All Posts by Dracis

Originally posted by nethervoid

What does RMT stand for?

RMT = Real Money Transaction 

I'm sure there are other meanings to the acronym, but that's the definition I know.

Now here's the real problem with RMT/gold buying/selling, etc. Eventually, if it becomes a widely excepted practice, especially here in the US, it will be taxed. That's right, your transactions will be taxed and your ingame items/currency may eventually be taxed as well. Congress has already tried to do this once.

I'm not sure about you all, but I surely don't want to have my leisure activity taxed, just because I'm doing well within the game, but yes, that is what it is coming to.

I'm not saying RMT isn't ok for other parts of the world and I know in fact it works else where. Just here in the US, they can and will get us with taxes, which I certainly (and I'm sure others do as well) want nothing to do with.

Then there is the corporate issues. Game development companies are already trying to push forward the idea of RMT. I'll use this example, because it's the best one I know of. John Smeddly of SOE already has stated and released figures that suggest that once RMT is put in place that gamers eventually spend more money on top of their monthly fee, up to $130 per year. It even works out that once RMT is in place and you no longer have a monthly feee, you still end up paying more than your regular $14.99 per month due to the fact that more content/items/decorations, etc will be placed on the game store and not available to you unless you pay for them.

Now alot of these transactions seem small, a few cents here, a few dollars there, but it all eventually adds up. We just have to becareful is all I'm trying to say, especially when it comes to which games we play and which companies we choose to buy from.

One huge fact to burst your bubble, Raph Koster is now in favor of RMT, just like his ole buddy John Smeddly. He thinks it's the future of MMO's and that's what his next MMO will be based on. Sorry, I think Koster had a great vision for one game, but now he's a completely different person not much better than any other of the corperate suits out there now.

Originally posted by Obraik

 

Originally posted by Draccan

 

Originally posted by Obraik

All of those features are still part of SWG today ;)

However, The Sims came long before SWG did...

 

If they had any way of getting their IP extended SOE should reprogram pre nge and pre CU SWG into a SWG 2.0. They would have a GEM of their hands. A real niche to medium market game.

People would flock to it if (despite of a few of the most angry fans) they got new management and fixed the early game and added 3rd generation mmo graphics. And fixed the jedi system into a completely RARE randomized system, where each server never has much more than 5-20 jedis.

Unfortunately Bioware probably has the mmo righs now and SWG will close soon. And they will wowify SW into a 10000+ kiddies with lightsabers in a linear quest driven game..

 

No one can say for sure what Bioware is making, but I expect it won't be Star Wars MMO.

 

As for SWG, SOE and the license, LucasArts have mentioned a few times this year that "they're committed to SWG" and have gone so far as to approve the addition of a Hoth encounter to the game which will be a free addition in Chapter 11 or so.

As for SWG being unaccessable to the new player, I wouldn't say that.  It will take some time to get set up, but nothing that long time players have is something that new players can't get, you'll just need to work towards getting there - or become friends with a crafter who can make the items you need for some kinda deal ;)

I could go on and on about how bad it is, but I don't feel the need to, as anyone who has tried the game, as a new player, knows better.

No, I won't buy any game unless there is a trial and, yes that includes MMO's. I'm tired of being taken by these companies, paying for beta tests (ie when the game is released unfinished), and basically being lied to. I don't think any of us deserve to be lied to intentionally, but these companies do it all the time.

Originally posted by Jamaludin

If you have a little cash to spare I really would recommend the Torque X engine its XNA game studio integrated and only costs 149,95 US Dollars which is a nice price tag for a complete Game Making Studio that has everything in one. It is what I am going to buy a License for.

http://www.garagegames.com/products/torque/x/

Actually, to make an MMO with Torque X would be rather difficult unless you want it to be 2D. I know the 3D version is in the works, but you're still better off with Torque Game Engine Advanced (TGEA) than Torque X. Even TGE, which Minions of Mirth was made with is a better choice for an MMO than Torque X.

You know what, and I really mean no offense by this guys, but I call BS on this one. Over a month ago I offered to pay for an attorney and had no takers. I did the same today and not one comment. I've already shown legal precedence in this case, but I'm ignored.

