At first, I thought this was all just a big joke. However, I decided to give one of my friends a call and asked him what he thought. He works for a local news investigative team in Minnesota and so I asked him if he'd be interested in a possible story. After explaining to him about certain activities on the internet as well as other illegal activities being performed by corporations in the online gaming industry, he said he would bring it up to his team lead.

Granted, it's the weekend, but I should get a call back from him early next week on whether or not they will start any investigation. So far, I've faxed him documentation on Colton Burgess and LAS, ranging from personal threats/attacks to his boasted chatroom discussion on NeverwinPoker.com. I don't have any personal contact information on people involved at the moment, such as members of this community or other websites, but I can aquire that over the next couple of days.

I'm sorry Colton, if you feel I'm taking this a little too far, but your actions have warranted such. However, don't feel like I'm singling you out because I'm not. I've brought other companies into this investigation simply because it's getting out of hand. I'm not doing this because you may or may not have earned money illegally. I'm reporting you simply on the grounds of what you've said or threatened to do.

The days of the Mafia are over and scare tactics won't work on me, trust me. If being in the military has taught me anything, it's to never back down and always fight for those who can't fight for themselves. So, on behalf of the gaming community and other people like myself, I'm going to expose you and your company for anything even remotely close to illegal. I'm tired of your behavior and from one business owner to another, your ethics on customer relations sucks.

Enjoy...

Ok, after doing a little research, apparently the game Mourning, was created by a Romanian based company called Nuanced Entertainment which was run by a 16 or 18 year old kid named McCall? Ooookay.

Because Mourning was selling preorders before the game was even playable, it was later shutdown because of this debacle. Nuanced Entertainment then sold their game and all it's virtual properties and designs along with it's engine to a Portland, OR based company called Loud Ant Software LLC. The company is run by CEO Colton Burgess who as we have seen in recent forum activity, a not so bright individual.

During LAS's ownership, MMORPG.com investigated the company to verify it was indeed a separate entity from NE. After verifying this to be true, it was later discovered that LAS had a few individuals from NE working for them as consultants. Not a really big deal as most of the game was in Romanian and needed to be interpreted. However, there were rumors that one or more employees of NE were going to be moved to LAS's company permanently. This is when MMORPG stepped in again and delisted Thrones of Chaos ( previously known as Mourning ) due to conflicting information.

After other recent MMO failures such as Dark and Light and Horizons, it's becoming quite a trend for gaming companies to attempt a bait and switch tactic to defraud customers of money. Colton of course has been allowing pride and ego to get the best of him, spouting off claims of going on a nice vacation as if his hard earned money was truely earned legally. After threats of IRS involvements by one or more game enthusiasts, Colton has stepped it up a notch with his own tactics of proposing the initialization of investigations into the legal activities of these people.

Basically, it's come down to who owns this game or who is about to own it. Simply because whoever touches it ends up getting their reputation drug through the mud thanks to the two prior companies already involved. I seriously don't care anymore what happens to those companies, so long as future involvements with the gaming community are prevented. The world has enough problems and we don't need selfish crooks who have nothing better to do then try and steal suckers from babies so they can live a better lifestyle.

Colton exclaims that he's done nothing wrong, which is fine and dandy. He does however seem to know a lot about Dark and Light's illegal earnings of $700,000. Thats right folks, you better believe it. MMO's are now probably one of the hottest criminal areas on the internet. Companies making promises and not keeping them, illegal. Companies selling products that don't fall under the detailed description provided by their website, illegal. Companies charging money to cancel subscriptions, illegal.

Welcome to todays world... isn't it wonderful?

I've played many forms of PvP and I don't get whats so important about having a full looting system implemented. Why must you have the rights to loot the people you killed in order for PvP to be enjoyable. It sounds to me like the only way your satisfied is if you make another player suffer personally. PvP doesn't have to be personal to be fun and Dark Age of Camelot has proven this time and time again. The conquer and control method provides plenty of opportunity for one to prove their skills in PvP without singling out specific individuals. World of Warcraft is another example with the new Burning Crusade expansion, that proves conquer and control gives a game that ongoing feeling.

Full looting PvP will convince more people to quit or not even buy a game then it will to encourage them. However, I feel all players deserve to have their ideal game to play and so perhaps gaming companies could start out with 1 or 2 servers with such an implementation as full looting and see how it goes. If it's a success, then no problem, add more servers. I just don't think a game will ever dedicate to full looting when PvP without it has proven to be as popular as it is.

