Yeah, it most certainly can be boring.  Even while simultaneously having a certain charm.  I've been playing off and on for years now, had a lifetime membership which is now converted to a perma-vip, and my highest lvl achieved is 42.  One thing that I have found that helps me, though, is to turn of the sleep inducing music.  I won't say it's not pretty... I'm honestly not sure anymore as I've had it turned off for so long, and when it was on I was snoozing within a matter of moments.  So turn off the game music, kick up some nice rock music in the background and try it that way.  I've also found that much of the soundtrack from the movies is very inspirational and can keep your blood pumping, even while waiting the year or so it takes to craft.

One thing that keeps pulling me back is my love for the movies.  Yes, the movies, not the books, the last time I picked up one of the books was decades ago and I had to put it down because of its long-winded style.  But the movies always get me ramped up to visit middle earth.

Also, don't be afraid to take breaks.  I'm usually playing two or three other games on the side, so if I get to incredibly bored, I hop over to another world.

So, boring it may be, but I have come to appreciate the significant amount of lore put into the game and I keep coming back to discover more.  It's not a bad game.  Just a bit slower paced, more casual than most of the others.

Definitely give me something to do while waiting for SW:TOR.

Well said, well said. Of course you realize you've just issued a challenge to every fancy-nancy other-worldy romance writer and angsty teen dreamer out there?  Sure, we say it can't be done, but I wouldn't have thought it could be done with vampires.  But behold... sparkles?

With the kind of backing sure to assault the zombie legend, I predict the zombie menace will soon come to a similar demise, and zombies themselves will soon be menaced by hordes of young gits trying to claim a piece of them... or just hug the sweet, squishy pulp of undead flesh.

And, unfortunately, zombies have been romanticized before.  Piers Anthony did it in his second and third Xanth books.  In the past five years or so I came across an incredibly adorable comic, "Blue Zombie" that, while keeping with the unwholesome demonic nature of the zombies, made them quite lovable.

I'm sorry, but zombies are doomed.

 Honestly, though, I find the idea of sparkling pretty damned terrifying anyway.  Maybe, as you so aptly pointed out, for the havok it wreaks on our concepts of evil that have been centuries in the making.

But maybe we need to think about what it means to the vampire.  I can't even begin to count the number of people I know that would assault and ultimately destroy someone who sparkled on a regular basis.  Weekends is okay, everyone has an off weekend.  

But what about the standards this sets for vampires?  They can't even make an appearance without performing a light show with their skin these days, and every one of them has to stop and reassess their blood thirst paradigm to find a motive that is full of feeling and deepness of soul.  I'm sorry, but that's just too much work all around.

Oh I'll grant, EA has an undesirable track record.  The possibility of them ruining this game is certainly there.  But I will hope, beyond hope as it were, that this game will survive and be pleasurable for everyone.

Today's games are much more fast-paced than before.  I'm not saying it's better, but there it is.  But part of that is also that a player tends to have objectives and quests that pull them through the content and game world.  There seems to be scarce time for the random socialization of previous game.  But then, maybe that's where guilds come in. =)  What functions like this one offer is a chance for groups of friends to create their guilds and groups before hand, allowing them to resume their previous social circles, while also giving them a chance to expand that based on their chosen game-play style.

Have things changed?  Drastically.  Is it bad?  Being an older gamer, I'll admit it has made certain aspects more difficult, but when all is said and done, I think the majority of gamers have gotten as much benefit from it as loss.  Trade-offs.  That's all.

Agreed, they both have their place, and their customer base to cater to.  I think both can be fun.  I like the feel of open ended games at times, but I also enjoy a good story, when well presented. 

This is very exciting, and I'll be watching this eagerly. 

It's true that mmo devs seem to recycle and share mistakes, but after the great work that cryptic has done with CoX I'm willing to believe they can pull this off admirably. 

Pardon me while I get a napkin, I seem to have developed a salivation problem.

Originally posted by jarish

Come on, we all know that the Hello Kitty MMO is going to wipe the floor with WOW.

Most assuredly!  That or the Lego MMO. =)

I'm not really a PvP lover, but this certainly has my attention.  I'm wondering if, rather than selecting any faction you can be against all factions... a baseless pirate of sorts...  That might be intriguing as well.

