AOC does have a great soudtrack. There is something about the music in Guild Wars that just resonates with me. When I hear the music it feels like home, it is weird but when I am feeling a bit depressed I play a little GW and listen to the music it cheers me up.

I felt the same as the OP but after giving a few days I warmed up to it.

Originally posted by Khrymson

Originally posted by Starpower

I get tired of having a headset weight on my head fast. The pressure on both sides is uncomfortable with every piece I have tried often leaving me with headaches.  Regardless of how comfy they supposedly they are I would never trade my sound system for a pair. Hell I even have a table mic for that very same reason.

 

Touche...

 

I love my 7.1 Surround System and desk mic way better.  Every headphone set I've tried becomes a heavy, crushing feeling and causes my already painful migraines to be worse.  Plus I don't like not being able to hear whats going on around me.  I have dogs that always want/need attention, or may get into something that I need to hear and be aware of.   etc etc etc...

Like you I have a 7.1 surround sound for my gaming pc and like it a lot better then headphones. The sound is richer and more detailed then with headphones.

The post on the SWTOR news about the release of music from the game got me thinking about great mmo music. Here are some of my favorite sound tracks. I never liked Lineage II that much but it had some fantastic music. Guild Wars has some of the best game music I have ever heard. SWG since they used music from the movie I really loved it. EQ2 has some wonderful music as well. I also like the music from RIFT.  MMO music sure has gotten fantastic over the years. What are your favorite mmo sound tracks? I am making a poll but I am sure there is some awesome music I did not put on the list.

SWTOR it brings excitment at the thought of it. I miss exploring a SW world. I was a huge fan of pre-nge SWG and was hoping some smart company would make a wonderful sandbox mmo to fill my need in mmos that only SWG has filled. Will SWTOR fill that need? Nope! Will SWTOR be a great mmo? Yes, but I did not think so my first few hours in the game. 

I got a chance to play in a few of the SWTOR beta tests. My first few hours were disappointing but it was SW so I kept at it. Much like WOW it took a few day for me to start warming up to it. I did not like the art styling at first. My first minute in RIFT I was hooked. No other mmo grabbed me as fast as RIFT. I love the look of RIFT. However the more I played SWTOR the more I warmed up to the art. As an artist and college art instructor the art direction of a game is as important to me as gameplay. The days of poor graphics but great game play are over in the mmo world. You better have both.

The game play was similar as the art for me it took a bit of time to warm up to. By my third day in SWTOR I started to really like it.   At first the voice acting and cut scenes for all the quests were annoying but I discovered I felt more connected to the storyline then in most mmos I have played because of it. Again it took a bit of time to warm up to. The game was a challenge but not frustrating. The pace of the game was good. I felt I was always moving forward. I never felt like I was grinding. Now I only got 3 toons to about 20+ so it is hard to say how the long term game play will hold me. Simply put the more I played the more i liked it.  Some of my first negative impressions of SWTOR might have been due to hype and wanting another SWG experience. When I started to really play the game for what it was and not what I hoped it would be I started to enjoy it more. That can be said about any mmo first experience. 

I am glad I got to play the beta. I will be pre-ordering it and I am looking forward to playing it. At this point I am not sure how long it will hold me. I played 7 years of WOW and EQ2. 2 years of LOTRO and I think SWTOR will be more of a LOTRO experience a lot of fun for a couple years but I hope it will hold me for years to come, only time will tell.

SWTOR is a great game that will impact the mmo market and other games. If at first you are not hooked give it a little time. You might find as I did that you will warm up to it and find a pretty great game that is worth the price of admission. 

I am 52 years old and I enjoy Rift. I feel it appeals to an older mmo player. I do not know this as fact but from interviews and videos I have seen about Trion and the making of  Rift it seems to be made by a team that is a bit older and I think it shows. Any age can enjoy Rift but I do not think it appeals to the young WoW players.

