This topic is a fail.

First of all, these new games are not EQ clones, they are WoW clones. Even EQ is a WoW clone now.

What you really want  to ask is why dont more developers make open world pvp games isnt it?

And the answer is: The big elephant in the room called World of Warcraft.

Games are no longer made by geeks who actually want to play a game.

They are made by people who want to get rich.

How  do you get rich quick. Put out something new and shiny but not so new that it wont attract the WoW crowd. Make tons of money off sales and what few subscriptions you keep. Repeat.

Nope, thats not it.

Yesturday i deleted my UIFiles and then reloaded and game worked fine.

Today i log in and keyboard doesnt work again. I go back out, delete UIFile again, reboot game, and it still doesnt work.

This is lame.

Want to go back to the old days for awhile and see if i can get my love for MMOs back.

BUT. After i get to the character screen in game my keyboard doesnt work, at all.

I can log in fine but after it gets to the char screen and when in game it doenst work at all.

Anyone ever have this problem or know how to fix it?

Originally posted by Ozmodan

SOE has already said they have no intention of making an Everquest 3, that is from the horses mouth, Smedley himself.

Pretty much invalidates everything in this thread.

 You Sir are correct, they are not making EQ3. They are calling it EQ Next so we will talk about that instead.

EQ Next will be a "Reimagining of EQ, not a sequal, i.e. alternate universe.-- Yes please

Built to be much more like EQ then EQ2-- Yes Please

Class system back to how EQs was -- Yes Please

Only wants to use Instance for Dungeons --  WHAT!

Perhaps a special server or two with open Raiding and Death Penalty -- OK, i'm back on the line

But wait, that statement implies that there will not be a death penalty on regualar servers!

I'm starting to get the sick feeling of another WoW type game but in Norrath. WIll i still play it if it is that, ya probably, but man that will be disappointing. They already have EQ2 for that.

Originally posted by TopperH444

Well consider this Verant was EQ1. The good EQ1. Pre-PoP. SOE controls EQ1-2 now. And quite honestly I have lost faith in their ability to make an MMORPG. They are $$ hungry and it would more likely freeze in Peru than see SOE make a good MMO.

 I feel i must state this again.

Yes, Verant did indeed create EQ from the get go, but who pray tell owned Verant at the time???

The answer to that question is Sony. Yes, it is true, Sony did not take over EQ and then let it go to crap, they owned it from the git go.

Here is a small bit of proof for ya. One of the big cities in EQ was Qeynos:

Qeynos - sonyEQ ........ See anything similar there. It is not a coincident.

Verant was created by Sony to produce an MMO, which at the time was in no way a sure fire success. My guess is that if the game failed they would rather it failed with Verant on the box instead of Sony. Of course when it proved to be a huge success they had no problem putting Sony on the box then.

So SOE has created a good MMO in the past. They just have to do it again.

EQ2 is not a bad game, it just doesnt touch what EQ was.

EQ2 was not a huge success because the game pissed off old EQ players because it was so different, many didnt play including myself that preordered the game and bought a new computer so i could run it on high, and the new breed of gamers liked WoW better and they were familiar with Warcraft already.

That is the correct reason for Vanguards failure.

I was a huge supporter of Vanguard as soon as i learned of the game, and i too thought it was going to be what EQ2 should have been. Yes, i drank Brad's koolaid.

And then i got to play it and couldnt really play it at all. Buggy, glitchy and my computer which was pretty decent at the time was having a heart attack trying to run it.

Vanguard is now on life support and though some still play it it will never be anything. Once a MMO leaves that bad of a taste it is hard to get people to come back, even if you put alot of effort into making it better, which SOE has not.

I would also be happy if SOE were to shut down Vanguard, put an actual team on the project and fix the game to where it should have been and what was promised at release. Then you re launch, anyone who had an active account from launch to closure gets 6 months free play, anyone who preordered and played at launch gets 3 months free play.

If they did that, and the game worked as it should i think then people might come back.

They can do all that and rename it EQ3 if they want, as long as it was the game that was originally advertised i would be all over it.

I would take a game like AC any day as well.

I dont mind PVP, i just think it should mean something and not just be a complete slaughter fest with high level people camping the newbie zones. I saw way too much of that in Lineage 2.

Maybe i'm just getting old and memory is fading but it seems that the days when the big games on the market were UO, AC, EQ and DAOC it was the best time to be a MMO Player. Those 4 games were all very good and were all very different from one another.

