Originally posted by TheHatter

Ok, when I think of a Post-Apoc world, I think of ppl feeding on others to survive.

I can not think of one single story or movie where the inhabitants of a Post-Apoc world didn't fight against each other and when they won, took everything they could so they would be able to survive better than they were before they won the battle.

So, if you were attracted to a Post-Apoc MMORPG, would you expect the game to have an epic PVP system and some sort of player looting? Or, would you expect a PVE game where people try to reform a utopian society, despite the fact that there are mutants running around from a nuclear fallout and almost everything in the world was out to get you...... but for some reason not other people. :-|

What if I told you there was a group of players that wore human heads on their armor, used blood as warpaint, and decorated their buildings with human bodies and were at war with other player factions in the world?

I would want a Post-Apoc Harcore PVP game if it was made just a Multiplayer Game, for a MMORPG I want it to be more of a virtual world where players are giving choices in how to play, which can be very broad.

FE is at this moment the perfect example of how I like to see it currently. Obviously I wished a A-Tittle company could do it aswell, but FE has allot of potential if they go the same route like CCP did with Eve, that is,  grown in time.

I also want to get immersed with the gameworld, meaning I want to act as if I am there, which for me means I do not want to kill the last survivers of this world, but want to build up the world again with who is left, I want to kill the baddes out there, not my own kind, unless obviously they are of the opossing faction or are a treath to my survivel.

Originally posted by Fearlessbro

Seriously, what makes this game so played by many people? Are they zombies or infected with some kinda virus? I mean WoW has nothing great about it, and if you call WoW a great community, go to their forums, Post something constructive and get shunned by all the level 1 emo super trolls. It offers nothing in terms of Replay value. You just do the same stuff over and over, and it gets boring VERY quickly.

I remember buying The Burning Crusade and leveled up from 60 to 70, and then there was like nothing to do. The leveling was funner then the actual endgame content (and leveling is pretty gay as it is). After only 1 week from the expansion, you had absolutely nothing to do but farm useless heroics to gear a character for a pointless purpose. waiting every 2 months for something new, which also got old fast, then you had to wait more months (alot of TBC content was also impossible to do unless you were in a skilled PvE guild or asian)

The same still applys for Wrath of the Lich King. After 1 - 2weeks leveling from 70 to 80, doing the heroics, you had to wait for a patch for new content, Naxxramas wasnt new It was actually very lazy reused content. After gearing up threw Naxxramas which took many pointless months before ANY new raids cameout, Uld was released. After about 3 weeks of more boring Naxx runs and slow Uld progression, Uld was on farm, and after farming uld, your uber gear was useless, you cant do anything with it. When they released "Lol" Trial of the Crusader, the content was easily punched down in 1 week, with nothing to do for another 2 - 3 months.

Patch 3.3 will be even easier, after 1 week a guild would of downed The Lich King, 2 - 3 weeks itll be on pug farm, then we have to wait for Cataclysm, which is pretty much a ripoff of Aions idea, where they just take all old content, and rip it to pieces, throw in Deathwing, reuse pretty much every level 60 encounter, let players go in places they couldnt before but were always there (Hyjal), offer them no new classes or spells, only 2 races which every noob and their mother QQd to recieve for 5 years, and call it an Expansion, seriously, Do I really want to spend only 4 - 7 days leveling to 85, then running Shadowfang Keep heroic, or The Deadmines normal, for loot. This is ridiculous. They are only doing this (same with Onxyia) because people overfarm those areas.

 

They reuse Everything they have over and over, They take other MMO concepts and put it into their game. They reusing Wintergrasp + Isle of Queldanas Ideas but fusing them.

 

The Only reason I play WoW still VERY casually is because there is no other MMO out there with these sort of numbers playing, Literally go into WoW, go on a High Realm and look at all the people in Ironforge, Stormwind or Orgrimmar, and Dalaran. This is the only reason, I actually hate the game.

 

Why do you play WoW, or ever did?

I played WoW off/on for perhaps a total time of a year till I bought BC, installed it, spend 2 day's in it and left WoW for good. When I played I enjoyed the game, when I felt the game wasn't fun anymore I left. Simple as that, no amount of people would make me stay at something I would not like anymore, truly wish other people would do the same.