I guess you have not experienced Ember Isle content yet. They raised the ante and grouping is more important unless you are geared out and if you did not group while playing you do not have the gear to clean out Ember Isle. Rift is not a solo game. Yes you can solo a lot of quests to level 50 but if you want to do dungeons which are fun and challenging, for gear, you need a group. I like that rift offers a lot of content to solo players but it seems to me you chose to solo because grouping is there and needed if you decide to group. However as a solo player I like Rift and I do not feel short changed as in other mmos. Rift respects the solo player but does not cater to them. I have good gear I got soloing but far from the best and Ember Isle is indeed a challenge for me. I get my group fix mostly from world events a nice solution for the solo player.

Please no why do you play mmos if you solo.  Over the 15 years I have played mmos my free time is harder to come by so a solo friendly mmo is appealling to me. However when I want to group and raid there is plenty of oppertunity for that in Rift.

Originally posted by GreenKnight7

@ OP: No, it's not us, OR Rift. It's BOTH. As we've seen in this thread and elsewhere ad nauseum, it's SUBJECTIVE. There are plenty of gamers who simply will not like or enjoy Rift for any one of a thousand reasons. Rift is what it is. I enjoy it, and for the most part I have enjoyed it since beta. But I have my reasons for that. So your original post is pointless. 

The only thing I sometimes get angry about are those who claim they knew from the beginning that Rift was a failed, doomed MMO and "quietly smiled" when Rift got its comeuppance and headed down the path of self destruction. If only us poor, stupid bumpkins had listened to the more enlightened professional gamers, Rift would have simply shutdown and rid the gaming world of its presence. 

I would say, Rift can feel lacking for the same reasons ANYTHING can feel lacking. It's almost always subjective. In some cases, something is so god awful that clearly, it's a failure for 99% of gamers or human beings for that matter. I would not put Rift in that category, but maybe some would. 

In the end, threads like this one are just entertainment, flame wars or both. I intend to play both Rift and GW2 since I can. I enjoy Rift for what it is and what it may become. Isn't that more important than blaming Trion for the Great Gaming Deception or players for just being human?

Well said I agree. I never intended this thread to be, you all are stupid and should all like RIFT. This thread is indeed entertainment and I worded my original post to be provocative to get a disussion started because it is fun to talk about games. I do not and never thought RIFT is the best MMO ever made. It is good and I feel if players stop playing all MMOs as console games to win they would have more fun. I do feel RIFT is a lot better then many here at MMORPG.com claim. Greenknight7 is correct it is indeed subjective.

Originally posted by teakbois

Originally posted by eccoton

 

MMOs are bigger and better then ever before. 

I just had to laugh at this part of the OP.  Guess he never saw EQ1 or WoW's size at launch

I guess (know) you are wrong. First I said MMOs are bigger and better then ever before. Did I once say RIFT was a bigger world? Nope. Actually I did see both Wow and EQ1 at launch and RIFT while not huge is not as small as people like to make out. I started EQ first day of launch and I was a closed beta tester for WoW. WoW at launch was not to big in fact if you were there then you know that was one of the complaints of WoW. Vanguard, EQ2, LOTRO were bigger then WoW at launch. 

The ignorant often laugh at things they do not understand. I have 15 years of MMO experience and if you read my list I have played all the major MMOS and put real time into them. You may disagree with me but I do know what I am talking about when it comes to gameplay and world size. Many disagree with the games I like such as RIFT or EQ2 but my experience, knowledge, and dedication to MMOs should not be underestimated. 

Originally posted by kakasaki

Originally posted by Kyleran

No, it's Rift's fault.  I was only able to enjoy it for about 1.5 months and when my first and only character hit 50 and I found myself staring at a standard, boring gear grind end game I walked away. (despite paying for a 6 month sub).

I then picked up EQ2 and have enjoyed it for over 3 months, have 2 avatars, a necro and dirge and am having far more fun than I did with Rift even though its a standard theme park MMO.

It's possible to make fun, in depth and engaging themepark MMO's, Rift's just not one of them.

 

I had the same experience. Don't get me wrong; Rift is a very polished and well made MMO. It just lacks a "soul" for lack of a better word. The novelty wears off quite quickly and  it gets harder and harder to want to log on and play so you just quit...

