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All Posts by Whitebeards

All Posts by Whitebeards

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Originally posted by SuperDonk
Originally posted by Whitebeards
Originally posted by exhell
Originally posted by Battlerock
Proof that wow is the best and still is - Wow is the best mmorpg of all time. Congratulations WoW and to all of the wow community for being better than the rest.

I think you're getting popularity and quality confused. Sure it's proof that the game is popular, but the best, not so much. McDonald's is probably the most popular restaurant, does it mean it's the best? However,  I think your comment is meant to be sarcastic, in which case, I'd agree.

Mc donald is popular because it is cheap. That is it. Is WOW cheap?

And who says popularity and quality can not go hand in hand? and if WOW is not quality than what is? even the most die hard haters would tell you that WOW is one hell of a polished and quality game.

I'm sick of the McDonalds analogy. WoW is more like Apple, hugely popular with loud whiny critics.

 

If anything is fast food in the MMO world it is the F2P games. Wow is a premium product that doesn't have to worry about catering to broke gamers.

Tell em about it. but i don't blame them. These people just read something what other said somewhere on forums and just copy paste it without even realising if it makes any sense or not.

Originally posted by JJ82
Originally posted by Thestrain

I am sorry but there are not enough sandbox players to support a game like this with pure P2P model. I suggest get used to the whole F2P thing or just quit MMOS. You are just a dip in the ocean.

 This is false.

SWG had 350K subscribers. That's 5.25 million a month. 63 Million a year. And that is for a game that took less than 20 million to make.

EVE has over 500K subscribers. 500k is 7.5 million a month. 90 million a year. And like SWG, did not cost a ton of money.

Both of those games were before WoW and the vast expansion of consumers into the MMO market with tops over 20 million around the world.

There is no reason an actual GOOD sandbox cannot have 1 million subscribers. If they are going F2P, its because they do not believe its good enough to be a success.

And yet we know what happened with SWG. 

Eve is  unique because it has no competition in its own genre of space sand box.

Fantasy and land based sandbox MMO market on the other hand not as lucky as EVE.

As much as i love playing sandboxes (Ryzom i miss you). I have to agree with him.

If you think there are enough players to sustain a sandbox FFA PVP MMO purely on sub then you are wrong. It got nothign to do with being good or bad. The market is just not in favor of P2P sandbox.

Would you consider AA a good MMO? forget about what happened to it once Trion got hands on to it. I am talking about AA when it was first released in Korea. And yet it had to go F2P because they were having trouble sustaining  on subs alone.

 

Originally posted by stevebombsquad
Originally posted by Tasslehoff35
Originally posted by Bannuk
Originally posted by MoreOfTheSame

i've never played this, what have I missed?

why does it have so many people playing and paying a subscription?

 

I've only seen a few videos and frankly it looks like crap, i.e. a saturday morning cartoon.

It is the first dumbed down and easy mode MMO.  Millions started playing MMOs with this game and claim all others are clones of it when it is nothing more than an EQ clone that requires zero skill to succeed at.  That last bit is my opinion of course but I did play it and I formed my opinions from personal experience.

What a bunch of crap...easy mode?  So you have completed the hardest level raids I take it?  You have completed heroic dungeons I take it?  Why don't people continue to open their mouth spew out 100% crap that's is so easy to spot.  It's been TEN YEARS let it go buddy you aren't fooling anyone with your lies.  

 

You are wasting your breath. It is the same with people that claim raiding requires no skill and that you can just faceroll the keyboard and be successful. I always laugh at those people because they are so clueless. 

These people queue for LFR and think those are the real raids lol.

I would love to see them facerolling in mythic and claim it takes zero skills.

Originally posted by zzax
Originally posted by CrazKanuk
Originally posted by zzax

Its ~3,300,000 subs. Everything else is F2P (almost) accounts from China.

Ummmmmmmmmmmm, why not just use their ACTUAL revenues. It's actually not that difficult. 

