Originally posted by Pie_Rat
Someone who controls an avatar in a virtual world is by definition a role player, whether he enjoys sitting around a fire speaking 18th century English or not.

While it's true that "role playing" can be defined in different ways, everyone but you seems to be aware of the specific definition being used by the author.

I'm slowly upgrading this old computer, starting with the video card (it's already preventing me from playing some of the games I want to play).

I currently have:

Asus M4A77TD motherboard

Athlon II X2 240

2GB RAM

GeForce 7800 GT

500W PSU

Windows XP

I plan on getting new CPU, mobo, memory, and OS later, but that will have to be all at once.

Needless to say, I'm used to some pretty low-res gaming with the 7800 GT. I'm leaning toward the GeForce GTX550 Ti, if I can find one for under a hundred bucks.  But I'd go with a lower end card if the savings was worth it. I don't do a hell of a lot of gaming anymore, but I'd like to try out some of the newer games even if I have to turn down the eye candy.

Vahzilok are one of the harder groups to fight at low levels (at least for my melee-heavy style) so I do my best to avoid them, but when I absolutely must fight them I always take out the Mortificators first, so they don't go reviving the corpses in the middle of a fight.  You can also anticipate when the big guys are going to spew, and get out of the way.  If you play a melee archetype, try to use your origin power to pull a group so you don't get stuck fighting two groups at once.

You can also recruit some other players to help, leave in the middle of the mission to get more inspirations, or get a few more levels then come back to the mission later.

Roleplaying has always been seen as a typically "nerdy" hobby. But now we've got teenagers desperately trying to look cool while enjoying a roleplaying game. How can these nerdy kids avoid looking nerdy to their high-school buddies? They denounce the roleplayers as being even nerdier, the same way roleplayers look down on LARPers, LARPers look down on furries, and furries look down on... well, I think it ends at furries.

The anti-roleplayers just awkward little kids who are uncomfortable with roleplaying. That's why it's so fun to roleplay in front of them as much as possible, refuse to break character, and don't back down. It scares the hell out of them.

Originally posted by ActionMMORPG

My day...

1. grind materials

2. travel to get rare crafting pattern

3. on the way back to town get slaughtered multiple times by a corpse camping griefer

 

= Adventure?

 

That's going to be a tough one to sell to a mass appeal audience.

But getting your level 40 character ganked repeatedly by a level 80 is all about the skill, man! Don't you love the challenge of dying without a chance to fight back?

City of Heroes implements destructible environments in a very limited scope. I have a blast playing my villains in mayhem missions - smashing cars and mailboxes and pretty much everything but the buildings themselves.

Sadly, that's the only place in the game where you'll find it.

Originally posted by XSirCarlosX

So has anyone checked this out or joined up?

I checked out the website, but I need to dig my NWN discs out from wherever they went before I can play. I was just talking to a friend of mine the other night about how NWN persistent worlds would be better for roleplaying than an MMO, and he was talking about how much he loved the Ravenloft setting, so finding this thread was rather serendipitous.

I'll probably play. If we can find him a cheap copy of the game I can probably get him to join too.

Originally posted by Eronakis

Originally posted by bonobotheory

Originally posted by Eronakis

Originally posted by bonobotheory

Keeping my character fed, making sure he has enough water, telling him to use the toilet, and telling him to put on a hat before he leaves the house so he doesn't catch a cold sounds much too domestic for the RPG genre. I'd rather keep it out of the game entirely, so I can focus on the adventure.

I want to play the hero; I don't want to babysit the hero.

Have you played Wow? Everytime you buy food and drink and use your character to regain mana and hp, that is technically baby sitting your character too. Single player rpgs you are the hero. Everyone who playes mmorpgs are potential heroes. So maybe the mmorpg genre is not the genre for ya.

 

None of this would have a heavy weight when your character would be in those zones. Just a moderate survival tactic to make gameplay more interesting and immersive.

I've played lots of MMORPGs, including WoW, and the need to eat and drink can be annoying on occasion. I find the less of it I have to do, the more fun I have. And in the typical MMORPG, it's kept to a minimum - just enough to give an occasional break from the action. It's a far cry from what you're suggesting.

