PQs in open RvR lakes.

This one's been talked about from day 1 and imo is the most effective (and probably cheapest) possible addition to open RvR experience.

The last event showed that they can be fun... if done well.

If Mythic finally got off their asses and introduced RvR PQs in contested zones that would actually provide VPs it would go a LOOONG way towards making T4 RvR experience on pair with scenarios. Not to mention how it would finally make different zones FEEL different rather than "bash the door" level of complexity and variety we have now. Say that there is a different PQ in each RvR lake that is unlocked when the zone goes contested... they could even be modelled on existing scenario rulesets. Like, in one you have to carry the thing to your base, in the other one you hold 3 nearby points for a certain time and in third it's a race who is going to kill the other faction's npc boss leader first - ofc, the bosses are very close to each other, maybe even fighting each other... Fun stuff, you know.

.. and besides that.. duelling - that one is definitely missing.

The rest is fine by me.

.. at least for me, so if anyone is in open beta or has some more info please resopond!

Does Allods have any of the following:

1) Open PvP

2) Viable leveling through PvP only (or mostly). In short, do you get decent xp for player kills? And can you PvP from low rank or do you have to "learn your class" and "earn your spurs" by killing 1000's of dumb mobs?

3) Open world or some kind of follow the A-B-C road?

4) Territorial warfare in open world? (taking keeps, resources, towns etc for your guild/faction)

5) Some kind of sidekick/boost system so I don't get separated from my friends just because I can't spend exactly the same amount of time on the game as they do?

... and I saw instanced PvP mentioned. How many arenas/bgs are there? Are they available from early level? Can you get XP from them?

Oh and yes... crafting? Anything interesting there?

Their webpage is very prettily done but its severely lacking in basic information. Yes we all know their game is "revolutionary" and has "thousands of quests" and all the drivel about gfx and animation and "original "epic" story"... just like absolutely every MMO ever published.  I couldn't care less about those tbh. Please gimme hard info on stuff that will really impact my gameplay.

Thnx in advance!

WAR has 4 tiers of content (game areas basically) which follow char level progression at roughly 10 levels each tier.

Tier 1 is starting areas, levels 1-11. There's both open world and instanced PvE and PvP in three separate racial pairings (6 largish zones). It is pretty representative of the whole game, although a lot of things are introduced later on. For example a lot of open RvR revolves around keep sieges which are missing in T1 where you fight over battlefield objectives which are not protected by walls. In addition you get your 3 scenarios (instanced PvP arenas) and PvE stuff to explore.

A lot of players consider T1 to be the most enjoyable and polished part of the game, especially if you like to play casual, hence there is always lively action in T1 due to all the alts players create to take a break from later tiers and play the game more like an online FPS with discardable characters. Later on things get abit more complex and some solutions, particulary in open RvR, are not very well thought out and implemented. This is being adressed by the devs although quite slowly.

From what I gather they are putting an emphasis on something called "story" so I don't expect they will allow some uncouth creeps unknowledgeable in the ways of "story-telling" to mess with their "vision."ž

In short expect a single player RPG with a highly optional multiplayer component and PvP that is divorced from the rest of the game and especially the world state... we can't allow those pimply geeks to mess with our carefully crafted "story" now can't we? This could seriously diminish little Timmy's chances of completing his heroe's jurney by saving the world and finally feeling like he accomplished something with his life... he and 10+ milion others like him.

So, a little Timmy game... Sadly the devs (or at least western big-name ones) still believe their target audience is 12 year old boys. Until this is changed we will continue being fed "Little Timmy Saves the World" mmos.

On the other hand I might be wrong. Who knows? I'm skeptical tho. Bioware is a single-player developer and I seriously doubt this won't influence their design. Their press releases largely confirm my fears.

Originally posted by Tyvolus5

Originally posted by Phioku

Having to level to 25 just to experience pvp is lame while in WAR I can start messing players up from level 1. Whats the point of leveling to 25 to experience mass pvp?

 

Having played WAR -- the only messing people up you can do at level 1 is maybe a scenario.  The races are so spread out and split up in that game, at level 1 you will be lucky enough just to see someone from your own alliance, let alone someone you can actually pvp -- other then of course a "scenario."  So, nice try -- but like I said, I played WAR, so I know how full of &%$@ you are.

