Ok, im not posting a rant about how crap eve is because it isnt [yourmmohere].

Im posting a serious question, so i expect discussion to be slim ;)

Our corp has links to 0.0 , access to markets and such for capital level construction, and currently has POS's in low-sec, whilst being headquartered in Hi-Sec, we also run various W-Space operations , and turn over a nice profit.

Is it worth the upset and schism to move to 0.0, under quite onoerous terms of alliance, for huge risks and not much more reward? 

Its mainly one or two very vocal members that bring this up constantly, the silent majority staying silent.

Is this EVE's version of end-game epiclust? You know, where 1 or 2 from a casual guild decide that they want to be Hardcore Raid Pwners and drag the guild kicking and screaming to its destruction? 

Are there major risks in 0.0 other than gankage and war?  For example the logistics of selling manufactured goods?

[edited for clarity]

was that many of the more advanced items/ships were listed that you couldnt be on the trial to use them. which for me is a pet pieve, if you want someone to trial your game, why limit it?

Because a trial account hanging around near a gate means people are scouting using disposable trail accounts.

Limiting the gear limits the extra pewpew that this alt would provide.

Because a trial account trained for hauling means people are solo or small group mining.

Limiting the ships mean they have to pony up some ISK or RL Money to have the advantage of a hauler

Etc etc etc....

Mostly though, EVE players are smarter than everyone else ever, and have worked out every possible exploit.

Secondly just because the game is in-depth and has many neuances, in no way means that i should expect to have to ask other players how to play. It at the end of the day is a game and games are meant to be fun, fun is not sitting in some space station reading a 16 page dossier on how to play the game.

Point 1:  perhaps eve's devs trying to get you to socialise? as without social interaction , EVE is literally nothing.

Point 2:  I find it fun sitting in a spacestation doing spreadsheets and whatnot.  Does that mean my fun<your fun?

Your opinion is not fact.  Neither is mine.  These are:

EVE is a primarily social game, and has been built as such.

You compare anything to the first similar thing you encountered.

Most posts on this thread have not insulted people becuase they are conditioned to other games, but have tried to point out gaps in logic. (I play x game, y game is not the same or is unfamiliar therefore Y<X)

Originally posted by Zyphriss

I tried RoM when it was in beta, and I noticed a load a lag that made the game unenjoyable.  I give it another shot, because I've been reading the Roleplaying forums on the site and it's getting my blood boiling for some RPing!

Thanks a lot!  I will post the verdict after a reasonable amount of play-testing.

The lags gone :)

Game is actually pretty good, something do whilst being station camped.

This entire thread is a tautology.

Tell you what, im now redefining FREE to include only paying once, or paying a subscription.  At the exact moment im paying its not free, after that it is FREE.  This definition is now the official one because i say so.  I dont care what ,y'know, the actual definition is.

While im at it, Up is now DOWN! Since Up can only exist in relation to down, i decided to make life simple by rolling all words that describe directionality into a single word, i chose UP because it looks good in capitals.

OP: how about this, you define PVP as any interaction in an online game that involves another player?

So MSN Hearts must be pretty hardcore yeah?

Or Facebook Scrabble must be 1337pwnz?

Or how about you pull your head out your arse and stop psuedo-intellectualising commonly used terms to somehow assuage your own feelings on games? 

By your logic, blue=red because they are both colours.

In the common usage, PVP refers to consensual player verus player combat or interaction that produces a victor and a loser, within the confines of a game-constrained set of mechanics.

I hope you realise that intellectual standards dont exist to play around with semantics all day.   You define your terms way early on, then refine your argument from there.  Arguing over semantics and meaning is useless, as the commonly accepted meaning is the one that counts (i refer to the original meaning of  "hacker" and its current meaning). With this in mind you can see that this thread is tautological.

(see what i did there).

 

The reward would be to make your enemy do the same thing.  You wouldn't think people would risk their real lives in wars and duels, but they do. 

Its safe to say in general people risk their lives in war under very specific circumstances, I.E. the boss told them to (as a soldier) or because the other guys boss told the other guy to.

I doubt many people go to war out of choice, but rather when there are no other choices left.

Permadeath in a game cant work, any reward worth dying for would imbalance the game too much.  People wouldnt do it for honour, realistically speaking theres no such thing anymore in MMO's.

To extend your analogy , the only way pvp-permadeath will be accepted is if it was forced, but unlike RL...people can walk away when they want, meaning you'd end up with one very lonely and very powerful character per server.

Originally posted by Schufti

Dear weird college student,

No game is strictly "Role-Playing" every one plays with his own leisure if you wish to role-play maybe join Gta San andreas online or maybe a Role-playing wow server easy as that just understand a strict role playing game is a 1-Player game and a free community is a Multi-player Game hope i put a stop to your search and oh asda story aint half bad ;) try it

Sorry, your wrong.

There may be a set that contains single player games that include traditional role-play elements, but the OP is referring to finding a game in which he "becomes" his avatar,and, by my reading feels immersed in that other place.  

