All Posts by Hadesprime

Originally posted by IAmMMO

Originally posted by green13

The graphics could be better and it may be something they plan to get around to, but they inherited a plethora of bugs, bad game mechanics and half-finished features.

So far I don't think they can be faulted on their approach to development.

 

 Istaria is a great little MMO at it's core.

How exactly ? its a dinosaur from an age where the MMO developer that a grind was the best content around. Basically, in istaria all you do is drag a cargo disc around. The adventure side of the game is not even worth mentioning.

Needs a lot more work than just a graphics update.

I would peg chaos at roughly 350 to 400 during peak

Order is about 300 based on samples taken a month back.

Thats what the numbers were during Tulga's peak. They dropped to under half that during PM whatever's reign. I really do not think the game will go past 400 peak for chaos.

Right now this is what happens with the game

new players join. These new players are usually refugee's from other games looking for something fresh to play. The game presents OK from levels 1 to 20. You will find new people leaving shortly after that. So there is an attrition rate there. Then you have old returning players coming back. You have a modest attrition rate there as well.

All being said and done the game had a massive influx after Vitrium acquired the game. Since then it has tapered out with small growth spurts. But its remaining pretty even right now.

The game seems to be doing ok for a small game. But it's going to appeal to a small crowd anyway. That seems to pay the bills at vitrium so its playerbase will have their sandbox for sometime to come.

Originally posted by dand3

 

This thread on the community forums discusses Vista, now with SP1! and extra goodness.   As indicated above, it can be done, but seems to be hit and miss. It is being worked on of course, but unfortunately no date yet.

I just read that 10-20% of major business programs don't run on Vista; part of the reason businesses are beginning to announce that they're waiting for Windows 7(?). 

http://community.istaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17885

Windows 7 will be built on Vista's foundations

The reason why the game does not work on Vista is because vista does not allow the game to use the exploits in the dot net framework that Bowman and company put into the game during their dot net 1.1 love affair. Vitrium does not seem to have the expertise to recode these areas of the game to make it work with vista.

These security changes will continue with windows 7 and programmers of the day are just going to have to put the lazy days of coding behind them.

Vista isn't that bad, its no windows xp SP2 yet but it will improve and its the way of windows future. So either learn to deal with it or hope the open source community can get it together enough to make linux a viable alternative.

Originally posted by Bruwin

 

Originally posted by Hadesprime

 

Originally posted by katriell

 

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Originally posted by MystaIV

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Originally posted by green13

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Originally posted by Katashi-kun

 

Darn was gonna give it a try again but they don't support Windows Vista atm!

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Neither should you! :P

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lol, when will these posts stop, vista is fine.

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Only by the standards of people who don't know any better. The few benefits of Vista only apply to people who don't have the computer skill and (un)common sense to replicate similar results on other operating systems.

 

 

I hate to break it to you... but MS is going to be forcing people away from XP very soon. So its not a matter of going oooh Im a computer geek I'm still running XP WEEEE!!! If it takes any computer skill its knowing how to make Vista work on par with XP which can be figured out easily. That or you can look it up on google.

Berating Vista even if its deserved does not deflect from the fact that vitrium hasen't a clue on how to make horizons truely compatible with Vista. When in all reality all they really have to do is redo some of that sloppy dot net programming they have going on in the game, then it will work with vista like a dream.

btw what other operating systems are you talking about ? Istaria is completely dependent on the dot net frame work. So its windows for this game or nothing.

<modedit>

 

Actually, the time when people are "forced" to upgrade to Vista has been pushed back by Microsoft

 

http://www.news.com/Microsoft-extends-Windows-XPs-stay/2100-1016_3-6210524.html

 

There's even rumors to the effect that support for XP will continue past the new date given by MS. It will depend on if their new version of windows, currently named Windows 7, ships on time.

The current date for XP to stop shipping in its entirety is June. I believe we might see that pushed to Christmas. When I said forced I meant that you are going to stop seeing DX9 games being developed, everything will be developed with DX10 and above. The hardware will be developed to work around the latest Operating systems.

you can still use XP all you like, I have set it as a dual boot and on VM option on another computer. But the fact is you are going to have to figure your way around vista. Windows 7 will be a build upon of vista.

