Originally posted by Zorvan

Originally posted by Shakkles

A dozen or so big-name industry moguls flew from across the US and some across the world for no other purpose than to stand in front of a room full of broke guys and girls in their 20s and say, "Please get out there and develop because you're the only hope for mmorpgs in the future." They call it IMGDC.

I think a lot of people are forgetting that SGL is the definition of Indie, which is a handful of young no-name guys trying to make something out of literally nothing and any progress so far towards that goal, ANY, should merit a modicum of respect or at least encouragement, don't you think?

That's just my opinion.

 

 

When it's done by any less-than-honest means? No.

Being an "Indie developer" does not qualify you for instant respect or kudos.

FYI: Mourning and DnL were both "Indie" games.

DNL... yeah I remember DNL.

In truth the only thing that I see them as "guilty" of would be saying how they had this big great game and it's 14km by 14km and so on and so forth.

From what I can recall the game was just bug city but if you think DnL made one red cent off of the money people paid to play it you're dreaming. I doubt they ever made back what it cost to develop.

But then again certain death awaits anyone stupid enough to try and make a fantasy game right now. indie or major developer alike. Yes even WAR will fall prey you mark my words to the girth of WOW.

But I digress.

I can definately see your point about "less than honest" approaches. The problem is that who knows if that's the case. The media manager at sgl hasn't worked there since, oh, since he was fired over the ordeal over a year and a half ago and the guy at mmorpg.com who recieved them isn't with mmorpg.com anymore either.

/shrug

I'm sure if the game ever gets to the point where there are a few thousand people playing and complaining on the forums every day about this being overpowered or that crashing to desktop like with any mmo that these will be much bigger problems than any screenshot mishap.

At least those are the problems that I look forward to hearing about.

A dozen or so big-name industry moguls flew from across the US and some across the world for no other purpose than to stand in front of a room full of broke guys and girls in their 20s and say, "Please get out there and develop because you're the only hope for mmorpgs in the future." They call it IMGDC.

I think a lot of people are forgetting that SGL is the definition of Indie, which is a handful of young no-name guys trying to make something out of literally nothing and any progress so far towards that goal, ANY, should merit a modicum of respect or at least encouragement, don't you think?

That's just my opinion.

Here's hoping WAR is anywhere near as polished as wow because i'm still subscribed to that @#$% game for the 9th time and hating every minute of it >.<

If you get an extra WAR beta key toss it my way and I'll make it worth your while lol.

Originally posted by Leucent

Ya thats the class i m leaning towards. Now the wife i have to convince her to play , she s dead set on playing nothing till WAR comes out :) I ll just pick her up a copy too without telling her. Thats how i got her into MMO s in the first place :)

1. Convincing a significant other to play an MMO I want to.
2. Having a significant other who plays MMOs in the first place.

Bewaaaaaaaaare!

Seriously though I was really bummed out to find that when I finally got into beta it required a 4GB FREAKIN' PATCH that took more than the 3 hours they opened the stinking server for to download. So unfortunately I can't give you an inside scoop on how well conquerors really do tank :/

Like it matters in reality anyways. There isn't anything else coming out for half a year so I'm pretty much committed to buying it anyways.

Originally posted by Leucent

I have to say i m impressed. I m a huge WAR fan and will be playing it no matter what at it s release....but i m getting more impressed with this game as time goes by. I am truly bored to tears with the games out there atm and look forward to the 20 th. I need a new MMO fix and this will do a good job to fill that void. Now to decide on a class, i m usually a tank type but like dps :)

Then you should check out "conqueror". From what I can tell it's a dual wielding class that can tank.

You should really take a look at the new stuff on the website that just went up in the last couple weeks...

www.divergence-online.com

Originally posted by NewMonster

wow im suprise that hellgate is on this site...... it jus odd....... its not even massively multiplayer...... weird.

Dude, they had the @#$% sequel to The Longest Journey up on here. I don't eve know why they still call this mmorpg.com it should be renamed to wewilllistanydamngamethatpaysus.com

Newest addition?

This game  came out @#$&ing seven years ago!