As i said in my first post i probably will be trying out RIFT when it starts. Some things in it sound cool but alot sounds like the same old story. Very fast leveling solofest where you might actually talk to someone if you need them to finish a quest.

Here is a fun little fact that a friend and i were discussing. At launch RIft will have 5 dungeons (all instanced) in the world. @ for each side and 1 that is open to both. The developers say they hope to have 5 per side soon. Dungeons start at lvl 17.

He was a huge dungeon crawler in EQ, me not as much, and we started counting EQ Vanilla dungeons. We got to 15 and i'm not sure we got them all. And they started at lvl 5.

Games dont feel epic anymore. Why is it a race to get to maximum level? The leveling in EQ and those other old games was much slower then games of today but there was actually something to do in those levels. I dont care if it takes me a week to gain a level as long as i have fun for that week.

At level 5-10 in EQ you were grouping with other players and doing dungeon runs into Blackburrow, Crushbone and Befallen. In WoW you dont even have to talk to anyone until you hit level 15-20, if then.

Now i'm just rambling so i will stop.

But listen up SOE or anyone else who has the marbles to jump off this current MMO train, there is a market here that wants, maybe needs, a game. You will get rich from them, just ask Brad. He got rich enough to start a complany, destroy said company, and still be rich.

(and i would still love it if Brad were to develop a new game, not own mind you but develop)

I was doing a search for Everquest 3 (because i like to cause myself pain) and i found this write up. Its a little old but new to me and i think it states what alot of us old EQers are looking for.

http://www.wolfsheadonline.com/?p=3924#567c5

I'm sure many will blast this post because "NO ONE WANTS TO PLAY A GAME LIKE EVERQUEST AGAIN!!!" and that is ok.

They can have an opinion and my opinion is they are wrong.

SOE does have an opportunity here. They can make the same game that is being made by a dozen companies who all want ot get a piece of that WoW million dollar pie or they can make a game that for sure will get less subsriptions then WoW by far but will cater to an active and vocal MMO crowd that doesnt have a game right now.

If they build a game this way they may only have 300-500 thousand subscriptions but i bet they would keep them for awhile and they wouldnt have a dead game 6 months to a year after launch.

I am way easier to please then the author of the story, they could make a new shinny world with new shinny graphics and then put the entire gameplay system from EQ 1 in it and i would be very happy to give them my $15 a month.

Anyway, there are tons of games like WoW out there, i am going to try Rift but im afraid it will be much closer to WoW then it will be to EQ.

Nothing wrong with WoW, it is a great game for what it is, it just isnt what i want.

Maybe this is the time to advace the genre by actually going back in time to what made the genre so popular in the first place.

SOE has an opportunity here. Sadly i think they will probably fail with it though.

And No full world open PVP fans, this too would not be the game for you. PVP in the Everquest world can work, they certainly have the setup for it, but it will only be a special rules server kind of thing and probably never Free for all.

So bash away.

I loved Minsc as well.

But if we are talking MMOs. I like Nillipus and Dorn alot but i think my favorite has to be Boomba the Big. Did anyone actually buy his pickles?

And here is the kicker.

You all who love the new MMOs like WoW are set, you have your game and even multiple others that can fit the bill. WoW, EQ2 and LoTRs are more or less the same game so you have plenty to choose.

Those of us who are looking for something else would really like some kind developer to make us the game that we are looking for. Make us EQ again but with a new world and maybe some shinny new graphics.

You guys have plenty of games, if we want our experience again we are forced to play a dated game that most of us have already put years into and arent that exited about going back. Not to mention that those games are not even what we are looking for anymore for the most part.

Thanks!

Quick question if i may.

Is GW2 going to be an open world or is it going to be the same style as GW? I think i read something that said it was going to be open but i cant find it now.

Originally posted by altairzq

Originally posted by safwd 

Maybe the game will last 1 month, maybe it will last 10 years. It really doesnt matter as things go but as long as someone is actually enjoying it why the hell does anyone else care.

 

You don't get the point, we have the feeling they are trying to sell a crappy car here.

Then dont buy the car.

Are you really all here to save those poor fools who may still be wanting to play Darkfall?
How about asking them if they want your help.

Originally posted by warpp

Are you some sort of dumb ass? {mod edit} This forum was created so people can talk about DF in anyway they deem fit and that include negativity as well. This is not the main DF forum and the mods here are not going to lock threads that don't agree wirth the fanboys way of thinking.

