The game needs a UI overhaul and a graphic overhaul.

WoD and SWTOR are the only games which have my interest peeked and mainly due to their awesome ip's and the awesome companies bringing those games to market. That still does not mean I am on board with either games other then just being interested in their development and ultimate outcome as mmoRPG's.

The same thing happened to me. Conctact your CC company or bank and contest the charges. Remove all CC info from you account once you unsubscribe. Only use paypal or time cards to activate mmo's in the future IMHO.

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Originally posted by Vhaln

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Originally posted by M1sf1t
So what is the point behind pvp and committing crimes or arresting criminals other then just gaining stuff?

Can guilds/gangs/enforcers, etc.. hold territory is there any actual benefit from pvp whatsoever that allows players to control, shape and own areas of the game world like in EVE? Unless there is a benefit to pvp'ing as in I can hold, control and benefit from the act of engaging other players then I'd pass on this game as I've already played GTA and COX.

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I think a lot of people have been wondering that, and the very closely related question, what's the point, in terms of longterm playability, a monthly fee, or just what will keep people coming back for more than a week or two.

Levels that don't mean much? I can see why they don't want levels to do much, but they need to offer something that players get excited about accruing. Given the setting, I think the obvious choice would be money and cool stuff they can buy with it. Still, doesn't have to create a huge power disparity, but I think lots of people would get hooked on just collecting stuff they can accumulate and show off in one way or another. Especially, if there's a large element of customization to it.

They could even make it work more like xp, where players can't give it or even trade it to other players at all, for obvious gameplay reasons. Guess it would have to work seperately alongside regular money that player will be trading, though..?

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I honestly have no great desire to play "loot grind" which what "collecting stuff" amounts to in the end. I want a world that I and others can shape and mold online. If I was really into "collecting stuff" I'd probably play a mired of other online games which have the "collecting stuff" idea as their premise. It would of been nice if this game were setup in such a fashion where PVP would actually mattered and players would be able to control sections or portions of the game world.

I guess that is not going to happen period with this game. I was hoping for a little more then a item carrot on a stick style game play from this game.

So what is the point behind pvp and committing crimes or arresting criminals other then just gaining stuff?

Can guilds/gangs/enforcers, etc.. hold territory is there any actual benefit from pvp whatsoever that allows players to control, shape and own areas of the game world like in EVE? Unless there is a benefit to pvp'ing as in I can hold, control and benefit from the act of engaging other players then I'd pass on this game as I've already played GTA and COX.

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Originally posted by TJ_420

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Originally posted by Gobwar

I really don't get your point that people using third party communicating programs have some kind of advantage... Over what? Catching their friends?

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Then why not include a global friend chat? That being my point. If realism is the goal, ban 3rd party communication so everyone is forced to only talk to people withing 10 meters (whatever).
Guilds will be able to coordanate moves,, hunt and PK in tandem. Ask info and directions from anywhere, call for help, etc.... Single players or people with just a couple friends must find someone (hopefully friendly) to ask directions and such... If realism was the reason to only allow you to chat with people in visual range- third party vent for guilds should be against the eula to put that limit on everyone.
I find it funny you cannot see my point. If vent is no big deal for guilds, why not friends lists and global chat?

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Never going to happen ever period.

1.) They would basically kill off the majority of their subs if any from folks looking for a game like MO who are part of guilds/clans from other games.

2.) They would have to use some intrusive piece of software to scan for VOIP software and that alone would incur the wrath of many a gamer who detest spyware in their games.

There are more reasons why they would not prevent users from using VOIP but I let other people put those reason up.

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Originally posted by MadnessRealm
I actually stopped DarkFall too (temporarily I hope).

So many things in DarkFall that I would love to try but it's only accessible by the strongest guild..... it's come to the point where it's annoying. I mean, let's be honest, small guilds can hardly survive nor access the "end-game".  Alright you can get a Ship, but you lack the manpower to use all the cannons and the extra members to heal or repair ship while your enemy is coming your way with a Ship-Of-The-Line, 30 players shooting cannon balls at you, 50 players throwing nukes at you, etc.

Then there's the crafting where you can't craft important items (Astrolabe, Orb of Might, etc) .....the crazy inflation on the market, the greedy community who can only answer you with "Well deal with it and shut up and go grind your wood". There's also the obvious exploits around towns, the shitty alignement system, name them all.

