pvp seems to bring out the worst in people and it's the same in competitive games based on epic loot.


Originally posted by Beatnik59

Originally posted by eldaris Lost any interest in big guilds as soon one of them in classic wow wanted an "interview" and a "probe period". I only care about small friendly guilds with people I like to chat with, I don't care about how good players are them as long they are nice and able to have a nice chat.So I am quite glad that gold era of guilds in mmos is over,I can't wait for a mmo with no guilds at all,a friend list is more than enough.
Yeah, I think once guilds got to that point, the publishers had to do something to make them less relevant.

Some of the most social people I meet while playing online games were in small guilds or in no guild at all so I don't think the problem is new games are not encouraging guilds or socializing but that online gaming got so popular that it's harder than before to meet the right people.


Originally posted by YoungCaesar
maybe in trash themeparka, but in sandbox games guilds are pretty much everything, you could write books with all the guild history.

And they will be as interesting as a gang history book, probably even less.

Lost any interest in big guilds as soon one of them in classic wow wanted an "interview" and a "probe period". I only care about small friendly guilds with people I like to chat with, I don't care about how good players are them as long they are nice and able to have a nice chat.So I am quite glad that gold era of guilds in mmos is over,I can't wait for a mmo with no guilds at all,a friend list is more than enough.

Thanks for your post OP, I was thinking to download TERA to play it again these days but if they use fb type mechanisms like production points(labour points) no thanks.I don't mind spending money on cosmetic things in f2p games (spent more money in eq2 free to play than during my time being subcribed to eq2 before f2p) but I hate fb way of monetizing games which affect even players subscribed to the game.


Originally posted by Scambug
I'm very concerned and I won't be touching another "free" to play / cash shop MMO ever again.

Call me an old fart but I never saw anything wrong with the good 'ole sub model, where you payed 15€/month and had access to everything the game had to offer from within the game.

I don't think I'll ever feel comfortable with this F2P business and it seems to be getting worse and more embedded in the genre at every new release.

Time to start looking for another hobby me thinks.


Problem is that these kind of systems start to enter even p2p games, same as with mobile gamining where you pay for a game then you still have a cash shop with all kind of boosters.If Archeage would have unlimited labour points for subscribers then it would not be much to discuss. I think developers saw how much money they can make with cash shops in other genres and sooner or later most mmos will have them together with game system designed to push players into using them.


Originally posted by DMKano

Originally posted by eldaris Actually RNG just supports my theory of heavy monetization and I was comparing two paying players since in a normal p2p game they would have been on equal level just by paying a subscription.Thanks to fb like system and rng, not only a subscriber will end by buying potions but rng will push him or her into doing it over and over again because "next time I'll have more luck". I also doubt that RNG will be better than other asian games,can't say I enjoyed it in Tera and I was not even at max level - at least Tera didn't have labour points and it is quite decent as far as f2p systems go.
Confirmation bias

No matter what evidence I provide, you will only use it to further promote your own hypothesis.

End result = no meaningful discussion

 


Actually there was no evidence supporting your theory that archeage system will not try to follow fb model, just suppositions regarding no need from patrons to buy potions even to craft powerful weapons and the whole RNG thing is a well know mechanism of asian f2p games. So no evidence provided just a pro archeage bias which as so many mmo launched in last few years told us, is not a good adviser regarding the quality of a new game.

Those are labour points gaining rates but how fast you spend them ?Especially to craft good items, it is true that even gathering materials takes away labour points ?
Actually RNG just supports my theory of heavy monetization and I was comparing two paying players since in a normal p2p game they would have been on equal level just by paying a subscription.Thanks to fb like system and RNG, not only a subscriber will end by buying potions but RNG will push him or her into doing it over and over again because "next time I'll have more luck". I also doubt that RNG will be better than other asian games,can't say I enjoyed it in Tera and I was not even at max level - at least Tera didn't have labour points and it is quite decent as far as f2p systems go.

To answer your question OP, if you are worried about these systems starting to appear in more and more games the only way to show that is not to buy those games. I don't buy any mobile games which have in game purchases for same reason, to avoid being pushed towards cash shop and these kind of systems will be much worse in mmos since people usually play them long term.