Sorry guys but I've been honest with you all, brutally honest, about my situation and profession. I've been patient and tried to educate and let us ex-players have some focus. I've even offered my own money, which seems to be in shorter suppy every month. I just can't do it anymore. I can no longer try to be the voice of reason to the deaf. This is one vet who's had enough of the hate and I just can't justify coming here anymore. Good luck guys, you'll need it...

Dracis Draconian ( and Dreen/Dagothos/Darla/Dooncan), formerly of Euro-Chimaera, signing off.

Originally posted by miagisan

and for all this hate talk towards me and my view that legally SOE has not done anything wrong (morally is another question), not one of you can provide solid proof that it is illegal. Immoral maybe...but thats it. The sheer fact that you AGREED to the EULA which states "GAMEPLAY MAY CHANGE" void any argument that you could have against legal action. Would be like signing a contract with a painter who states "Color may change during painting" and he uses 15 colors instead of one.

Let's be honest folks, any judge, at this point ( 2.5 years later) , is going to wonder why it took you so long to bring a class action lawsuit against SOE. Then the judge will look at or an SOE attorney will bring up the previous lawsuit involving UO, in which there were many similarities and does set a legal precedence. I'm not condoning anything SOE has done, nor am I trying to defend them, I'm just trying to be realistic here.

Also, my offer still stands, as I stated in the previous thread. If you folks seriously can find a real attorney that has a history of winning these cases and will accept the case, I will pay the retainer fee out of my own pocket. Just contact me via PM and I will send you my irl info and get the lawyers phone number, so I can know where to send the check.

Originally posted by Krayzjoel

I played it for about 5 hours..in some station....doing one quest after another.....i just cant get into this game. I have a lvl 6 jedi. I flew around a little........

Unfortunately no, there is no light at the end of the tunnel.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Fellow Vets after   OP realized it wasn't smart  to use

"not that bad" then he/she changed  the phrase to "as good as pre-cu"  thinking this would serve his plans more...

what do you think  fellow  vets  current crap=pre cu ? 

Obviously that isn't Fishermage's direct quote, but it's close. I don't think the current dev team even know what pre-CU is, outside that they aren't allowed to give it to the players.

Originally posted by salvaje

 

Good point.  I wonder if there is enough population left in the NGE to decently populate more than 1-2 Pre-CU servers, enough to harvest all the resources, craft all the items, apply all the buffs, etc.

 

Pre-CU the servers had a LOT more players on them than they do now.  The NGE can get away with very low densities and lack of crafters/non combat players because...  Well, they arent' really needed anymore.  And when they are most people use an alt to turn "generic looted schematic 345435 that always crafts to the same uber loot" into an item.

 

Remember, they allow AFK gameplay, only a few are needed now.

Originally posted by Dhaeman

Surprised no one has brought up the UO lawsuit from the late 90s. It basically failed to give the plaintiffs any sort of cash reward. I think if someone managed to start a class action lawsuit it might get somewhere but the risk far outweighs the rewards. Unless you are already rich and want to make a point I suppose. On the other hand, lawmakers tend to view EULAs indifferently as in...they don't mean much.

I actually did bring it up the last time a thread with the same topic appeared, but obviously it didn't sink in the last time, so we have to rehash the whole darnedable thing out again.

Originally posted by neonaka

 

 

We have all gone over this many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many times.

No one has done anything about any of this because you can't. Here are the reasons no veteran has a case against SOE.

1. Game Change Issue ie. Not the same game argument - FALSE

Name of game in 2003 : Star Wars Galaxies : An Empire Divided, Name of game in present time 2008 :   Star Wars Galaxies : An Empire Divided. (This would be the same, making it the same game). Core programming code is the same - Core world is the same - only game play and mechanics were changed.

2. Implementation of the CU / NGE - FALSE

SOE/LA along with every other producer of MMO's on the planet reserve the right to patch, change, replace, delete, update, or massacre anything that THEY own. Pay very special attention to the THEY part.

When a consumer purchases a PC game from the store, this is what the consumer is actually paying for. The plastic CD's inside the box, which allows you to install said product. You get a digital CD key allowing you access into the hosting companies servers as proof that you paid the fee to do so. Oh and a manual usually. That is all, that is the extent of your bought and paid for property from whatever company of your choosing.

