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All Posts by Scot

All Posts by Scot

264 Pages 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 » Last
5269 posts found
It means that too much money is being spent on an advertising team to come up with sound bite slogans that demonstrate they only have a very limited understanding of what it means to be a gamer. :)

Most players have an astonishingly complex definition of what a cheat is. I am a purist and think cheats are an abomination, but if in a guild will I ask others to hold back because of that? No.

It is like in PS2 when a kid who was so clearly under age came on and was squeaking away. In a way he was cheating as I think he was about 9 years old. But would you have the heart to report a kid like that who was as well behaved as people four times his age? But if it was excessive use of bots you have to speak to them, because it reflects poorly on the guild.

Nari, please tell me some five? months after we spoke about Marvel Heroes that the grind has got to you now. That's what's wrong with the broadening and change, it is glossy yet shallow.

Oh and you are getting obsessed with labels again, I thought only I did that. :)

Originally posted by Loktofeit
nvm - not worth the ban
Calm down Loktofeit, and carry on posting. :)
What's with taking what I said as a quote? Ads do not break gameplay, but I can see some would have immersion problems with them. If popping up when you access an inventory or the like not an issue to me. But as I said we won't just get the ads instead of a cash shop, we will be stuck with both. I am all for looking at alternative revenue methods instead of a cash shop, but do any of us here believe it would not be cash shop + something new? Here is one for you, a never ending Kick Starter, no cash shop, development and wages are paid by donations. Huge risk I know, but we need something to pull MMOs away from Kerching! cash shops.
I don't know what's up with the editor, boxtastic!

 

Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Scot
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Scot
So adverts would never replace cash shops, and just be annoying because the players have to put up with both.

 

No you don't. It is a free world. No one forces to play a particular game. If you do, it is because you want to.

In fact, aren't many people here who don't like cash shop stop playing MMOs because of that? A perfect example of the fact no one has to put up with anything in gaming.

 

I have been in guilds where the majority of members put up with the cash shop because of their love of the game or the theme the game was based on. They played in spite of the cash shop, there are hordes of them out there doing that Nari. But also as you say I know many who gave up on MMO's, not just because of cash shops and FTP but the easymode, solo player accessibility direction they moved in over the years.

 

But no one forces anyone to stay. In fact, you said it yourself ... "i know many who gave up on MMOs" ..hence no one puts up with anything. If they stay, it is because after they balance everything, they want to.

And from the total market perspective, there are MORE people playing F2P games with cash shops, not fewer. So I don't think most people hate cash shops that much .. at least not to the point of giving up gaming.

Personally i find them easy to ignore.

There are more people playing, tons more. That should be your clue, so many that those now playing could not possibly be from the same pool we had fifteen or even five years ago. The MMO companies have chased a new audience, first solo gamers, then console, then social media users.

The numbers playing keep getting bigger. But people are playing games for shorter and shorter times. Be they solo, multiplayer or MMO games. You bring into gaming people who are not naturally gamers but led in from Farmville and that's what happens. This is already an issue for the industry, people will not stay long in most games and their attention cycles seem to be every diminishing. I know you will see this as great diversity and lots of choice, but there are deeper problems here.

Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Scot
So adverts would never replace cash shops, and just be annoying because the players have to put up with both.

 

No you don't. It is a free world. No one forces to play a particular game. If you do, it is because you want to.

In fact, aren't many people here who don't like cash shop stop playing MMOs because of that? A perfect example of the fact no one has to put up with anything in gaming.

 

I have been in guilds where the majority of members put up with the cash shop because of their love of the game or the theme the game was based on. They played in spite of the cash shop, there are hordes of them out there doing that Nari. But also as you say I know many who gave up on MMO's, not just because of cash shops and FTP but the easymode, solo player accessibility direction they moved in over the years.

 

Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Scot
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Scot
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Vorthanion
I blame it on the F2P era, where games are designed first to be money traps with some if any fun tacked on and MMORPGs being turned into shallow arcade games.

While I wouldn't lay all the blame at F2P's feet, its 'contributions' to the genre are certainly a mixed bag.

Agree but its cash shops not F2P, you can start a game as P2P or B2P it is what happens once a cash shop is introduced that breaks gameplay ethos.

 

That's a pretty bizarre statement. Unless the F2P game is making money off ads or other sponsor revenue, 'cash shop' and F2P is one in the same.

Cash shops are the issue, F2P is a subset of that issue. We often think of it the other way round because FTP brought cash shops to the MMO genre. The pervasiveness of cash shops has now gone far beyond F2P, but Cash shops are more essential part of the F2P equation than other financial models. Certainly agree there.

Are you saying you prefer in-game advertising? I am interested in what you suggest as an alternate revenue model.

I would not mind in game advertising, it does not break gaming ethos. You open up your bank and there are adds, would not break my immersion. But if the history of MMOs shows you anything it shows that they want money every which way. So adverts would never replace cash shops, and just be annoying because the players have to put up with both.

I would not be surprised if that's what they want to try out next, if not that something else, as I have said so many times before the changes will not end at game breaking cash shops.

Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Scot
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Vorthanion
I blame it on the F2P era, where games are designed first to be money traps with some if any fun tacked on and MMORPGs being turned into shallow arcade games.

While I wouldn't lay all the blame at F2P's feet, its 'contributions' to the genre are certainly a mixed bag.

Agree but its cash shops not F2P, you can start a game as P2P or B2P it is what happens once a cash shop is introduced that breaks gameplay ethos.

 

That's a pretty bizarre statement. Unless the F2P game is making money off ads or other sponsor revenue, 'cash shop' and F2P is one in the same.