Your statement that "maybe the mmorpg genre isn't for (me)" is ludicrous. Just because I like the games the way they are, and don't like your suggestion to add an annoying subsystem, I must not like MMORPGs? How does that make any sense?

There are many types of players. I suppose your the guy who wants to be in combat all the time. Which is fine. I enjoy that a well. Well in todays mmos, when you log into a server, your logging into a lobby or a game, not a world. I don't think it would be an annoying subsystem at all because it creates immesion and different survival tactics. It wouldn't be a main concert something you'd have to pay attention to once in a while. Something to add challenge. It's obvious that we enjoy polar mmo design concepts and mechanics.

You didn't really want an answer to your question, did you?  You just wanted people to agree with you.

Originally posted by Death1942

Originally posted by lilmark_utsa

I'm PvE(FFXI 7yrs) & PvP(UO 5yrs).  I love a great storyline, I like to craft, I like to decorate my home (in-game), I literally enjoy every PvE aspect MMO's offer...even fishing.  But, I enjoy PvP as well.  I like having to adept my tactics in a PvP battle rather than being able to kill a PvE mob with my eyes closed.

The one thing I don't understand is what PvEer's have to fear.  PvEer's say PvPer's are the minority now and they're right.  They probably have us outnumbered 10 to 1.  With that type of advantage what's there to fear?

The fear is (and in WoW case it is proven) that the minority can still affect the majority.  I've had many skills and spells in games go from being awesome and fun to use to being utterelly useless because the PvP'ers complained.  Nothing pisses me off more than finding a spell i like to use and finding it's been nerffed to hell because a bunch of guys on the forums complained hard enough.

 

I'm not against PvP at all but i am completely against it affecting PvE in that respect (spells, equipment...etc)

That's something else I forgot to mention. No matter how separate the PVP action is kept from the PVE action, the mechanics spill over.  Blizzard does this all the time with WoW. I've had some pretty big changes made to my PVE characters just because some other plater didn't like the way the class played in an arena fight.

Originally posted by Eronakis

Originally posted by bonobotheory

Keeping my character fed, making sure he has enough water, telling him to use the toilet, and telling him to put on a hat before he leaves the house so he doesn't catch a cold sounds much too domestic for the RPG genre. I'd rather keep it out of the game entirely, so I can focus on the adventure.

I want to play the hero; I don't want to babysit the hero.

Have you played Wow? Everytime you buy food and drink and use your character to regain mana and hp, that is technically baby sitting your character too. Single player rpgs you are the hero. Everyone who playes mmorpgs are potential heroes. So maybe the mmorpg genre is not the genre for ya.

 

None of this would have a heavy weight when your character would be in those zones. Just a moderate survival tactic to make gameplay more interesting and immersive.

I've played lots of MMORPGs, including WoW, and the need to eat and drink can be annoying on occasion. I find the less of it I have to do, the more fun I have. And in the typical MMORPG, it's kept to a minimum - just enough to give an occasional break from the action. It's a far cry from what you're suggesting.

Your statement that "maybe the mmorpg genre isn't for (me)" is ludicrous. Just because I like the games the way they are, and don't like your suggestion to add an annoying subsystem, I must not like MMORPGs? How does that make any sense?

Keeping my character fed, making sure he has enough water, telling him to use the toilet, and telling him to put on a hat before he leaves the house so he doesn't catch a cold sounds much too domestic for the RPG genre. I'd rather keep it out of the game entirely, so I can focus on the adventure.

I want to play the hero; I don't want to babysit the hero.

Games can have both. It's been done.

The game should always have text, so I can read it quickly and move on. I don't really care if it has voice-overs or not, so long as they're skippable.  I don't want to stop playing because I have to listen to some boring NPC blather on about his sick mother, wondering if he's going to offer up some useful information somewhere in his tedious spiel.

Would  you rather play a game where you enjoy everything the game has to offer, or a game where you find half of the gameplay to be dull and annoying?

Even though I can avoid the half I don't like, it's still there. Development resources are going toward it - time and money are being split between the PVE and the PVP parts of the game. I'm only getting half a game.

