Originally posted by RonnyRulz

Thx for the info. Still waitin on that buddy key though :-\

Maybe someone in your guild might have one? I'm also looking for guild as well, so that's a good recruit tool :P lol

I'll ask around... again, if you have any questions, ask me away!

I will warn you, the game is VERY buggy. It's still darn fun IMO, but the bugs can be frustrating.

I like this game, but I will still tell you to get a Buddy Key and try it our first. It's not for everyone, but it's damn fun for some 

That said, if you have any specific question, feel free to ask away

Originally posted by whitedelight
No, you did try to claim it was 175k subs over and over.

No, I didn't.

Here IS what I said:

Personally, I believe the total active Subs are around 120k, with about 30k additional Subs canceled and waiting to cycle out. Why? Well, after reading around and comparing Primetime User Numbers, that seems about right.  Again, Personally, I don't think  Canceled but not cycled Subs should be included in the numbers, but I won't call Brad a liar for activly communication with his customers on regular basis, even if I do believe he's looking at the Glass Half Full.

EDIT hours later:

Originally posted by Markaj

For example, there was a thread about subscription numbers. MX13 argued for pages and pages that 175k is the subscription numbers whereas it was actually the sales figures. But you see, that is what he wants to believe. And no matter what you do, you can't convince him. And then Brad came out and confirmed that it was indeed the sales numbers and that he can not "yet" reveal the actual subscription numbers. But, surprisingly MX13 just vanished and didn't contribute a line when it was being discussed here.

Originally posted by Markaj

Originally posted by KariTR

But what exactly are the critics critiquing?  They arent even playing the game. When posters who are playing say anything positive they are instantly scorned and told they are in denial. Well let me see, who am I going to believe; the guy who hasnt got a clue or the guy who backs up his opinion with $15 per month. Tough one no?

If I came here looking for information, I'd mostly find a lot of "sux" and "lols" - on many of the game forums not just VG's. And yet the OP states rather arrogantly "One thing I DO like about this site though is this.  Most of us are harsh critics of MMORPG's and want them to be held to higher standards."

I'll tell you, that comment sure had me laughing. The General Forum should be renamed "Free P2P discussions" and unfortunately the plethora of posts asking "Is this game free?" seep into every individual game forum too. IF there is one underlying reason that MMOs are routinely chucked out sub-par then blame the majority of MMO players (who probably put Blizzards WoW 8 million to shame) who will never shove their hands in their pockets to actually pay for quality even when it is made available to them.

It doesn't matter. Vanbois are in denial no matter if you are playing the game or not. For example, there was a thread about subscription numbers. MX13 argued for pages and pages that 175k is the subscription numbers whereas it was actually the sales figures. But you see, that is what he wants to believe. And no matter what you do, you can't convince him. And then Brad came out and confirmed that it was indeed the sales numbers and that he can not "yet" reveal the actual subscription numbers. But, surprisingly MX13 just vanished and didn't contribute a line when it was being discussed here.

Kari, this is just an example, but do you see what I mean? What can you discuss with this mindset? Or  with someone who claims that the game has been thoroughly fixed now? Or that his server is packed with people and he can find a group in the snap of fingers? etc. etc.

ROFLMAO....

Actually, I argued that the Subs were around 120k... but why would the truth matter? Especially if it gets in the way of a good Trolling rant... LOL...Brad said they were more, but I can't remember the number. I defended what he said because Trolls, with no proof, decides to come in and "claim" they knew the secrets of the universe. Anyways, they've dropped a bit IMO, based on what I've seen.

Also, stop putting fake words in others mouths. I didn't disappear, I'm right here. It's not my job to argue back and foth with anyone. If I choose to ignore Trolls like you, too bad for you. I love that I stopped following a Cluster $%^& posts that spirals off topic, and trolls like you claim "VICTORY!!!"

Grow up...

Originally posted by Vyce
The Vampire thing sounds like an exact copy of what they have in The elder Scrolls IV - Oblivion.  It was a cool feature in that game, but not cool enough for me to go back to VG. I still think they need a good year or two to fix the game.

Originally posted by KairBare

Originally posted by tillamook

Originally posted by KairBare

I don't know what kind of game you run joejccva, but if the members of this site would do a quick google on your handle, I think it would be quite enlightening.  I particularly found this linkage to the vanguard fansite you are affiliated with to be quite illuminating.

http://www.vanguardspheres.com/forums/members/joejccva.html

http://www.vanguardspheres.com/forums/search.php?searchid=91375 went dead

http://www.vanguardspheres.com/forums/search.php?searchid=91423

If you had any ethics you would disclose your affliations in your signature.  Please take your viral to your own site and stop trying to pull the wool over the eyes of the members here.  Did Sigil promise to invite you to the company BBQ in exchange for pushing their pig of a game on unsuspecting noobs?  Do you have any conscience or does it not bother you that your 'marketing' will most likely cause people to be out 50 bucks?