2013 subscription revenues were like $1.041 Billion, meaning they were collecting an average of 7 million subscriptions per month, whether that be from 3.3 million "actual" subs or 1 billion Chinese "almost" F2P accounts. So pretty much *face palm*

3.3 million actual subs + 6.7 m chinese 7cents/month "subs" (lol) + account services + cash shop

I am pretty sure you can check it out for yourself (google ftw) that their cash shop + account services revenue is very paltry compared to what they make from subs.

Moreover you keep generalising entire asian player base as 7cents per month.. do you have any idea how much they actually pay? it is lot more costly to pay WOW in Asia than in west.

Originally posted by exhell
Originally posted by Battlerock
Proof that wow is the best and still is - Wow is the best mmorpg of all time. Congratulations WoW and to all of the wow community for being better than the rest.

I think you're getting popularity and quality confused. Sure it's proof that the game is popular, but the best, not so much. McDonald's is probably the most popular restaurant, does it mean it's the best? However,  I think your comment is meant to be sarcastic, in which case, I'd agree.

Mc donald is popular because it is cheap. That is it. Is WOW cheap?

And who says popularity and quality can not go hand in hand? and if WOW is not quality than what is? even the most die hard haters would tell you that WOW is one hell of a polished and quality game.

Originally posted by Horusra
Eldryth you just sort of described garrisons.

Nope. Playing garrison now for almost a week so nope. 

is it p2w
General Discussion « Rift
11/21/14 2:56:36 PM
Rift is a purely a PVE game i don't know how you P2W in that. Now if you say AA is P2W i would understand but Rift? nah!!
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by Whitebeards
Originally posted by Hyanmen
Originally posted by JeroKane

This applies for every MMO out there.

People just expect everything handed to them on a silver platter these days. Even socializing needs to be spoonfed to them.

The current generation refuses to take initiatives on their own, because it's much easier to complain and whine on a forum instead. /shrug

Lol. It's not the current generation b*tching on the forums about socializing, it's the old generation. Old MMOs spoonfed socializing to them, and now that MMOs no longer forces them to socialize, they are completely unable to do it themselves and blame the game for it.

This +1.

Mostly people who complain and moan on forums about 'no socializing' are not young or new players but old farts who just can not let go of the past.

There was no choice back them in terms of socializing. Take example of FFXI. Even if i didn't want to group i had because there was no other option. Either i do that or quit the game. Where was this 'initiative' that you guys speak of? forcing me to group with others never made me more social, it was just means to an end.

Infact it made me despise it. Back when i was playing FFXI only difference is that i just didn't know better and i was naive and new to MMO genre. So that was the only kind of interaction and socializing i was aware of.

If it was really that amazing i would miss it and think of it fondly but i do not. I like freedom of choice and i want to socialize on my own terms.

That is not entirely true. Partly for sertain old games yes.

Star Wars Galaxies for example wasn't forced grouping for most content.  Just some specific areas and missions for badges.

But if you wanted to you could easily solo to level through your combat and profession skill trees.

For me, the attitude was just different back then. People just expected to socialize and team up in an MMO and took more initiative to this, compared to today, where every MMO is much more solo friendly and a lot of grouping going through automatic match making, like Dungeon and Raid finders.

So people just don't bother anymore for some reason.

I like having choice to solo when I want to and to group when I want to. I still take plenty initiative to engage with other people, group up, help people out, etc.

But sadly, I don't see it happening much the other way around these days.

People's attitudes have changed. That's just a fact.

Yes people's attitude have changed because they have realised that somewhere within this whole talk of 'we need more freedom in MMOS' is hidden the deep seeded need for old school players to be spoonfed socializing. That is why you see so much backlash between people who like the freedom of socializing on their own term and those who are of the opinion that forcing people to socialize is still the best way to make people work together.

Originally posted by aftabboo
Originally posted by sportsfan
Originally posted by mgilbrtsn
Only natural.  The numbers will go back to their previous levels fairly quickly.