So many things Aventurine has yet to fix and it won't get fixed for a while longer, which is why I hope to stop temporarily only. I mean, let's be honest, the game is awesome, but it does have many issues and if you say the game is perfectly fine, you are insane.

Oh well, it was fun while it last and hopefully AV will listen to some of the many great suggestions on the forum to fix the game. For now I'll be looking for a new game kill time.

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Hmmmm.....have you tried Ryzom? It's skill based, everything is player made, the housing system is about the same as DF, open world to explore, and pvp is consensual with pvp areas. The skill system is kind of interesting in that you can mix and match skills sets (aka stanzas) to make your own attacks, spells, buffs, heals, etc. I've been playing it on the side and right now am debating between this game and Ryzom.

The OP's post is known as a logical fallacy. To be exact its an appeal to emotion.

www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-emotion.html

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Originally posted by Kyleran
Odd are, some folks/clans will figure out a way to exploit in MO and you'll be right back where you started from.
Have yet to see a game that doesn't have this problem, what matters is how you deal with it.
 

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Correction, what matters is how the company producing and supporting the MMO deals with it.

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Originally posted by trashburnin

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Originally posted by M1sf1t

 

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Originally posted by Kyleran

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Originally posted by trashburnin

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Originally posted by StrixMaxima

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Originally posted by Kyleran 
CCP and EVE prove your assertion is incorrect, a PVP game can bring in 300K subs or so, which is more than enough to keep AV going I'm thinking.
Not every game has to appeal to the mass market.  There's nothing wrong in having games like DFO which require a player to 'pay their dues' as it were, and part of the fun is overcoming the challenge this sort of world provides.
MMORPG's are about progression, and players who'd put in the effort get greater rewards (for everyone else, there's FPS'ers)
Now perhaps what many people would really like is a good MMOFPS which there is a real shortage of right now, but that isn't what DFO is nor should players expect it to be.
 

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 However, what is the future of a game where the gap between veterans and newbies is so wide?

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What game has less of a gap between newbies and veterans?  Starting chars have around 200 hps, maxed out hp chars that don't even exist yet will have 450 hps. 
In what pvp mmorpg does a max level/developed char have less than 125% more HPs more than a newly created character? Oh thats right, NO GAME!  Quit your crying and  find another game that is easier for you if you can't handle developing your char like everyone else.
They have already killed all the long term progression besides stats, what more do you lazy whiners want so Darkfall can be easier for you?
 

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I have to agree with this post. I think DFO is far more balanced than many other level based games out there.
Right now I'm currently playing Aion, and just today I was in a raid of about 25 players in the level 25-35 range and we went through a rift into pigeon territory and just 2 level 50 players cut through us like scythe and killed every one of us and there was nothing we could do to fight back. I'm suspecting a pack of 25 newer players in DFO would cause real havoc if they ran across two players who'd been in the game for a long time.
Of course, in Aion you can play about 20 levels w/o ever running into PVP (and I'm really learning to hate this) but overall I think DF does a decent job of getting players into the core of the action pretty quickly.
From what I have read, looks like about 3 months of reasonable playtime will get a person to a competitive level, and compared to EVE, that's pretty good.  Yes, I know, you can tackle in the first week in EVE, but most players don't really head out to the wilds of 0.0 until they have 3-6 months under their belts.
 
 
 

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Ummm....3 months of playing day in and day out hardcore (6-8 hours a day everyday of the week) yes maybe but not as a casual player. Fact is to be honest the grind in DF is very hardcore. First there is the stat gap and then the skill points gap for weapons, weapons skills, spells, overall spell schools, stamina, sprinting, riding, jumping to cover on top of understanding the game mechanics. 3 months if you play like a average person will mean that you are only just being able to take on medium mob spawns if you min/max your stats and skill points and grind hardcore on these areas. This involves maxing out your harvesting skills to take advantage of the fact that they grant a lot to certain stat points and provide a lot reagents for spells. For example I went hardcore and got my herb gathering skill to 100 which is the cap and my herb mastery to about 89 points(100 is the cap for this mastery). In total I raised my wisdom all the way form 25 points to about 39 points and my intelligence from 21 to about 28 points. This was basically harvesting like a made man for about 10+ hours a day in 2 half days.