Cash shops are the issue, F2P is a subset of that issue. We often think of it the other way round because FTP brought cash shops to the MMO genre. The pervasiveness of cash shops has now gone far beyond F2P, but Cash shops are more essential part of the F2P equation than other financial models. Certainly agree there.

 

The only skill in MMOs has been in group play, knowing what you are supposed to do and when in a group. Skill is a swear word in gaming companies these days because it conflicts with the primacy of accessibility in design. if you want games to be accessible to all so all want to play, you do not want them to need any skills at all. That's why grouping is on its way out in MMOs, and that's why other skills are never going to be brought into a MMO.

Watch the flashy graphics, listen to the pings, but don't expect to have an ounce of skill in anything you do.

How about telling us this closer to when we can actually play the game? :)
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Scot
Originally posted by Octagon7711
Originally posted by Scot

These threads, that come back again and again show one thing. There are a ton of players out there who think MMOs have gone of the rails. They can't all be wrong. 

Nope, they can't all be wrong just the same as they can't all be right.  It's always a mixed bag.  There will always be happy and unhappy players no matter what the devs do.

Kick-starter is showing that people want old genres back like point and click adventures, which the big names had given up on. Using a generic template with a drive to streamline gameplay (dumb down) and making your design priority accessibility is not what everyone wants. Bring back the old and bring on the new.

 

and kickstarter is also showing that people are willing to pay for wishful thinking.

You are right nari, some of it is just wishful thinking and will go nowhere. But as long as we get enough old and new ideas that work I don't mind that and I think most players would see it that way too. We don't expect KS to change gaming, just give us a few more decent options.

 

Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by Vorthanion
I blame it on the F2P era, where games are designed first to be money traps with some if any fun tacked on and MMORPGs being turned into shallow arcade games.

While I wouldn't lay all the blame at F2P's feet, its 'contributions' to the genre are certainly a mixed bag.

Agree but its cash shops not F2P, you can start a game as P2P or B2P it is what happens once a cash shop is introduced that breaks gameplay ethos.

 

Originally posted by Octagon7711
Originally posted by Scot

These threads, that come back again and again show one thing. There are a ton of players out there who think MMOs have gone of the rails. They can't all be wrong. 

Nope, they can't all be wrong just the same as they can't all be right.  It's always a mixed bag.  There will always be happy and unhappy players no matter what the devs do.

Kick-starter is showing that people want old genres back like point and click adventures, which the big names had given up on. Using a generic template with a drive to streamline gameplay (dumb down) and making your design priority accessibility is not what everyone wants. Bring back the old and bring on the new.

 

Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Scot
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Distopia
 

The reality is what I want doesn't exist, so i must settle for what does. ANother way to make my point is... coming here, doing this day in and day out.. doesn't make it better, it really doesn't change anything. IF it does anything at all it feeds myopic feelings, in turn heightening them. What good will come of that?

You certainly aren't going to "achieve more" by creating threads like this... IF that were the case it would have happened years ago. That's what is sad about this to me...(This type of rebuttal ).

The notion that accepting reality is bowing down to some regime of tyranny. That's how these posts make it sound... Accepting reality in this sense is nothing more than attempting to occupy free time with positive activity, not consuming oneself with the negative.

 

What? People come in to change the MMO industry?

And i thought they are here just for some fun verbal jousting.

Nari, coming from someone who posts more than about ten of us put together that P2P is over, F2P is wonderful and making more money, and all online games are MMOs...that is a bit rich. :)

nah .. that is just realistic. Anyone who expect an internet forum will change anything is naive. Don't tell me you really think i am here to change minds?

You have done posts before trying to prove F2P is earning more than P2P etc, so yes you are. But for all of us there is an element of that in our posts. We believe something to be true and want to pass that on. It was the idea that you of all people were just here for verbal jousting that amused me.

 

Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Distopia
 

The reality is what I want doesn't exist, so i must settle for what does. ANother way to make my point is... coming here, doing this day in and day out.. doesn't make it better, it really doesn't change anything. IF it does anything at all it feeds myopic feelings, in turn heightening them. What good will come of that?

You certainly aren't going to "achieve more" by creating threads like this... IF that were the case it would have happened years ago. That's what is sad about this to me...(This type of rebuttal ).

The notion that accepting reality is bowing down to some regime of tyranny. That's how these posts make it sound... Accepting reality in this sense is nothing more than attempting to occupy free time with positive activity, not consuming oneself with the negative.

 

What? People come in to change the MMO industry?

And i thought they are here just for some fun verbal jousting.

Nari, coming from someone who posts more than about ten of us put together that P2P is over, F2P is wonderful and making more money, and all online games are MMOs...that is a bit rich. :)

If there was no cash shop I would pay a high tariff.

These threads, that come back again and again show one thing. There are a ton of players out there who think MMOs have gone of the rails. They can't all be wrong. 

I think of MMOs as in their dark ages medieval period, only looking back to the ancients. How long it will last, who knows?
If they were releasing the PC version in 6 months time that would be the "definitive edition." The longer after a game is launched = the better it gets. Cash shop Is excluded from that equation though, which is going to be a potential Achilles heel for the game.

Nothing wrong with WoW style raiding being over, as long as it is replaced by something as a good or better. But so far mmOs have only given us also rans.

I do think the industry wants to see an end to raiding, not inclusive enough blah blah. But there is a reason games which do not have it suffer at top level. Nothing...for...them...to...do. You can put in all the inclusive mini pvp etc you like. Players just leave and they need to get there head round it and except it.

You can do without raids if your games is designed differently from the ground up. Take PS2, the whole game is a pvp match, no need for raids.

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