Any and all virtual property which includes, your characters, any and all equipment attained playing said game, the countless life spent playing the game, anything inside the server, to include source code of the game, all game play and mechanics, EVERYTHING you can see with your eyes while playing, belongs to said company. Since you never had a right to any of this virtual property to begin with, The company can change, upgrade, remove/delete anything they choose at any given time. They do not even have to notify the consumers playing the game, tho most do ahead of time.

This being said, the CU and NGE were all decisions made and implemented by SOE/LA which were well within their rights to do so as the sole owner of this virtual property. I haven't seen an online game in the last 10 years that didn't say right there on the back of the box before you purchase it.

"Game experience may change during online play".

You agreed to this the minute you handed it to the nerd behind the Gamestop counter.

3. Fraud through bait n switch with ToOW - TRUE and FALSE

Though SOE were clearly in the wrong with the bait/switch of the ToOW expansion, not given ample warning of the changes to come before the money exchanged hands, they did however offer anyone not lazy enough to get a refund their money back.

If was very cloak n dagger of them to try to pull this off, but at least they admitted to the tactic, and offered refunds, putting them in the clear for any further legal matters in the future.

 

To make an already long story short, the EULA may be garbage all across the board with MMO's but SOE wouldn't even need to bring up a EULA in court to beat anyone who would challenge them. All they need is the document that states they own SWG and everything that goes along with it. You go and try to prove to a jury that SOE took some "virtual" property from you or wasted your "virtual" time, and beating SOE will be the least of your worries. You might instead try to figure out how your going to get out of the straight jacket they are going put you in. It will be like trying to sue Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

 

The very sad part is here we are 3 years after the fact. There have been a plethora of games hit the market in 3 years.... and people are still crying over poor SWG. Let the game die.

SW : The Force Unleashed looks promising, get yourself a xbox360 or PS3 and shoot some lighting out your fingers, have a coke and a smile, and just let it go.

With as much energy as SWG vets spend QQing over the death of a game, or how to punish SOE, you could have all banded together and made your own damn SW game by now.

Just a quick note, once again, the part in red does not allow them to make any changes they want. This must be the tenth time I've had to state this. That statement, once again, refers to that they can not control what others, do, say, or how they act online. There are parts in the EULA, which is posted online for most every MMO, that allow them to change the game as they see fit.

Originally posted by Sam123jo0123

Originally posted by hipiap

You people need to get over it for gods sake.

 

While I am mad about what Lucas Arts Made SOE do to SWG back in 2005 and 2004, moaning and whining over it and w/e else you're doing is a waste of time.

 

You kids and adults seem to forget that LEC controls what SoE develops for SW:G.

You blame and flame and scream at SOE....but one in a thousand complains that it was Lucas Arts/LEC fault for wanting to attract the Numbers that WoW draws.

 

I am just soooo tired of you people harping on what SOE did to your game.  One would think by reading the threads in the Veteran's Refuge that you people have no life away from the Computer.

 

 

So...there is the Gauntlet.

Heres the question:

 

When was the last time anyone here actually Logged INTO SW:G?

Pre-2006?

Expertise for Spy or Smuggler?

Chapter 6 AI Combat adjustment?

Chapter 7 The Return of Aurilla, Dathomir, Heroics and Collections?

Chapter 8 Space Collections and ISD Heroic?

Anyone here take advantage of the 14 or 21 Day Trials? Or the Buddy Program?

Anyone actually Log in to see how active Bria or Starsider or Chilastra or Gorath or Intrepid is currently?

Or are all of you so bitter that your too chicken to log in and find that you might actually enoy it?

 

 

I Am a 9 Time Elder on Intrepid.  I have the ORH.  I have Completed the fate of the galaxy quest for the Shard of Retribution.  I also have over 120 Badges.

 

I am sick of seeing you people not move on or grow a clue.

 

 

Play SW:G or play something else.  Quit complaining about something that happend Over 2 years and 2 months about at minimum.  And if some of you are still pi55ed over the Cu....well....Log in....the game is difficult and takes thought.

 

 

 

I agree, these people really need to get over it , It's coming up to three years now, most of them have gone but theres a few stragglers left - As a guy once said, "Get over it" - Wepps.

Two years, five months and 2 days is not quite coming up on three years. 2.5 maybe. I agree people should stop, but those bitter current players need to stop coming here and aggrivating the situation as well.