XP had a good run. But its showing its age now especially as hardware continues its stead fast forward march. XP is a definite step backwards for that hardware.

To be blunt and I have had to tweak Vista but I have a vista computer right now that is faster than any XP box I have with the same hardware specs. Problem is that Microsoft went to far when trying to address the holes that programmers were exploiting with dot net. This is one of the reasons why Horizons does not work in Vista, crappy programming by Tulga.

if you want functional 64 bit computing as well you have no choice but to go to Vista. Linux 64 Bit options aren't that great to be blunt.

Wine  does not work well with HZ and its not a viable uncommon sense approach... it barely works well for windows games. if it did along with lets say Cross over for Linux than heck even I wouldn't have a windows OS. But the fact is they don't run windows games even with the wine project and others. In that two computers same specs... one will barely run a game like WoW and the other won't. Windows is still your best bet for games and i doubt the open source community will ever get its crap together enough to make an OS that is a viable alternative to windows in the real world.

So if you can use google and you are willing to try... mess around with Vista. It can be made to run just as well as XP. Lets hope windows 7 turns out to be what vista should have been. Cause right now there is NO alternative period for a PC based gamer.

This of course does not mean I wish I couldn't just be running Linux, cause I have those running options available to me. But for what I do in the business world with a PC and the fact that I also game makes windows my only option. Linux is a cool I did that OS , its a nice thing to have installed. It has a long ways to go before it can ever be a primary OS for a user such as myself, much much longer for the average user.

I have recently played as a new player on both order and chaos.

Both servers have people that are friendly and helpful. Both have players that are more interested in keeping their sandbox as big as possible for themselves and would rather that new people go away. They treat you as such too.

But in that regard I have found this games community to be no better than what I saw in Vanguard or a few other small games.

To date the best community I have ever seen in an MMO has been in EQ2. That playerbase seems to understand that the key to making sure EQ2 is around for a while is to treat new players well or at least answer their questions when they are asked.

and no you wouldn't want PVP in this game. Multiclassing makes it impossible to incorporate.

Originally posted by katriell

 

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Originally posted by MystaIV

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Originally posted by green13

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Originally posted by Katashi-kun

 

Darn was gonna give it a try again but they don't support Windows Vista atm!

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Neither should you! :P

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lol, when will these posts stop, vista is fine.

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Only by the standards of people who don't know any better. The few benefits of Vista only apply to people who don't have the computer skill and (un)common sense to replicate similar results on other operating systems.

 

I hate to break it to you... but MS is going to be forcing people away from XP very soon. So its not a matter of going oooh Im a computer geek I'm still running XP WEEEE!!! If it takes any computer skill its knowing how to make Vista work on par with XP which can be figured out easily. That or you can look it up on google.

Berating Vista even if its deserved does not deflect from the fact that vitrium hasen't a clue on how to make horizons truely compatible with Vista. When in all reality all they really have to do is redo some of that sloppy dot net programming they have going on in the game, then it will work with vista like a dream.

btw what other operating systems are you talking about ? Istaria is completely dependent on the dot net frame work. So its windows for this game or nothing.

<modedit>

TR's downfall was launching in a very unpolished state and not having more depth to what could have been fantastic concept. The bane should have been a dynamic enemy that reacts to player actions in the world. Its also a faction that should have been playable in an instance say something like creep play in LOTRO.

The basics of the game itself is fantastic. But after that it starts to fail. As well this game will die a quick death for any hardcore player type.

Thing is this game is better than a game like Vanguard... which probably has 30K population playing it. Its better than that piece of garbage horizons that keeps sticking around. No TR will subsist as a money make for NCsoft just as it is now. They will adjust their business model for it based on how well its doing at the time.

But out of games like vanguard and Horizons - two major failures in the MMO world... TR has the best come back potential. It will never be a large game but I can bet good $$$ that it will always be a money maker for NC soft.

Its not that bad considering some of the utter junk thats out there right now.

umm no

I have read back through a couple of patches

95 percent is labeled as

"Fix

and the rest is work that was done by Tulga but never rolled out to live servers.