Now for the next part of my post...You and your rabid fanboys come here day after day telling us about these mass battles or claiming that there are no hacks in DF..LOL(That was proven to be bullshit). We have been asking for vids of these mass battle that you and your rabid fanboys claim DF has been having but you still have not provided any vids showing these battles.

We have seen screenshots with 40 people in them but nothing with this 200 people claim.If DF is that good and you don't like these forums and the people that have negative things to say about DF then why put yourself through this shit everyday? You could save yourself ther pain and stick to the main DF forums where everyone agree with your views on DF.

This is a mmorpg site that has a small forum for DF and people call talk or curse about the game as much as they like,it's an open forum. {mod edit} You are not going to convince many of the people on here that DF is anything but a pile of dated boring crap.

You have 6-7k in your paid beta and within three months it will be half that. You are desperate to convince us because you know that 7k players will not keep your pile of shit game afloat.

We are still waiting for these vids of these epic battles...isnt funny that as yet you and your rabid buddys have fail to post one?

Well im not a fanboy first of all. I dont play Darkfall nor will i be playing Darkfall so wrong on that one.
 

And why the hell does anyone playing this game have to go out of their way to post anything for people like you and yours. If they post a video with 200 people fighting does anyone here really think that you wont find something to bitch about.

And while you are right and this is a free forum so you can post anything you want, stupid or not, there are still people here who want to here about whats taking place in this game and do want to see these types of posts. So you tell him not to come on here with that shit is once again stupid.

And yes, i am a the dumbass. Im spending my time hawking a forum for a game that i obviously hate just so i can prove how cool i am by bashing on anyone who posts something positive. Yep, thats me the dumbass.

Maybe the game will last 1 month, maybe it will last 10 years. It really doesnt matter as things go but as long as someone is actually enjoying it why the hell does anyone else care.

Really, actually read one of your own posts. {mod edit}. Have fun though.

Originally posted by warpp

Originally posted by Kasmos

The Murder Herd (my guild) got atttacked this evening by over 8 separate guilds working together. I'd say the numbers were well over 200. I got lag for the first time since I started so I dropped my visual quality from 1600x1200 on high to 1024x768 on high, and my lag immediately stopped. The clans were the Old Timers Guild, CLAW, Severnity Now, Vindicators, Awful Company, and a couple others. We were attacked while at our guild city and managed to hold them off, pushing them both north towards the middle of Agon. Eventually our enemies ported out or ran off, and the battle finally ended.

Definitely one hell of a time, and I would like to thank all guilds that participated in this awesome battle. By far my best experience in Darkfall so far (seeing about 100 mana missels and 50 people firing arrows flying in your direction was definitely an amazing experience).

Sorry for being drunk and posting this, but I wanted to let you all know that relatively large battles are now happening on a daily basis. We saw 2 clans declare siege status against two other clans this evening, and they are the first 2 sieges to happen on the server.

So shit is already starting to get dirty. Looks like I'll be up until 7 A.M. again (thank god I don't have class or work tomorrow ).....

Why do the rabid fanboys keep coming here telling us about these massive battles that are getting bigger everyday. We are not interested and DF for many of us is a heap of dated shite. Instead of telling us ,why don't you maske a vid of these 200 people battles instead of showing screenshots that look like its more like 50 people and not 200.

Lets see a vid or stfu and post your shit on the main DF forums where the rest of your fanboys are waiting.

Ya you ignorant slobs. Why do you guys who are playing Darkfall keep coming onto the Darkfall forum and posting about the fun you are having in Darkfall. That is just ignorant shit.
Why do you think that anyone who visits the Darkfall forum would want to hear anything about Darkfall???
 

And to come on here without videos or anything, you know that its your job to prove that the game you are currently playing actually exists dont you.

Stupid fanboys talking about a game on their own forum. What are they going to do next, actually try to get others to want to play too.

FOR THE LOVE OF FREAKING GOD, get over it people. Darkfall actually launched, people are actually playing it, and people are actually liking it. And while you have spoken, and Darkfall is a heap of dated shite. people still seem to be playing it. So how about you actually let them have the forum that was created so people could talk about darkfall.