Never ever will I play a game that isn't fun to me.

Perhaps OP there more people like you that just play the game because of the amount of people that are in.

Though I have a hard time understanding how someone could stay this long with a game if they admit they dislike the game.

It's a shame people can not leave games they dislike playing, but unfortunaly OP isn't the first person I see playing a game he is hating. Yet he continues to play it.

It's a strange .....Strange world......

Originally posted by JacobFlowers

I've got to say, this preview is far superior than the load of crap previews we've gotten from several other sites that all iterate on the SAME THINGS. So I've got to hand it to MMORPG.com for doing a more thorough job.

At the same time however, I am not excited about Bridge Officers and such. We have heard Cryptic drone on and on about this for almost half a year now, and its one feature that I'm starting to disdain only because they have nothing else to talk about.

What about the CRAFTING system? People want to know how this would be done since the IP doesn't exactly lend itself to a traditional "MMO crafting system" but still players want something clever and deep, not simply commodity exchange (which is what they've described it to be thus far).

And what about the economy, another thing the IP struggles with. Will energy be able to purchase USEFUL items, or will it all be junk stuff like what they have going on in Champions Online? Will it be a player driven economy like EVE's, or some generic auction house set up?

STO has LOADS of potential, but a whole lot of us are hoping that Cryptic doesn't muff up this monumental opportunity to develop this IP into an MMO (hats off to them, I recognize the difficulty and respect them for taking on the task).

WOOT a Star Trek IP that doesn't lend itself to traditional crafting.........?

Personaly I feel this IP would or should have awesome in depth crafting, with a IP like ST it could go beyond that I knew of SWG......how many turrets have you seen Geordi build?  I must say I am very disappointed hearing how Engineer seems to be turning out. Actualy so far disappointed with the overall classes...

There is simply so much they could do with a IP like Star Trek, yet they seem to follow a very narrow route for the game, Star Trek is everything but narrow.

Props to OP as it was a very informative article, but it definintly once again lowerd my excitement for the game.

Overall it sounds like the game is more a Multiplayer/Co-op game than I got a MMORPG fibe from what was written and from the info known so far about STO.

I am wondering how much will be left ingame of what was said>> Star Trek Convention Presentation though I will admit watching it a second time it already showed the game might turn out to be somewhat narrow.......

I am sure I will get to play the game and still hope Cryptic can proof me wrong and atleast deliver a great game experiance, regardless what my expectations are for a IP like Star Trek.

Originally posted by luckturtz

I was reading the dumbest mmo mechanic thread.They are fair amount people saying they hate the trinity in games but what do you replace it ? If people have notice but shooters are using the dps,healer,and tank mechanics for example TF2,resistance 2,Killzone 2 just to name few. Ask yourself why

I can tell you the reason why the healing mechanic is used so often,It is the best active support mechanic out there and other than healing there is basically cc,buffing and debuffing.So if you are trying to diverse your game from just attacking alone and you want active non combat support class what are choices?

You are making a RPG and you want combat to be more than just attacking.What are you replacing the Holy trinity with?

I don't hate the HT, but I do dislike it somewhat. it makes games in this genre pretty limited and predicteble.

You give example's of multiplayer games, to me it's logical that it's there as for me multiplayer games are far more limited when comparing it to a MMORPG's. And with multiplayer games it's all about combat, where with MMORPG combat should be part but definitlly not all there is to a MMORPG, else we might aswell call this genre "Action Online Games"

But I also must admit that the HT makes games in this genre lack the challenge I really would like to see, as anyone with a little focus in a HT group will alway's WIN, unless you are a bad player or unexperianced, keep in mind I am a niche gamer in MMORPG and I simple like more challenge, doesn't mean HT groups can not be challenging cause I am sure for allot of people it can be quite challenging, but I aint answering for everyone I am merly answering for myself as I see no use for it in a MMORPG. Unless the game is offering allot more then just HT professions.

Myself replace the HT with just random professions, when I group I do the same and hope I enter or creat a random group of professions, it sure feels comfortable when I don't have healing skills and someone else does have them, but not having healing skill or anyone with these skills in the group makes my experiance a more challenging one, again mainly speaking for myself.