Vitrium themselves have added very little CONTENT to the game. But one can attribute that to working on the port over of the unity players. Not that they haven't done work. But I haven't seen anything that is eqivalent to the content I see added in patchs from game like LOTRO WOW and EQ2. Those games have patches that feature bug fixes and content additions.

but... looks like thats going to change now.

btw the other guy

Tango - he is now working on the new stargate game. A much better career move for him.

Originally posted by Orlena

Ok, I'll bite, Hadesprime...

Who are the "good developers from Tulga"? ;)

Smeglor is no longer there he has moved on to better opportunities... and for the life of me I can't remember the other fella who did a heck of a lot of work on the game.

what they have left now are those that know how to work with the games existing development tools. They can't afford anyone who can take the game along a more advanced development path. Which is why what you see now is what you are going to get and why all recent patches have been fixes and content additions to whats available in game now. They cannot do major revamps of the game.

Some people will be happy with that. Lots won't however. Hopefully it's enough to give those left at vitrium a reasonable take home pay check.

Vitrium is comprised of former Artifact and Tulga employees minus Bowman. However the good developers from Tulga aren't there anymore. Despite that they seem committed to the game and is perhaps the best developer to handle the game to date.

I have tried to get back into HZ but its showing its age now at over 4 years now. I just got tired of seeing patches where it just featured the line ..."FIXED Insert 4 year old bug here". Plus the grind was getting to me since I was just pretty much dragging a cargo disc around. There are so many games now that are just so much more polished and have tons more content than HZ has. My $15.00 a month was better spent elsewhere. But that was my personal opinion, there are people who enjoy it a great deal and it has some nice features to it.

Considering what you see in game now look and feel wise is always how its going to be. Vitrium hasen't the money or resources to upgrade key components and never will.

However to be fair they have a 14 day free trial.

You will know in that time if the game is for you.

I actually found it much easier to get groups in Vanguard than LOTRO.

LOTRO everyone seems more interested in soloing than group. Which is bad because at level 40 the solo content in LOTR is slim pickings.

I liked LOTRO and I liked VG

However

I can this without much doubt. Had Vanguard launched in a stable fashion and it didn't have all the performance issues it has now... it would have smashed apart all other MMO's LOTRO included and would have challenged WoW's current UNCONTESTED supremacy in the MMO market.

Why ?

Vanguard has many different ways for a character to advance and some interesting twists to the usual MMO grind. LOTRO never challenged WoW because its basically a copy of WoW. It really doesn't do anything different than WoW and is heavily quest centric. I liked LOTRO because it had a decent story line and was yes very well polished. But despite that LOTRO subscriber wise is well over 9.5 million behind WoW.

Originally posted by Orlena

Just a thought:

They said in their latest interview that they will be working on a tier 2 revamp after they complete the tier 6 Labyrinth.  So the developers seem to be well aware of the fact that the game needs content and changing post level 20.  While it is great to evaluate it at any level, in fairness to Virtrium when they've said "We are going to revamp this", it is better to look at what they have done and evaluate based on that.  So a much more accurate assessment of Virtrium's work would be to say "How is the game between levels 1 and 20?" and how are the things that they have changed and developed.

there are many offerings in addition to istaria. Competition dictates that people will offer no quarter to a developer because they can just go elsewhere.

In today's MMO market EQ2 and Vanguard offer better crafting systems than HZ and comparable housing systems. The adventuring side, just about every mmo offers a better experience there.  I mention this to illustrate that HZ doesn't provide a unique enough of an MMO experience to foster the... we gotta be fair to vitrium idea.

To note the game level 1 to 20 is now not half bad. But that was Tulga's work not Vitriums. To that end Vitrium hasen't done much since they took over other than to offer stability and competancy to the game. But then to be fair yes to be fair they do not have the person power that Tulga had. Its going to take them longer to get things done. But this isn't barney the purple dinosuar world where everyone loves one another.

Post level 20 is something they definitely need to take a hard look at. The trend for new players has been good to level 20. After level 20 they get bored and leave.  Last time I played was a few months ago. The post level 20 is still dismal. Its better as a dragon, perhaps they should change the name to istaria, The Dragon chronicles ?