They just slapped on a new name and rehashed the same damn game. Why do we continually reward underhanded behavior with praise?

H    A    V    E

Originally posted by GM-FStevens

Originally posted by Home15
There not many out there, try waiting for ST online?

Meh ST won't have enough combat if they do it right. If they don't do it right and it isn't true to the ST IP it's going to suck hard like SWG did when they let everyone be Jedi.

You should checkout a game called divergence. Several friends and I got all jazzed up to buy the shit out of that one but found out the devs lost their funding. I don't think it's gone anywhere since I lost touch with those guys but then if they manage it it looks like it'll be the best thing out there period.

Also there are a lot of indie MMORPGs out there to checkout like force of arms and dark horizons. The only problem with geting your hopes up about indie games is they're usually done on crappy or just cheap engines that don't really feel like you're playing a good game. I'm not saying multiverse is crap it just has a long way to go. Divergence is getting it's ass kicked financially because they're trying to get a really good engine and you know how much those cost.

Either way it looks like we're all up a creek until one or more of these companies makes a new scifi mmo to play. Me there's no way I'm going back to SWG but like you I don't see anything else on the horizon.

I have zero interest in playing anything out right now and that really sucks... In fact it's been that way for months. If I could brainwash myself into believing SWG hasn't become a bastardized and gutted shadow of it's former self I'd still be playing it. That is if it were still a skill-based game.

This is why I'm really pissed off that DO (Divergence Online) might never even get developed fully. Out of all of the games on the left of this screen do you know how many are really scifi? Out of those how many are recent with decent graphics? Out of those how many aren't korean made?

That narrows it down to Fallen Earth, Star Trek Online and Stargate Worlds.

Fallen Earth: 4 years in development and still nowhere near beta? The damn thing will be out of date before it ever launches if it ever does.

Star Trek Online: What happens when you try to make an mmorpg based on someone elses intelletual property? You become the IP (Intellectual Property) owners biatch, and your game sucks. With ST Online I can iamge this is going to be because the community will keep spamming to make the game mroe combat centric and hardcore, but in sticking with Star Trek, there's no way this can happen. If it does it's screwed. If it doesn't people will move on. Star Trek is supposed to be about exploration and imagination not about combat.

Stargate Worlds: Once again someone elses IP. Plus they're using Unreal 3 Engine for an mmorpg. I'm all for people pushing the boundaries of technology but Unreal 3 sure as hell wasn't designed for that much load. Remember what happened when Twilight War tried to use Source for their MMO? They got 1/3 of the way through and realized that was retarded. FPS engines are made to do FPS really well, that's it. Plus because of this they probably won't be in Beta for another almost 2 years. AND if that weren't enough, it's an MMO, not an mmorpg which means because Unreal 3 can't handle many simultaneous connections it's probably going to be sharded off like Guildwards hence it isn't a MASSIVE multiplayer onlien roleplaying game.

GAH! Such negativity!

And then you have games like Global Agenda where the developers just flat out lie to get attention for their game. When I first heard this new company was making a spy-fi MMORPG i nearly had a stroke, but after watching the video and reading on their website the actual features of the game...

Engage in solo, co-op, and team objective-based missions against non-player and other player-created agencies.

Right... It's another @#$& game like Dreamlords that try and pass themselves off as MMORPGs to garner a little buzz when the reality is they are not. Coop? Sweet Vegas has that! Give me a break.

Originally posted by harrisond
Im wondering because i want to try some other MMO, and prefer high populations for groups and PVP.

What are you talking about?

WoW is one of the smallest population MMORPGs in existence. Each server can only support like what 2000 simultaneous connections? And of coruse you have two sides which halves that for available teaming, not to mention the level-based restrictions.

Also you might want to think about rewording that little "God *amung* mortals" thing. I would think someone proud enough to make that statement would have better than a 2nd grade literacy level. †

†That means it's spelled "among".

<scratch head>

Why isn't anyone else pointing out that this isn't even an mmorpg?

There are MMORPGs out there who aren't even being allowed to list on MMORPG.com yet this singleplayer game get's a front page news article just because it's Funcom.

