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All Posts by Distopia

All Posts by Distopia

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Originally posted by greenreen

 

All I kept thinking though reading about stealth is that... I've never seen a stealth healer.

Stealth has always been about damage, never about support. This scouting and camouflage is the first step toward support.

I'd love to see a large group of stealthers seem to come out of nowhere then begin turning a tide because they could heal instead of backstab hehe

 

 

SWTOR Scoundrel. I guess one could say ESO as well.

Originally posted by DarLorkar
Originally posted by Rhoklaw
It will be interesting to see what price they come up with for purchasing additional lineage. While one could play the game for a year with the initial box price. That is only true if you don't die from being ganked or latency death and so on. Just imagine if you were fighting a difficult battle and the internet or game drops you, causing you to die. You now just lost a month of play time or whatever, because of something out of your control? Yeah, I'm not sure that's going to work out so well.
  • Q. How much does the game cost? How much does a life cost?
  • No exact price has been set, but we anticipate it will be on par with the retail cost of other PC games. Lives will be roughly the cost of a game expansion.
Do not see much that i would find worth the bother to play really.  Some ideas that sound ok...but the way they are monetizing them sounds screwy to me. 
 
Course just a bunch of words now. If this goes anywhere may take a look in a year or 2-3 and see then.

100 lives is nothing to a PVPer. That said...Nothing better to kill motivation than costing money upon failure, good luck getting people to take part in truly challenging content with this system.

Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by TheHiveLeader

I find the comments regarding the community really odd. On my personal account (aka - on a character not named TheHiveLeader), the community has been nothing but extremely helpful to me. Simply put, it is full of the nicest people I've ever come across in an MMO.

I don't doubt that most people who are already part of or familiar with the community have that same perception.

Exactly, I was always cool with many on Bloodfin in SWG, that didn't mean I didn't see those same people turn around and act like elitist jerks toward what segment of players they viewed as scrubs. It also makes a huge difference regarding when you join a community, at first things are not like that, hell on Bloodfin we did nothing but zerg from Bestine to anchorhead night after night, after night with starter pistols. Later once folks had their bearings and created their clicks that greater community wide involvement died off, it really didn't reemerge until well after the game started to take a turn for the worst.

Originally posted by Muke
Originally posted by Talonsin
Regardless of WHY or WHAT happened, Daybreak will move forward under a new CEO.  While many of us believe that it was Smed holding the company back, only time will tell. 

Well, it does say enough that if someone mentions the JS name in a MMO environment, the general reaction is not enthousiastic. Not even speaking about the mmo fan community.

And people say 'even bad publicity is good publicity', I doubt that is the case in this matter when you have JS steering your train.

 

ALl it really says is people take changes to games far too seriously. As well as hold on to it far too long. That's where most if not all of this hate began.

Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Distopia
 

Clearly... based on a couple posts here? Clearly would mean you can hold up an example of a game flourishing with said system as a MMORPG... That's hard to do.

There's a simple reason this doesn't work in a traditional MMORPG environment, it's very much like the reason why devs don't usually mix item loss/ item decay with raid/gear based games. Who wants to spend a 100+ hours building, outfitting, achieving, etc.. just to lose it all in one fell swoop? It just makes no sense when the whole point is character growth/identity... Not to mention large amounts of players available to complete content with, which is another issue Perma-death brings forward. No one is willing to risk their character.. you saw this is SWG when Jedi had perma death. That is highly detrimental to the overall focus of an MMORPG.

AS for the argument it only works if everyone has to suffer it... That's not the case in most titles that feature it as in most cases it's only within "hardcore" type modes. Which means it's very much a self-inflicted option there as well.

 

 

 

"Clearly" meaning that through the years there have been numerous posts and discussions about people who want it. Which means that there is a small contingent of people who want it.

Secondly, no, I can't hold up an example of a game flourishing with this system. Can you or anyone else hold up an example of a "good" game (meaning few bugs, decent art design, workign features) that had a similar system. I'm going to say no.

And you repeat the same argument which doesn't apply. It doesn't

People who are asking for permadeath DON'T CARE about investing 100's of hours into the character because that's not what permadeath is about.