 

Heck, I keft Rift and went back to Vanguard and still having a blast!

Now here is someone I disagree with but have no problem with their opinion. They played RIFT realized the effort of Trion, felt for them it lacked "soul" and moved on to Vanguard a great game (I forgot to put Vanguard on my list, played it about a year) No mention RIFT was not like WOW, EQ2 or some other MMO and did not try to explain why I should not like it. I disagree about RIFT lacking "soul" that is why I play it even with it's shortcomings. For me it has a lot of enviroment and feels alive which gives it "soul" but I do agree Vanguard can be a blast.

Originally posted by Kyleran

No, it's Rift's fault.  I was only able to enjoy it for about 1.5 months and when my first and only character hit 50 and I found myself staring at a standard, boring gear grind end game I walked away. (despite paying for a 6 month sub).

I then picked up EQ2 and have enjoyed it for over 3 months, have 2 avatars, a necro and dirge and am having far more fun than I did with Rift even though its a standard theme park MMO.

It's possible to make fun, in depth and engaging themepark MMO's, Rift's just not one of them.

 

You did noticed in my post my longest playing MMO is 7 year and it is EQ2? I will be in EQ2 until the lights are turn out but I do not compare my experiences in EQ2 to RIFT. They are very different. I never said play RIFT like EQ2 or SWG (pre-nge). I play RIFT for what it offers. I also have not been defending RIFT. You are right it is possible to make an in depth and engaging, themepark MMO and for me Trion did just that. Is it as deep as EQ2? Nope, but no one said it was.

What I love about RIFT and WOW was that you can jump into the game for an hour get in some trouble, earn something cool, log out, and get back to the real world and feel you did something. RIFT is deep enough that when I have 4 hours to play I can challenge myself, immerse myself in the world, and even roleplay. I feel that is what Trion was trying to do and they succeeded at it. If you are a player that can sit for 6+ hours a day everyday then RIFT is not for you. So stop judging RIFT based on something it was not intended to be.

I never said RIFT was about longevity. You can play an MMO like RIFT allow yourself to slow down and enjoy it if you want and get a few really fun months out of it. What is wrong with that? No one said an MMO experience had to last for years. I also want to clear up something I never said RIFT was the best MMO out. I was making the point people seem to be judging it for what they want not what Trion made. Most who disliked it say they had a lot of fun for awhile well made awhile is all you get. Some also misunderstand the idea of using your imagination. When I play any game MMO or single player I allow myself to get immersed in the art. If that is something you can not do with RIFT then so be it move on. I just find if funny that people complain about something that they did not enjoy and try to explain to me and other why we are deluded in enjoying our experience as if somehow we do not get it.

I have been in MMOs as my main form of entertanment and gaming since 1996 with meridian 59. So I hate to do this but I will list my experience so you see I am not just a WOW kid. All these game I put real time into not just 1 week some I loved some I moved on from: Meridian 59, UO, Project Entropia, EQ, EQ2 (7 years), WOW (6 years). FF11, Seed,  Rysom (3 years), Priston's Tale. Tale of the dessert, Age of Conan, DDO (2 years), SWG (4 years) , COH/COV (2 years). LOTRO (3 years), Champions Online, DC universe, DAOC (3 years) Planetside, RF online, and more. I used my imagination in all of these games not to make a bad game better but to allow myself a chance to escape a bit into the world the artist created. Now if that is something you can not do and play MMOs as a game rather then a virtual world then we are on different pages not better pages but different.

MMOs are definetly my main form of entertainment not TV not movies. I play MMOs. I love them. I support them. I try to experience the hard work of the wonderful people who make them. In all my years here at MMORPG I never posted anything about a game I did not enjoy to tell others how bad it is. That is one thing I hate about this site so many troll and trash games they do not like instead of talking about the games they like. If you hated an MMO why waste your time talking about it? If I find an MMO lacking I just move on. Don't worry about my money and how I spend it you are not doing me a favor by coming to a forum of a game you hate to tell me how crappy it is. You ain't my momma. RIFT is a wonderful experience that I can see getting a year out of. I do not see myself playing for years. Yes I do role play in RIFT and it is fun not deep like EQ but still a lot of fun.