RPG=Roleplaying game.   Doesnt need to be electronic, and doesnt refer to baldurs gate clones exclusively.  

What is generally meant by RP is illustrated below:

NON-RP version:

Player A: lets go gank some noob in a frigate

Player B: awesome, i just used EFT to max my dps

RP Version:

Player A:Fancy some easy killing?

Player B:Roger that, just fitted new toys to this bird and she needs a shakedown.

So you see, in the non-rp version you may be playing at being a pirate, in the RP version you suspend your own disbelief and actually mentally "become" that pirate.

So a "Strict" roleplaying game would be one that enforces keeping kayfabe, or keeping in character, an obvious impossibility in a single player game, and a reality only very rarley achieved in modern MMO's.  A whole two generations of gamers who never cracked the spine on a good sourcebook means RP is getting pretty bloody rare, and pretty bloody diluted.

Wont be long before "RP" goes the way of "hacker", and the polar opposite meaning becomes the popular usage.

(although to be fair, that kind of change can be good too...reference "gay", most kids think "gay" = "lame" and not "gay"="homosexual")

  MMOs were never really meant for the nerds and geeks with no life. 

Erm...yes they were...UO, EQ?  Online versions of pen and paper rpg's without a license(i.e rights to D&D) , a gaming genre defined by geekiness, nerdiness and often percieved by the masses as "no lifers".

Sure, MMO's now have matured beyond that, most players dont even know what RP is, let alone how to do it.

Also, given a large enough sample size, any statistic can be derived, "hardcore" as defined earlier doesnt apply to this circumstance surely? 

If kid A wants to believe he's "hardcore", let him. 

Find people who dont have an epeen to waggle in your face.  I remember the metal scene was the same once, the "hardcore" fans deriding the tourists becuase they werent metal enough. 

Punks do it too, as do academics, scholars, binmen, and all bloody mammals.  An instinctive urge to belong to a defined clique just after our balls drop.  And when you are in the "in crowd" everyone else becomes a target of hate or irrelevance because your clique is *the* clique.

Are MMO's meant for the hardcore? no more so than any other activity teens engage in.

Are MMO's meant for you?  Hell Yes! For every 10 "1337pwnmobiles" , theres another 10 sitting quietly thinking " are there others out there like me? "

I guess people would rather cry "wahhhhh i want my control system that I am used to like WoW, WAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!"

Are any of you people capable of  learning or is it all bitch, moan and cry ? I guess it's just easier to be a 2 week n00b who trialed Eve and be an expert on the game and those that have been around since beta KNOW NOTHING.

 Well Bloody Said Sir!

Welcome to the world of ends, where each end is an ass.

Seriously though, if you do want to go "neeeeeworrr-fwooosh-dakkadakkadakka" dont bloody complain about eves abstracted control system, but go play a game that has that in it.  Did you ever see Adama at the helm of Battlestar Galactica? hell no, he was in CIC *telling* the helmsman where to point the ship.

Adama =EVE pod pilot (in a way), Starbuck=*insert space/flight game here*.

Some want to play Adama, others Starbuck.    

Its like me complaining that my flying mount in WoW( Time Lost Proto Drake btw) doesnt have Warp To, Orbit or Align options. 

This is not an eve-fanboi rant. 

This is the rant of someone who genuinely despairs for the average IQ of humanity. 

/emote dies of laughter.

Yeah....my buddy was playing WoW and going on about all these 25 man raids and epic loot.   I downloaded the trial and it was shit.  I mean, whats the point, i was in some crappy Abbey somewhere killing "defias", took like totally no effort at all, totally lame dude, i mean like, my buddy totally raves about this game man!  And im like "WTF! this blows", totally fricking boring man, stabbing defias over and over. 

And this other time, my buddy was totally like "you so have to read "the old man and the sea"".  So i went to Borders, i picked it up, but the cover was totally lame man.   Like a book about fishing or shit? Whatever! So yeah, literature sucks.

And this other other time, my bro's on X-Box were like come play "Halo", so i like totally checked it out man, i went out and got some action figures and totally played in my room with em, but like my buddies were raving about it so i like totally couldnt get what was so special.  First Person Shooters?  First Person Lamers more like lulz.

Then i heard about the "internet" and like, i could totally make friends there, so i hooked my phone into my ass and imploded WITH MY OWN FUCKING STUPIDITY.

Obvious Troll is Obvious.

Anyway, your not too old, i would say your too bally young.

Stop worrying NOW. 

Your in your twenties...go have fun with bodyparts and abuse drugs, when you hit 30 and have a real job, then you can play mehmorpigahs, and you wont be a badly socialised ass-hat with no perspective, but will be able to just log on and have fun.

Originally posted by MyPreciousss

Originally posted by Saggra

At least it was good enough for you to play your 14 days out , when i tryed LoTR free trial  the game is so bad i didn't even play for 1/2 hour out of the 7 days, talk about bad animations and trees and lame quests. And when i jumped it looked like my toon was skipping down the street right in the middle of a gay pride parade that was enough LoTR for me

 

Gay pride parade in Bree? and people are complaining of the lack of events in LOTRO!