You obviously played WAR a long time ago and are basing all your comments on that experience. You are full of bs and are, probably unintentionally, misleading. Nowadays open RvR has huge rewards compared to scenarios and there is always a lot of it going on, especially in T1 - just don't expect it to come to you. Open your map, check which pairing is "hot" at the moment (it's got huge crossed swords on it FYI) and simply fly there - it'll take you less time than an average wait for a scenario. Please base your comments on the current state of the game and not your hazy memories of how it used to be at launch.

As for OP.. yup, that's why I cancelled my subscription. I'll be back when they introduce some kind of viable PvP leveling scheme from level 1. However strange it might seem, WAR did spoil me in that regard and I don't really care about how awesome a game's PvE is or how fantastic PvP might get later on. The basic requirement for any future mmo that I might play is "PvP leveling from the start" - if this is not present then I won't even consider playing.

Originally posted by teco221

Originally posted by markoraos

Originally posted by ninja33284

Originally posted by markoraos

Personally I find it pretty but dull.

With age I've grown into more of an exclusively PvP player and I simply cannot (or won't) enjoy the PvE thing this game relies so much on. I simply don't have the time to spend it on any game experience that isn't really intense and only PvP gives me that buzz. If I want a scripted story I'll read a book or maybe watch a movie. If I want a sense of accomplishment I'll go grind my garden or the dishes. They might have some kind of PvP "endgame" which is supposed to be fantastic but I wouldn't know - I won't play a game that forces me to "earn my right" to actually have fun. I believe I earned that "right" by purchasing the game.

That being said I can see this game to be really appealing to the PvE, "story" crowd. It's simply that I'm not one of those.

If they had some kind of PvP leveling enabled (like in WAR and now WoW) I would play it because it really is quite pretty and amazingly polished. However... this is the way things are now. I'll keep my eyes peeled for future changes tho. We might do business yet.

 

LMFAO this guy cant take the like 5 hours it takes to get to lvl 20.. GG sir you must be SOOOO BUSY if u cant play for 5 hours just to get some nice PvP... Things in the world arnt just handed to you, Spending a little money will never get u happiness u have to work for it, if your the pvp player u say u are ud be willing to spend 5 hours to TRY aions pvp out...all in all sir.... GG u lose

 

As you wish. And it is a bit more than 5 hours.

Additionally you can't really progress through PvP even later on so you are stuck grinding mobs or quests or whatever to get your xp. I find this completely unacceptable. I don't want to be forced into anything by an entertainment product that I bought. PvE so you can PvP is the dogs of MMO design for me. I would find this whole situation a bit more palatable if the world and it's PvE weren't so damn linear. In short it isn't fun for me and you can personalize this with whatever projected character flaw you assume I possess.

WIll you level up my char to 25 so I  can finally try this fabulous PvP? In addition will you level up my char later on while I'm not playing so I can enjoy my PvP without feeling I'm retarding my character's growth? No? Well then I guess that's it then. Enjoy your game and hope to meet you there if/when they resolve these issues which seriously detract from my enjoyment from what otherwise seems to be an excellent game.

 

You can go to play War or WOW or whatever you want.. no one is forcing anyone to play Aion.. Gees... this is a free country... People are like "I don't want to be force to pvp or pve or grind".. guess what "DO NOT BUY THE GAME"

 

Exactly, I'm back to WAR and ETQW for now.

The thread is titled "So what's your opinion so far?" so I felt obliged to share mine. Since I did buy the preorder and played both the closed and open betas and I do have an active account (soon to be deactivated) I thought I'm entitled to an opinion here. It's a pity tho, I wanted Aion to take the place of my daily mmo fix but I don't see this happening with the game as it is now. We'll see, as always.

Originally posted by ninja33284

Originally posted by markoraos

Personally I find it pretty but dull.

With age I've grown into more of an exclusively PvP player and I simply cannot (or won't) enjoy the PvE thing this game relies so much on. I simply don't have the time to spend it on any game experience that isn't really intense and only PvP gives me that buzz. If I want a scripted story I'll read a book or maybe watch a movie. If I want a sense of accomplishment I'll go grind my garden or the dishes. They might have some kind of PvP "endgame" which is supposed to be fantastic but I wouldn't know - I won't play a game that forces me to "earn my right" to actually have fun. I believe I earned that "right" by purchasing the game.