I finish with this I can not wait for TOR and I will be playing IT not some game I want but the game the developers have made.

Originally posted by popinjay

 

---

Originally posted by eccoton

One poster here says why should he pay for something then asked to use his imagination. I find that a very sad comment and the current state of many of the problems in America.

 

I spend a lot of money on books and when I read them I use my imagination. I am an artist and my paintings sell for a lot of money, I would be saddened to think people did not use their imagination when they look at it.

I find MMOs to be an art form more then a game.  

 

---

Sorry but a book is nothing but a visual imagination because you don't have a visual available. How you compare this to a mmo is beyond me.

 

 

A mmo by it's VERY NATURE is a visual dependant thing. How many blind people do you know that play mmos? Now, if you DID meet a blind person playing RIFT, don't you think that person would have to use their imagination? Of course. Why?

 

Because they can't SEE the fun everyone else sees. It's probably MORE fun to that blind person playing because they have to imagine how awesome a water rift would look like then imagine how awesome a air rift would look like and then imagine how awesome a fire rift will look like. But since I can see there is no real difference between any of them, how can I "fool" my imagination to pretend it is? How do I pretend there's are reason I'm actually fighting Guardians when there isn't any consequence, but I see the same premades every roll?

 

If you think it's sad someone expects to be entertained by paying for an entertainment medium, that's kinda weird. Doing the same content over and over will breed boredom, no matter how much you 'make believe' in a game. You can do things to challenge yourself like fight with no gear on, or fight with a level 1 weapon but that's not really fun to me.. more like busywork or keeping occupied but I know people who do that stuff and happily pay the $15/month.

You have missed the point of my comment and are stretching you argument by using the blind thing. Of course mmos are for people who see, just as my paintings are. If you don't like the game then don't play. I get it you don't like RIFT. You are distorting my point by trying to say that you have to use your imagination to enjoy RIFT bullshit I never said that. What I said was slow down don't play an mmo as a console single player game. Use the tools the developers put in place and enjoy the ride. Do not rush to end game. If that is your play style all power to you. You simple do not think there are any good mmos out there I disagree. I have played a lot of great mmos and nothing you can say will change that opinion and I used my imagination in every one to allow myself to experience what the artist tried to present. Using your imagination is never a bad thing and does not replace a game that is lacking. I simply do not thing RIFT is lacking. I play the game Trion made. Have you ever really allowed yourself to get immersed in and MMO if you have then you have used your imagination.

Of course I went a bit over the top to get the discussion going. I play RIFT currently and do find it to have some issues but it is still a lot of fun for me. If for you the game ends in 4 months then it does move on. You still had 4 months of entertainment. Get use to it the days of all the players playing one game for 6 years are past. That does not mean you might not find that in a game but as for me I want to try many new experiences so if I have fun be it for one month or 7 years who cares? This was actually a more general comment about the state of MMOs and more the player base. It does not matter if I had to work my ass off or play casually to earn my mount all that matters is did I have fun getting it? That is the bottom line, entertainment value for my dollar.

One poster here says why should he pay for something then asked to use his imagination. I find that a very sad comment and the current state of many of the problems in America. I spend a lot of money on books and when I read them I use my imagination. I am an artist and my paintings sell for a lot of money, I would be saddened to think people did not use their imagination when they look at it. I find MMOs to be an art form more then a game. I am encourage at those who like to work hard in an MMO but so many of them seem to have smuge attitute towards casual gamers, both can exist in the same MMO. That is the holy grail in the MMO world.

Other seem to be pissed at Trion for not making the game they wanted. Trion made the game they wanted. If you don't like it spend your money on something else. Developers make the games they want and hope others do too, TO MAKE MONEY. To all of you, don't stop using your imaginations while gaming, that is what "Dancing With The Stars" is for. 