Edited second link because 'magically' it stopped working but its back.

 

WTF does it mater to you? I don't play VG because it's not the game for me.  If you don't like the game, you aren't gonna play it, but that doesn't mean he should be squelched from informing people who might be interested. Get a grip and stop being petty, grow up ect. The same thing could be said about you. Who do you work for and why does it matter

It matters because I make the electrons that light up your screen and power your computer is why.  As far as having a financial interest in VG or any other MMORPG or computer game for that matter, I do not.  I love how its ok for 'fans', and I use the term loosely to promote a bug-ridden, unfinished, beta-quality, exploiters paradise to the consumers of this website, but let someone say an ill word about the game, direct people to another game, or challenge your statements and all of a sudden there is a problem.

Originally posted by KairBare

Originally posted by Gerec
It's funny how you seem to know more about the game by the amount of time that you troll it than I do by the amount of time I play it.

My highest adventuring level character is 17, it's not the sphere I focus most on.

Calling a Vanguard fan who ISN'T affliated in some shape or form with Sigil,SOE,or an affiliated website here?

....................silence........

I knew the playerbase bleed was bad, but this is worse than I expected.

/raiseHand

/wave

Originally posted by KairBare

Originally posted by joejccva

 

---

Originally posted by KairBare
I don't know whether to laugh or cry watching the circle jerk over a hit or two on an obscure site.
If your site rocked you wouldn't be here........
If your game rocked you wouldn't be here......
But keep throwing out your swill for the noobs, theres enough honest people here to keep it in check.

---

 

May I ask what the problem is? You seem to have this hate flowing through you.

When people like you stop coming here lying about the state of the game and trying to drum up sales for it, I will stop trying to let people know how it really is.   From your perspective I hate VG or Sigil, I would tell you that I'm just a girly man carebear who loves everyone and dosen't want them suckered in by corporate lies or the prattering of delusional fanboys.  Honestly, I can understand someone who has had a bad experience and wants to share it, what I can't understand is people who spend all their time on these boards trying to spread the STD that is VG?  I mean, I don't like throwing out the viral accusation without at least a shred of proof, but for Christ sake, I can't understand the mentality.  What motivates you people, it has to be something.

Originally posted by Tnice

Originally posted by MX13

Originally posted by Enigma

Originally posted by MX13

Just a quick FYI...

Sigil stops by all the time. I'd guess they just don't see much to comment on...

The problem is that the Haters insist on taking over.

The Haters were once loyal Vanguard followers and players.  They got screwed over by misleading upcoming game reviews and awesome game mechanics in which 60% of them were never implemented in the game (and more than half of that never will according to Sigil).

I think these "haters" has every right to be pissed.  If Sigil feels uncomfortable coming here, then that is their perogative.

Haters DO NOT have the right to take over every conversation, and shout down others. Period.

I've been frustrated by this game, and been honest with it. That happens. If all you can to is bash the game without contributing anything of worth, you should leave. If you want to debate & discuss, let's do it.

 

I don't hate the game.  Hate is a strong word.  I am very disappointed in the game, yes.  However, we, as forum posters or even as Players do not have the power to change the game direction.  All we can do is point out the flaws.  If you want to call that "hate" then so be it.  Telling them everything is fine is much more disingenuous as it does not help them correct things.

The Sigil Team is down in the weeds of the code and perhaps are not able to see the overall picture.  They can only get that picture from listening to the Players.  They are probably playing on Uber machines that are right next to the actual server.  Therefore, they can not understand how freaking frustrating it is to cross a chunk line and lose my invis or go into 1st person view.  Are those game breaking problems?  No, but they contribute to my dissatisfaction with the game.

EQ2 was bashed when it launched and that Team was able to make a gem of a game.  Sigil may or may not be able to change direction.  Only time will tell.  But if they listen to those people who are throwing candy up their arses is not going to help.  Those posts that say there are no performance problems, no grouping problems, and that their Guild is increasing are simply BS.

Even if you think my post is BS you have to admit that this game is not doing just fine and is in danger of just being another blip in the history of MMORPGs like SWG or Horizons.

 

Edit:  The only thing Sigil needs to do to understand the problems with the game is get out of the Sigil office.  Go home.  Play on a computer they pick up from Best Buy and try to make progress.  Do not bring your friends or other Devs with you.  Pick up the game off the shelf at Best Buy and buy a relatively good gaming rig from there and play.  Then come and tell us if you have any problems and are having any fun.

