Originally posted by jiveturkey12

Also to Mr.Bloodworth, no not everything we are talking about was only in writing. Again There was clearly a video with Evil and Good armor and characters in it, there was dungeons with destructible objects like Walls and doors, and there was emphasis on quests and travel with freinds like using a different race to read certain "Lore" from another race.

 

 

 

Distructble objects = In Game.

Quests and travale = In game.

Reading diffrent race lore = Ingame.

Originally posted by pencilrick

Originally posted by Mrbloodworth

Originally posted by pencilrick

Originally posted by Mrbloodworth

Originally posted by pencilrick

 

  In WOW, you can make your way into almost any zone, even ones too high in level for you.  By contrast, in LOTRO, the zones are laid out almost a line, and you have to complete quests before they open up to you.

 

 

This is incorrect. There is only two zones that requires a quest to get into, east angumar, and Moria itself.

You are quite free to go anywhere you can get to. FFS level 1 chickens can get to lothlorien.

I recall beginning LOTRO in a tutorial instance, having to complete quests to leave the instance before I could even get to a starting area, then having to complete quests to get out of the starting area to go to another zone with only one or two ways out of it.

I did not play LOTRO much, but to me the actual books felt more free and less on rails than the game.

It was a tutorial.

As soon as you are in a starting are, have at any direction you want. Go for it.

I got to level 10 and a few zones out and still it seemed like a linear zone layout, with maybe only one or two options out of each zone.  Regardless, the game had the biggest IP in gaming history, three blockbuster movies out at the time,and it still missed, and it did so because it was too linear.

Missed what? Being the second most successful MMO in the west, because thats what it hit.

You played to level 10, and are now an expert in the titles future.

Awesome.

Originally posted by pencilrick

Originally posted by Mrbloodworth

Originally posted by pencilrick

 

  In WOW, you can make your way into almost any zone, even ones too high in level for you.  By contrast, in LOTRO, the zones are laid out almost a line, and you have to complete quests before they open up to you.

 

 

This is incorrect. There is only two zones that requires a quest to get into, east angumar, and Moria itself.

You are quite free to go anywhere you can get to. FFS level 1 chickens can get to lothlorien.

I recall beginning LOTRO in a tutorial instance, having to complete quests to leave the instance before I could even get to a starting area, then having to complete quests to get out of the starting area to go to another zone with only one or two ways out of it.

I did not play LOTRO much, but to me the actual books felt more free and less on rails than the game.

It was a tutorial.

As soon as you are in a starting are, have at any direction you want. Go for it.

Originally posted by pencilrick

 

  In WOW, you can make your way into almost any zone, even ones too high in level for you.  By contrast, in LOTRO, the zones are laid out almost a line, and you have to complete quests before they open up to you.

 

This is incorrect. There is only two zones that requires a quest to get into, east angumar, and Moria itself.

You are quite free to go anywhere you can get to. FFS level 1 chickens can get to lothlorien.

Originally posted by Kyleran

What the OP really wanted was less of a game and more of a virtual world,  a sandbox game as it were and of course, they don't have a history of selling well so Turbine changed the game to follow WOW and other more financially successful games.

They did not, really. The op is reading a extremely early interview of the game we play today. Most of the features that are in the article in question, are in the current game. Just not as was originally said there.

I can go through and do a point by point if people would like.

Originally posted by Toquio3

Ok the only thing I gathered from that gamespot article is that there was a "little" more options with what skills you got. but they seem alot like the deed "talents" lotro already have. is there more info on features or is this and non instanced housing? cause if this is it, then i dont see how those features would make a "crap game" (lotro) suddenly turn into the most perfect game ever created by man.

 

Edit - thanks jive thats what I read. again, just a little more customization when it comes to skills. still 1 pvp area (mordor), granted you can use your own characters. But again, to me, it doesnt seem like the games turned out that different. I dont see how those features would turn shit into gold.

They didn't. What happened was the reality of Real development kicked in, and things were changed or morphed into different things. Apparently, some people seem to think MEO was a completely finished game. Totally.

See this line here:

The version we saw was, according to Turbine president Jeffrey Anderson, "in a prototype state,"

This totally means that way back then, the game was 100% done, and the ripped it apart to make it what it is today. Just totally RIPPED IT APART. OMGWTF NGE!

(All the rest of the features the two posters here are talking about, WERE ON PAPER ONLY, at that point not at any point and time did anyone play thoes features, nor was it implied in that article, it was all speculation)

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Originally posted by SignusM

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Originally posted by Mrbloodworth

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Originally posted by SignusM There was a 3-4 year gap where there was no development. Turbine's MEO was made from scratch using their Asheron's Call 2 engine.