It is not RIFT it is YOU! All  MMOs feel boring and lacking something if you play them just as a game! I have a great time in RIFT, WOW, EQ2, and so many more MMOs that people call boring. I have fun because I use my imagination and enjoy the amazing worlds the artists work hard to bring to me. I am so tired of all the boring players complaining about all the crappy MMOs out there. Most who complain play them like a console game. Your avatars are just vehicles to drive around the game world. MMOs have not gotten boring the players have. No one role plays any more and if you do you are treated like a nerd. My avatars are little being to me that live in these world that the developers created.

MMOs are bigger and better then ever before. Start using your imaginations and get into the world instead of play just another game. Turn off the TV and your mp3 player when you play and allow yourself to get drawn into the experience. Look at all the detail not just rush to end game. It is not the developers fault you choose not to allow yourself the fun of being in the game. Read the quests respond to others as your character would and have some fun. If you don't like it shut the hell up and move on. No one needs you to elighten them to the fact they are not really having fun when they are. RIFT is a wonderfully detailed world and filled with visual treats everywhere. It is funny I am over 50 years old and I play these games with the joy and imagination of a kid. Picasso had it right when he said "It takes a life time to be young".

[Mod Edit]

Originally posted by Zippy

Originally posted by Golelorn

Just keep in mind the daily chronicles are not for casuals to solo. You will need 1 or 2 other people to help.

For some reason, though, its geared for raiders to solo. Seems like they kinda targetted the wrong crowd there. Raiders already have something to do at max level. Why add more things that exclude casuals? I really don't understand that logic, but I have a feeling they wanted to make sure the raiders feel superior to casuals. Its always like that in these types of games.

It was a good thought, but, imo, they failed on executing the game plan. If they ever come up with something that doesn't exclude casual I'll try the game out again. It has a lot of potential, but their unwillingness to depart from the raid centric end game is a real let down.

Chronicles are made for casuals.  The fights are fast, easy and simplistic for casuals.  The rewards are geared for new level 50 casuals.  Of course Raiders can kill the mobs easier than casuals.  Casuals will always kill slower as they have less gear, skill and knowledge.  I am not exactly sure what else you would expect.  You seem to be saying you want them made easier but at the same time you don't want players with better gear, better knowledge, better builds and better skill from killing easier.  I would be interested how you plan to accomplish this.  Not to be rude but what your saying is nonsense and completely unrealistic.  Chronicles gives us out rewards for ultra casuals and brand new 50's, it also drops nice vials, very good coin and the HK one drops the Murdantix mount which will sell for 300-1k plat.  You wanted solo content you got it.  The choncles are well done for what they are.  They give casuals some simple  content, loot and a simplistic look into raid dungeons.

Rift is just like every mmo it is dumbed down for  casual players.  They have constantly nerfed the game for  players who hate thought, effort and want everything handed to them.  I don't blame Trion but the players. But the reality  is no matter how much a company gives into casuals they will always complain.   They are impossible to keep happy as they simply are not game players.  They are  game players in theory and on forums only.  They don't have the patience or attention span to actually play a MMO.  One magizine estimated these non players make up 90-95% of the MMO market but  when one considers their actual play time  they become a minority in game as they simply do not log in.  But they do have the cash to help fund the games they pretend to play so real players can enjoy them long after they have quit and moved on to the next game they will pretend to play.

Sadly the MMO genre is dying as games are becoming completely made for the mainstream simplistic audience.  Eye candy and fluff is valued over substance, difficulty and long term gameplay.  Companies focus now on short term sales and marketing rather than gameplay,   The casuals simply do not want anything of substance, basic gameplay or challenge.  Websites like this site who employ writers that only barely play MMOs in their most basic form and lack almost all understanding of MMO gameplay and mechanics then  write about these games they pretend to play only makes the matter worse.  This sites poorly written previews and articles  lets developers get away with and hype these vanilla poorly made simplistic MMOs that we have seen of late.  As they simply do not have the knowledge, expereince or playtime to actually write about MMOs.  That is why almost all MMO media articles always focus on lower level gameplay systems.  Simply because these people never actually play MMOs except in the most minimal form.  In other words MMORPG,com like all MMO media represents only the casual ill informed player and rarely if ever provides any information of substance.   The casual whiny player along with the poor MMO media is what is killing this genre.  MMORPG.Com being by the far the biggest and most popular MMO site the last 10 years or so has likely done more to harm to the MMO genre than any single entity, including even, gasp, SOE.