{mod edit}

Originally posted by Josher

Vanilla WOW had an acceptable death penalty.  It did sting back then when money wasn't flowing like candy.  A light or worthless death penalty is WAR.  When you use it as a method of travel is when it becomes a nuisance rather than a deterent.  EQ's death penalty was not only annoying, it was a kick to the nuts.  People who tolerated a penalty that could result in hours of lost playtime are simply masochistic or just bored and have nothing better to do with their time.  It didn't make the game harder.  It made it more time consuming.  Time consuming isn't difficulty.  Killing 1000 pigs in a group without moving instead of 30 pigs solo doesn't make the game harder.  It just drags out the experience, because we all know EQ didn't have content.  It just had grinding.  Lots and lots of grinding and sitting down between fights which even made downtime a grind.  That changed through the years, but it shifted when Blizzard came into the picture.

Old MMOs were awesome for THEIR TIME when there was little to compare them to.  They're not awesome now.  Much like DOom was great in its day, but pales compared to today's FPSs.

Having no in game map didn't make the game harder.  It made it annoying and tedious.  Killing 20000 pigs to level didn't mean you had intelligence.  It meant you had patience.  Camping a spawn didn't take brains once you got the group together.  It just required monotonous repetition for hours.  Having no quests didn't mean it took more skill to level.  You don't HAVE TO do any quests in WOW.  You can go randomly kill mobs if you want. 

I just don't find fun in games the artificially stretch out the time it takes to accomplish something.  Theres a limit.  No one wants it handed to you, but you shouldn't have to treat it like a job either.  EQ had to be played like a job.  You HAD TO dedicate hours at a time to accomplish anything.  Many hours.  Not fun.

Don't mistake nostalgia with good gameplay. 

 

 

 

And here is the root of the whole problem. What does the amount of time it takes to do something matter when you are talking about games that are not supposed to have an ending?
 

Oblivion has an ending, once you get to a certain spot you have won the game. MMOs are not supposed to have a "You won" so why does it matter how long it takes to accomplish things (withijn reason).

And people like to say how EQ forced you to spend so much time and that is just not true. EQ didnt force you to do anything you didnt want to do. I played for 4 years straight and never was forced to play any longer then i wanted to. I certainly wasnt a die hard player, i was in the military at the time and had a wife and kids. I never was forced to run a 7+ hour raid because i chose not to run them. I played how i wanted to play, sure i was not able to get every piece of loot in the game with my play style but i never ran out of things to do.

The people who complain that EQ made you play too much are those who wanted everything the game offered but were unwilling to put in the time it took to get some of those things. That wasnt me though, i just dealt with the fact that i would never get a drop of Naggy, i didnt whine about it.

I have made my stance known on this previously and yes, i am with the OP and it seems many others.

People have brought up points on why the new breed of games are better and i would like to talk about a few of those.

Im hearing that the old grinding of EQ is no good but the new questing of WoW is much better. So it was a grind when you went out and decided that sitting at this camp and killing 50+ Orcs is the best exp i can get at this level, but it is an epic quest when some guy with a ? over his head tells you he wants you to go kill 50+ Quillboars. The grind is the exact same. The insane exp and leveling speed of WoW is what makes it seem less grindy then EQ, not the mob smashing. As a teen through 20 horde i was told to kill SO many quillboars and centaurs that  i nearly went insane, but i guess that isnt a grind.
And the insane exp speed may make the grind seem less but it doesnt help the game out. In EQ 2 months after launch you were maybe mid level and still finding tons of things to do, in WoW 2 months after launch you were max level and wondering what to do.

And yes, i do believe that a heavy DP (though i didnt think EQ had that bad of a DP,  but then i also didnt die that much) and CR does add fear to the game. But you pick whatever work you want for it, i suppose even annoyance.
In EQ if you saw a cave that you had never explored before you thought about whether it was worth going in there. There could be something really cool in there that you will be the first to find but there could also be a high level mob in there and dieing would make for a touchy CR. In WoW you just ran in the cave, because who cares if you die.
In EQ i really wanted to see what kind of mobs were in the high level zones, but i respected those zones and didnt go in because i knew i would die and have a hard time gettnig  my body (or i just went in naked), in WoW i just ran in the level 50 zones when i was level 20 because it was no big deal if i died.
In EQ if you did something stupid and got your group whiped people were really pissed at you and you really didnt want to make that mistake, in WoW sure people got mad if you wiped the group but it really didnt hurt much so wasnt that big a deal.
I feel that the heavy DP and CR made the player base smarter players, you had to be or people would not group with you.
Dieing actually became a good way of quick travel in WoW. When i was told that the best way to get from point A to point B in game was to just run until you die, you will pop up and the closest graveyard, res and run some more. Because you will keep popping up at graveyards farther along until you get to where you are going. That was the most insane thing i had heard in a MMO yet.