It's not necessary, and I don't recall it being made any kind of a mandatory rule. But I haven't read the forum's rules of conduct in a while - did something change recently?

Of course, it's not a bad idea to make sure you know the difference between fact and opinion when posting. Some people express their opinions as if they were objective fact, and defend them as such, and ultimately come across looking like idiots.

At least in my opinion, they look like idiots.

Originally posted by Ramonski7

Originally posted by bonobotheory

Originally posted by Ramonski7

Originally posted by bonobotheory

Originally posted by JLVDB

Originally posted by jpnz

The value of an opinion is wortlhess if the statement isn't based on experience.

The value of a rating is zero if that opinion is based on hear say.

Logic.

You do realize he said 'he never played WoW but he think it is 3 out of 5'? So anyone will make up their own judgement?

Sorry, I'm not even remotely arrogant enough to force 'what is logical to me' onto someone else.

Which shows the objective worthless value he gave compared to what the market analysis gives to the game: 91%.

http://www.gamerankings.com/pc/971498-world-of-warcraft-cataclysm/index.html

His rating is meaningless, just as meaningless as what the OP stated in his excellent post above in this thread.

 

Seriously?  "Market analysis?"  That 91% is just the average of 20 reviews from various websites.  20 subjective reviews, just as meaningless as the original poster's opinion.

That's 20 different reviews based of experience playing the actual game outweighing 1 guesstimation from someone who claims to have never touched the game. And you're saying we should give his assumption full merit? Wow, I'm glad I don't live by those rules:

 

20 people say it hurts to put your hand in fire , one says, "It doesn't hurt that bad, altough I've never really done it." Who would you logically believe?

You quoted my post, but I don't think you read it. The words "full merit" never appear once in my post.  In fact, the term I used was "meaningless" - quite the opposite. Opinions are opinions - they're all subjective.

Your example is a poor one, since I can trust my own experience in the case of what causes pain and what doesn't. In fact, fire causing pain is a given, except in rare cases involving sensory disorders. What if 20 people said putting your hand in fire felt great? Would you do it? Do you just go along with the majority on everything? Your music collection must be appalling.

Do yourself a favor and familiarize yourself with the logical fallacy known as argumentum ad populum. It will keep you from making the same mistakes in the future. Popular does not mean good.

You can stop with the excessive hyperbole to try to prove your point. By full merit, I mean full weight to his limited opinion. What I'm trying to get you to see is if you get more good opinions than bad opinions about a mmo and the good are based on experience and the bad are based on asking around, then I think more people would listen to the people with the expereince. But I guess you also believe people that make comments about betas, alpha and screenshots with no hands on have just as much merit as those who have played in them.

 

So take from that what you will and you keep believeing that guesswork has the same weight as work that has been done.

You of all people shouldn't be accusing anyone of "excessive hyperbole."  Also, I think you'll find that most negative opinions are based on experience.

Originally posted by Xeno326

The most unorthadox thing I've heard yet. You want to play a game that is like WoW but isn't WoW. So what's that mean. You want to play WoW with a different graphics engine and maybe different races? I don't get it. Won't ever happen, because there's copyright laws.

 

Now there are some free games out there called Perfect World and the other called League of Martial Arts or something like that made by the same company who has ripped off WoW sound effects for some of their mob sounds. A familiar sounds like a whelp drake and a boar sounds like the WoW boar. There you go, theres your resolution, a game thats like WoW but not really. Have fun.

If someone doesn't say what they don't like about a product, it can be hard to understand why they would like a similar product.  Fortunately, most people requesting a game "like WoW, but not WoW" give examples of what they like and don't like. If they don't, it's usually an error in the explanation - most people know what they like and what they don't like.

I think most of us are familiar with fast food, so let's use McDonalds and Burger King as examples. Both are fast-food restaurants that serve hamburgers. They use almost identical ingredients on their sandwiches - beef, cheese, lettuce, tomato, onions, pickles. They even serve the same beverages and side orders. Burger King is like McDonalds, but it isn't McDonalds. Most people would say the food at Burger King tastes different than the food at McDonalds. Some even prefer one to the other. Imagine that!