That being said I can see this game to be really appealing to the PvE, "story" crowd. It's simply that I'm not one of those.

If they had some kind of PvP leveling enabled (like in WAR and now WoW) I would play it because it really is quite pretty and amazingly polished. However... this is the way things are now. I'll keep my eyes peeled for future changes tho. We might do business yet.

 

LMFAO this guy cant take the like 5 hours it takes to get to lvl 20.. GG sir you must be SOOOO BUSY if u cant play for 5 hours just to get some nice PvP... Things in the world arnt just handed to you, Spending a little money will never get u happiness u have to work for it, if your the pvp player u say u are ud be willing to spend 5 hours to TRY aions pvp out...all in all sir.... GG u lose

As you wish. And it is a bit more than 5 hours.

Additionally you can't really progress through PvP even later on so you are stuck grinding mobs or quests or whatever to get your xp. I find this completely unacceptable. I don't want to be forced into anything by an entertainment product that I bought. PvE so you can PvP is the dogs of MMO design for me. I would find this whole situation a bit more palatable if the world and it's PvE weren't so damn linear. In short it isn't fun for me and you can personalize this with whatever projected character flaw you assume I possess.

WIll you level up my char to 25 so I  can finally try this fabulous PvP? In addition will you level up my char later on while I'm not playing so I can enjoy my PvP without feeling I'm retarding my character's growth? No? Well then I guess that's it then. Enjoy your game and hope to meet you there if/when they resolve these issues which seriously detract from my enjoyment of what otherwise seems to be an excellent game.

Personally I find it pretty but dull.

With age I've grown into more of an exclusively PvP player and I simply cannot (or won't) enjoy the PvE thing this game relies so much on. I simply don't have the time to spend it on any game experience that isn't really intense and only PvP gives me that buzz. If I want a scripted story I'll read a book or maybe watch a movie. If I want a sense of accomplishment I'll go grind my garden or the dishes. They might have some kind of PvP "endgame" which is supposed to be fantastic but I wouldn't know - I won't play a game that forces me to "earn my right" to actually have fun. I believe I earned that "right" by purchasing the game.

That being said I can see this game to be really appealing to the PvE, "story" crowd. It's simply that I'm not one of those.

If they had some kind of PvP leveling enabled (like in WAR and now WoW) I would play it because it really is quite pretty and amazingly polished. However... this is the way things are now. I'll keep my eyes peeled for future changes tho. We might do business yet.

Originally posted by Khrymson

The worst for me was not only the battlegrounds, but the massive amounts of XP you got from doing them also. {Never should have gotten XP from PvP...or at least that much.}  I was never a huge PvP person but I enjoyed it in DAoC and it was amusing in WAR.  It shouldn't have had Battlegrounds at all and was instead entirely focused on open-world PvP, and just make many more quests be interacted with the PvP areas instead so players could not only do PvP but also knock out quests for their XP as well!

Hmm, both of your concerns have been adressed a long time ago. Open RvR gives you much more rewards than scenarios now, and there are repeatable quests in RvR areas (tho not as many or as fun as I'd like). On an active server there's plenty of open RvR in all tiers with ocassional scenario pops for a change of pace (if you need it). Maybe you should try a free 10 day return offer?

My reasons for WARs "failure":

(I use quotations because I still play it and I feel I get my money's worth)

1) Just 2 factions which create an inherently unbalanced environment. Why didn't they go for 3 which proved it's worth in DAOC? They were clueless obviously as to what exactly made DAOC work. It seems they stumbled into DAOC's winning design features by pure luck, rather than skill.

2) Too much PvE. Huge tracts of land are reserved for PvE content which is not what WAR should have banked on if it wanted to be competetive. PvP should have been the main "thing" in WAR and this should have been reflected in every aspect of the game, including zone design. In adddition PvE and PvP is forcibly separated through dull and restricting zone design - which diminishes the replayability and unpredictability of both. The game would brighten up enormously if they put some wandering PQs into RvR lakes and give a few PvP infiltration quests into the other faction's PvE zone.

3) The world cut up in all those isolated square maps. Breaks immersion, spreads players too thin and makes it almost impossible to make changes to the game (like adding 3rd faction which could have concievably be done post release if the world map were open).