Ofcourse that would require that players be able to build their own stations, and I don't think they are ready for that... or perhaps just implementing a nuetral faction that services any faction.

I think the Ambulation idea will actually garner a whole new type of player.  Those of us that like to spend a little time just hanging out with your buddies across the galaxy will be very happy about this.  I would certainly love to see this idea expanded upon and improved, but I'm honestly quite excited for this.  I've always considered the fact that players seem melded to their ships in some way that prevents them from exiting to be a shortcoming of the game.  The devs apparently agree and are aiming to fix it.  Just because for now the Ambulation is focusing strictly on social environments doesn't mean it can't be used for other things later.  It may just be a stepping stone for all we know. 

I'm hyped and can't way to see it actualized.

On an extended thought, some games people feel are ruined because they contain aspects they do not particularly favor.  While I can understand, it's really a pretty silly sentiment. 

You definately have a point.  We have a large variety of games that do a great many things differently from eachother.  Granted not all are a whole new world and story, but there are a great many that stretch our imaginations already.  I think the problem is that people get bored with the games that are engineered to fit their preferred game play, and don't particularly want to engage in another type.  Personally, I like to jump from game to game when I find time to play, and when I come back I try to re-explore in a different way, possibly from a different toon's perspective.  Helps to keep it fresh. =)

In very large part, you're correct, and I agree that a player should not be limited to the one path required for the story archs.  However, some of the storylines are fascinating and well thought out, and can be enjoyable to unlock and discover.  Again, I think there should be both story archs and the options to not deal with it, allowing other areas of play.  I'm reminded of an article I read in which a person was playing UO, had just come back from some high lvl quest laiden with gear.  He comes across a player sitting on the edge of a river fishing.  Trying to be generous he offers the player some gear he figures will be usefull but is rebuffed by the fisherman, who is quite content to sit on the bank fishing.  That is the kind of experience needed more often and fully.  Sure, have epic adventures and stories, do fantastic things... but when all is said and done some of us would like to retire to a nice farm or fishboat.  Another thing to highlight.  I think it would be very entertaining to have available to players, not just housing, but other more business oriented properties.  Such as buying a fleet of trading vessels, owning a shop here or there, that kind of thing.  Bah, I talk to much.  My point is that all types of games we have are good, there are those in every game that appreciate that style, I would just like to see both aspects taken to a new level.

Originally posted by Cephus404

 

Originally posted by Hexxeity

I like content.  I like to read.  I like to be told a story.  Based on the success of content-driven games, I am not alone in this.

See, that's really the big problem right there.  No offense or anything, but if you want to be told a story, then you should be reading a book or watching a movie, some passive activity where the writer imparts their story to you.  An MMO or a PnP roleplaying game is different.  It's an active role in *MAKING* the story and *CHANGING* the story.  People who roleplay don't want to be dragged by the nose through an overblown story that they have no power to alter, they want to be given a setup and allowed to go where they want and do what they want and have the story be about them, not around them.

 

That's something the devs haven't figured out yet.

Honestly, I think we've come to far in the concept of integrating story to go back to hack and slash grinding games.  That's great if you like that kind of thing, but the world moves on and progresses.  At least we hope to progress, we certainly don't shoot for digression if at all possible.  Story is an integral part of enjoying the game for many people, i hope it becomes even more so in the future.

Originally posted by Hexxeity

When I read a thread like this, it really hits home one important truth.

I like content.  I like to read.  I like to be told a story.  Based on the success of content-driven games, I am not alone in this.

This isn't such a big epiphany, but the other side of the coin is something I have trouble remembering:  sandbox people do not like content.  They do not like to read.  They don't generally care about the lore, the background, or the ongoing story of a game.  They want to make their own story, and they feel that being a part of the game's story is somehow robbing them of the right to make decisions for themselves.

Really, honestly, the two playstyles don't mix well.  They don't even belong in the same game.

I can't imagine enjoying a sandbox game, and most sandboxers can't believe I like a game as "linear" as WoW.  Yes, those are irony quotes, because I don't feel WoW is linear at all.  I have about six characters at the moment, and each of them has taken a very different path in life.  True, there is a bit of overlap in terms of content they've experienced, but not as much as some might think.