PVP in DFO is a lot harder to get competitive in unless you are part a very large group and only then you'll probably be sniping with a bow but you will not be competive in 1v1 pvp in DF.
Unlike in EVE were I can be helpful in just under a 2 weeks with the right build which has me being a tackler for a fleet and allows me to run level 1 and 2 missions for ISK generation and pvp'ing solo if I like in 3 months again with the right skills and knowledge of the game. In DFO you wont be doing anything pvp wise in the same time frame except being a notch on some other players belt. PVE wise you are going to kill goblins until your eyes bleed. The only area where this is not true is in naval combat where you can man a cannon because that is the only pvp part of the game that does not require stat or skill points.

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3 months and you can only kill medium spawns? That is pretty bad.
I didn't kill goblins beyond my first two days in game.  You seriously killed goblins till your eyes bled? That is pretty funny b/c they have such horrible loot and probably the worst mob to farm considering their difficulty vs loot.  I went straight from goblins to med-high mobs, using terrain like trees and rocks to provide some cover from projectiles.  Hell I killed a dark dragon solo in my first month, it took me 2 hours of mana missle but I did it.  totally not worth it tho, loot sucked at the time for that mob.
to be blunt, my advice to you is to stop sucking, gathering is nowhere near as fast in raising stats as combat skills used against mobs and nobody gathers for regs, thats just a side benefit.  Wisdom is only good for crafting really.  You should have seen how slowly skills raised before, it would take an entire day hitting something non-stop just to get 50 weapon skill.
 

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My advice is that you learn to read and work on your reading comprehension. I never said I played the game for 3 months as I was commenting on the post I quoted which used 3 months as measurement for player to become proficient at pvp enough to last longer then 2-3 hits by a rank 100 fireball spell.

As for you killing a dragon using just mana missle (the weakest damage spell skill in the game) well sorry I don't believe it. Then again you mentioned you played during the first month so probably the dragon bugged out hence your mana missile victory or you are just flat out lying. Anyways your experience is that of someone who seems to be playing (or played) the game at a hardcore level and probably bugged out mobs during the first month of the game. Also my comment was meant to reflect that of someone not playing like a loser 8+ hours a day, bugging out mobs, macroig and playing more at a casual pace (around 2-3 hours a day) will not see the same gains as a "hardcore player'. Thanks for proving my point for me.

Well I was talking to a clan mate about the current goings on with the market and materials. Since gold has lost a ton of value (due to various game breaking reasons) it is currently cheaper to buy vendor rank 20 weapons and armor then it would be to make them. Depending on the costs of ore, wood and gold needed to craft these weapons you'd be shooting yourself in the foot not selling your mats. Then on top of this you add in the fact that a well developed character can easily farm using vendor gear and then replace this gear with mob dropped rank 30-40 gear and armor and you see that crafting armor/weapons outside of plate/rank 50 is basically not worth the effort.

The mats you use making armor below rank 40 and below are more valuable being sold on the market then actually being used to craft. As I said before a lot of this has to due with the value of in game gold just plummeting as players with literally millions of gold are buying up mats at outrageous prices. So if you've farmed a ton of mats are dead serious about crafting I'd suggest you wait until gold increases in value to see your money back on rank 40 and below gear or eat the loss or better yet sell your mats, buy vendor gear and farm for rank 40 gear. The later of the options mentioned will probably see you with a lot more gold then if you were to buy off the market or farm mats yourself.

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Originally posted by trashburnin

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Originally posted by StrixMaxima

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Originally posted by Kyleran 
CCP and EVE prove your assertion is incorrect, a PVP game can bring in 300K subs or so, which is more than enough to keep AV going I'm thinking.
Not every game has to appeal to the mass market.  There's nothing wrong in having games like DFO which require a player to 'pay their dues' as it were, and part of the fun is overcoming the challenge this sort of world provides.
MMORPG's are about progression, and players who'd put in the effort get greater rewards (for everyone else, there's FPS'ers)
Now perhaps what many people would really like is a good MMOFPS which there is a real shortage of right now, but that isn't what DFO is nor should players expect it to be.
 

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However, what is the future of a game where the gap between veterans and newbies is so wide?

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What game has less of a gap between newbies and veterans?  Starting chars have around 200 hps, maxed out hp chars that don't even exist yet will have 450 hps. 
In what pvp mmorpg does a max level/developed char have less than 125% more HPs more than a newly created character? Oh thats right, NO GAME!  Quit your crying and  find another game that is easier for you if you can't handle developing your char like everyone else.
They have already killed all the long term progression besides stats, what more do you lazy whiners want so Darkfall can be easier for you?
 