4) Levels, tiers and crap. This is utterly unacceptable for a PvP game that relies on other people being there in order to work. One of the major reasons for Guild Wars success was its basically level-less advancement scheme that keeps all the players accessible to each other. Mythic is trying to address this issue with upcoming sidekicking system which would enable players from all levels to play together (it both increases or decreases the practical level, depending on where you want to go). However with this system you have to ask yourself "then what is the point of levels at all?"  And you would be right - the game would work much much better if there was a single player "level" and you would advance through collecting skills, unlocking stuff through tome and yes, of course, gear.

5) And oh yeah the client performance.. Tho I never did experience anything that would seriously override my enjoyment of the game. Guess I'm just lucky with my PC configuration and adaptable with regards to what I expect from the game... tho I understand that this is a huge issue for many.

Me 2 cents.

Dunno, I never perceived it as grind.

I play the game to have fun and Renown happens. I don't play the game to get renown.

I never could understand people who play mmos to "achieve" something. I play games to have fun, and if that entails occasional achievements then so be it, but I always keep my priorities straight. RL is for achievements, games are for fun.

And besides I don't think anyone is "supposed" to reach RR80. In fact before the release devs stated on numerous occasions that  RR80 is basically unachievable in any practical sense and that when several players somehow do manage to reach it the RR cap will be increased. Renown should be like money - you can always get more and you're never supposed to reach the "cap". The cheat described above throws a cog into this system and that's not cool at all.

For the first 2 days it was pretty unstable (got one CTD per hour on average) but then it rapidly improved. Now it's completely stable, at least for me. They hotpatch daily so I suppose all or most problematic hardware configurations are going to get fixed. As for general improvement... I don't see much of a difference but then again I never did have any major problems there, guess I was just lucky with my rig.

Originally posted by popinjay

 

---

Originally posted by markoraos

 

 
Thas true, my Archmage rank 19 alt gets facestomped regularly by any Squigherder in his lower teens... It's insane how much burst dps they can dish out and at long range to boot. But you won't hear me complaining - Because you are a fanboi extraordinaire. Everyone knows that, lol.

that's the way the game is and that's what makes it interesting for me.Simple things please simple minds all the time. Why should WAR be any different?

Choose your battles and all that. Imo the OP is just whiney because he got used to playing his SH one way and now he's forced to change his tacs a bit...Yep, it's the "player's fault", not Mythic's. Gee, such a broken record from you again with the "player's fault" excuse. I suggest you reread you response to his post, so you understand what "whiney" looks like for perspective, lol.

well if that's what he considers a valid reason to quit the game then I really can't help him I don't recall reading him asking you for "help".

and I sincerely doubt anyone or any game or any particular area of life for that matter will be able to conform to his standards.So because he found WAR with serious problems, he won't ever like anything else in life? What's it like on WARfanboi World? Maybe he should just quit.Like most everyone else who's tried this game? Just give him time, lol.

I like all my characters and never have a problem finding a fight somewhere.Staging fights with your friends for free RP isn't really a "fight". He's talking about actual battles.

I just need to get off my assAgreed and QFT

and actually do something while I wait for a scen - like run around with an ORvR group or something.Or sit around watching other people in the BO, also waiting for action while making pots. Or log onto MMORPG to berate people.

If he's doing the WoW thing Oh, you mean like Mythic did when they put this game together? That WoW thing?

and is waiting for a scen by standing in a WC, Or coming out of a game crash.

tapping his foot impatiently and completely ignoring the open RvR..the tons and tons and tons and tons and tons and tons of oRvR action. WAGGHHHH! is EVERYWHERE! You're losing it, haha.

just on the other side of that hill Oh.. so THAT's where all those enemies that people who quit in droves because they got tired of looking for fights were. They were always just "on the other side of THAT hill. Doh. They were always looking on the OTHER side of the OTHER hill. I think you just saved WAR, now subs will return in droves! Yay for you!

(because he wants his scenario NOW) Well, based on how many people are left in this trainwreck, that's pretty true. He probably COULD get his own scenario now.
then.. of course he's not having any fun and never will. Sheesh.Duh.. that's what everyone's been saying. Finally, you "get" it.
/shrug QFT
 

---

 

Yeah, and I love you too Pop, but you already know that. ;)

Originally posted by xaldraxius

 

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Originally posted by Sioned
hehe, nice thinking. If Bioware will release the game with their ideas i really hope for a total failure. But my fear is the kids will like it.. Currently i would say the target market for this game is like 8-18 years old. So i am not even close to be a target market.
 