Oh so you mean 11 million when the movie will launch next year then ?

I mean what are the previous levels ? 2-6 million in Vanilla WoW ? 6-9 million in TBC ? 11 + million in WotlK and 10 million in Cata?

or the 3 years cycle of around 7.5 million subscribers while the rest went free to play and had to abandon subs after one year ?

 

Actually wow has had declining bumbers of subs ever since 2009.

 

Cata and the other expansions didn't make dent in even 6 monthely subscriptions number because they didn't retain the players. At the 6 month plot lines for number of subs in wow, it shows no increase for any of the expansions since 2009 because there was no customer retention for up to 6 monthes.

I see that you still copy pasting data from that unreliable website? lol

Originally posted by ConjureOne
Originally posted by Whitebeards
Originally posted by jbombard
It's not a fail game, but to say something is better just because it sells more isn't necessarily true.  More people eat McDonald's everyday than filet mignon.  WoW is McDonald's of MMORPGs.  It isn't bad, but it isn't great either, it's just quick and easy and good enough.

As far as WOW is Mcdonald analogy i am not even going to touch that. I will let someone else comment on this as to why this is a completely wrong analogy.

ofc you wont, because you cant

and regarding my brainwashed comment, i will chew this down for you, but only ths once, start using your brain yourself, you were given with one for a reason. People who are chasing after "the next big fad" are brainwashed by their friends, neighbours, wives etc, people who own an iphone go on and on how good it is, making you want to buy one aswell (especially when you are a weak-willed individual) and you become part of the mob without your own opinion instead with a planted one from outside

peace out bro, dont bother answering, i dont like arguing with not so bright people, thanks

Not because i cant but because the horse is dead. And i don't want to beat it anymore. 

I see i have hit the nerve with you now...hence the name calling. For someone who outright denied using the term 'brainwashed' few minutes after making the post shouldn't be calling me 'not so bright' or anyone else for that matter.

The biggest fail of argument is when you start throwing personal insults, that means you have run out of relevant material to talk about.

What you call 'brainwashed' is what us normal people called 'good word of mouth'. I suggest learn and understand the term 'brainwashed' before you start an argument. When i tell my friends or cousins that there is a MMO called WOW and you should check it out that is not brainwashing..lol. 

Even if i force my friends and family into buying WOW i can not make them stick to it. To say that millions of people who have been playing WOW for 10 years now have been coerced or brainwashed into is just insane.

I bet no one has ever told their friends about Wildstar..right? if they did i am sure that is brainwashing too by this logic? or that logic applies only to WOW? 

Please stop typing. Thank you.

Originally posted by Bannuk
Originally posted by MoreOfTheSame

i've never played this, what have I missed?

why does it have so many people playing and paying a subscription?

 

I've only seen a few videos and frankly it looks like crap, i.e. a saturday morning cartoon.

It is the first dumbed down and easy mode MMO.  Millions started playing MMOs with this game and claim all others are clones of it when it is nothing more than an EQ clone that requires zero skill to succeed at.  That last bit is my opinion of course but I did play it and I formed my opinions from personal experience.

I am sorry but WOW is not a EQ clone. I don't know why people say that. EQ was a very complex and user unfriendly game. I wonder if you guys even played EQ or just copy paste what you read on internet.

Originally posted by jbombard
It's not a fail game, but to say something is better just because it sells more isn't necessarily true.  More people eat McDonald's everyday than filet mignon.  WoW is McDonald's of MMORPGs.  It isn't bad, but it isn't great either, it's just quick and easy and good enough.

I am sorry but it is a failure. Lackluster sales coupled with low profits and dwindling population. In the end 'profit' is all that matters and if anyone has seen the latest NCSOFT earning reports they know where WS stands. Right now it is just a burden on their shoulder and nothing more. For how long they want to carry this burden is upto Ncsoft.