Like many older MMO players I miss the days of MMOs being a niche game rather being ruled by the whims and whines of the masses.  But I don't have a problem with casuals getting content.  I support it.  But I do object to their forum warrior whining,  demanding all  content be made exclusively for them and that all game play needs to be dumbed down to their level so they can get the same rewards with no effort or thought.  If these casuals actually spent 1/2 the time they spend whining and making demands on the boards playing the game they pretend to play they might actually accomplish something in game.

I do not ring in much anymore but this is nonsense. You generalize about casual players in an insulting way. I know a lot of casual player who are patient and work hard in their mmo of choice. Also rubbish about game sites like mmorpg.com They have many good writers who are mmo players and fans.  Oh and no I am not a casual player and I do have friends in the game reporting industry. A good friend of mine is Tal Blevins one of the top guy at IGN these guys know games mmos and game trend so much more then you will ever know. Like many older mmo players you got to prove you are so experienced. What was your first? You go all the way back to the beginning with Meridian 59 1996? if not get off your high horse, you sound like the whinny casual players you are talking about. Just another I'm a old school hardcore mmo fan bla, bla, bla.

Originally posted by Xexv

Let's face it SoE marketing has been in deep sleep for a Hell of a long time, for whatever reason.

If I see a banner ad I will be (pleasantly) surprised.

 Agreed!

Originally posted by Letsinod

Sorry, but I know no one that thinks EQ2 is a great game.  The graphics are just horrid. 

 I won't post pictures and proof of how great eq2 can look  been there done that. What I will try to do is post a video with the new video features and post it this weekend and people can judge for themselves. If you have the right system, which I do, it is still after 6 years one of the top looking games in my opinion and graphic are very, very, important to my game play experience. I won't paly even a good game if I think the graphic are bad. I can max the graphic with all the new feature including AA and the game runs and looks fantastic. It is not RIFT graphics (which I really love) but it still is wonderful to look at. EQ2 is a true piece of art a bit dated but still one of the best.

I have said this for years SOE could have had huge success with both EQ2 and SWG as they were at release had they actually marketed the games. SWG never needed to change they need to market it in a creative way. SOE never understood the potential of an mmo marketed right. They were woken up by the thunder of WOW but what they heard was the marketing not the gameplay they thought was the sound of success. SOE try marketing a great game like EQ2 at release not 6 years later.

Originally posted by lovebug

am a group player in dungeons so I left" is silly since there are many group dungeons in EQ at all levels. Try starting your own group instead of just sitting watching chat to get a pug.

 

lol why o why do people come out with this same remark. well get this i have never played solo in eq2 it bores me to tears and to say that is what i did is a joke at best left at lv72 group play only it is what you call being good at the class you played.

and yes raid has well was in a very big guild has well at the time but when i left out of 150 plus in a guild you were lucky if there was 5 on.

class i played was a mysyic :)))) and you should know that they were a group class at best.

and yes to me and many more ive known in the past eq2 did change more to the wow side of play has they wanted a slice of the pie it might of come out before wow but it never stayed true to its roots.

 Why oh why? because it is true based on your first post, you did not explain yourself. You were basically say there was no group play in EQ2. Why oh why do people say EQ2 never stayed true to it's roots. Of course it did. Saying SOE made SWG a WOW clone is correct but they did nothing like that to EQ2. They might not have taken it the direction you liked but it is still very much it's own game and still the same game I started on day one but for me it is simply a better game now. No other mmo has has held me as long as EQ2 and still after all these years I am not bored. SOE makes a lot of stupid decisions but for the most part they had done right by EQ2.