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You are correct, the Tolkien foundation after being burned on there keystone IP took quite a while to pass it on. Also, an engine does not a game make, the game layer does. So that was irrelevant to bring up.
Point being, Sierras vision, nor Turbines vision that came from it, was a good design. Hence. We have the successful LOTRO we have today. Your personal grumps do not counter this.
Considering that AC2 pretty much defined the modern MMO (Its downfall was due to not being a true sequial to AC1), and is part of the basis for Wow, you imply that LOTRO was an attempt to copy Wow, is like saying Turbine cloned itself.
 
 
 

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Again, you are confused, please give it a rest. At no point in time did Turbine EVER advertise perma death, the so called "poor sierra design" you keep harping on. MEO under Turbine was its own encapsulated game, which existed, which people played, which people like, which was advertised, and would have successfully hit store shelves, but a last minute revamp changed the face of the game, causing the majority of original fans to leave. Hence, NGE.
 

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I didn't say Turbine did, it was one of the first ideas to go.
 
You do know that many on the sierra team, are part of the original LOTRO dev team, right?
 

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The project would include Humans, Elves, Hobbits and Dwarves as playable races. The character system would be based on skills and levels. The play would incorporate numerous quests, although few if any would be required. Among the other features, one of note was the idea of allowing users to control monsters. Another was the team's controversial intention to implement permanent death. Unfortunately, we never saw how it would work since the title was cancelled. Earlier this year, after at least a couple of other attempts, Turbine's The Lord of the Rings Online: Shadows of Angmar finally let us enter a virtual version of Tolkien's world. Chance Thomas, who worked on that game, was also a member of the original team. At his suggestion, we looked back nearly a decade with him, Daniel James, Stephen Nichols, Craig Alexander and Janus Anderson.

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Source, and an interesting read. I Guess you do not see how ANY of the original sierra game, became the Turbine MEO, that became LOTRO. Can you. Must be hogwash!

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by tryklon

 Turbine did a great job with LoTRO. It's a game with lots of quality and great storytelling.

Why would ayone do another LoTR MMO?

Unlike Warhammer lore for example, wich was completed left out by Cryptic, Turbine really honored Tolkien's work and made a very good game. Wich will be around for yet alot of time.

Because the current LotR MMO is nothing like the one that was advertised or promised, and because it is far too linear, instanced, and WoW like for many people to enjoy. It is feeling less and less like Middle Earth with every patch. 
 

You, are not a majority. You are a singular person. Try not to confuse the two.

Originally posted by SignusM There was a 3-4 year gap where there was no development. Turbine's MEO was made from scratch using their Asheron's Call 2 engine.

You are correct, the Tolkien foundation after being burned on there keystone IP took quite a while to pass it on. Also, an engine does not a game make, the game layer does. So that was irrelevant to bring up.

Point being, Sierras vision, nor Turbines vision that came from it, was a good design. Hence. We have the successful LOTRO we have today. Your personal grumps do not counter this.

Considering that AC2 pretty much defined the modern MMO (Its downfall was due to not being a true sequial to AC1), and is part of the basis for Wow, you imply that LOTRO was an attempt to copy Wow, is like saying Turbine cloned itself.

Originally posted by SignusM

You are confusing Sierra MEO with Turbine MEO.

One int he same. When sierra was unable to deliver, the IP and all assets were given to turbine, hence why early LOTRO (Turbine MEO) looked like MEO (Sierra), even feature wise, however Turbine eventually realized just how deeply flawed the ideas were.

And the mmo world was better for it.

You guys may wish to read the link I posted.

Originally posted by jiveturkey12

Originally posted by Mrbloodworth

Originally posted by jiveturkey12

While I completely agree that development on the game was horrible, that doesnt mean it wasnt going to be a good game. And what do you mean "never had any In game Graphics", there was a whole gameplay video on gamespot that featured a UI, quests, and combat.

Made by turbine.

Yes that is true, but your forgetting that the game still when created by Turbine under the title "Middle Earth ONline", started out very similar to what Sierra wanted to do. As I said before over time, MEO degenerated into LOTRO like when they announced the switch from seamless houses, to instanced ones.

Just like the article posted by Signus, the MEO Turbine was making still had the "Villians and Heroes" or dark and light scenario for character development. And many other features exactly like the Middle Earth Game Sierra wanted.

Lots of things from the paper that is MEO is in LOTRO, however, NOTHING of MEO came to light until turbine made it so. True, they used some of the models and assets from sierra (as you see in that vid) that all had to be replaced due to errors, and just down right bad for 3D work.

What you called degenerated, other sane people call Evolved and was saved by.

Permadeath... REALLY? Yeah. k. The game was simply a bad design. Technically, and from a design standpoint. Hence, why it was stopped, and handed over lock stock and barrel to one of the most experienced MMO developers to this day, and at that time.