As far as WOW is Mcdonald analogy i am not even going to touch that. I will let someone else comment on this as to why this is a completely wrong analogy.

Originally posted by V_i_O
Originally posted by Whitebeards
Originally posted by Kaladin
Originally posted by fyngerbang
Impossible to believe any of this. This is now so far past ridiculous, its just insulting and embarrassing. Senior management of Carbine started jumping ship BEFORE the launch (e.g. their head of operations). Does anyone remember that? Who does that? Only people that know they're about to drop a steaming pile of crap and they don't want it on their resume. Then right after launch the senior management was practically wiped out. Who is dumb enough to believe Jeremy Gaffney had "family issues?" Seriously? How about the rest of them? All family issues too? LOL! My god people, open your eyes. How about the "megaservers?" Its called a server merge for a dying game. Megaservers, LOL! Canceling holiday events, idiotically timed drops right before WoW, begging for subs with 7 day free trials, massive layoffs across Carbine and NCSOFT, people jumping ship left and right... Its over. How about the fact that there still is no studio head? Really!?!?!? NCSOFT is a major publisher and they have NO ONE in the company to take the helm even temporarily? Here's your evidence, any big company manages a transition like getting rid of Gaffney by putting in another high visibility person to do damage control. They didn't. Its all quiet. Do you know what that means? Its over. My favorite quote from another post is "we had 270 people at launch, we still have hundreds of people here." No you don't. 270-70=200. Yes, I guess that is "hundreds" since there is two of them, but don't BS us with "we have hundreds." You have a couple hundred, TOTAL, which is very few actual developers - very few. How about the NCSOFT quarterly numbers? WS revenue is down by 40% in just one quarter! Look at the revenue chart, its posted here on MMORPG. The category of "other" made more than Wildstar. Hey, look at our two top new awesome products, Wildstar and "other." LOL! Wildstar's revenue this past quarter is less than GW2. Think about it, GW2 is 2+ years old and living off just gem sales. Wildstar is only 6 months old and is still presumably selling boxes, subs, and game time. Compare Wildstar to GW2 numbers in their first 6 months. Compare the cost to bring Wildstar to market with the numbers its making and its current trajectory. There is NO way for NCSOFT to recoup its losses. NO WAY. Wildstar is a flop. Sure you can argue with any one of these points, but all of them? Seriously? Its all just coincidence? One thing after another after another, and Carbine and fan boys have excuses for all of them. At what point does everyone just add it all up and just admit it; its over. If all that isn't good enough, there are articals all over the place taking about the Glassdoor reviews for NCSOFT and Carbine and it reads like a horror story. Read them yourselves. Hey Carbine, game over. Turn the freaking lights off, call it a day, and stop embarrassing yourselves - cupcake.

Grats on your first post!

I suggest you not make a 2nd though.  You've really pieced together one hell of a conspiracy theory with this one.  Some perspective would do you a world of good.

Everyone has to start somewhere right? you yourself started posting in 2013.

I however think you have lost complete grip on reality. The fact that you make snide comments about WOW's subs and then one up a failure like WS in every post tells me everything i need to know about hidden agendas and conspiracies.

failure and is still sub ? guess they are so dumb to make a fail game sub until now or you are so dumb to think it is a failure while it is still sub  ? i don't know, i think i will leave this question to be answered by the audience or by obviously logic ....

 

Yes because a game is only a failure when it goes F2P right? lets ignore all other factors like people being fired from their jobs, those in lead of development leaving Carbine, downsizing of their team and obvious issue of very low population along with lackluster sales and low profit they made for Ncsoft.

So you were saying something about 'logic'? if WS is a success then i guess we understand that term very differently.

Originally posted by aftabboo

snes to wow is the same time frame from wow to the modern day.

 

The guy said wow has top quality graphics which is 1 reason it's so successful.

 

It doesn't, it has terrible graphics for 2014/2015 even if the gameplay is good.