Originally posted by StevieHmself

 its funny how this is still a Problem!

I wonder in what way you think that it's funny and still a problem.

Is it because we already have seen hunderds of MMORPG's being released PERFECT, meaning it's logical that games in this genre should ALL be perfect at launch? Obviously I  wish we could see PERFECT made and released games.

What many seem to forget is how complex this genre actualy is. I bet that even experianced developers sometimes might get a bit scared seeing how complex this genre is.

I am NOT saying it's okay to release games to early, but at some point these games need to be released. There are several games I could mention that in my opinion released far to early, but that is mostly due to lack of experiance of creating/developing a MMORPG myself, in my mind I know what would be a perfect filled with content MMORPG, in my mind I also would know how to handle it. But you see that's all in my mind.

Now when I see 20/30/50/100's MMORPG's being released near to perfect , I will demand that each and every game should be released that way, but being releastic and actualy seeing how young this genre actually is makes my slightly understand that games in this genre might have issue's I don't like to see. But overall like alway's I often see more issue's in games by people on forums than actualy seeing these issue's in the games I play myself.

A example is Fallen Earth, the amount of people I heard saying this or that is bugged while we know for a fact they where just either doing a quest wrong, I have seen people who simply did not understand a quest, didn't understand how things worked, I heard people say Stats where bugged because when they put 15 AP into some Stat they didn't feel any differenence, when telling/asking them if their armor/weapon use skill was in sink with the armor/weapon requirement lvl I often heard they where wearing/carrying low requirement weapons, yet many felt Stats where bugs, someone had a rifle skill if 60, yet was complaining why he still needs to use that crappy bow, while he or she had plenty of options to gain another weapon, but for some reason some people think that only a higher stats/skill would make that same bow work better, while when knowing the game you know you need to constant upgrade your weapon to fit the requirement. Don't get me wrong FE has lot's of issue's, but even then I read more about issue's then I actualy encounter them.

Overall I play games in this genre what is given, by actualy playing these games, I don't play what is promisssed as when I would try and do that I bet  I would be disappointed far to many times.

Originally posted by TheHatter

Originally posted by Reklaw

Hmmmm, well just leave it that you must be a very young individual due to the way you reply.

If you can't think of a reply and still feel the urge, just resort to age. It's win win right? And no, I'm not young. Always seems to be by people who select the option to hide theirs in their profile. Funny.

"Keep up with feeding money hungry developers rehashing old games for the 10,000th time. I'm sure they love you."

Above is what you said which sounds like you are very young cause it shows you have no idea to what games I play.

But hey I get it, I have a different viewpoint, I play games in this genre different, there for I must be a troll.

Originally posted by TheHatter

Originally posted by Reklaw

Originally posted by TheHatter

 Someone obviously hasn't played much Warhammer. It really is almost a direct clone reskinned, dumbed down (yearh, it's possible lol) and a couple features added to WoW. It even feels like you're playing WoW, even with those couple features they added. If you have played and you still don't think it is, then I've always wondered something... How do brail monitors work? Or do you just have a program that reads stuff to you like in 7 Pounds?

SWG tried to clone WoW. If you deny that, you're just trolling.

 

I playd Warhammer, still no WoW clone to me, and I still find the SWG tried to be a WoW clone so incridible funny. It continues to show more about how people play games then it tells anything about the game itself. But then I must have forgotten that in WoW you could be a dedicated crafter, make almost anything, in WoW you didn't need to combat, we could have player run vendors in WoW, we could fly of in space in WoW, also forgot you could mine everywhere in WoW, sorry you are right SWG is definitly a WoW clone or atleast tried to........NOT!!!!!!

But I will admit I didn't play Warhammer much as the game didn't move me.

Sorry that I have a different opinion then you have, cause then I am obviously trolling...........

 

Yup, because SWG didn't have that stuff before NGE, which was before WoW came out. You took one thing, the crafter thing, that they made different from WoW because they had such an advanced crafting system and arguably the best in MMORPG history and turned that into an entire post. Mechanically, they changed the game to be almost exactly like WoW's mechanics. 