So yes Bioware i understood the jedi wave "This is not the game that you are looking for"

---

 

If this game is merely KOTOR 3 with limited group-ability I'll be happy. If it's Mass Effect with different stories for each character class I'll be happy. If it's a sandbox MMO with open PvP and a player driven economy I won't even bother to try it. I'm 35 and I stopped playing in sandboxes long ago. I want to play a game that draws me in with a good story and believable characters, not some glorified chat room with a box of legos and a bunch of smart ass little punks who think ruining someone else's gameplay experience makes them cool.

Like EVE right? Because we all know that it is impossible to make a popular sandbox game that is actually structured and enjoyable for mature audience... /sarcasm off

Originally posted by Rohn 

EDIT: To the OP, as opposed to launch-time, the Squig Herder is now one of the most effective classes on Destro side.

Thas true, my Archmage rank 19 alt gets facestomped regularly by any Squigherder in his lower teens... It's insane how much burst dps they can dish out and at long range to boot. But you won't hear me complaining - that's the way the game is and that's what makes it interesting for me. Choose your battles and all that. Imo the OP is just whiney because he got used to playing his SH one way and now he's forced to change his tacs a bit... well if that's what he considers a valid reason to quit the game then I really can't help him and I sincerely doubt anyone or any game or any particular area of life for that matter will be able to conform to his standards. Maybe he should just quit.

I like all my characters and never have a problem finding a fight somewhere. I just need to get off my ass and actually do something while I wait for a scen - like run around with an ORvR group or something. If he's doing the WoW thing and is waiting for a scen by standing in a WC, tapping his foot impatiently and completely ignoring the open RvR just on the other side of that hill (because he wants his scenario NOW) then.. of course he's not having any fun and never will. Sheesh.

/shrug

Originally posted by Spaceweed10

Listen, you people complaining are missing one very important issue here.  There is a reason why eastern European countries can't play on the central European servers - latency.

You many think that you all have perfect connections to these servers - you don't.  I had the misfortune to play with the Russians <who I find despicable, but just my opinion based on personal experiences> in Age of Conan.  Everytime I came into contact with them during PvP, they lagged my game out, and trying to hit them was a near impossibility.  They caught onto this fact very quickly, and made very good use of it.  This wasn't isolated to just me, I was involved in some very heated debates about it on the AoC forums.

This is predominantly a PvP game, and I certainly don't want to be facing hordes of Russian players causing latency problems to a server they are too far away from.

I'm very pleased NCSoft have taken this stance.  The boundary line has to be drawn somewhere, so it's just tough luck on those that would rather be playing elsewhere.  Thank your lucky stars you have the game available to you, and stop QQ for God's sake.

Well the dorks at NCsoft shouldn't have placed their servers in effing Ireland which happens to be the westernmost effing country in the effing EU.

If they put them in Germany or Switzerland for example then we'd have no lag whatsoever for the europe but oh no, they had to put them in effing Ireland. Like the north atlantic has a playerbase comparable to the mainland over there to the east. Sheesh... probably the only worst place you could put a mmo server down in europe would be Iceland... even north Finland would probably make a better choice.

Originally posted by Benjola

Originally posted by markoraos

 

"Racism" has absolutely nothing to do with any of this.

IP blocking is simply WRONG because it is removing the choice from the players and pigeonholing them into arbitrarily drawn  drawn corporate "regions" that may or may not have any basis in reality and what is most convenient for the paying customers.

For example, tho NCsoft may find it convenient for whatever nefarious economical reasons to put countries like Turkey and Croatia into "russian" zone it is utterly idiotic towards the players. Croatia (and former Yugoslavia) was never a part of the eastern block or Warsaw pact (it was a neutral buffer zone between east and west) and very very few people there know Russian or even had any contact with Russians  - most people in Croatia speak english as their second language. Of all the eastern european countries, even those in the EU, Croatia is probably the one with the LEAST cultural or historical connections to Russia. Turkey is pretty much the same.. but even more so because there's been a centuries old rivalry between Russia and Turkey and during the cold war Turkey was probably the staunchest NATO point defender, right there at the hot southern border. I very sincerely doubt any Turks or Croats would find themselves comfortable on a Russian speaking server - they'd probably hang together, isolated from the rest of the population and speak english between themselves.