Ya know, if any game offers a free trial, there should be no reason to ask if the game is worth playing. Just DL the trial and play it and find out first hand if you like it. One thing I've learned is a lot of people on gaming sites tend to lie, exagerrate and mislead others into believing what they feel, not what they know about a game.

I played SWG when it first came out and it was fun, unbalanced, but fun. I would have to say that it probably had and still does have one of the best crafting systems of any MMO. The current combat system is a little awkward to say the least and I can understand why people say it seems destined for a PS3 console game.

Would I suggest SWG as a game for someone interested... hmm. There really isn't anything wrong with the game if you've never played before. It's just that the changes made to the game are so drastically different then the original concept that veterans cant stand to play it anymore. That doesn't mean that someone new to the game wouldn't enjoy it, but thats why I say give the trial a try and find out for yourself.

World of Warcraft does bring a lot of new innovations to the genre, but nothing so spectacular to make it as popular as it is. To be honest, theres nothing about WoW that sets it apart from other games other then 8 million people saying it does. WoW is just an oversized bandwagon with a majority of its population derived from teenagers or younger who haven't a clue what they are talking about. Sure, I'm 34 and I've played WoW... twice now. Once when it first came out and again about 6 months ago.

WoW did do something right because it is addicting to play, but it's end game, atleast until the expansion came out was nothing to take home to momma. I personally haven't tried the expansion, but it sounds like a nice addition to what WoW already has to offer. However, WoW's PvP system is still flawed outside of battlegrounds and by that I mean it's a griefers paradise which is never a positive side effect for any MMO.

WoW has a great story, great graphics and a lot of competitiveness, but I'm going to pull this out of my arse and say, it's just another 1 hit wonder probably because of Blizzards track record with it's other games. In essence, due to the current public awareness of MMO's in todays world, I would go so far as to say, WoW is today what EQ1 was when it first came out.

EQ1 was the first stepping stone and now WoW is the second. Who knows what next MMO will leap forward to take on that 3rd step and have everyone dying to play and by everyone, I mean everyone.

I must say, I'm impressed the CEO of a gaming company would take his/her time from what should be a busy schedule to log in to this website to shoot the shit with gamers. I don't know anything about ToC, but I'm pretty sure that won't change. However, I can see that because one person has called you out and you feel compelled to respond a multitude of times in an unprofessional manner, that perhaps this individual hit a sore spot. Honestly, if the game was anything close to being successful, I really doubt you'ld feel the need to come here and defend it yourself.

I guess even your company can't even afford a decent PR rep eh? Tsk Tsk, nothing like putting a nail in your own coffin.

FFA PvP does not work because of griefing, differences in leveling due to power gamers and casual players and so on. Lets take a look at a game that does allow for FFA PvP and a game most of us may have played, Eve Online. EO offers FFA PvP but it also provides protective parameters in lowbie zones, but you can still kill anyone anywhere if you so desire. You can also loot whatever is left over from the target ships destruction. As well as detroy their pod ship, setting them back in either skill points or the loss of a clone or even both.

One would say, Eve Online is doing well, since it just recently reached 30k subscribers online at one time. Well, EO only has one server, so to say everyone who plays it, plays it for the FFA PvP is probably a biased assumtion since the players don't have the option to choose a different server type to play on. However, plenty of people still play that game despite the game settings. I've played EO for a while, but found it to be rather boring since the whole purpose of the game revolves around who has the biggest gang on the block. You can control certain sectors in the galaxy, but so what, the game in itself serves as a PvP game only. There really is nothing to control except the rights to mine certain minerals and well, that's not exactly exciting to me.

When it comes to FFA PvP with no risk, such as games like DAoC and Planetside. I find them to be more interesting because your not forced into a life of recovery mode if you are killed, unlike Eve Online where losing a ship could mean a huge setback in terms of a loss of resources and isk. I don't play PvP games to grief, I play them for the competition. I know plenty of folks enjoy the griefing aspect of FFA PvP servers and to be honest, I think they simply have no PvP skills because they can't PvP anyone their level.

FFA PvP with a complete looting system enabled will not work, because too many people fight with no honor. Perhaps if the game were setup like Eve Online, where everyone that starts on a server, levels at the same pace regardless of time spent playing, then it could work. But thats the only PvP system I've encountered that would support such a task without jeopardizing game integrity. 