Go back and read what I edited while you took the 15min or so to write a reply  that post. (last edit was a spelling error) unless you just cut the rest of the post out. Your logic is flawed and extremely shallow. Keep up with feeding money hungry developers rehashing old games for the 10,000th time. I'm sure they love you.

Hmmmm, well just leave it that you must be a very young individual due to the way you reply.

Originally posted by TheHatter

 Someone obviously hasn't played much Warhammer. It really is almost a direct clone reskinned, dumbed down (yearh, it's possible lol) and a couple features added to WoW. It even feels like you're playing WoW, even with those couple features they added. If you have played and you still don't think it is, then I've always wondered something... How do brail monitors work? Or do you just have a program that reads stuff to you like in 7 Pounds?

SWG tried to clone WoW. If you deny that, you're just trolling.

I playd Warhammer, still no WoW clone to me, and I still find the SWG tried to be a WoW clone so incridible funny. It continues to show more about how people play games then it tells anything about the game itself. But then I must have forgotten that in WoW you could be a dedicated crafter, make almost anything, in WoW you didn't need to combat, we could have player run vendors in WoW, we could fly of in space in WoW, also forgot you could mine everywhere in WoW, sorry you are right SWG is definitly a WoW clone or atleast tried to........NOT!!!!!!

But I will admit I didn't play Warhammer much as the game didn't move me.

Sorry that I have a different opinion then you have, cause then I am obviously trolling...........

I havn't seen a WoW Clone EVER in all of my gaming experiance, Though obvious I see certain similarity's between games. But a WoW Clone is something I only see people on forums speak about, never really seen a game actualy be a clone of WoW. So if a game is hyped a WoW clone to me it has always been due to forum or blog posters. I am just glad that when I enter a MMORPG I don't only focus on game-mechanics cause doing that could indeed make me pretend games can be clones of eachother, thankfully each game has different story's, settings, lore, overall feature's, different players/gameplay etc....etc....A clone wouldn't be different.

You should not wonder why a person play's a certain way, either solo, grouped, pvp or pve or just mainly social.

Unless you are willing to pay that persons sub-fee.

Google broke?

Anyway: http://www.direct2drive.com/8616/product/Buy-Fallout-3:-Game-of-the-Year-Edition-Download

But to be honost I don't know if people who can't find something this easy on the internet should actualy play action RPG games or even MMORPG's, keep in mind certain games will let you search things game-wise aswell.

Originally posted by Midare

Frostbite had some good points, self-reliance and avoiding unreliable players (basically the same thing) but one could say that self reliance and not needing to rely on others could be fulfilled in a solo RPG that isn't online.

 

While I myself am not a solo-player, I have a close friend who is. I've actually had this discussion with him rather recently. The point we come down to is that a MMOG's "world" extends beyond just the grouping and questing. There is interaction with people in the towns, supporting newer players, chatting with friends while you go about your business, and other social involvement.

 

His big attraction is game economies, he's a business geek, he loves essentially farming for materials and pushing the extremes of the market. Learning how a particular game's market flows is fun for him, and that is what he likes about MMOGs. That is what he enjoys, and something which this genre provides better than a solo game can... since the solo game would be static as he is the only factor in any market a solo game provides. It is far more interesting, for him, to compete against others for resources, to fuck with the economy to make a better profit for himself.

 

That's one reason people who solo "content" may play an MMOG.

Highlighted what I feel many "against" solo play don't really graps, atleast that's what I think when I read yet another  "why solo" type of topic.

There is simply so much more then just group with other people in a MMORPG.

I must also admit that with older games I grouped allot more, but group mentality's have changed ALLOT, people don't want to group to let's say explore or just have fun with others, Nah today's players need rewards, better loot, better XP if they group and if grouping doesn't give them anything else then more xp or some sort of reward in what ever form they feel it's useless. I am that guy entering a PUG and ALWAY's pass, another thing is that grouping started to feel lonely when hardly anyone speaks in chat, sometimes even a hello back seemed like a impossible mission to get out of some pugs, now don't get me wrong I have met really great PUGs, unfortunaly I met MORE bad ones with examples just given.

Originally posted by nate1980

Originally posted by Reklaw

Originally posted by vladww

Originally posted by Reklaw

I am always glad to see people find their game, I am not into PVP much so Darkfall isn't a game for me.