Permadeath is about multiple characters, I've said this already. It's about a "family" or a "dynasty". If you play strategy game and you lose some units or a squadron do you go nuts?

If you play X-Com for instance do you go nuts because you lost Sanchez? No! Sanchez gets replaced.

The problem with this argument is that people who don't want it argue against it based upon completely different games and under the guise that they are going to forced to play these games. Hence your last sentence.

Ridiculous. Also, where is the OP in all this?

I said it didn't work in a traditional MMORPG environment, that's a game that is all about character growth and spending hundreds of hours on that. I also made no stand on whether or not I would support the feature, I've never known you to be one to use such broad generalizations as to why someone is presenting an argument to you.

Using a  feature like this takes real imagination, as well as out of the box design. It's a whole different concept to get folks behind. That is why it is rare... when it is used, it is usually an optional mode that gives the player the choice of partaking. What is ridiculous about pointing this out?

 

 

 

Originally posted by Talonsin
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by Ikeda

Yea, except the moment they charged per month... their game is launched.  You're on the clock and owing something to your consumers.

Alpha " In this phase, developers generally test the software using white-box techniques. Additional validation is then performed using black-box or gray-box techniques, by another testing team. Moving to black-box testing inside the organization is known as alpha release"

 

Well I guess it's time to review shroud of the avatar and many other Steam EA games, like ARK etc... They're all charging for their alphas. Many of those have been at it far longer than PFO. Yet they're still in "alpha"...

The game was reviewed due to the CEO coming here and stating that the game is NOT in any kind of testing state and is a complete game.  If those other games you mentioned are claiming they are "complete" then they should be reviewed.  Luckily they are hiding behind early access/alpha/beta testing state.

I was referring to the idea of charging money, in reply to what Ikeda said... which even Bill has said he views any game as released that is charging money, so reviewing those other games would fit the bill.

Doesn't GW consider it to still be in a early access state BTW? My understanding of what he was saying was it's core features are in place, there's nothing missing in that regard, that doesn't mean they don't have a ton of things to work out. My guess was he was referring to major features being in place, guild systems, combat, building, and crafting. OR what ever other features that entails. I don't play the game nor have any interest to do so.

I just feel it would be fair to treat all EA games the same as...IMO it was reviewed because people raised a stink about it. In other words to please their own crowd here on MMORPG.com.

 

 

Originally posted by F0URTWENTY
Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by F0URTWENTY
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by Ikeda

Yea, except the moment they charged per month... their game is launched.  You're on the clock and owing something to your consumers.

Alpha " In this phase, developers generally test the software using white-box techniques. Additional validation is then performed using black-box or gray-box techniques, by another testing team. Moving to black-box testing inside the organization is known as alpha release"

 

Well I guess it's time to review shroud of the avatar and many other Steam EA games, like ARK etc... They're all charging for their alphas. Many of those have been at it far longer than PFO. Yet they're still in "alpha"...

 

Those games charge box fees just as pathfinder does and most people don't have much of a problem with that.

The difference is pathfinder will cost you 180$/year.

Rust and H1z1 are being actively developed and not costing me a thing.

Ah, so your position is that an Alpha game with a cash shop is perfectly fine but an alpha game with a subscription is not.

Pathfinder charges a box fee, sub fee, and has a cash shop for the pitiful state its in. You can't compare it to other early access games, none are as incomplete or cost anywhere near as much. 

There would be something seriously wrong with games like Dayz, Rust, Ark, etc.. charging a subscription fee...

That is Pathfinders business plan, just as a box fee is any of those other games business plan. IN short all of those games are taking advantage of running with their business plan, while still being considered alpha products by their studios...

Bill has also gone on record as saying once you're charging.. you're released in his eyes... he's said that about mere cash-shops with F2P games. In other words, games you don't have to pay a dime for.  What's good enough for the goose is good enough for the gander as they say... otherwise it just looks like a selective public lynching.

 

 

 

Originally posted by Ikeda

Yea, except the moment they charged per month... their game is launched.  You're on the clock and owing something to your consumers.

Alpha " In this phase, developers generally test the software using white-box techniques. Additional validation is then performed using black-box or gray-box techniques, by another testing team. Moving to black-box testing inside the organization is known as alpha release"

 

Well I guess it's time to review shroud of the avatar and many other Steam EA games, like ARK etc... They're all charging for their alphas. Many of those have been at it far longer than PFO. Yet they're still in "alpha"...

Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
I almost..almost payed money to try this game and i am glad that i did not.

Why would you pay? They were handing out free trials like candy.

Originally posted by SlyLoK
Originally posted by madazz
So.... nice argument and all... but Star Citizen wasn't revealed too early. It was a project idea presented to the public for funding. Very different. So its not really a good candidate for this conversation.

Supposedly it was more than just an idea as they said that they had already worked on the game for a year prior to crowdfunding. That doesnt seem to be the case.

That could really mean anything, from coming up with design docs and concept art to 3d models or story-lines.

Originally posted by Vonatar

Games like this are all very well, however they need community. I played 4hrs of PG today for the first time and the community was full of unhelpful elitists thinking that newbies wanting basic guidance are just WoW players needing instant gratification who should gtfo.

 

Maybe just my experience on a particular day, but there go my thoughts of playing it again or supporting it.

This is what I was wondering about while reading the lead's intro on the PG site. As he was essentially promising good community within a game all about "challenge".., which if community involvement is based on what you can do as well as what you've achieved, you're going to have a lot of what you described above. As that's how many of the hardcore PVE types are (the leets so to speak). IF you can't run this dungeon, defeat that boss you're no good to anyone, hence you're treated as a scrub.

An odd choice to base the article on, how is a studio to fund a kickstarter if they don't reveal the product people are kickstarting?
Originally posted by h0urg1ass
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by h0urg1ass
The vast majority of players want their hands held.  They want to be told what to do next and where to do it.  Only a small percentage of gamers have the imagination or the drive to create their own experience given the tools to do it.

Sandbox games will always take a backseat to the on-rails hand holders.  It's just a fact.  But it doesn't invalidate the need to produce ever better sandboxes with ever better tools to play with in those sandboxes.

I hate posts like this. It's somewhat self agrandizing. 

yeah that's right they don't have the imaginations. Or maybe they use their imaginations for other things, maybe important things, and they just want to chill with a story that games can grant?

It's always disappointing to see people make some claim that bolsters who they are and puts another down because that person doesn't appreciate what they like. That can go many ways you know. I wonder if the microscope was put on you if you would pass?

 

Call it whatever you want.  

Most people prefer to be ushered from one treadmill to the next.  

It simply, and undeniably, takes more imagination to be dropped into a huge box of LEGO's and told "go build something, but we're not going to tell you what to build".  

Go research the EVE Online forums for quit posts and you'll find that the majority of players say the same two things "I'll never catch up" and "It's boring... there's nothing to do".  Which is absolutely laughable.  There are literally thousands of things to do, but no one's there with big flashing neon lights saying "Dugeon 'x' has the best gear, go grind that dungeon next".

You might have a point if most sandbox games involved truly creating something... How many examples of that are there really? In most cases it's as much creating something as following the directions on a box of mac and cheese. It basically boils down to..."Here place this box we made on this node we provided for you to do so." Even EVE's or in the past SWG's RP and in game politics/story is a rare type of scenario. In most cases sandbox creativity boils down to join my group so we can beat up that other group... which is more comparable to a schoolyard brawl than it is the powers of the human imagination.

 

 

Nope, not enough respect for the complexity involved in doing so. Plenty of other interests to cater to where that is not the case.
Originally posted by Lonzo

where the **** are the games for the hype? Still not a single new decent Sandbox-Release till today. What are the companies doing? Chilling and sleeping?

I cant understant that....

Perspective... if you're wondering why it has taken too long, after three years of waiting... it has taken Bethesda, a studio with countless resources, 4-5 years to make Fallout 4. A single player game.

Originally posted by greenreen

The release of DLC says to me the cash shop is not doing well enough so this is a push to get people to pay again. I expect they'll play both of them back and forth now. A little cash shop, a little DLC.