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There are a handful of guys who have max vital in DF on the NA server. Even with 400 health that is a huge advantage in PvP let alone all the other skills, spells and stats which are going to be just as high compared to a new player. This isn't even mentioning their better gear and food buffs, access to better potions, etc..

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Originally posted by Kyleran

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Originally posted by trashburnin

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Originally posted by StrixMaxima

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Originally posted by Kyleran 
CCP and EVE prove your assertion is incorrect, a PVP game can bring in 300K subs or so, which is more than enough to keep AV going I'm thinking.
Not every game has to appeal to the mass market.  There's nothing wrong in having games like DFO which require a player to 'pay their dues' as it were, and part of the fun is overcoming the challenge this sort of world provides.
MMORPG's are about progression, and players who'd put in the effort get greater rewards (for everyone else, there's FPS'ers)
Now perhaps what many people would really like is a good MMOFPS which there is a real shortage of right now, but that isn't what DFO is nor should players expect it to be.
 

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 However, what is the future of a game where the gap between veterans and newbies is so wide?

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What game has less of a gap between newbies and veterans?  Starting chars have around 200 hps, maxed out hp chars that don't even exist yet will have 450 hps. 
In what pvp mmorpg does a max level/developed char have less than 125% more HPs more than a newly created character? Oh thats right, NO GAME!  Quit your crying and  find another game that is easier for you if you can't handle developing your char like everyone else.
They have already killed all the long term progression besides stats, what more do you lazy whiners want so Darkfall can be easier for you?
 

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I have to agree with this post. I think DFO is far more balanced than many other level based games out there.
Right now I'm currently playing Aion, and just today I was in a raid of about 25 players in the level 25-35 range and we went through a rift into pigeon territory and just 2 level 50 players cut through us like scythe and killed every one of us and there was nothing we could do to fight back. I'm suspecting a pack of 25 newer players in DFO would cause real havoc if they ran across two players who'd been in the game for a long time.
Of course, in Aion you can play about 20 levels w/o ever running into PVP (and I'm really learning to hate this) but overall I think DF does a decent job of getting players into the core of the action pretty quickly.
From what I have read, looks like about 3 months of reasonable playtime will get a person to a competitive level, and compared to EVE, that's pretty good.  Yes, I know, you can tackle in the first week in EVE, but most players don't really head out to the wilds of 0.0 until they have 3-6 months under their belts.

 
 

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Ummm....3 months of playing day in and day out hardcore (6-8 hours a day everyday of the week) yes maybe but not as a casual player. Fact is to be honest the grind in DF is very hardcore. First there is the stat gap and then the skill points gap for weapons, weapons skills, spells, overall spell schools, stamina, sprinting, riding, jumping to cover on top of understanding the game mechanics. 3 months if you play like a average person will mean that you are only just being able to take on medium mob spawns if you min/max your stats and skill points and grind hardcore on these areas. This involves maxing out your harvesting skills to take advantage of the fact that they grant a lot to certain stat points and provide a lot reagents for spells. For example I went hardcore and got my herb gathering skill to 100 which is the cap and my herb mastery to about 89 points(100 is the cap for this mastery). In total I raised my wisdom all the way form 25 points to about 39 points and my intelligence from 21 to about 28 points. This was basically harvesting like a made man for about 10+ hours a day in 2 half days.

PVP in DFO is a lot harder to get competitive in unless you are part a very large group and only then you'll probably be sniping with a bow but you will not be competive in 1v1 pvp in DF.

Unlike in EVE were I can be helpful in just under a 2 weeks with the right build which has me being a tackler for a fleet and allows me to run level 1 and 2 missions for ISK generation and pvp'ing solo if I like in 3 months again with the right skills and knowledge of the game. In DFO you wont be doing anything pvp wise in the same time frame except being a notch on some other players belt. PVE wise you are going to kill goblins until your eyes bleed. The only area where this is not true is in naval combat where you can man a cannon because that is the only pvp part of the game that does not require stat or skill points.

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Originally posted by xephonics
It is kinda true tho, atleast for a decent portion of the "hardcore" pvp'ers

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Your right and so is the op.

Lets also had exploiting game mechanics which were not intended to work in the manner some "hardcore pvpers" use them to avoid consequences (going red) to the list along with justifying hacking and macro'ing. It is truly sad what some people consider to be okay for the sake at "wtfpwn'ing" in pvp even though they are fighting the equivalent of a 5 year old in game. What is even more laughable is when they make videos of their ganking and then its discovered they only go after n00bs or they are exposed for hacking/exploits after proclaiming themselves PVP gods.