 

You then didn't like the fact that he was wrong about wows graphics so you changed the word graphics to visuals to suit your agenda because you hate anything negative being said about wow.

 

Then you started pretending we were talking about visuals and came up with the argument that top quality graphics don't mean top quality visuals.

 

That is right, top quality graphics don't mean top quality visuals but top quality graphics are 1 factor which is mandatory for top quality visuals, you cant have top quality visuals without them.

 

Then because you hate anything negative being said about wow, you denied that and started to pretend that wow has top quality visuals for the standard we are at in 2014/2015 rofl.

 

Wow has many great things about it but its graphics are terrible for 2014/2015 and its visuals are mediocre for 2014/2015.

 

Stop being blind bro.

Huh? you doing this  circle jerk with us again till you get another account banned?

Let me makes it clear for you. The guy you  quoted gave a very personal and objective opinion of 'quality graphics'. In reply to which you have brought comparisons to 2014/15 over and over again lie 10 times atleast to prove him wrong.

I on the other hand never tried to prove you 'wrong'. Liking visual is very subjective thing but graphics are not just 'visuals'. That was my whole argument and since you kept on comparing WOW's graphics to SNES i don't need you to type me in capital letters that you are stuck on 'visual' part. Although you keep on denying it.

So nope i am not blind or tried to change the subject. You latched on to something completely irrelevant and now you won't let it go because that is what you do.

Your biggest problem is that you get personal with everyone and reason why you keep getting your accounts banned.

it is not what you say but how you say it.

Originally posted by ConjureOne

I dont need 10, give me one :) for now i only hear "bla bla bla"

Its hard for me to talk to people who cant understand what I am saying and intentionally or unintentionally (i think this is your case) put things upside down... where did I say that blizzard brainwashed people? As a matter of fact where did I say that Apple brainwashed people?

its a perfect example how a product that once was good and popular established itself and pretty much occupied the market, making it hard for new and better products to compete with it just because their brands isnt known or people are brainwashed in believing in superiority of the said product just because ITS APPLE, NUFF SAID

I know exactly what you are saying. Now if you want to pretend that you didn't use the term 'brainwashed' then go ahead. If WOW is apple maybe here is a thought..maybe Carbine shouldn't try to copy APPLE? how about that?

I know it is gonna be a futile attempt so i will give you the reason why WOW is sub worthy

It is sub worthy simply because of the quality and polish Blizzard brings to the WOW. Whether it is the fluidity of combat, rich lore, the world, back stories ..just put any feature here. That is what separates WOW from other MMOS and players know that they are getting best bang for their buck. WOW is the only MMO where i have never regretted paying 15 bucks a month for the same reasons. And i still have to play a MMO which has same quick response and combat fluidity of WOW's combat. 

I find it really funny though that you would say i am talking 'blah blah' coming from you i would take it as a compliment. 

Originally posted by Horusra
The problem for aftabboo is "quality". While it is possible to make better graphic...delivering that graphics in mmo's has not been done. Compaired to what is out their now WoW is top quality.

Yeah i can not make him understand something so simple. he thinks WOW graphics are same quality as SNES!!! lol 

But then again he did the same on his another account when he was stuck on subscription discussion and kept calling everyone a fan boy.

Some people are so damn obvious aren't they?

Originally posted by aftabboo
Originally posted by Whitebeards
Originally posted by aftabboo
 

Edit :btw he said top quality graphics not visuals which you are saying to change the subject but since you change the subject I would say yes, top quality graphics are needed for top quality visuals.

Come on now i wasn't born yesterday. You clearly latched on to the'visual' part when he said 'top quality graphics'. 

And no graphics are not just visual. There is also art style, fluidity , variety, quality if the engine and other numerous point.

But yes lets stick to how WOW's graphics are bad because they don't look like 2014 games.

Rubbish, he commented on graphics and I commented on graphics not visuals. You guys changed the subject to visuals by saying top quality graphics aren't needed for top quality visuals.