That's just lame guys.

This is like listening to an Atheist and a Christian argue back and forth.

The athetist (Pro RMT) keeps pointing out factual data suporting his point and all the Christian (Anti-RMT) can do is make stereotypically uneducated, broad and ignorant phrases such as "It's wrong" without having to back it up with any proof other than citing the popular concensus.

The RMT is the future of mmorpgs. If anyone reading lacks the foresight to agree with that statement then feel free to ease back into your comfortable little rut of understanding that the world is black and white right and wrong.

"Buying an extra queen?"

"Printing Money"?

Probably the worst analogies I've heard in months.

If you occasionally speed to work, you're a criminal and you're putting lives at risk.

Stick that black and whie tobacco in your pipe and smoke it.

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Originally posted by BlazinBlades

LMAO, I don’t know what worst, the NGE or people role is playing other people for therapy LMAO. Bring it on down now.

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Originally posted by nomadian

Auto Assault, CoH/CoV, Anarchy Online, Eve Online, Matrix Online, SWG, Roma Victor

Do any of them come under fantasy?

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No. No they don't.

What was the point of that statement again?

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Originally posted by tanager

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Originally posted by Shakkles

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Originally posted by shae

While I absolutely see ZERO point in vanguard and for the life of me don't get why we need yet ANOTHER fantasy game, I do think we need to be fair.

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We do not need another.

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We didn't 'need' a fantasy game in the first place, but many of us wanted one... I don't understand this argument, so we don't need too any more racing, football, baseball, army fps, war strategy, etc etc video games either.  Because some have been made there shouldn't be anymore made?  Maybe we should have just stopped at pong.

What about improving or at least evolving the genre of mmo regardless of the lore behind the game.  Many of us do want more fantasy games btw, we enjoy them.

So I guess in summary, you are not really speaking for 'We' now are you.  Maybe you should try saying 'I' do not need another, and leave other peoples opinions to them.

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You signed up 4 months ago and your 1 post on record was to disect and contradict my statement as if it were a 5 page essay on the subject.

I think I'm a tad more qualified to speak for the community.

As another person stated in more words than I'm going to use; it's the same old rehashed crap with zero innovation.

The reason games like Vanguard exist is simply because of the publicity that the emerging mmorpg genre got 5 years ago when mmos were becoming popular. A lot of people in both America and overseas saw this as a moneymaking opportunity and nothing else.

Now many of those games are either launched [Dark and Light] or nearing completion to the realization that the market is so bloated with subpar fantasy-based games that...

...We do not need another.

As I've stated many times on these forums hoping desperately that developers will heed my warning and save themselves, their families and their employees tons of grief;

If you're developing an mmorpg, you must ask yourself two things...

...What does my game offer the subscriber that they cannot get in WoW? Would people be willing to invest in my one or two differences as opposed to playing the largest, most stable and fun online game in the world?

If your answer is anything but a resounding "Yes" to this question, scrap the entire project before you become even more financially invested in a lame horse.

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Originally posted by shae

While I absolutely see ZERO point in vanguard and for the life of me don't get why we need yet ANOTHER fantasy game, I do think we need to be fair.

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Yes.

They is.

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Originally posted by scaramoosh

Graphics

 it all looks like it comes from 2001, i mean we're living in the age of Crysis DX10 style graphics. I'm pretty sure theres the hardware for the servers to handle that kinda thing. Tbh most mmorpgs have like 2000 people per server anyways, it's not alot of stress considering EVE Online has 35k at the same time.

Animations always look poor and and dull. Anyone seen heavenly Sword? http://www.gametrailers.com/player.php?id=13314&type=wmv&pl=game Where are the animations like this?

Then you get the dull boring UI's and most of them are horrible. Why not have a mmorpg with as little UI as possible and have all your character changes visual?

Character movement, any game that does this poorly is soo horrible to play. Take DAOC vs WOW for example (i know DAOC is old) but theres just no match.