Yes, SOE is out to get everyone. That's why they are the only company to offer a decent monthly price for not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, but 5 MMO's. If they were hurting that bad for money, I don't think they'd have bothered to create the station pass, do you? I'd like to see NC Soft do something like this with all their games, but they won't, cause they can't afford it.

So many people hate SOE because of SWG and no matter how many times you tell them, they simply remain ignorant of the truth. SWG was developed and produced by SOE with the sole exception that Lucas Arts would have control of game direction and design. But no, people just keep spreading false rumors and propaganda that SOE screwed SWG players all by themselves.

I quit playing SWG before CU and NGE, but just because so many of you hate SOE cause of SWG, I decided to start playing again. I want to see if SWG is really a horrible game like everyone claims it to be. Since I already have a station pass, it doesn't cost me a dime to play it anyway, so whether it sucks or not is no skin off my back. I can still enjoy the other 4 games I have access to, which boggles my mind.

People hate SOE out of pure spite and thats about it. SOE has done nothing to the gaming industry that makes them stand out as a leader in corruption, unlike games like Dark and Light. Oh, so a game changed so much since you bought it that you can't stand playing it anymore? So quit, holy crap, how hard is it to do. I quit MMO's all the time if I don't like them anymore.

This whole SOE haters club is a joke and everyone I see promoting it has lost all respect from me. A gaming company would have to do something seriously wrong to piss me off to the point of constant bickering and flaming for months and months and months. I have yet to encounter such a game or a company aside from Dark and Light, but thank goodness I didn't follow that game.

As I mentioned in my post, there has already been an alternative to "The Grind" which was implemented a few years back in a game we know as "Eve Online."

In Eve Online, you gain skill points constantly, whether your online playing or not. Basically, you select a skill you want to train in and the game does the rest. There are hundreds of skills to train in and some take months to complete. However, you can spend your time in Eve Online doing whatever it is your heart desires. Mine asteroids, learn schematics and build stuff or just explore. You don't gain XP from killing things, just items and ISP which is EO's monetary system.

The only drawback is that your account must remain active in order to select new areas to train in. Training points do not build up over time if you aren't training in anything. The game is also intelligently designed to allow the new player, to engage in large battles because the way combat is designed.

• Small Ships: What most people can achieve in little to no time at all, usually within the first month for a new player still figuring out how to play. Small ships are well, small, thus making them harder to hit by medium and large ships, making them viable assets in any war.
• Medium Ships: I'd say on average, a player can achieve this skill and cost after about 1-2 months of playing. Like small ships, medium ships are hard to target by large ships but medium ships can take more damage then smaller ships and can of course, provide more combat strategies, due to more ship slots and abilities.
• Large Ships: I'm not positive, but I would guess a person could achieve a large ship in about 6 months or more. Large ships carry a vast array of weapons and tactics and are usually the backbone to any faction war. Providing heavy armor and shields as well as extremely powerful weapons.
• Capital Ships: I only know of 1 capital ship being built, but I don't play Eve Online anymore. However, this is a huge ordeal and is usually sqwaked about on the Eve Online main webpage. These are the ulitimate ships providing enough armor and firepower to give a corporation and their allies the edge needed to control a large portion of the galaxy.

There you have it, a game solely designed on the idea that games don't have to be played constantly to be fun. Also, people stay subscribed because they continue to train while subscribed, giving them the ability to utilize a vast array of skills and options.

The grind was implemented first in EverQuest and the reason being was because MMO's took on a new form of never ending gaming. How do you create a persistant online game without setting boundaries. Even with recent games such as World of Warcraft and City of Heroes, people are taking the grind to new limits by reaching max levels in months or even weeks and in some rare cases, days. You have to look at it from the developers point of view. You spend millions of dollars which can only be recovered if the game's longevity is there to keep people subscribed for atleast a year or two. The easiest way to keep people subscribed is of course to control their rate of leveling.

Perhaps one day, games won't require so much money to create and we could do away with "The Grind" so people can actually sit down and enjoy the game with everyone, instead of just those who level at the same pace as you. We all hate the grind, not because it makes the game progress so slowly, but because we miss out on the feeling of accomplishment. The grind when first introduced was actually a good idea and something everyone could live with. It wasn't until people started gaming hardcore or paying 3rd party levelers to get them to max level in a few days that games became pointless to play.