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Originally posted by DarthRaiden

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Originally posted by jimmyman99

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Originally posted by trashburnin

When I play an MMO, I don't cry about advantages other players have that  put more effort into the game than me and are obtainable to me.  I used to cry in WoW because other people had abilities I did not have access to nomatter what I did, like WotF in Arena, an extreme advantage. 
Macroing is allowed but you can only macro so many things and it is much much slower than if you played the game normally.  I had been arguing for increased skill gains in PVE since release and i'm glad they finally did that.
Stat gains are faster at low level and slow down at higher levels.  AV has been making the game easier for casuals to catch up with vets constantly and a lot of vets aren't very happy that AV had to dumb down their game so that the lazy whiners could catch up to them when they had to put 6x  more time and effort than the casuals.  
Developing your character is part of the competition and these kind of games aren't as fun when progression stops for various reasons. 
you stat-difference whiners are asking AV to ruin their game just like other games have been ruined because of lazy whiners wanting to be able to beat someone who has invested more time into their character.  This has happened in other games already.
you have low stats and die a lot?   suck it up like the rest of us you big baby, its your own fault for not seeing Darkfalls potential before, now you have to play catch up, deal with it or go find another easier dumbed down game that lets noobs and retards win like in WoW.  Darkfall isn't going to die because the lazy crybabies can't catch up to people have put more effort into developing their character, Darkfall will die when they piss off all the veteran players by allowing the lazy whiners to catch up to them with 10x less effort.  The vets will go to a different game when that happens.  One where they don't allow retards to compete with the best.  I never macroed melee and never bloodwalled and I have 390 hps, why would I want to continue to play a game where they keep allowing people who don't put as much time or effort into developing their char to beat me? 
There are so many people who macro for months only to find out they suck at the game and that extra 50 HP cushion really doesn't do much at all when your aim isn't great.
BTW I enjoy fighting multiple enemies at a time, when you are fighting two guys at same time their HP pool and damage output is always greater than mine and it takes player skill to overcome so even tho I have more HP than both of them and do more damage than both of them I am still challenged and at a disadvantage but I still stand a chance.  If everyone can easily get 450 HPs and have same damage as I do it won't be as fun for me because although I will still be able to beat players 1v1 I will nearly always lose in 2v1 and this is a group pvp game and I like to solo so that will probably be the day I quit Darkfall.
 

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Do you realize that the majority of the population is casual? If you restrict casual players access to the game, if they cannot compete with the macro grinders/no life people then it is YOU that will suffer. Once the casuals quit, who will u play with? Other people like yourself? All 20 of them?

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Always stood under the impression that casuals are usualy  the macroers, they do things in RL and let macros working for them , the hardcore is out in the wild skilling 2x - 6x faster at the keybord ;)

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Then you heard it wrong. Hardcore players are macro'ing when they are away from the keyboards (aka asleep, eating, etc) and then going into the wild and raising their skills faster off mobs when they are back at their keyboards. Look up the word "efficiency" this is what a hardcore player strives for instead of simply working harder like a lemming.

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Originally posted by trashburnin

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Originally posted by DarthRaiden

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Originally posted by jimmyman99

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Originally posted by trashburnin