But I like to ask: in what way do you consider FE the ultimate theme park.

I give you that it's pretty easy, but thankfully there is more then enough way's to challenge yourself (GAME-WISE)

But to consider FE a ulitmate linear themepark should come with some explanation.

Obvious I do hope your comment did more then just the intro, cause then I would agree that the intro is linear, but then again that's about 1% of the game.

Myself not really into themepark, don't really like linear, yet enjoying FE which atleast to me is a Open World game, which already can't be linear. Obvious if you want to let the game hold your hand (commonly speaking) it can be viewed as being linear, but that's due to a playstle not the game itself. So like I asked would like to know in what whay you consider FE a ultimate linear themepark.

 

 

 

- Level 1 - 20 progress thru Sector 1 quest threadmill

- Level 20 - 30 progress thru Sector 2 quest threadmill

- Level 30 - 45 progress thru Sector 3 quest threadmill

( You have to go thru the quests to get your AP's )     Well if this is not linear..

- Crafting is great but follows the same sector progression routines, now if only the economy was player driven.. But its not :

Amazingly, with quite a nice & large gathering / crafting system, you'd think the dev would give the players the chance to build up an economy ? no, lets have NPC's selling everything instead ZZZZZzzzzzzzzz, we don't want our customers to interact together.

And just the same, lets make 99% of the mobs soloable diablo like, occasional grouping in mmo's is too challenging. ZZZzzzzzzz

That said, FE game mechanics are basicly very very good. But why they are so poorly exploited remains a mystery to me.

If the devs introduced player driven economy with real item decay, non instanced player city  housing, a proper capped AP system, etc.. Fallen Earth true potential would be revealed. Imho Right now it's not.

I'm glad you enjoy FE, i also kinda did until i hit Sector 3 and took a step back. The devs could turn this game to sandbox in the future, they already have the tools . Until then i still think we only have a (nice) carebear themepark.

 

 

hmm, thankfully I gain AP not only from quests. I could view it as linear if in fact you could only gain AP with quests, but you gain AP for various things, for example, crafting, scavaging, random killing, sure you could just merly use quest to get AP faster.

I have not even covered halve of S1, main lvl17, rifleman lvl8. Keep in mind I have little time to spend ingame, mostly sunday's, occasional Monday's but during the rest of the week, hardly.

I think it's gonna take me some time before reaching S3 at my pace.

But due to the things you said, does say something about you as a player in how you played it, unfortunaly nothing really why  the game is linear.

Economy definitly needs work for sure.......

 

I'm not name calling Reklaw, but what you just said made me think that you don't know your own game. There is a max amount of AP that players have figured out you can get. For the sake of discussion, let's say this number is 1100 AP. Well, this game would require 1100 AP to be considered a maxed out character. However, if you don't do the quests, you'd only have about 700 or so AP. You'll be much weaker than the person who played the game like a linear themepark game. It'd be like walking around and arbitrarily picking up quests in WoW, and quitting at lvl 60 instead of leveling up to lvl 80.

So like any game, you can play it in a non-linear fashion, but that playstyle will gimp you in FE. In FE, to be the best you can possibly be, you'll have to do every single quest that offers AP as you level up and explore the world. That's no different than going from one quest hub to the next, doing all the quests to level up to lvl 80 in WOW. In fact, it's the same thing in FE.

Because I like and enjoy a certain way of play doesn't mean I don't know the game. The only thing I said is that questing isn't the only way to gain AP, which was in response to your comment that you said you can only get AP with questing. I never said I do not do quest, or do you really think you could get  a lvl 17 not even covered half of S1 without doing quests? Would be logical when knowing I have limited time to already understand that my lvl 17 character must be doing most of the quest he can get's his hands on. But again I was not speaking about not doing quest, pure spoke about that questing isn't the only way.

In a MMORPG I play in the best way that is fun to ME, I like competition but like that in other genre of games due to the fact I am a socialing/exploring/crafter if possible in this genre, I could care less if the other person might be stronger or weaker, it's about  the fun I can get out of the game. This doesn't mean I don't like to be the best I can, cause I am sure I a very good gamer, mainly due to the experiance I have with this genre, but just understand that I am a niche gamer when it comes to MMORPG's where I know I certainly play and look very different towards games in this genre then the mainstream "I want it all and want it now"  type of player.

