Originally posted by Alberel

Judging by SOE's recent shift in design philosophy I think it can be said that's not true at all. The MMO industry is now completely saturated with casual MMOs leading to new releases having too much competition to meet their sales targets (the number of games that have shifted to F2P is proof of that).

The 'old-school' hardcore MMO style which was generally more feature heavy and sandbox in style is now a MASSIVE gap in the market. The more casual MMOs that saturate the market the more likely it is that a developer/publisher will decide targetting the old-school audience is more profitable.

It is inevitable that the market will eventually swing back the other way and SOE has made a lot of noise to that effect lately already.

Shall we wait until SOE actually gives us something playable showing their new design philosophy before we point to them as the savior of mmorpg? We do see a slow move to more 'sandbox' like gameplay at the moment, but it is nothing like the 'old-school' games. You say there is a massive gap in the market, but all those developers do have market research. If there was such a gap and they thought they could make money of it, they would be. Since they aren't, that means either the gap isn't there or making the games for it doesn't bring in as much profit as making the next 'casual' game.

Originally posted by eldaris

The only reason arena net offers the game on their site together with prepurchase is because otherwise most people will not bother to get it from them when can they order it from someplace else for 15 £ cheaper.Yes,some want the game faster and downloading it is easier than waiting for it in mail but the number will not be so big when the difference is 15 £.So arena net sold the game at that price mostly because of 3 days of play in prelaunch.You can defend them as much as you want ,in the end is still a poor launch and since so many of gw 2 defenders laughed at blizz and diablo3 37 error don't complain now that error 42 makes gw launch as bad.Btw I had to wait 2 hours to play diablo 3 at launch ,had quite a few disconnects the next few days and i found that launch really bad for a game which should only have had optional multiplayer.

Some sites are offering the prepurchase for the exact same price as Anet. Some sites are offering the prepurchase for less. Some sites are offering the prepurchase for more. The download speed makes no difference, because in all cases you will be downloading from the Anet servers. Personally I paid less and if the servers would be working, I would be playing now. But the servers being up or not doesn't make a difference for this discussion. I'm not defening Anet or trying to make anyone believe there aren't any problems. I'm just pointing out anyone who says you had to pay more for prepurchase is wrong. Anyone who paid more only has himself to blame.

The prepurchase currently on Amazon isn't the one from Amazon itself it looks like, but from someone selling through Amazon. So it's price isn't an indication for the price Amazon uses normally.

Originally posted by eldaris

15 £ to get into pre launch and not being able to play - annoying
seeing arena net 'defenders' at work - priceless

The game is overpriced on arena net site.amazon can sell the game at 35 because nc soft agreed on that price,is not like amazon sells the game at a loss.So you want it or not,arena net asked more on their site because they knew people will pay and put the 3 days of play in it to make people overlook the 15 £ difference.Now they can't play and is normal to be upset and no,gw 2 is not the only popular game to launch and quite a few of them (LOTR,Rift ) didn't had problems.

There are tons of reasons Amazon can offer the game for less. As I said, the same happens with every game. You can always get it cheaper. Sometimes at Amazon, sometimes at another site. That doesn't mean you pay more for pre launch. It means that site is giving you  a discount. You would have a point if in 3 days Anet suddenly starts selling the game for less. But you and I both know that won't happen. The price at the Anet site will stay the same for the coming months. The same it has been for the past months. Making this whole argument not about paying for head starts, but about Amazon's price policy.

Originally posted by GwapoJosh

Originally posted by Urko

Originally posted by GwapoJosh

Originally posted by Urko
It aint about the time , its an extra £15 roughly i paid to play on the 25th and i cant.

Things happen at launch.. Get over it

You obviously didnt pay extra or your loaded

Sorry if I sounded like an ass.. Why did you have to pay extra?  Is that something some countries have to deal with?  Here in the United States you didn't have to pay extra.

You don't have to pay extra anywhere. It is just that some shops offer the game for less than the 'standard' price. The same happens with every game and isn't exactly new. You can buy GW2 for less than 25 pound if you want to. That doesn't mean Anet makes anyone pay more for the headstart. It means some shops give you a nice discount. Not sure why this Urko person makes such  a big deal out of this, unless this is the first game he ever bought. Any 50 pound game released in the last year and any 50 pound game going to be released in the next year can be bought for 10-15 pound less than the standard price in certain shops.

Originally posted by Gardavsshade

I think of how MMOs were as akin to Odysseus and His Odyssey.... and grand adventure, a thrilling adventure... ALSO quite a few parts of that adventure royally sucked... but that was part of what made the final ending so great. You can't get that kind of an experience in a NOW,NOW instant gratification novel.

We have millions of People trying to take the MMOs and turn them from "Homer's Odyssey" into Pulp Fiction paperbacks. That is the biggest issue that needs fixing of all.

The problem with that example is that the Odyssey isn't that exciting. Of the 10 years he was gone, he spend 7 being stuck on a single island with as only company a nymph badly in love with him, but who he wasn't interested in. Another year was spend with Circe. The parties there of course were a fun experience, but I'm sure they became a grind after a few months. It also has lots of backtracking. The Odyssey is an epic story, but only because 8  years pass with just a few words. Actually playing through it would be a lot closer to the mmorpgs of old.

Originally posted by thekid1

I assume she was a bit overselling the point and she was actually referring to dynamic events?

So the changes made in the world are not permanent but only a few weeks or months.

It means the changes are permanent, until someone comes along and does something about it. The bridge used in the example can be blown up by monsters. Unless players come along and rebuild the bridge, it will stay down. And it will be down for everyone in that server. Events don't reset by default. Players have to actually push them back into the previous state

Originally posted by Unlight

Originally posted by arenasb

Originally posted by Fishbaitz

You missed the bit on Transmutation Stones which allows you to take the stats from one time and transfer them to another for when you like the look of one item but its worse than another. It will be avaliable in the in-game store for real money. Purely cosmetic item.

 Sure is a lot of bitching on the GW2Guru forums about this. I'll reserve my judgement until I see the cost of it.

Yeah, it didn't take much to put some of the folks there into a self-righteous tizzy.  It will be interesting to see how ANet responds to what's really the first negative feedback they've received.  Predictably, it's focused on the item shop.

It isn't the first time. Just like all other communities, people often overreact. Like there were negative comments about the graphics in the first gameplay trailer, the people not liking the health bal, the energy potion and lots of others. But as negative as they are now, when the next article comes everyone will be happy again.

Except that is a necromancer and not a ranger.

Originally posted by Leonidus0

Apparently from that video you can make your character come from a wealthy background in a castle, or a prostitute on the streets. Whichever origin you pick will affect your character directly in-game. For instance, wealthy origins will receive more gold per monster kill and starting gold. Prostitutes will have high endurance and stamina.

Lol, classic. You are right about the having an effect, although not the effect you describe of course.