Originally posted by wolfmann

1 guild?

I remember when the Mos Entha Roleplaying Community was 10+ guilds, with hundreds and hundreds of RP'ers.

 

Last trial I went on, I couldnt find a single one of em...

Yeah, the Mos Entha Community is long gone. The guild I'm speaking of SEA, does most of the roleplay events now, but they aren't the only ones involved in it. While it's no where near the numbers of the old days, there is still a some that value good RP.

Originally posted by Thunderous

There is no amount of EULA verbage that can take away a persons right to sue for damages.  Any veteran could contest that the NGE is in fact, a NEW GAME.  The code is different.  The core gameplay became a new and different game.

So SOE didn't enhance the game they coded a new one.  However, their legal problems are glaring when they sold an expansion that was advertised and marketed for the original version of SWG then turn around and launch a new game (NGE) in its place after they sold said expansion.

That is fraud.  Pure misrepresentation and no jury of reasonably-minded people are going to accept their EULA as an excuse to commit  fraud.

I agree with you on the enhancement of code part, but we are only part right. The same base code is still there and still used, just not all of the things that used to be there are compliled anymore. I know, I know, but this is where any law suit could get stuck.

As far as the fraud part, I also agree, but remember, they allowed folks to get a refund for the expansion. If they had not, then yes SOE would have been in major trouble. At this time though, I think it's way too late to even think about suing SOE. Any judge and/or jury would wonder why it took someone so long to do anything about it.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

 

huh  am i more subtly then i thought i am :P

 

i 100% agree with you honest.

It is ridiculous to hide behind statements like that in EULA , such statements can be read in 1000 products of 1000 diferent companys. There is much ...much more needed to cover things like the NGE.

The funny thing is, there are others within the industry that see this and are working to change it, along with others like the ECA. I'm actually very much in favor of a "Players Bill of Rights" at this point. We've seen alot of games and not just MMO's anymore, come out with shoddy work and in an unfinished state. I think it will eventually happen as we see huge game companies like EA try to have a monopoly on certain kinds of games. It's just sad that many people don't see the huge issues with EULA's, RMT, and some of the other problems that are facing the game industry today. All we can do until then is try to inform and vote with our wallets.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden 

May  this sentence  apply to the NGE about  "system requirements may change" , in the red....

"You understand that online games evolve over time and, accordingly, system requirements to play the Game may change over time."

The  PC has to be built  for NGE  running  as an enjoybale  MMO and a piece  you want  to be part  of ...and want it run  on you local PC ...lol

Actually that's part of it, there's more and I understand you're trying to be funny ( or at least I think you are. I have a spring cold so please forgive me and my obvious Nyquil abuse ), I'm just tired of people thinking game companies can get away with anything because of certain broad statements.

Originally posted by glord

I miss SWG, and I might come back for roleplay. Is there an established, ACTIVE RP community, and what server is it located? I am particularly interested in the rebels side.

I'm sure there are others on other galaxies, but the only one I know of is on Chimaera. Contact Caerywnn. Their guild is a mixed guild, so it doesn't matter if you're Rebel or imperial. Caerwynn's guild is SEA and they do have frequent cantina crawls and story teller events.

Originally posted by fozzie22

And Dracis refering to your other post sadly it does cover the gameplay maay change issue..

 

Read the part in red.."we may enhance gameplay" pretty much cover the NGE..i.e new game enhancments,now given its a POS is another matter but hats off to SOE they covered tthier asses well with it tbh,mainly becuase the wording of tthe agreement is so vague they could aply it to anything

Once again, and please let this be for the last time, the statement, "Gameplay may change during online play", does not include the changes of the NGE, the part of the EULA I put in red does. There is a difference. The warning about gameplay changes online is basically stating that they can't control what other people do, say, or how they act online.

Please read the entire thread that I linked.

Edit* Just so you know, I'm not defending any game companies EULA. All of them are horribly against customers and I am very much in favor of some one eventually challenging them. What I'm against is the ignorance of the players who think that broad statements like, "Game play may change with online play" allow gaming companies to do whatever they want, whenever they want, because it simply is not true. I'm not trying to argue or flame, I'm trying to educate.

Actually Zorvan, that does not cover actual game play change, but I've been through all this before. Here's a link if you want to read it: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/1872300#1872300 .