Again the only thing you show is once again the way you have played the game, still nothing about the game being linear.

Originally posted by vladww

Originally posted by Reklaw

I am always glad to see people find their game, I am not into PVP much so Darkfall isn't a game for me.

But I like to ask: in what way do you consider FE the ultimate theme park.

I give you that it's pretty easy, but thankfully there is more then enough way's to challenge yourself (GAME-WISE)

But to consider FE a ulitmate linear themepark should come with some explanation.

Obvious I do hope your comment did more then just the intro, cause then I would agree that the intro is linear, but then again that's about 1% of the game.

Myself not really into themepark, don't really like linear, yet enjoying FE which atleast to me is a Open World game, which already can't be linear. Obvious if you want to let the game hold your hand (commonly speaking) it can be viewed as being linear, but that's due to a playstle not the game itself. So like I asked would like to know in what whay you consider FE a ultimate linear themepark.

 

 

 

- Level 1 - 20 progress thru Sector 1 quest threadmill

- Level 20 - 30 progress thru Sector 2 quest threadmill

- Level 30 - 45 progress thru Sector 3 quest threadmill

( You have to go thru the quests to get your AP's )     Well if this is not linear..

- Crafting is great but follows the same sector progression routines, now if only the economy was player driven.. But its not :

Amazingly, with quite a nice & large gathering / crafting system, you'd think the dev would give the players the chance to build up an economy ? no, lets have NPC's selling everything instead ZZZZZzzzzzzzzz, we don't want our customers to interact together.

And just the same, lets make 99% of the mobs soloable diablo like, occasional grouping in mmo's is too challenging. ZZZzzzzzzz

That said, FE game mechanics are basicly very very good. But why they are so poorly exploited remains a mystery to me.

If the devs introduced player driven economy with real item decay, non instanced player city  housing, a proper capped AP system, etc.. Fallen Earth true potential would be revealed. Imho Right now it's not.

I'm glad you enjoy FE, i also kinda did until i hit Sector 3 and took a step back. The devs could turn this game to sandbox in the future, they already have the tools . Until then i still think we only have a (nice) carebear themepark.

 

hmm, thankfully I gain AP not only from quests. I could view it as linear if in fact you could only gain AP with quests, but you gain AP for various things, for example, crafting, scavaging, random killing, sure you could just merly use quest to get AP faster.

I have not even covered halve of S1, main lvl17, rifleman lvl8. Keep in mind I have little time to spend ingame, mostly sunday's, occasional Monday's but during the rest of the week, hardly.

I think it's gonna take me some time before reaching S3 at my pace.

But due to the things you said, does say something about you as a player in how you played it, unfortunaly nothing really why  the game is linear.

Economy definitly needs work for sure.......

Originally posted by nate1980

Originally posted by fyerwall

Originally posted by Reklaw

How can developers end something that is in the control of it's players?

Plenty of MMORPG's under my belt, either fully played or tested but not once did I grind, I dislike that kind of playstyle, which is all Grind is to me a playstyle. I chooce not to grind, so in turn I might not hit cap lvl asap, I might not be the toughest ingame character within weeks, eventually I will ALWAY's reach that same lvl of those who "grind" onl;y thing is I personaly am enjoying the game allot longer and never get to a point of getting bored, cause to me grinding will also result in people getting bored very quick.

 

^ This.

Grind is in the players hands ultimately. If all you care about is getting to the end game as fast as you can, then you will feel the grind. If you play to have fun and see all that a game has to offer throughout all the level ranges, then you will be less likely to feel the grind.

I also like taking my time in a game. To me there is no point in grinding all the way to max level as fast as I can only to spend the next few months repetitivly grinding raid bosses and encounters. After all, raiding is still a grind for gear, and a far worse grind than one would experience while leveling.

 

Even taking your time, experiencing all the game has to offer could be considered a grind if what there is to experience is tedious and repetitive. For example, hundreds and thousands of quests that could be better described as tasks and chores will feel tedious and repetitive for me, no matter how slow I do them.