As for the Baltic states I really have nothing to say that hasn't been said before.

Imo, the whole IP blocking thing is utter crap. Everybody should be able to choose where they want to play. I don't see why turks living in GB shouldn't be able to play on a Turkish speaking server. Or why shouldn't Russians be allowed to hang out with EU people if they wish to. Or why americans in Moscow shouldn't be able to play with their countrymen. IP blocking is wrong and utterly at odds with the very spirit of the internet.

 

Your post started reasonable but still failed when you decided to put politics in it.

My point is that if you follow this logic of "I dont feel/want/feelcomfortable playing with this or that group and there for you should provide me with server with people I DO want to play with" this means we end up playing single player game heh.

I don`t like playing with players younger then 21. I can only have fun playing with mature people.

Should NCsoft make 21+ servers to accomodate players like me?

Yeah that will happen.

There are english that can`t stand germans, split EU servers maybe? heh

So this is not a case of denying you the "freedom" to choose the large group you`ll play with but it`s more about NCsoft not taking silly prejudices of the Europeans  in consideration when they were making business decisions on this issue.

Only issue I see with not being able to play with other nations is the time zones.

I`m sure there are people that only can or prefer playing at nights so would like to play on US servers instead of "empty" EU servers for example, but that`s not the case here.

So if the croatian,baltic or turk dude passes on AION because for whatever reason he cant stand playing with a particular group, he `ll be missing on a huge fun in an amazing game because of his own silly prejudices, not because of NCsoft.

 

It's nothing to do with "politics" like it has nothing to do with "racism" as well. Any kind of forcing the players to play on a server that does not suit them, based solely on their current geographical location, is wrong. The very point of the internet is that geographical location does not matter - it is what you are, not where you live that counts.

And bigotry has nothing to do with it. Nothing whatsoever. The problem is that this "regionalization" of the internet is what is creating bigotry. I don't see any reason why persons living in Russia should be barred from the english speaking servers for example. Since I live in a small nation with a peculiar language one of the main draws of the mmo genre for me is that I get to meet people from all over the world and practice my english daily. On the other hand I can understand Russians or French or Germans who'd like to hang out with their countrymen and/or speak their own language rather than english. Imo there should be variety between servers - but based on the language spoken and yes, why not an 18+ or teen only server? Or timezone servers for that matter? However this policy of forcing the game population into this or that server and, even worse, this or that client version based SOLELY on their current geographical location is total and utter bollocks - it is simply not compatible with the global medium that is the internet.

Originally posted by Benjola

NCsoft is only looking from a business pov on this issue as they should.

If they go by the logic of "Some kids don`t like to play on rusian servers because of their racist or political brainwashed believes so we should take this in consideration and don`t mix players from any country that had ever been in conflict with another" they should then let every European country has it`s own servers and nothing else... I mean, why would you let Germans play on servers together with everyone else amirite? Hitler was a nazi fuck you know..make sense to split them from everyone....etc.

You get the point.

How about stop being rasists and try to get along with everyone on your server?

It is a game you know.

That`s what I do and tbh the most drama and smack talk I see on EU servers always comes from EU players, mostly hating on rusians or just being jealous of them for being very organized and dominating their PVP server (AoC Fury server for example).

"Racism" has absolutely nothing to do with any of this.

IP blocking is simply WRONG because it is removing the choice from the players and pigeonholing them into arbitrarily drawn  drawn corporate "regions" that may or may not have any basis in reality and what is most convenient for the paying customers.

For example, tho NCsoft may find it convenient for whatever nefarious economical reasons to put countries like Turkey and Croatia into "russian" zone it is utterly idiotic towards the players. Croatia (and former Yugoslavia) was never a part of the eastern block or Warsaw pact (it was a neutral buffer zone between east and west) and very very few people there know Russian or even had any contact with Russians  - most people in Croatia speak english as their second language. Of all the eastern european countries, even those in the EU, Croatia is probably the one with the LEAST cultural or historical connections to Russia. Turkey is pretty much the same.. but even more so because there's been a centuries old rivalry between Russia and Turkey and during the cold war Turkey was probably the staunchest NATO point defender, right there at the hot southern border. I very sincerely doubt any Turks or Croats would find themselves comfortable on a Russian speaking server - they'd probably hang together, isolated from the rest of the population and speak english between themselves.