VERY well said. I wouldn't view anything you said here as being "Hating". There are quite a few things I think we would agree on about the game. Haters, IMO, are people that refuse to let anything good said about the game, and Troll posts without contributing to them.

This post contributes.

Originally posted by Markaj

Originally posted by MX13

Haters DO NOT have the right to take over every conversation, and shout down others. Period.

I've been frustrated by this game, and been honest with it. That happens. If all you can to is bash the game without contributing anything of worth, you should leave. If you want to debate & discuss, let's do it.

You can not and will not decide that. Debate and discussion can be carried on with people tolerant to criticism, not with those in constant denial or with those who has scratch off critics as haters.
 

Critics & Haters are two different things, just like Fanbois & Fans are. Critics are welcome. I consider myself a Critic & a Fan. I like the game, but I'll be the first to tell you what I think is wrong with it. Performance is a joke, Graphic errors, early launch, CTD's, LAG due to build, missing material, bugged quests, a TON of play bugs, Chunk issues up the %^&... I could go on, and in detail... and there are NO excuses for launching the game like this IMO, period. They know that, and actually understand opinions like that.

That said, I still enjoy it. Also, after being in Beta for a long time and having an open dialog with the Sigil Team, I feel they get a bad wrap. They know how I feel about the state of the game, I've told them myself. I, however, believe it can be corrected and improved. Will they disappoint me? Maybe, but so far they've been great. I refuse to let my dis-trust of SOE affect my opinions of Sigil, especially when they've been great to deal with.

Since I enjoy the game, I'll talk about that as well. I fun, and I'm glad to have a game I like this much again. Maybe I'm used to poor performance since I'm a SWG Refugee... who knows... but I enjoy playing, as do our entire guild.

Originally posted by joejccva

I'm not a moderator of VG Spheres anymore just so you know. I had to leave and take alot of time away because I had a death in my family last year. I'm still a member but I'm not a moderator anymore.

You don't need to defend yourself to this Troll. "OMG, you're a Member of another site!!! YOU WORK FOR SIGIL!!!!" Come on, this guy's just trying to pump himself up... he's a big man, he knows everything about you because he can Google!

Originally posted by KairBare

Originally posted by MX13

Originally posted by KairBare

I don't know what kind of game you run joejccva, but if the members of this site would do a quick google on your handle, I think it would be quite enlightening.  I particularly found this linkage to the vanguard fansite you are affiliated with to be quite illuminating.

http://www.vanguardspheres.com/forums/members/joejccva.html

http://www.vanguardspheres.com/forums/search.php?searchid=91375

If you had any ethics you would disclose your affliations in your signature.  Please take your viral to your own site and stop trying to pull the wool over the eyes of the members here.  Did Sigil promise to invite you to the company BBQ in exchange for pushing their pig of a game on unsuspecting noobs?  Do you have any conscience or does it not bother you that your 'marketing' will most likely cause people to be out 50 bucks?

AND????

I'm a member of SV... OH NOES!!!! I'm tricking you all!!!!! OH NOES!!!!

You're talking about ethics because he's a member of another site? How about you? Tell us all of the sites you're a member of? And when did telling you info that's none of your business become a rule? Grow up...

 

Ah yes MX13, well I can't figure out if this is YOUR website or if you are just a member but the whole 'OMG VG has Vampires with a CURSE, it is soooo amazing' seems to be the current viral marketing 'talking point', at least judging from this thread and your recent post here...

http://www.rlmmo.com/viewtopic.php?t=2684

ROFLMAO!!!

Thanks for the RLMMO plug!!! I'm sure the boys appreciate it!

I'm a Cor there, and proud of it! I do not serve in any official way there. As far as marketing, Mr Genius, try reading what other people there think of the game. It's not a Vanguard Fansite for sure, lol...

If you notice when that was posted, it was posted after this post. I had forgot to tell the RLMMO folks about it, and this post reminded me. You see, like Barney, I believe in sharing. And yes, I think it is DAMN cool.

Oh, and here's a link to part one of my 3 part Vanguard Review: Buying Vanguard http://www.realmmo.com/?ul=Focus&il=70

Part 2 & 3 will be coming soon, at least 2 will hit this week... it will be on Gameplay. Part 3 will be Performance & Summary .

Originally posted by damian7

Originally posted by Lidane

 

---

Originally posted by damian7

but, since he's stated he's got thick skin and is a dev for a game, wouldn't a sigil forum be an even better stomping ground? one single place for players to look for information, since he answers different questions on different sites at different times.

 

---

Oh, believe me-- I was howling for official forums back on the Vanguard beta forums, and even some of my earliest posts around here were about the same issue. I think Sigil SHOULD have official forums, and that their excuses for not having them are idiotic.