If a game....any game....regardless the genre would feel tedious and repetitve, I choose not to play such games. But keep in mind what could be considered fun for me could be considered tedious and repetitve for someone else.

I feel that if a game starts to feel tedious and/or repetitive there is more focus to get to the next lvl, to me lvl's are just a side-effect, a necessary side-effect, as obvious you will lvl.

As a example, there can be quests in a MMORPG that tell you to kill 1000 specific creature's, now I am sure if people would enter the game world and focus on killing those 1000 creature's will end up in feeling like a chore/tedious and/or even repetitve.

When I would take a quest like that it might take day's/weeks/months before I finish it, I know on my travels I will spot these creature's, I would see no need into killing them in a row, perhaps I kill a few today, perhaps a few the next day, perhaps don't even get to see those creature's for day's/weeks, eventualy I know I will finish the quest. Atleast to me this is what is meant with taking my time, I don't want games to turn out being jobs, but keep in mind seeing me talk remember I am a social/exploring crafter and hardly put any time into PVP, while sometimes I might get a feel to get into PVP, it isn't the main reason or even a reason for me to play a MMORPG, I like the other parts of a MMORPG and am more into PVP with FPS or RTS games. Though I do feel PVP should always be a part of a MMORPG game, but only by choice and never forced.

Originally posted by vladww

Not really waiting for a new sandbox, as Darkfall fill the niche for me and is really good .

Tried Fallen Earth last month but for me FE is the ultimate linear theme park,

as well as being so easy & casual it actually felt like an online sleeping pill

I am always glad to see people find their game, I am not into PVP much so Darkfall isn't a game for me.

But I like to ask: in what way do you consider FE the ultimate theme park.

I give you that it's pretty easy, but thankfully there is more then enough way's to challenge yourself (GAME-WISE)

But to consider FE a ulitmate linear themepark should come with some explanation.

Obvious I do hope your comment did more then just the intro, cause then I would agree that the intro is linear, but then again that's about 1% of the game.

Myself not really into themepark, don't really like linear, yet enjoying FE which atleast to me is a Open World game, which already can't be linear. Obvious if you want to let the game hold your hand (commonly speaking) it can be viewed as being linear, but that's due to a playstle not the game itself. So like I asked would like to know in what whay you consider FE a ultimate linear themepark.

Originally posted by johnmatthais

Originally posted by Reklaw

Myself not into Wurm, but do feel it's the closest we can get within this genre of being a sandbox MMORPG's.

 

This is straight ignorant. As long as A Tale In the Desert, Haven and Hearth, Roma Victor and Neverdaunt exist, Wurm is not alone.

It's actualy YOU that is acting ignorant as you asume I should know every single game, which I already admitted with H&E to not know every single game.

So sorry I am not being ignorant, perhaps you know each and every game ever made, I simply don't but like I said I enjoy people pointing out games I might have missed, but  this can be done in a mature way without calling someone ignorant.

Also looking forward to Airbender, still going to see Avatar. Both very different movies, both something atleast for me to look forward to, I am not a person that feels one thing is better then the other thing before I actualy have seen them, but rather enjoy them both (or not depends how they both turn out of course)

About the demo, great and believeble alien planet, graphic wise awesome to look at, game-wise just far to short of demo to really get a play feel out of it.

4400X2/7950X2/X-Fi Elitepro sound, 4gb.ram on WinXPproSP3 still makes the game looks awesome, bet on a true high end rig this will even more so.

Originally posted by JugaBro

Originally posted by Reklaw

Originally posted by GTwander

I play WURM, now *thats* a sandbox... literally, you can sit in a pit of sand and make it a castle.

 

Myself not into Wurm, but do feel it's the closest we can get within this genre of being a sandbox MMORPG's.

But like Khalathwyr I am enjoying FE, which is more a open world MMORPG atleast to me which I like allot. I like freedom I truly dislike the holy trinity, thankfully FE is giving me this freedom back that for my type of playstyle has been lost with most current MMORPG's.

Overall I don't know what people expect from a full sandbox MMORPG, I played a couple that had sandbox like feature's, like SWG, I also played UO but didn't like it as much as I did like SWG. But both are no full sandbox games but in their own way games with sandbox feature's, atleast the way I see them which is pure based on my own opinion.