When I play an MMO, I don't cry about advantages other players have that  put more effort into the game than me and are obtainable to me.  I used to cry in WoW because other people had abilities I did not have access to nomatter what I did, like WotF in Arena, an extreme advantage. 
Macroing is allowed but you can only macro so many things and it is much much slower than if you played the game normally.  I had been arguing for increased skill gains in PVE since release and i'm glad they finally did that.
Stat gains are faster at low level and slow down at higher levels.  AV has been making the game easier for casuals to catch up with vets constantly and a lot of vets aren't very happy that AV had to dumb down their game so that the lazy whiners could catch up to them when they had to put 6x  more time and effort than the casuals.  
Developing your character is part of the competition and these kind of games aren't as fun when progression stops for various reasons. 
you stat-difference whiners are asking AV to ruin their game just like other games have been ruined because of lazy whiners wanting to be able to beat someone who has invested more time into their character.  This has happened in other games already.
you have low stats and die a lot?   suck it up like the rest of us you big baby, its your own fault for not seeing Darkfalls potential before, now you have to play catch up, deal with it or go find another easier dumbed down game that lets noobs and retards win like in WoW.  Darkfall isn't going to die because the lazy crybabies can't catch up to people have put more effort into developing their character, Darkfall will die when they piss off all the veteran players by allowing the lazy whiners to catch up to them with 10x less effort.  The vets will go to a different game when that happens.  One where they don't allow retards to compete with the best.  I never macroed melee and never bloodwalled and I have 390 hps, why would I want to continue to play a game where they keep allowing people who don't put as much time or effort into developing their char to beat me? 
There are so many people who macro for months only to find out they suck at the game and that extra 50 HP cushion really doesn't do much at all when your aim isn't great.
BTW I enjoy fighting multiple enemies at a time, when you are fighting two guys at same time their HP pool and damage output is always greater than mine and it takes player skill to overcome so even tho I have more HP than both of them and do more damage than both of them I am still challenged and at a disadvantage but I still stand a chance.  If everyone can easily get 450 HPs and have same damage as I do it won't be as fun for me because although I will still be able to beat players 1v1 I will nearly always lose in 2v1 and this is a group pvp game and I like to solo so that will probably be the day I quit Darkfall.
 

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Do you realize that the majority of the population is casual? If you restrict casual players access to the game, if they cannot compete with the macro grinders/no life people then it is YOU that will suffer. Once the casuals quit, who will u play with? Other people like yourself? All 20 of them?

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Always stood under the impression that casuals are usualy  the macroers, they do things in RL and let macros working for them , the hardcore is out in the wild skilling 2x - 6x faster at the keybord ;)
 
About the stat difference ..is the scape goat players who loose often blame instead on working on their skills that is arranging and getting skilled with the hotbar, skills regarding when and which support spell to use, when and what escape way to use, twitch skills, what paper skill in what order to skill up etc..  

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exactly, in fact I hardly ever macro because I'm usually playing the game.  How hard is it to set up a simple macro to click to cast a spell on an afk person before you go to bed or before you go to work?  If you are macroing when you could be playing the game you have a strange sense of fun.
 
Macroing is not illegal either, afk-macroing is and I assume this is only illegal because of all the whiners.  AV doesn't expect you to click the same buff  other spell 10,000 times so you can give 1 or 2 extra stat points to your buddy and have it last 15 seconds longer, you can if you want to but the smart players use a macro to do it instead of getting a repetitive stress injury.  macroing is fine because when players raid the macroers city, it is can be very profitable for the raiders because of the macroers.  If there were no macroers in player cities and and no people at crafting work stations  for the intentionally long time it takes to craft things, raiding would'nt be nearly as profitable or rewarding.   Macroing melee without using reagents to heal your target is extremely slow gains in comparison with PVE.  You don't HAVE to macro and why would you macro when you could be playing the game normally and be developing your character much faster and making profits from mobs you kill?  Pretty stupid imo.  Darkfall is about freedom, you don't HAVE to do anything to compete besides use your brain.  It is a sandbox game where you can do anything you want so if there is one player you can't beat, team up with a buddy and one block while the other shoots arrows into his back.  Its so easy but people are too stupid to figure it out.  Also there are things like buff other spells which you can cast on friends which will increase their DPS and resistances more than any amount of character development.  Darkfall is much more about player skill and using your head to win fights than any other game yet the whiners always find some miniscule thing to whine about.
The race analogy is a good one, these whiners want to be able to compete in a race against someone who has spent 6 months training for the race while the whiner trained for two weeks and feasted on potato chips.  The whiner wants lead weights put on that 6 month player so he can catch up.  At least in Darkfall the casuals can combine their strenght and easily overcome character development differences.  New character 200 hp, Max hp character which doesn't even exist yet is 450 hp.   That's the least character stat difference between max lvl and newly created character by far than another other mmorpg.  Just goes to show you that whiners will whine about any slight disadvantages they have.  There are plenty of casuals who aren't crying about the fact that they have to put as much time into their characters as the "hardcore" players.  Darkfall has long term progression like UO did. 
If people would learn the game, there are loads of things a casual player can do to beat a veteran, it doesn't require you to have the exactly the same HP and do exactly the same amount of damage because you can utilize terrain and abilities like a well placed confusion or utilizing high ground advantage which can totally turn the direction of a fight.  This isn't like WoW where you click on a target once and press all your abilities and never miss, player skill plays a HUGE role and ignorant newbies will always cry because they can't figure out how to beat someone and will blame differences in character development or the game rather than blame themselves.   Also stats grain faster for new players so I really don't understand what all the crying is about, yes Darkfall has long term character development, deal with it or find and easier game where they allow you to win based on other things besides player skill.   Its funny that people compalain about time invested = win in DFO because that is more true of every other mmorpg game by far than it is true for DFO. 
 