They announced their plans for DLC like content additions along with the breakdown of the B2P set-up. In that sense the plan was always to supplement sales with subs, DLC would be the only reason to sub past the first month or so of B2P as the Cash-shop as it stands doesn't really offer much (in turn the crowns you get for subbing, don't amount to much), still months later that is the case. Each purchase from the cash-shop is also account wide in terms of mounts pets, outfits etc.. Buy a horse, every character has it, same with pets and outfits. This alone shows cash-shop was never really the main avenue in further profit, DLC will entice subs, which seems to have always been the plan, I don't think it's a reaction.

Originally posted by Golelorn
I think people honestly do that. I just don't believe it if I see their forum join date is not that old. So you were there at DAoC launch, but you didn't sign up at MMORPG until 12 years later? Skecthy. Plus, there is no way everyone who says they were there could be there. EQ/DAoC would have had millions of players at launch lol

I didn't sign up here until after the NGE hit SWG. I knew of the site of course, read articles, browsed forums etc... SO join date really means nothing considering the first MMO I tried was DAOC at the tail end of 2002 (almost a full 3 years prior). I only dabbled in DAOC of course, I had no idea what i was doing, and only picked it up to get the idea of what an MMORPG was, due to learning of them in an article about SWG. SO I literally went out bought a PC, and two games UO and DAOC, all because of this one game coming up. UO was certainly not my thing, shortest lived MMORPG experience for me. DAOC though was fun and the PVP mechanic blew me away which I only saw the surface of, by the time I was doing that SWG was about to release.

Long story short, had it not been for SWGs NGE, as well as the long standing, continuing drought of any game close to being like pre-cu SWG, I would possibly have never signed up here, I'd still be too busy playing games I actually wanna play/see...

The middle road in KOTOR is essentially don't get involved. Which with most side conversations you can choose. KOTOR 2 takes these options a bit further. Either way I don't really feel it detracts from the core of what that game is all about.
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Sovrath

The issue here is you "don't get it'.

Sov, here's the thing. You say it can works for a limited audience in a different type of game. No one said your wrong. You can say 'you don't get it' all you want, but that doesn't change anything. Culturally, it doesn't work in MMOs here. 

 

It works if people are interested. Clearly there is a call for it and clearly there are people who don't mind it and want it and want to play it.

I would 100% play a perma death mmo if it had a system where you count down to death. Sort of like those old arcade games where you have a free life.

And I'd pay a sub to do it.

I can imagine there are others who would to. It works as much as ffa pvp (which people will say "doesn't work" yet there are people wholly on board for that.

The problem is people are saying "don't make the game because I don't like that". And that's the part that I think is ridiculous.

The only issue is that it would have to be a small game with a small budget.

Clearly... based on a couple posts here? Clearly would mean you can hold up an example of a game flourishing with said system as a MMORPG... That's hard to do.

There's a simple reason this doesn't work in a traditional MMORPG environment, it's very much like the reason why devs don't usually mix item loss/ item decay with raid/gear based games. Who wants to spend a 100+ hours building, outfitting, achieving, etc.. just to lose it all in one fell swoop? It just makes no sense when the whole point is character growth/identity... Not to mention large amounts of players available to complete content with, which is another issue Perma-death brings forward. No one is willing to risk their character.. you saw this is SWG when Jedi had perma death. That is highly detrimental to the overall focus of an MMORPG.

AS for the argument it only works if everyone has to suffer it... That's not the case in most titles that feature it as in most cases it's only within "hardcore" type modes. Which means it's very much a self-inflicted option there as well.

 

 

 

Originally posted by Wizardry

I  have been spoiled by FFXi,they are up to about 40 or so npc's personalities that can join your fight.

They are doing a few cool or funny ideas however you want to label them.One npc being able to say your name will be funny or absurd or abnoxious all depends on player names.Then we have added model detail to allow for cool effects when killed,not sure how many models will have that added detail.I have bought many titles from the past Fallout.Elder scrolls,Skyrim seems their games are like well done enough to want to buy them but once i start playing i wish i had my money back (.

I love the dog and him as your companion but then again i love dogs in real life too :) so that alone might get me to play this game.

Maybe you should stop buying them then? In the end all Bethesda RPG titles play similar to one another.

I do have to say, I am starting to wonder about your posts, you constantly try and shine a negative light on other studios games, while singing some form of praise toward SE.. I have a hard time remembering a post of yours that didn't do just that.

 

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