Every class should be soloable, the who game should be soloable. WHAT. As a big fan of soloing in EQ i think that is just an insane statement. This genre was originally made by a bunch of guys who liked to sit around with their friends and play D&D, the game that you played with other people. I cant believe that the pioneers of MMOs were hoping to make vibrant virtual worlds where thousands upon thousands of people could play together simultaniosly yet never interact with one another. No, i think the genre was set up so that thousands upon thousands of players could play together and rely upon one another and build a community. See, there have always been games that you could solo all the way through, they are called solo games. EQ had it right yet again i think. Of the original 14 classes 3 could solo extremely well, 6 could solo and 5 could not solo well or really at all. That is a nice breakdown because it gave you plenty of options if you wanted a solo class yet still was group based. Solo should for sure be an option in MMOs, but it should also be a more difficult and less rewarding option.

This is getting long so i will end it here, but i have so much more.

Originally posted by Netzoko

Originally posted by safwd

The game is releaseing, it is actually real.

Your idiotic war is over.

Now how about you just let people play it who want to play it and not worry about it since you obviously dont.

 

Is it? Where can I buy it?

Yes, i guess you got me there. Perhaps it still will not release and you are free to ride that horse until it is finally dead.
 

But i think we both know it is near dead now.

I really dont care, i doubt i will be playing the game. But your just saying shit now to say shit.

First it was never going to release, now it may release but should be F2P because it sucks so bad.

Im sure you have a whole lineup of stuff you can say for every possible outcome for this release.

But hell, i'll answer your stupid original question for you. Because they can make money off of the game. There are obviously people wanting to play it or you wouldnt be having such a wonderful little hate war.

The game is releaseing, it is actually real.

Your idiotic war is over.

Now how about you just let people play it who want to play it and not worry about it since you obviously dont.

Originally posted by winter

Originally posted by safwd

Again for the simpletons.

DF Audience- FFA PVP with full Loot Crowd

WoW Audience- No fear linear PVE that is easy to get into and has little to no consequences crowd, and intelligent Chimps.

His numbers are based off the audience. Do you get it now.

 

 His numbers where something even he admits he made up out of thin air, and stated as fact. Do you get it now?

 I have little problem with the statement in itself, I just get tired of the fans making up BS to power their arguements.  (and yes some of the trolls are just as bad) If someones gonna make up shit like, only the trolls said DF was not a niche game (would make WAR or even WoW like sub numbers) etc then I WILL point it out as BS. I have no doubt if I go around making up shit about DF thats negative the Fans will call me on it.

  So correct me if I'm wrong your saying we should just accept what the fans say without question even when we know they have no facts to back up their points? Personally i'd say doing such would be the act of a simpleton.

You've already stated WoW is for intelligent chimps, so I assume you believe that anyone that plays DF is somerhow smarter and better. Guess the whole "different people have different playstyles and everyone should be able to play whats fun to them without being labled a "intelligent chimp" point would be wasted here.

And here i was thinking that everyone understood that he wasnt actually stating those numbers as fact, guess not.
 

But lets just say that he was stating these numbers as fact. If so then the numbers he quoted for WoW would be about 5% of the population, and most who are willing to put a reasonable number on the audience size for a ffa pvp game with full loot they would probably say somewhere between 200 and 300K. So if you take the middle of that figure his numbers would have then made up about 4% of the target audience for Darkfall. (No, im not saying Darkfall will have that many, im saying that that is a reasonable number to look for if the game is any good)
So it appears that for numbers he pulled out of his ass he did pretty well.

Of course you dont just accept anything that the fans say, nor the non fans. But you also dont jump on something that you know was not actually based on any fact by acting like you actually think he was trying to state fact.

Perhaps the Chimp comment was too much, im not sure it is because the game is really not complicated, but perhaps. I know quite small children can figure it out. But anyway, i said others that WoW was made for also.
And no, i dont think Darkfall players will be any smarter or better then WoW players. Darkfall will probably pull in a large amount of tools due to the ganking aspect.

You did make a very good point about the "different people having different playstyles and they should be able to play whats fun for them without being labeled" but since this is a Darkfall forum, and i was actually showing support for the game that this forum is for, im wondering if you are going through the threads and telling everyone on here that is bashing DF and its playerbase the same thing.