It has never made any sense to me for this game not to have a single, unified official forum, where people could go to get information, hear from the devs, etc.

exactly.  one stop shopping = better for the customer.

Originally posted by damian7

Originally posted by MX13
http://www.mmorpg.com/profile.cfm/username/Aradune

thanks, i see a handful of posts on 3/10 and 3/11 and nothing else since release.  so i guess his post about posting here wasn't "accurate".  i also still am not finding his 5 year plan anywhere, other than a reference to it on occasion. 

but i did learn that

EQ 1 cost $8M, Vanguard over $30M, and WoW something like $80M.  Why?  Because the bar keeps being raised -- players expect more and more from these games (and rightfully so).

um, brad, boobie... wow came out a few years back, your game was just released.

i also notice a LOT of references to eq 1.  and how he says this isn't an eq clone, but he keeps comparing vg to eq and saying "we're just like eq in this respect and that respect".  and he promises raiding.  which is the single-worst thing EQ introduced to the genre -- a mind numbingly boring grindfest of a timesink.  but i guess for all those wanting a 10th eq, it's great?

i want to love this game, but i'm having a hard time even doing a trial if i can't easily find information on a game. i mean having one forum to go to that has class, profession, server, etc forums, and where the staff (plural) communicates with the playerbase.  i'm curious, why is it everyone finds it acceptable?  if you're a fan, you're not insulted by this?  how much more time does it take a dev to go to 20 boards on different sites, and repeat the same sort of answers to questions, than it would to have it on a single site?  how much more work on the parts of devs to correct incorrect impressions on a dozen different urls, than to answer the question once on their own url? 


i want to say nice things and think nice things.  but brad says he has thick skin, but then hides on other people's boards...

flame if you want, but give me important data and not sissy girl hysterics PLEASE.  so viralists, please just don't.  i want objective information and i want a reason to try out a game where the devs don't have thick enough skin to host their own forums; cuz you don't see real issues brought up on technical forums where someone has to be explained how to turn on their box.

Why is his statement inaccurate? Because he doesn't post all the time? He does have a company to run, and it shouldn't surprise anyone he posts on "Affiliated" sites first, and sites like this second.

What he said was true, he does post here. Maybe not as much as I'd even like, but you can't fault him for not meeting your timetable. There are Dozens of sites he's on, this is just one of them. Also, there are quite a few posts since release if I remember correctly.

His focus on EQ shouldn't surprise anyone either. He's one of it's creators, and has said all along he was trying to take the next step beyond the EQ experience. Personally, I hated EQ. I'm a SWG Refugee, and I think he's headed more in that dirrection, and not far enough.

His "Future Plan" is posted somewhere on SV I believe. If you ask there, I'm sure someone would be happy to point it out to you.

Originally posted by Enigma

Originally posted by MX13

Just a quick FYI...

Sigil stops by all the time. I'd guess they just don't see much to comment on...

The problem is that the Haters insist on taking over.

The Haters were once loyal Vanguard followers and players.  They got screwed over by misleading upcoming game reviews and awesome game mechanics in which 60% of them were never implemented in the game (and more than half of that never will according to Sigil).

I think these "haters" has every right to be pissed.  If Sigil feels uncomfortable coming here, then that is their perogative.

Haters DO NOT have the right to take over every conversation, and shout down others. Period.

I've been frustrated by this game, and been honest with it. That happens. If all you can to is bash the game without contributing anything of worth, you should leave. If you want to debate & discuss, let's do it.

Originally posted by arctarus
"Just a quick FYI... Sigil stops by all the time. I'd guess they just don't see much to comment on..." How you know they stop by all the time?

Originally posted by Kyleran

Originally posted by MX13

Just a quick FYI...

Sigil stops by all the time. I'd guess they just don't see much to comment on...

Now there's a statement without a shred of proof.....

Most likely, they don't have time to focus on more than a few forums, and MMORPG.com isn't on the list since its not  dedicated solely to VG.

But you are right...there really isn't much more they can say.... they just need to get busy and fix up the game as quickly as they can....

See above...

Oh, and this (thanks OP of this in this forum, made my life easy  ):

Yesterday, 04:11 PM - by Aradune

Quote: Originally Posted by Mayl Be nice if Sigil did not post on guild boards.. Talk about elitist FoH is less of a guild site now and more of a general MMOG dicussion site, one of the largest, and this has been true for some time. I use it and other general boards (like mmorpg.com) to answer general questions and get the word out about the game. I try to post on affiliate sites as well, but usually the questions are very specific and so the devs post more on the affiliate sites (Cylus, Tagad, etc.).