 

So like I said b4, we were talking about graphics but again like I said b4 even if we change the topic to visuals to suit your troll agenda, top quality graphics are still needed to run top quality visuals.

 

Try making top quality visuals for 2014/2015 standards with snes graphics and see how far you get bro.

The fact that you keep trying to make references to 2014/2015 and give zero examples of what you consider top quality graphics and not just 'visuals' i am going to assume that you are stuck on 'looks' alone.

Your reference to snes graphics is a dead give away.

Originally posted by aftabboo
 

You cant have top quality visuals without having top quality graphics and like is said and he said, he was talking about graphics not visuals even though you change the sub hect.

 

I hardly think we would get top quality visuals in 2014 running a game on super Mario graphics from the snes.

 

Good graphics are necessary for top quality visuals.

 

For all the good things about wow, its graphics is not one of them. By 2014/2015 standards, the graphics of wow are terrible even though that doesn't mean its a bad game.

Sir Repeats a lot strikes again.

 You seem to think that Graphics are just visuals when i keep saying that lot more goes into making it good quality.

Graphics are sum of its parts..visuals is one of those parts.

Originally posted by aftabboo
 

Edit :btw he said top quality graphics not visuals which you are saying to change the subject but since you change the subject I would say yes, top quality graphics are needed for top quality visuals.

Come on now i wasn't born yesterday. You clearly latched on to the'visual' part when he said 'top quality graphics'. 

And no graphics are not just visual. There is also art style, fluidity , variety, quality of the engine, the ease at which it runs on your machine and other numerous point. (look at example of WS, look at its graphics which are more suited for 2004 game and yet makes even beast machine cry with low fps)

But yes lets stick to how WOW's graphics are bad because they don't look like 2014 games.

Originally posted by aftabboo
Originally posted by Whitebeards
Originally posted by aftabboo
Originally posted by DjDriVer

LQQK people it don't take a scientific calculator  to figure this out,and you don;t need a master's Degree.  Here are some of the

Biggest reasons for not only W0W's 10mil subscribers,but their continued success WITHOUT being a F2p:

1- Top Quality graphics

2. The  game mechanics that have remained consistent throughout the games history.

3- Flatout a business model that continues to be successful, and actually giving members

  bang for their Bucks.

4- continued content growth through continued add-ons and updates,not giving scribers a chance

  to get bored.

5. since the game's conception,it's actually an enjoyable game to play,including a player community

  that is always ready to offer in game advice ad tips,a thing that many F2P games are seriously lacking.

  IMO,above and beyond all that developers are always striving to create new in game items,and working

to expand the player Xperience.  I also think the player community has a great deal to do with the 10mil

scribers. For the most part,they make it easy for a new player to feel comfortable & welcomed.always 

willing to help new players

The tope quality graphics bit of this made me lol. top quality in 2004, terrible quality in 2014/2015 you mean.

 

There are other flaws but im going to point out the 2nd most ridiculous one. The player community 'ALWAYS' makes people feel welcome. Then how come there is a thread on a newbie to wow who cant complete any quests on a PvE server because the enemy faction continually wipes out all npc quest givers so he can never manage to hand them in and get beyond level 40.

Yeah because top quality graphics only means quality in terms of 'visuals' right?

And did he say entire WOW community is full of angels who makes you feel welcome? every MMO has its bad apples.

Way to pick on his points and try to twist it into something it isn't.

Dude, try to be logical here, don't just be blind and get on the wow hype train.

 

I wasn't saying wow is a bad game. maybe its still the best mmorpg out there but to pretend it has top quality visuals in 2014/2015 and actually state that is a joke.

 

Its like me saying in 2004 that diablo 1 still has top quality visuals.

And i answered to that point already. When he says top quality graphics you read it as 'visually'. Even though top quality is more than just visuals. Read what you want to read but don't pretend that is what he was trying to say.

And what hype train are you talking about? stop throwing around random cliches.

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