Gameplay

It's all level up this level up that go kill questing, kill 10 of these come back rise and repeat : BORING!!!!!! Why can't we have cinematic Single player styled quests? It wouldn't be hard to implement, take games like Oblivion for example they manage to do that in a world similar to a mmo.

Why is character creation soooo crap? You have some gay little slider things and limited options, take WOW for example. Why can't we change our own faces with tools like Garrys mod?? We could morph the faces ourselves and change everything manually and have endless possibilitys and fun.

No more gay sliders.

Why can't we have no levels? It should be about the skill of the player like in CSS or sumthing, there shouldn't be a giant UI clogging up the screen. Everything should be done by visual and SKILL.

Theres no games with a player customisable world too : SWG had it great but then they taken everything away. Why arn't there more player city mmorpgs or player economies?

 

People don't want a boring static world we can't change, we want to create our own world!

 

 

I dunno theres nothing that even comes close to a decent mmorpg xp for me, it's all old and crap and a pointless waste of time. Level up till you get bored on endless grinds then do RAIDS. No thanx.

 

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"No more gay sliders"?

There are two obvious things wrong with this statement.

First the obligatory homophobic content. Secondly, had you played more than two mmorpgs in your day you'd realize that the phrase "sliders" is synnonymous with having more character customization. "sliders" allow you to customize how your character looks as opposed to the "pick a face" style of asian mmorpgs.

"Tbh most mmorpgs have like 2000 people per server anyways, it's not alot of stress considering EVE Online has 35k at the same time."

Last I checked EVE had more than one server. In fact, I'm pretty sure they have one of the largest server clusters in the mmorpg industry. the fact that they're able to brag about having so many players is that their playground is OUTER SPACE where you physicaly cannot get character congestion.

Research = Good.

"Why can't we have cinematic Single player styled quests? It wouldn't be hard to implement, take games like Oblivion for example they manage to do that in a world similar to a mmo."

This is another no brainer. What kind of game is Oblivion again? That's right. SINGLE PLAYER ONLY. Then again if a guy like you who knows nothing about mmorpgs thinks it wouldn't be hard to impliment, it must be super easy. That must be why it isn't being done. Wait...

"Why can't we have no levels? It should be about the skill of the player like in CSS or sumthing, "

What the hell is CSS? I seriosuly hope you aren't talking about CS [Counter Strike] because I'll remind you of the hilarity at the idea of a CS left-click spamming child condescending the way mmorpgs work. Take your ritilin and cry on your myspace. Damn emos...

"Why arn't there more player city mmorpgs or player economies?

People don't want a boring static world we can't change, we want to create our own world!

I dunno theres nothing that even comes close to a decent mmorpg xp for me, it's all old and crap and a pointless waste of time. Level up till you get bored on endless grinds then do RAIDS. No thanx."

The answer to all of these jumbled questions is the same...

Because of the statement you just made.

When kids criticize every unique project attemping to come out [such as twilight war or divergence] with pointless bloggish and illiterate rantings of minutia, quiet investment brokers listen with the intent of advising their clients one way or another about what to invest in. The result is a multitude of subpar fantasy games because hey, there's no risk in making a fantasy game. You aren't breaking new ground or trying anything that hasn't been done before. How many idiots are spamming the Vanguard forums right now for invites despite the fact that the game brings absolutely nothing to the table which hasn't been rotting there since 7 thanksgivings ago. Or checkout the "upcoming mmorpgs" list on the mmorpg.com front page. How many of those are mass produced and rehashed androgenous clones? I submit that virtually all of them are.

Look at twilight war. It had such promise but less than halfway through their investors backed out after being tipped off that "mmorpg players want fantasy and that's it." Obviously that's a huge paraphase but pretty much sums it up. I can only imagine how much bile flows through the veigns of the guys who used to work for smiling gator and are now either jobless or modeling elf characters for some other game they hate.

Being as the only games which have a chance at breaking new ground are games which are privately funded with no corporate ties and agendas it makes me want to spit on my hands, hoiste the black flag and start slitting throats when i see retarded threads like this one.

You kids purport to want to play a "better game" yet don't seem to want to lift a finger if not to bitch about one thing or another.