MyPreciousss.....i spat coffee in RL...the single funniest comeback i've seen in years :D You Win A Peanut :D

Also QFT on your OP, really good post.

OFF TOPIC ALERT!!!

to the middle-income , middle-class homes, (white-collar to our colonial friends), its you who will suffer most throughout the credit crunch, not us burger-flippers, service personnel and frontline techies.

BTW....i have 2 degrees, and don't care about the credit crunch, because

1. Born poor, Stay Poor (in the EU at least, except for a few exceptions)

2. Self important "im all right jack" dipshits that think its everyone elses problem, and denigrate someone based on potential income,  are the ones who live with mortgages, car loans and savings accounts that are being affected the most.  The money i earn each month may not stretch as far due the rising cost of beer and fags(and food too, but mostly i eat out of the gutter since im so poor and not worth anything after all), but i can still pay for my fun, and  I  remember the '80's when it was the middle classes suffering most, not the working class. 

So Mr "2 kids, lives well, I work in tech support", when your home is repossessed, your wife gone and your suddenly wondering where the living you feel you are owed is, come over to the UK, ill put a roof over your head and help you back onto your feet.   cos im not a complete fucking cunt like you are.

Originally posted by gracefield

This is what a lot of people are saying - it's a nice game with no heart - people like it and they appreciate the effort that the developers have clearly put in, but it is undeniably lacking in something. I felt it after playing for a couple of hours. Don't know exactly what, and MMOs always develop after they've been running for a while, but I think Mythic need to focus on this missing something because so many gamers are talking about it in relation to Warhammer. The OP hit the nail on the head when he said you could log off at any time without feeling that you should stay in for just five minutes longer - It's hard to feel that you're a part of the Warhammer universe, maybe that's the problem.

Hits the nail on the head with a natural 20.

I've played WH/WH40k for close on 20 years, so i really was predisposed to love this game, coupled with the fact that my WoW, Eve and GW guilds/corp are all gone/dying, i should have been a shoe in to be a fanboy.

But, well, meh.   The USP of WaR is RvR....sorry, i just dont care for it, if i want short sharp focused pvp, i load up a Shooter, which has no monthly sub. 

If i want to play an MMO i want to be immersed somewhat in a world, perhaps because i used to play pen'n'paper rpg's (the spiritual progenitors of the MMO/MUD), perhaps it's my age, but WaR just *isnt* the Old World as imagined by WFRP, its the Old World as imagined by a million battle reports in White Dwarf.

and there's the rub.   IRL....i am actually crying inside, me and a few mates who are still GW employees drank to the death of the franchise recently.   Guess the lobster telephone that is WoW gets my money again, until Vanguard magically gets popular.....

Mypreciouss.....relevant how?

Seriously, that comment exists for all of eternity now, and people of the future will look back at this as the end of the age of reason.

The best way to "win" an argument is to subtitute the predicates with a set of your own choosing, often not related to the 1st set of predicates.

wtf is happening to peoples critical faculties these days?

anyhooo......yer.....10 mill a/c's CREATED != 10 mill players/payers, just ask  Archlord.

However ,, blizzard uniquely have 10 million paying people.  They have an inordinatley high number of accounts created, but generally do not use this as a metric.

Good luck to DOFUS though.

yer...so google secureROM and what its for perhaps?

and no, i wouldnt play a game that required not only a monthly sub, uniquely tied to a product license key, and then in addition insisted i whore my optical drives with a coaster.

1 single thing.....saving for 9 months for a juicy ship, and getting suicide greifed on my 1st undock.

immediately sold all assets, transferred funds to the corp, and waved goodbye.

Actually....the community is good, but the barriers to entry are very high.

Theres no zone-wide chat, so less Guild Recruit messages, also less general chitchat and funny that ensues.

I had to get to Altdorf/IC before i found a guild....10 levels in.    Until then it was essentially a solo experience.

To disarm the trolls/flamers(sic), i have played WH since about '87 , so i am predisposed to love this game.

However, the lack of a common chat really does kill things in the low levels. Being able to group by selecting the nearest group from a dialog box is not a social experience at all. 

Once your in the group, yes, there can be interaction, but no impetus to stay beyond your own specific goals.

Good game, but so many things that are wide of the mark.   I can understand not wanting another crossroads or barrens in this game, but as consumers of mmo's we kinda exepct them now.  Even DAOC had a default guild you were thrust into from the start.

essentially, most mmo's are "come for the shinies, stay for the community", WAR seems to be "come for the shinies, maybe a community might happen by itself, despite no tools that engender the process."

Jon Wood....for shame!

Pointless thread is pointless.

The date of launch was confirmed the day before you posted this.

Blatant traffic-magnet and flamebait thread.

Utterly disgusted at the standards you now believe to be acceptable.

FOR SHAME!