You are right though, the grind has been conquered because of 3rd party levelers and so a lot of games are being put on the shelf because no one wants to compete with that. Hopefully games like Eve Online will shed some light on how gaming should be done, where player dedication is rewarded based on time both in and out of game, instead of just in game.

Hello everyone, just thought I'd give a heads up in regards to what I have been through, seen and accomplished in my days of online gaming. First off, a lot has changed since I first started playing multiplayer games online. Simply because the first games I did play online, had no graphics. People refer to these as MuDs and let me tell you, they are still played today by a lot of folks. It wasn't until Ultima Online came out that online gaming was viewed as a limited way of enjoying fun with a few other people adventuring in the same world as you. Finally, a game with graphical representation of you, your fellow companions, enemies and structures. You could actually relate to things in a way never before imagined. This began the MMO era and let me tell you, it's only gotten bigger and better every year.

Rhoklaw's MMO History:

• Meridian 59  ( 3-6 Months )
• EverQuest  ( 4-5 Years )
• Asheron's Call  ( 6-12 Months )
• Anarchy Online  ( 6-12 Months )
• Dark Age of Camelot  ( 4-5 Years )
• Asheron's Call 2 ( 3-6 Months )
• World War II Online  ( 6-12 Months )
• Eve Online  ( 6-12 Months )
• Final Fantasy XI  ( 3-6 Months )
• Guild Wars  ( 3-6 Months )
• Star Wars Galaxies  ( 6-12 Months Pre Everything )
• Shadowbane ( 6-12 Months )
• Earth and Beyond  ( 3-6 Months )
• Planetside  ( 6-12 Months )
• The Matrix Online  ( 6-12 Months )
• D&D Online  ( 3-6 Months )
• Auto Assault  ( 3-6 Months )
• EverQuest II  ( 6-12 Months )
• City of Heroes  ( 6-12 Months )
• City of Villains  ( 3-6 Months )
• World of Warcraft  ( 6-12 Months )

Rhoklaw's MMO Betas:

• Asheron's Call 2
• Auto Assault
• EverQuest II
• Horizons
• Shadowbane
• Star Wars Galaxies
• Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
• ??? ( NDA )

Rhoklaw's To Play List:

• Gods and Heroes
• WarHammer Online
• Star Trek Online

I've only recently discovered X-Fire back in March of 2005, so a lot of my gaming history isn't recorded. I also play a lot of games that aren't listed here or are single player only. As of right now, I've been going through MMO's of the past trying to tide me by while I wait for the next MMO that's worthy of my money. I'll be honest in saying that I don't follow games as much as some, scowering the forums for any bit of info that gives them the edge of making them the truest of die hard fans. However, I have learned over the years since being a member here at MMORPG.com that even I started out as a hater, basher, fanboi and so on. Of course, I've learned to mature and understand that people like you and me don't come here to read other people's insults and flames. So I've taken it upon myself to be as unbiased as possible in my game reviews as I can. What does this mean to you? Well, I'm a freelance gamer, so I'm not being bribed and I don't have any reason to lie about a game to make it look good or bad.

So, from this day forward, I'm going to try my best to beta as many games as I can. I will utilize MMORPG.com's site as my place of operation. Providing a true gamer's point of view based on my past experiences with other MMO's. This won't be the ultimate review or guide on what games to purchase or play, but a simple rundown on what new games have to offer or areas of improvement from games of the past. 

You forgot to mention the all time greatest crime lord in MMO history, Dark and Light. Granted, the stores won't give you a refund, but that is because open box policies protect the stores, which are just retailers. If you want to make an actual fight/argument, you'll have to take it to the gaming company and their producers directly. Gaming companies can be held responsible for false advertisement and or fraud or other criminal activity. The reason you don't see a lot being done about it is because it is still relatively new and unexplored by the courts and legal system.

I have seen offers being made by Dark and Light for refunds of some sort. Unfortunately, the only thing to do is boycott which has been quite effective in human history for turning a company around, or flushing them out of the business. You could also try and get a petition started which can be signed in something as simple as emails, although a signed petition holds up better in court.

Companies are not impervious to consumer rights. Actually, companies can get sued for huge fines way more then what the cost would have been to actually produce the quality product advertised. In essence, businesses gamble with consumer stupidity on a regular basis. All it takes is someone with enough motivation and knowledge to turn a business giant into a crying child pleading for a second chance.