Anyway, yes, those characters will eventually hit 70, and 80 after that.  And then maybe I'll move on to some of the classes I haven't bothered with.  And after that, maybe I'll switch to Horde and do it all again.  And maybe one day I will have seen everything there is to see and Blizzard will not have another expansion ready fast enough.

But you know what?  I've never held any illusions that this game would last forever.  I don't think it's healthy.  I don't think anyone should expect to be able to pick one game and play it for the rest of his/her life.

I know I came late to the WoW party, and I know there are some hardcore players out there (who I suspect do not have jobs or social lives) who have already completed this cycle of experiencing the entire game and have gotten bored.  That's a shame, but maybe it's for the best.  It can only be a good thing if they find something else to do for a while.

But I have a job and a social life, and I imagine most of the people playing games these days do too.  To fully absorb a so-called "linear" game takes a lot of time, and most of us don't get sick of the "grind" because we don't see content as an obstacle.  We see it as THE REASON we play the game in the first place.

So I'd say the "linear," level-based approach to game design isn't flawed at all.  Obviously it's not flawed, or the market would look very different.

And for me, the endgame is the least attractive part of any MMO.  I don't mind starting a new character at all, but the idea of logging in a character who is at max level makes me sleepy.

Well said.  I can honestly say I feel much the same. 

I don't think anyone is saying we should eliminate grouping, I remember the old days of grouping in EQ, sitting around for hours in the Dreadlands (I was a cleric, so all I got to do was sit and watch everyone's health).  In those days you not only had to know how to play your character well, but be able to participate in entertaining conversation at the same time.  It was more about having fun and enjoying the company, and yes, I certainly enjoyed that and miss it now.  Whenever I play a game now, I find myself deterred from even wanting to group by  players that seem to only get in a group or guild in order to beg, steal and abuse those around them.  So I stop grouping, which ruins the whole point of the game.  In other words, I understand the desire for grouping, I just worry that this newer breed of 'gimme' players is well on their way to killing the idea and think it might be a good idea to implement other things as well.  We certainly shouldn't remove the good aspects of a game, to be replaced by others.  There have got to be ways to add on, not replace.  Ah well, now I'm dreaming again.  The thing to keep in mind is that it's not always the devs who are responsible for any lack in game content, but the groups funding the creation of the game as they will tend to push for release in order to make good on their investment.

I can only hope that EVE is all that everyone is saying it is, I intend on beginning my adventures in the vast reaches of space next week.  Wish me luck, and if I'm not back in five minutes...  that will be a good thing. =)

I agree, as far as I can tell (which admittedly isn't far) player created content is probably the thing to work for.  Someone else was talking about it in another thread, having a basic start designated in which the player would become accustomed to the world, and leading them into a path that would open up to pure player driven content.  The player would be directed to a 'mission' giving npc, where other players would set up missions, whether it be a mission to conquer and claim strongholds for a faction or even something as simple as a contract on another player.  It would certainly add some spice to life.

While I agree to some extent, I also have to think of those who play the games because they are based on so simple a concept.  For some, the real world is huge, undefined in many ways and what difinitions there are often are held to bear against the common individual.  Playing in a system that is basic and predictable and follows a predetermined course can be edifying to these.  A truly open ended game may seem pointless and without real gratification to them.  I return to my original idea that there has to be a variety of games for proper consumer satisfaction.  Some like the grind, some do not.  And some of us like it some of the time.  But you're right in that it won't satisfy for long, explaining the need for constant expansions and updates, or entirely new games altogether.  As things are going, I don't see an end to the production of these types of games, so no danger there. =)

Certainly they can, if they choose.  And each new game that comes along seems to promise a change of some sort, however, as many of the veterans that so fondly remember older games will tell you, these new games have only minor differences while on the whole mirroring the same pattern and type as is usually prevailant.  I'm not saying I don't have fun with those, too.  I do, as the mood strikes me, enjoy the progression and ultimate kick-assery implied with the common gaming system.  But when all is said and done, I'm left wanting.  I know the devs try, and I salute their efforts.  I've had a great deal of enjoyment out of many of the games that have come forward.  But there are certain elements that are not being addressed that might make a more rounded game.