Originally posted by DMKano


 
If they cared about game economy they would have put item decay in game, which would have solved the abundance of items problem. The only thing labour points is doing is pushing even subscribed players to buy labour points potions so the crafters which want to spend lot of real money will control in game markets. No much difference between this and a facebook game.
Item decay is one of the many options - the downside is if it took you 2 years to finally craft that best in slot armor piece only to have it decay - yeah that would suck.

In ArcheAge crafting a best in slot piece is a legendary achievement - its super rare.

Again another way of preventing everyone walking in uber epic gear.

Labor potions have a 12 hour cool down, so its not like you can buy 100 of them and slam them all down in 45 minutes (which is what Facebook games do).

Also a patron holder at level 50 ia going to have have a ton of labor points and with both online and offline regen, I don't see myself ever needing a labor potion.

Bottom line - reality of labor in ArcheAge is nothing like you described it.

 


Yes,super rare armour in a pvp game - another "wise" choice because all good pvp games are about veteran players in uber gear crushing noobs ,yes ? Actually I regret using term sandbox regarding archeage before, all this talk about uber gear and "danger" of losing a best in slot item makes it sound like the usual themepark.
Until the game is launched to public for a few months, there is no proof that the reality of labour points is anything like you described it too and the fact that the game borrows systems from facebook games,well know for trying to monetize every aspect of the game should be enough to make potential players avoid buying it before trying the game. Cooldown or not, if the labour points are needed (and no one can't be sure that a patron will have an infinite supply until some time after launch) then a patron spending money in cash shop will have an advantage over another patron which does not uses the cash shop and with "uber" weapons that sound quite pay to win.

Because forced grouping is so social ....OP please give up on rose colored glasses,old school mmos like EQ1 created some of the worse elitists and greediest players ever,no wonder Tigole with his "raid or quit" was a guild leader in that game and developed wow end game around epic armour chase above anything else.
Older mmos had sometimes better communities not because of antiquated mechanisms but because smaller communities and more common background between players,things which disappeared as soon more and more people had fast internet access and online gaming started to be popular.


Originally posted by DMKano

Originally posted by Vannor Labour points have destroyed ArcheAge for me. If I can't even open all the gold bags I've looted off enemies, the FTP option is worthless. The amount of times I said to myself.. no, ignore that ore.. there might be a quest soon that needs 100 labour to complete and I don't want to have to wait 2 hours before I can complete it. They put in too much control. It's controls exactly how much you can earn, make, identify and gather. Can be changed whenever they want. It controls your time.. forcing you to do things you might no want to do because you've got to wait. Only applies if you don't want to subscribe though.. of course. I probably won't touch ArcheAge again with them in place. I would have probably subbed anyway but I'm not supporting this kind of system.
 

Labor points have existed in ArcheAge since Korean Alpha years ago - it's a core mechanic of the game.

 

ArcheAge is a game where all best in slot items are PLAYER MADE - so it's all about crafted gear - without any kind of control on crafting - over time the entire game would be brimming with 1000s of uber items.

Labor system combined with extreme difficulty in crafting "best in slot" gear make those items *extremely rare* even after the game has been running for years in Korea.

So for the sake of economy - the labor system is a control mechanism.

 
 


If they cared about game economy they would have put item decay in game, which would have solved the abundance of items problem. The only thing labour points is doing is pushing even subscribed players to buy labour points potions so the crafters which want to spend lot of real money will control in game markets. No much difference between this and a facebook game and is quite funny to see old school sandbox fans white knighting a system from mobile/social media gaming but is to be expected - if wow tried this then it will be awful,shameful, a sign of blizz greed but since is a "sandbox" game then is a great system.


Originally posted by rojoArcueid

Originally posted by eldaris Nice try but if blizz wanted to have a real contest they should have one for the type of bike - the winning one will be offered to both alliance and horde not show their obvious horde favouritism once again. This chopper is only making me thing if I should buy WOD since is clear that blizz favours horde and their stupid "blood and honour" coming from a race of filthy pigs.Yes,I only play alliance .
its clear you favor alliance and that is fine. However, your comment shows that If Alliance had won and you were a horde player you would have said the same thing about Blizz favoring Ally instead. Some people really dont think before speaking. Like others said already, the community voted, Blizz didnt.... and Horde won because more people voted for them. I play both Alliance and Horde so i cant complain about winning or losing here.