As for the Baltic states I really have nothing to say that hasn't been said before.

Imo, the whole IP blocking thing is utter crap. Everybody should be able to choose where they want to play. I don't see why turks living in GB shouldn't be able to play on a Turkish speaking server. Or why shouldn't Russians be allowed to hang out with EU people if they wish to. Or why americans in Moscow shouldn't be able to play with their countrymen. IP blocking is wrong and utterly at odds with the very spirit of the internet.

lol white men can't jump

i'll pass thnxvymch btnthnx

muahahaaha! it would be funny if it weren't sad...

a pve only game that you can't even jump in... i don't get it.. i really don't. For my stories I dunno, I like read books, like in paper - I can still do it ya know? I play games for other things... like jumping and hitting people and sh***. wtf is this thing? It's like kindle that you have to hit more than one button to turn the page. I really don't get it, maybe I chose a wrong hobby - I just don't get this "story" sh*** in mmos. I'm dumb I suppose.

Well I think the suits' myth that only linear theme park games are profitable is a complete bunk.

The only 2 MMORPGS that were really successful in this WoW era (except the lumbering giant itself) were EVE online which is a pure sandbox and Guild Wars which has a definitely "sandboxy" advancement scheme - no leveling to speak of, lateral skill based advancement which keeps all the players in basically the same "tier".

All the AAA mmos that followed EQ single-player RPG model "grind levels to eventually save the world" failed to varying degrees. (Except WoW which suceeded due to an entirely different set of reasons) While SWG didn't really perform stellar it was destroyed by force-applying of the EQ model. WAR and AoC's faults can be to a large degree attributed to the forced stratification of players and the percieved "grind" inherent to the model which plays total havoc with the PvP component (and many others) of the game.

Imo the greatest problem with breaking the "developer ice" with sandbox mmos is that they still equate sandbox with hardcore PvP - as Dana noticed, with DF a prime example. You can have a sandbox with "soft" PvP or even without any PvP at all - if themepark games managed to dispense with the harsh death penalties nonsense (EQ was quite hard there) then there is no reason whatsoever why sandboxes shouldn't do the same. Until someone makes a sandbox game that doesn't actually punish you for playing with harsh death penalties we will never see a truly mainstream sandbox mmo.

Notice that I'm not saying that harsh death penalties are inherently bad.. Some people do enjoy them and the sense of danger they bring. However it is now obvious even to the blind dog that the vast majority of mainstream players and especially casuals (the guys whose 15$ is as good as yours) find them a real obstacle to enjoying a game. For example - the negative experience of ganking - the scourge of open PvP worlds - is directly proportional to the harshness of the death penalty associated. No death penalties and ganking becomes maybe a minor annoyance without the need to actually implement laborious elaborate systems to prevent it.

Yeah... I agree in general principle.

You can't have a PvP game (which needs as many people together as possible, regardless of whether its open or instacned - which is why WoW enabled cross server bgs) built on a PvE foundation (leveling and tiered content whose primary function is to stratify the population). There won't be a decent PvP mmo that players have been clamoring for so long until a AAA mmo finally dispenses with the EQ linear, vertical advancement model that's been dominant for waaaay to long.

If WAR had a char advancement model similar to Guild Wars - level up to 20, collect and unlock skills afterwards in a homogenous persistant world we'd have had a hit. You'd never run out of players like you do now on those huge empty isolated maps. Oh well... as we all know mmorpgs are all about leveling your character so he can "save the world"... NOT. That's single-player RPG thinking that's been dumbing down mmorpg design for almost a decade now. If it weren't for the crappiness that is WOW with its 80% of the content used to speed-level to the max where "the game really begins" (translation - most of the game is useless, its here only to irritate and slow down the players on their way to the "true" game where they will spend the vast majority of their time anyway, WoW now even started recycling low level dungeons because its pointless to throw good content on one way fast leveling treadmill) we might have a decent true mmo now... that actually utilizes ALL of its content.  However the pull of WOW/EQ linear, stratified sickness is too strong and WAR did betray us by fallling into this trap. Sadly I don't see anything else on the horizon and Aion is even worse. EQ leveling model + PvP enabled living world = Grind & Gank or "welcome to your empty box". I won't buy another mmo that follows this ludicrous design philosophy.