Well, your not understanding the MMO market then. You don't want to be competing with whats already out there. If you don't bring something new and exciting to the table, then what do you have to offer the already flooded market that will entice people to play your newly developed game?

I'm not trying to be funny or sarcastic in any way when I say this, but VSoH actually compares to Dark Age of Camelot in terms of gameplay. No, it does not compare to EQ2 or WoW, its not even close. There are strong points to this game, that I can agree with, but combat is definately not this games strong point.

Also, take a deep breath of reality folks. This game is suppose to be released in roughly 3 weeks, correct? Can you honestly tell me, the game is ready as is? Do you get the sense of a complete game, having its final tweaks and adjustment phases almost complete? I don't know, I just don't find this game interesting to me at all and it really hurts me to say it cause I loved EQ so much. I'm pretty sure the game will turn around, but my guess is, it's going to take longer then 3 weeks.

I've been following a lot of games off and on while I continue to play or beta other MMO's. G&H is one of these games and I for one thought it was a grand idea for an MMO. I saw nothing wrong with squad based combat and I certainly don't see anything wrong with Roman Mythology as the setting.

However, I recently read some posts by Netboyz in another thread and he seems pretty level headed and sure of himself, in a good way. He certainly doesn't have anything nice to say about this game, but then I began to wonder. How many ex-employees after being fired from a company, turn around and spread false propaganda in retaliation. I don't know if he ever worked for PE, but he said a friend of his did for 1.5 months. So, I'm beginning to wonder if his knowledge isn't tainted with some bad mojo.

At any rate, I've found out that MMO's are like anything else in the world. Not everyone likes the same thing. WoW is adored by 7 million people, yet theres plenty here that don't have a kind word to say about it. MMO's are becoming more and more popular and everyone is trying to cash in on a piece of the action.

While some might say a release date being pushed back is a bad sign. I say releasing an incomplete product like some veteran developers do isn't exactly a good reputation builder either. I remember a game called Dragon something being developed by Code Masters that looked superb for it's time era. All of a sudden, the whole game just up and vanished. It's amazing how games can have a strong following one day and then their new found love has been stripped from their die hard grasp as if vapor ware was going out of style. Guess what, Code Masters is working with Atari to help make Lord of the Ring Online. I'm sorry, but as much as I loved the movies and books, the MMO has to be as unoriginal as you can get. The game offers nothing new except a story driven environment enthusiasts can easily relate to.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, you have people like me, who are not developers, but rather veteran players who have no common ground with people who are game developers, such as Netboyz claims to be. It just goes to show, you can hate a game, but that doesn't mean it won't be successful. I guess, even hard fact advice from experts must be taken with a grain of salt. Hell, I wouldn't even trust our own president as far as I could throw him to tell me whats good for our country. My point is people, study the reviews and do your own research. Third party info is great, but be the judge for yourself and play a game because it looks interesting to you. Don't play something because one person who says he knows what he's talking about says to play it.

Originally posted by Corv1
Hm I can't agree with that - I really like the combat in Vanguard! I have much more than for example in WOW or SWG. It's not too easy and you have to use your skills. I really don't see where the problem is. No it's not a reinvention of the typical MMORPG combat but it's definitely not worse than others.

I also don't see why changing classes doesn't make a difference. It's night and day between playing a Blood Mage or a Ranger (that'S what I mostly played).

Maybe our tastes are completely different .. I don't know. Or maybe you jsut aren't in the mood for a MMO at the moment? ;) But seriously: I absolutely LOVE Vanguard so far and have high hopes for its future.

Where the game really shines so far is harvesting and crafting. I love that you can actually see a tree fall after you trotured it with your axe. The fact that you can work together in those ares is awesome too. Completely different from the egomaniac stuff in other MMOs.

Overall fun so far for me: 8.5 out of 10 .. increasing

My review of the combat system is based on 2 things, Animations/Spell Effects and overall Combat Style Variety. To be honest, this games combat compares in equality to that of Dark Age of Camelot, another game I love. Sad thing is, that game was made in 2001 and that's not something you want to be competing with.

If you want to have any success in this category, your going to have to have something equal to or better then games like WoW or City of Heroes. Combat in both those games fulfills not only animations/effects, but also a wide variety of combat styles. VSoH is extremely lacking in the combat system, atleast for a game thats suppose to be 3rd generation and due to come out in 3 weeks. I also said, that doesn't mean it can't or won't improve, as such, my review is based on the current state of the game.