Im personally upset about the time limitation to get the mount. They are completely killing the purpose of having a winner in that competition by only offering the prize to people who subscribe before Sept. 30th


No, the vote should have been about the type of bike and not about faction. Two theme bikes,the one voted the most should have been available to both horde and alliance. I agree with you on time limitation ,just another way of blizz pushing players to subscribe again. The horde bias is quite clear from lore,not only is Garrosh escaping punishment (instead of being killed he is sent to trial,lol could it be more pc than that ? ) but all this is used for a horde themed expansion ?
Anyway is not like I was ever interested much in wow lore,it's full of cliches at best and unlike Warhammer,wow orcs are not even funny.Too bad wow was made after warcraft 3 and not warcraft 2,less pc orcs more fun.
I don't care about bike, I have enough mounts and right now I don't have a sub to wow anyway - I just don't like the developers bias towards horde , losing Southshore to horde after all the battles there it was worse than a mount less to collect.

And still much less boring than grinding tons of 1000 npcs to gain a level like in eq1

Nice try but if blizz wanted to have a real contest they should have one for the type of bike - the winning one will be offered to both alliance and horde not show their obvious horde favouritism once again. This chopper is only making me thing if I should buy WOD since is clear that blizz favours horde and their stupid "blood and honour" coming from a race of filthy pigs.Yes,I only play alliance .

Maybe they tried to recreate vanilla WOW but sadly it lacks the most important part - the original wow community. Leveling my main and now my alt I didn't meet many people interested in socializing, parties disband after killing the target, chat was quite active in beta but now mostly dead (at least on my server), no dominion-exile rivalry (I played vanilla wow on a pve server but we still had to defend Auberdine from horde then as we levelled fights moved to Astranaar then Southshore vs Taren Mill - defending those towns made it easier to meet people and form parties/socialize - nothing like that in Wildstar). Having arrows directing people exactly to quest objective ,fights with absurd aoe from npcs which make you jump all around didn't help much too - actually I am surprised that in a game wanting to recreate vanilla wow they added huge arrows to your quest - asking chat when you can't find something is probably too much for some people.
It seems the developers were mostly interesting in copying "raid or quit" philosophy of original wow that the good parts of that game and I doubt that the raids will help them keep enough players long term.

GW2 kept me interested in game much more time than ESO (1 month) or Rift (2-3 months) managed to.
Lost my interest in Rift after beta thanks to small world and cities then ,when I bought the game and I was enjoying levelling my rogue, developers decided that I should be in same pvp teams as those heretic defiants which destroyed the already poor lore of rift for me. With ESO is even more simple - until they have a normal auction house and allow people to skip enemy factions areas I am not interested in the game.
World of Warcraft needs more content added before I subscribe again, is a joke they ask for a monthly subscription and do not add quests/areas to game for months .

Not all people expect the same thing from a mmo and contrary to the popular belief on this site,even less people want to go back to eq1. If WOW is Mc Donalds then EQ1 is like a pie sold by Dibbler from Discworld (something compared to which even hamburgers are a "fine meal")

GW2 for leveling alts from time to time and WvW - not my favourite type of rvr but better than alternatives and also b2p

Wildstar - they have housing,open world with no loading screens,a functional auction house and Chua ;)

Playing GW2 and Wildstar for the mmo part so B2P and P2P, Shadowrun returns and Torchlight 2 single player. If Wildstar gets boring I'll probably try some f2p games,there are quite a few which are decent enough like LOTRO,EQ2 or TERA.

The game could be a success with people wanting a low magic mmo but I am not a fan of the series,I prefer more magic and fantasy lore, less overdone violence. Game of Thrones is similar in style to "Acursed kings" by Maurice Druon just in a fictional setting and I could not enjoy that one too.

I would love a Malazan book of the fallen series,it could be perfect for factional warfare with Tiste Andii,Tiste Liosan and Tiste Edur or Jaghut,T'Lan Imass and Forkrul Assail - with all the history of that world going on for hundreds of thousand of years it would be easy for developers to find a period of time with more lore freedom but in same time allowing players to meet iconic characters from the books . After LOTRO and especially SWTOR I have doubts developers can create the kind of game world I would expect from this lore, maybe an open world single player like an improved Skyrim would be better .

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