Originally posted by SignusM

"Middle-Earth Online will attempt to bring true role-playing aspects to the world of massively multiplayer games--a world that, as he suggested, seems more focused on creating large fields of monsters to hunt rather than allowing players the freedom to play as epic heroes and villains"

 

Oh, what could have been... 

This is why you like darkfall. You believe every bit of marketing that includes your favorite buzzwords. They do not need to deliver on it in anyway shape or form. Just say it.

There WAS no MEO, it was a piece of paper, nothing more.

I have a bridge for sale that is seamless, has open PvP and full looting, will bring Role playing back to RPG's, with have the most epic endgame, and will feature the most dynamic world ever!

Interested? I love empty bullet point words words too!

Originally posted by Toquio3

I 've found the world of Lotro to be quite unrestrictive tbh, and I actually dont remember ever bumping into an invisible wall either. I bumped into mountain-sides, and huge rocks, just the usual "natural walls".

SignusM has never played LOTRO, or else he would realize while it may be a theme park at its core, its more sandbox than any other theme park.

Of course, those two terms have little use outside of forums. That, and he would not make completely off the wall comments like that.

Originally posted by jiveturkey12

While I completely agree that development on the game was horrible, that doesnt mean it wasnt going to be a good game. And what do you mean "never had any In game Graphics", there was a whole gameplay video on gamespot that featured a UI, quests, and combat.

Made by turbine.

Originally posted by SignusM

Middle Earth Online was never intended to have PvP, but it was going to have moral corruption choices. Also MEO was set in the same time as LotRO, just designed so that you were always a step behind the Fellowship. Just to clarify, LotARO and MEO are the exact same game, just LotRO is the NGE version of MEO 

A game change pre-alpha does not a NGE make. Stop saying that. It is retarded. The games design, from the very onset was a work of fiction that would never work. The game was simply not able to be produced.

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by Frostbite05

Originally posted by Gamesmith

I remember when MEO was being developed by Sierra. That game looked amazing. It truly looked like it was going to be "the next UO", but then it simply vanished.

When it resurfaced under Turbines name, I instantly lost all hope.

I highly doubt we'll ever see a LOTR MMO released that is true to the setting.

 

 

LOTRO is true to the setting........

Yes, because Middle Earth has a thousand hills with invisible walls funneling you in a literal valley through every zone, and every cave is a black hole you cannot enter without talking to a specific NPC first. It's a bit of a mixed bag, some story elements are nice, other areas of the story, setting, lore, and towns have been butchered. 
 

Originally posted by solareus

Originally posted by Retrad

Here's a link to that video. I found it on Youtube.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5NJhlqOztY

 

a lot of that looked exactly llike LotrO, except for Lotro has way way better graphics .

That would be because after sierras design failed, Turbine picked up the development of it.

MEO was never going to be anything but a pipe dream the original design was a joke, it had so many issues and conflicts i was not even funny.

It was also in the hands of a development house that had a HARD time transitioning from 2d (That they did masterfully) to 3D. Just look at the renders (Because MEO NEVER had any in game graphics, only renders, that video is from AFTER turbine started developing it and has little at all to do with the Sierra version). Its like bad scan-line renders of the 90's, hell, it WAS the 90's. Letalone make one of the first MMO's, not going to happen.

You do not have to take my word for it. That project was doomed to fail, and eventialy became just a project to meet milestones. It was never going to see the light of day.

Anyone who thinks it would have been a great game A) Was not around when it was in development B) Has no development experience at all C) Has a giant pair of rose colored glasses D) Bought into the Serra hype that was for no one other than the investors.

You got taken for a ride with your nostalgia.

Originally posted by Rednecksith

Originally posted by Mrbloodworth

Originally posted by streea

I hate to jump on the bashing bandwagon, but uh...

"The next few weeks are going to be the toughest as we begin to troubleshoot specific issues and refine the game and server systems."

Troubleshooting specific issues? Refining the game? This is what betas are for.

Before the lead-up to this launch, I was honestly curious about the game, but why would I pay for an MMO (or any game for that matter) that's being launched while it should still be in beta?

Isn't this game free to play?

 

Nope. $40 for the initial purchase, and $15 per month.

RIGHT!

I keep thinking this one is F2P.

Originally posted by ghop84

mythos is back baby! torchlight can suck it! f yeah!

Irony.

Originally posted by streea

I hate to jump on the bashing bandwagon, but uh...

"The next few weeks are going to be the toughest as we begin to troubleshoot specific issues and refine the game and server systems."

Troubleshooting specific issues? Refining the game? This is what betas are for.

Before the lead-up to this launch, I was honestly curious about the game, but why would I pay for an MMO (or any game for that matter) that's being launched while it should still be in beta?

Isn't this game free to play?