UO had macroing and it was much much more advantageous in that game,  I guess UO was a bad game too huh? 

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Most people who macro in DF do so naked. Those that have reagents on themselves are usually near their computers and are paying attention to system chat in city when they are macroing away. Anyone who approaches a city will be displayed in the system chat tab.

Also from what I've learned it is the people (groups of people mainly) who macro'd, skilled off bugged mobs (people used to fight over bugged mob spawns in this game) and hacked in game during the first few months in this game are the ones in charge of large alliances with tons of gold at their disposal.

Well it looks interesting. Yet does it have a open world of sorts or am I going to be shuffled from instance arena to instance area? Is there going to be any PVE at all and how does it compare to the rest of the game? Is there a story to the game and the pve in general? The pvp looks very thrilling and exciting, the art work and animations are top notch in my book but the questions I asked above need to be answered before I pick up this title and I need to have more to do then just fighting in a fps/3rd person pvp arena type game world. While I like pvp, I also like pve and open world games. Not that I am completely against instancing as it doesn't bother me if its kept limited to arenas, dungeons, etc but I need a world to explore and more to do then just pvp.

Sure go ahead and make a Twilight MMO of course I won't play it just like I won't play Hello Kitty online. To be honest Twilight is horrible effing bastardization of vampire lore in a effort to create a IP designed to sell and appeal to teenage girls.

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Originally posted by Ruyn

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Originally posted by Hotjazz

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Originally posted by Ruyn   If you macro still in Darkfall you are doing it wrong.  Much quicker to level off of mobs.

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  Haha we level on mobs, and macro when you sleep. Come on we know Darkfall is the biggest grind in the history of mmo's, no need to hide that fakt. I have played for 8 months, and still all I've done the last two days in DF is hitting a semibugged mob. It sucks, the grind in Darkfall sucks like an old mans swetty balls.   I have nerdraged several time these eight month over the stupidity from AV. Every new patch I get this small hope they will fix the grind, but they don't. I want pvp, battles, ships and fun, but what I get is spamming the same stupid spell at a bugged npc for hours. And all in my clan does it, and so does every other clan I know about. We used to pvp over the best spot for bugged mobs just to macro. Imagine that, we fight over bugged mobs to lessen the HUGE grind.   I have spent countless hours swimming at a wall, so my avatars head must be flat and have gills. It's so stupid I'm still shaking my head in disbelive. You grind up one magic branch (and that takes time), then you have to grind up the fucking spells in that branch if you want tham to work properly. But hey, in AV's divine wisdom you are still not done. You need to grind up your stats to open for more grind. Archmage and intensifier....fuck I'm so sick right now. Something is wrong in the world of Agon, let me repeat that   SOMETHING IS FUCKING WRONG WITH THE GRIND IN DARKFALL.   I'm a competitive pvp player, and all you "just play the game normal for 3 years" don't mean shit to me. I want my stats/skills to be like the other competitive pvpers in Darkfall. And don't even try to give me this "mmorpg is all about level" and "All will quit if they can't level anymore" You are wrong. In your shallow PVE wow clones level is all you got, but I've played  pvp mmo's before those games hit the marked. I know full loot mmo's is best when your char is done.   Still, Darkfall is the best mmo out there at the moment, and I pay for three accounts.

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  I bet that  in the next two months stat gain will be increased.  Any takers?

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http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=228299

Right now prices have hit the roof. Apparently the major alliances and people who bugged out and killed ub3r mobs like devils and where sitting on large reserves of gold are now spending their gold and acquiring materials. Don't waste your time with anything other then gathering IMHO. For example stuff like steed grass is currently selling for about 500 gold in the trade channel per item and wood is incredibly 8 gold per log which is insane.

OT - Someone mention player vendors but really in a game like DFO where travel is dangerous and a pain in the arse this item is pretty much pointless for the world economy. It my prove useful if you are in a rather large clan alliance but not much else. You'd be better off dealing and working within the constraints of trade chat in game IMHO.