Overall I want my MMORPG experiance to be that of a Open World, prefered all on one server, plenty of options ranging from combat classes to several none combat classes. Like Neonwire said I also would like to see more influence and change that can be done by the players in the gameworld, action/consequence.

And like Khalathwyr said I like to see it being made by a A-tittle company, I love what some indie devs/company's do develop, but would even love it more seeing it from those who do have a budget.

But for now will enjoy and in a small way (sub-fee) support the game I am currently enjoying which is Fallen Earth.

So not sure how to wait for something that has never really be realized other then games having certain sandbox feature's, and please EVE is not a sandbox game but also a game that has sandbox feature's again in my own opinion, thought from most current games it does offer the most options you could find in a sandbox, but in its own way it's still abit to limited to be a full sandbox game, but I am sure that eventualy EVE will reach that state where it can call itself a full sandbox game due to the many things they have planned for the game and will impliment into EVE.

Simcity or LittleBigPlanet are what I would consider full sandbox games, and not seen a MMORPG even come close to those type of possibility's other then what I started with mentioning Wurm.

 

Well, there is a game that's been around since around August this year that is definitly a sandbox game in many of your guys's definitions. Yes, it is indie developed. Yes, it isn't very polished, but it's definitly a sandbox where players control everything that occurs in the game. For you specifically, Reklaw, it fits what you call a good sandbox.

The game is called Haven and Hearth. It's a game where your thrown into the wilderness, and given the opportunity to do just about anything you want. It's what I'd call "the new Wurm", considering Wurm's recent decline. This guide best explains the game in its entirety: www.havenandhearth.com/forum/viewtopic.php   

I have personally enjoyed this game to no end, the first time for me with MMO's. I've even gotten many of my friends who don't even play MMO's to play it with me. Anyway, I just mean to give this MMO as an example of what you may be looking for.

Thanks Jugabro for posting this, I have looked at it but will admit that's it's not the game for me, yes in a way I am spoiled as being a gamer for 30+ years aswell being with online games aka MMO's since meridian59/UO, meaning I agree on you that it's the feature's in H&E that do make it a sandbox game, So I was wrong in only mentioning Wurm or those other 2 games.

But the way I am spoiled is graphic wise, personaly I feel that FE is my limit in how graphics may look to enjoy, I don't feel FE is bad looking, just somewhat dated, still has allot of detail, and I am very much enjoying the game, but H&E is abit to dated for my viewing taste to be honost.

The way I would really want a sandbox MMORPG would still take a few years before I feel tech. is able to make it into a MMORPG, meaning let's say I like to see a sandbox game nearing AoC graphics, technicly this isn't possible just yet as we still are bound to many limitations, kinda the reason why AoC does look great but has instances at many places, would for example AoC be a more sandbox game that gives players allot more freedom it would mean they need to sacrifice many things in the game, for example with current tech the world would even be smaller if they want to keep it's looks.

I also think that if FE wasn't so much of a Open World game but if they choose to make the graphics more high end that the game might have gotten instances aswell. Personaly I also feel performance is GREAT in FE, but I take into account that it's one server with people from over the world and I am even a EU player so the little hickups I get in major towns due to many people at the same spot is very excepteble for the freedom the game provide's me.

I think the option and freedom in H&E is great, just visually not appealing to me, but thanks never the less. I alway's like it when games are pointed out to me I was not really aware of, regardless if I do indeed like or dislike them.

UO the most wanted remake? I am sure plenty of people who want a UO2 or remake of it in a new skin

I think the industry DOES get it, just plenty of people on forums just don't. Just because something might turn out bad or just not what you expected does not mean the gaming industry doesn't get it.

Keep in mind forums only tell a very tiny part, it's hardcode we the players send by playing games where the coded data tells developers 1000 times more then what ever we might read on forums.

Same for me there are plenty of MMORPG I dislike, to me this never means developers don't get it. but will always mean the game just doesn't do it for me. If I would knew or anyone on forums what really would be the best way to creat/develop a game we would be doing that. Obvious keep idea's coming, some are very intrested, but to even consider that the gaming industry doesn't get it, tell me more that many people on forums simply don't get it.