Originally posted by Ramonski7

Originally posted by bonobotheory

Originally posted by JLVDB

Originally posted by jpnz

The value of an opinion is wortlhess if the statement isn't based on experience.

The value of a rating is zero if that opinion is based on hear say.

Logic.

You do realize he said 'he never played WoW but he think it is 3 out of 5'? So anyone will make up their own judgement?

Sorry, I'm not even remotely arrogant enough to force 'what is logical to me' onto someone else.

Which shows the objective worthless value he gave compared to what the market analysis gives to the game: 91%.

http://www.gamerankings.com/pc/971498-world-of-warcraft-cataclysm/index.html

His rating is meaningless, just as meaningless as what the OP stated in his excellent post above in this thread.

 

Seriously?  "Market analysis?"  That 91% is just the average of 20 reviews from various websites.  20 subjective reviews, just as meaningless as the original poster's opinion.

That's 20 different reviews based of experience playing the actual game outweighing 1 guesstimation from someone who claims to have never touched the game. And you're saying we should give his assumption full merit? Wow, I'm glad I don't live by those rules:

 

20 people say it hurts to put your hand in fire , one says, "It doesn't hurt that bad, altough I've never really done it." Who would you logically believe?

You quoted my post, but I don't think you read it. The words "full merit" never appear once in my post.  In fact, the term I used was "meaningless" - quite the opposite. Opinions are opinions - they're all subjective.

Your example is a poor one, since I can trust my own experience in the case of what causes pain and what doesn't. In fact, fire causing pain is a given, except in rare cases involving sensory disorders. What if 20 people said putting your hand in fire felt great? Would you do it? Do you just go along with the majority on everything? Your music collection must be appalling.

Do yourself a favor and familiarize yourself with the logical fallacy known as argumentum ad populum. It will keep you from making the same mistakes in the future. Popular does not mean good.

Originally posted by JLVDB

Originally posted by jpnz

The value of an opinion is wortlhess if the statement isn't based on experience.

The value of a rating is zero if that opinion is based on hear say.

Logic.

You do realize he said 'he never played WoW but he think it is 3 out of 5'? So anyone will make up their own judgement?

Sorry, I'm not even remotely arrogant enough to force 'what is logical to me' onto someone else.

Which shows the objective worthless value he gave compared to what the market analysis gives to the game: 91%.

http://www.gamerankings.com/pc/971498-world-of-warcraft-cataclysm/index.html

His rating is meaningless, just as meaningless as what the OP stated in his excellent post above in this thread.

 

Seriously?  "Market analysis?"  That 91% is just the average of 20 reviews from various websites.  20 subjective reviews, just as meaningless as the original poster's opinion.

Originally posted by Mardy

When I was a teenager, I played all females.  In Diablo I was that female Amazon.  In RPG games I always played a female magician of some sort.

 

But then I grew up, I no longer need to stare at pixelated boobies & behinds.  The real things are much much better.  Dunno I haven't played a female character since 20 I think.  So eh, just a personal preference.

That's actually really strange.  Do that many people see video game characters as sexual?  My characters are just characters to me, similar to a character in a story. Can you imagine an author saying "I used to write about female characters, because I like writing about boobies, but I don't need that anymore so now I only write stories with all-male casts"?

Does the gender of your character always have a sexual meaning to you? Can't they just be a character?

Originally posted by Robokapp

i play a male character because....i'm a male...?  that's like asking me why i wear mens clothes.  why the hell wouldn't i?

 

that's great for you but for others this reason isn't enough.

I was hoping it wouldn't be me saying this but...have you ever wondered "what if I was a girl?".

Huh. sounds like something you can answer in a fantasy setting much easier than in real life.

Not really. My female characters kill monsters and take their stuff, pretty much the same things my male characters do. When I roleplay, her gender rarely enters into it (our settings tend to be utopian, with gender equality and little gender-role prejudice). If you want to know what it's like to be a woman, talk to a woman. I know for some of you that's not an easy thing to do, but you'll get better results.