Of course one could say that the best Vitrium can ever hope for is to break even. This game definitely seems to be a passion for them since they obviously aren't in it for the money. That would be a positive I guess.

the horizons community is over rated.

A few months ago I tried the game as a newbie. The response I got on questions was generally cold. There were a couple of helpful replies but the general sentiment towards new players is one of a threatened stance.

They know that as more players try the game Vitrium is going to be FORCED to fix some of the more notable exploits and issues. Fixes that will change the way these old diehards play the game.

The MMO market is tough. As long as the community continues to hang on to old habits the game will eventually fade to dust. In cases like this sooner rather than later.

Originally posted by Recant

I still have the original game box and CD.  The screenshots on the back still look lovely.  I wonder if that old CD will even allow me to play anymore.

I remember how poor the graphics engine was, utterly terrible frame-rates, surely things are better now?  I remember seeing housing plots and thinking - woah, build your own cities... and the starting races looked so nice, especially the dragons.

How did this game pan out in the end, were things ever improved?

performance still bites though improved. But not improved enough. Lets say it performs only just now on par with Vanguard... the graphics arent anywhere near as nice though.

There isnt any content to speak of either. No its not about the quest systems of WoW. I think people get tired of that after awhile. But rather there is no in game lore, no in game content to speak out. People pretty much just drag cargo discs around crafting 10000 swords in a few seconds after having spent days gathering all the materials. Thats pretty much all people do.

2 bankrupticies later its still around.

its a small niche game. its never going to surpass the 10K subscriber mark again. But it won't need to in order to continue to survive.

Vitrium has a vested interest in not pissing off older players. Vitrium needs older players to keep the newer ones. The game won't draw new players on its own.

Perhaps that was the reason for not taking the issue more seriously. This has been happening since the game released.

However its a double edged sword. If that player was behaving in such a way this would drive off new players. But I have found that some in horizons do not like more people playing around in their sandbox. Never grasping that it takes more than their $15.00 a month to keep the game going.

a new player ?

I would be interested in your opinions after you have reached level 20.

be sure to come back with a followup.

a name change ?

interesting... but they are going to have to add a HELL of a lot of content to live up to the new name. I would say more than a hell of a lot, more like light years more. There is no story line in game to support it. Perhaps that will come ?

The labrynth looks interesting. But I wonder how they are going to balance it ? There are now a lot of players in fact I would more than 50 percent that are... multiclassed juggernauts. They will be able to waltz through this place unless Vitrium balances in accordance with this fact. But if they do that the moderates even group will not be able to handle encounters in that place. So thats going to be interesting to watch.

The rest of it was pretty much talk we have seen before.

However improving performance without a client rewrite ? I would be very dubious about any claims such as this. 2 Months ago horizons was still a pig and will continue to be with the current client and underlying engines. Thats a fact they aren't going to be able to avoid. So whats there now is there forever.

problem with eve

is that you have to spend about 6 months just skilling up.

Before that time dont even bother with 0,0 space. Unfortunately thats where all the fun is. Eve has no pve at all worth mentioning. All the the fun is in player politics and combat. Like I said you need to survive the first 6 months first.

Lots do not last those 6 months.

no horizons will never make a comeback

What you see now is whats going to be. Horizons is a game that will always have less than 10,000 active accounts. If that pays the bills for vitrium good for them !!!

But as time goes on Horizons is going to be eclipsed. So much so that it just won't be worth the trouble to bother with anymore. Sad to say but thats the facts.

However Vitrium seems like a good bunch of folks. Willing to keep the game alive. But I wonder if this is a wasted venture for those folks. Their talents could probably be better used else where than on horizons. Better to stick horizons in maintenance mode and try for something else.

Then again I have a feeling the mmo market is going to be a big 1-2-3 game market with many small titles. But with little hope for a working vista version of Horizons how long till people want to actually use those DX10 cards which are gaining more and more momentum all the time ?

Give me warhammer with the crafting of Horizons. I would never leave that game.

Rihahn what game are you talking about there !! Cause I would like to play it.

You definitely aren't talking about Horizons. Unless of course your friend is David Bowman and he gave you the game that HZ was going to be at release but never was eh ?