is it ready yet?

when will it be ready?

me play Champions of Regnum !

[quote] Originally posted by HeavyBadass

---

  thank you, I love that you can go in a discussion with an open mind, sorry if I seem a bit of a douche bag with negative energy, I just want to make sure players know what they go into before they waste their time as it seems promising and rvr WAS fun, I left after they changed sultars terror (I think that's what it's called) to having a % effect on being knocked down or not which ended up giving chance a much bigger influence in fights and less skil resulting in the team with more players having a better chance than before which wasn't very good for alsius (are they still underpopulated) I loved that they worked so greatly with each other despite being in different clans and such, they had a really strong realm bond and it seems like syrtis (where I played) got all the players you just want to kick in the balls, and it wasn't fair for alsius that they made these kind of changes. I would love to see a rebalance in their skillset which really kicked noobs in the balls and valued player skill over chance and luck. I can also understand you like the game but knowing how it was before and how it is now also has an influence in opinion since it's hard to hate something when you just got to know it because you haven't experienced how great it was before, I just wish they would realize how they raped their game and started fixing it even though I can understand they won't throw hours of work in the trash since it costs them money, I can understand that but imo it's a risk they should do to increase their playerbase, fix bugs, add features, fix balance, grinding and add fun, once I threw them a suggestion that mobs would sometimes gather and attack the cities, the level of the mobs would vary depending on the players around the city to balance having a chance, this would add fun to lower level grinding. I don't know if you play rvr yet but I hope you enjoy it :)

---

it's ok, i think i understand. when i played neverwinter nights, sometimes i would play a pvp mod and really enjoy it and then the devs would go and change it to suit their friends, even though i suggested not to. By doign so, they alienated most of their players and many of these fun servers shut down. So, I understand that games evolve and its really heartbreaking when my favourite mod goes a different direction :( Also I sometimes became good at the pvp, and had a strong understanding of the combat system, and I was totally comfused why no one else understood it. It was clear as crystal to me how everything worked and how valance worked.

It took me about 3 years to finally understand people have their own (perverted) way of thinking about pvp. To this day, I do not understand why barabarians shud be able to 1 or 2 hit kill mages. I have yet to find a pvp server which strikes an even balance between mages and melee, everything is so melee biased to me. * sigh * But... i just learned to (sadly?) live with it. Thing is, I cant change how these people do pvp balance, unless i do my own game. So i just tolerate it but keep an eye out for a better game!

---

  I would prefer the game gave one entertainment instead :p. I can't answer about high level grinding because I'm not max level yet, I should stop writing on forums and play instead haha :D, But to answer your question the best way I can, is that I don't think it's grindy at all, I don't even have a million xp yet for next level I think and I sometimes get 100k+ xp from quests and I even had to skip an area because I leveled too fast so in order to get more xp from quests and follow the main quest I just went to this area to do the main quest so I could continue with it (it has a really good story with cutscenes as well imo.) Also I don't think you can call pvp a grind since you actually have to have fun to get your stuff :) Some people in that thread hates the combat system and says it sucks, maybe because they don't like missing skills because of positionning I don't know, but imo I fucking love it, normally I hate pve I hate fighting mobs and prefer to fight players (I still do) but I actually enjoy the pve in tera because it's different, and you can chose either to grind the mobs for quests casually or aggro a group of them and then use strategy and skill to defeat them which is quite fun, even basic attacks are skillshots, when I swing my sword as a slayer - a barbarian type of class, what you would call a barb in regnum :) - everyone it hits graphically will take damage, you also have to beat something called bams (big ass monsters) where it's totally up to you if you can defeat them or not as as a single man, if you read them wrong you will die, however if you fight sucessfully (takes around 4-5m to defeat one on your own) it grants you a massive amount of xp and usually good loot. I can say that I could defeat the earlier bams but when I came against the fimbrillisks I made too many mistakes and misread it's attacks so I had to accept that I wasn't good enough to kill it on my own and teamed up with a priest to kill it. Here's some footage of slayer vs a bam http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gd7EJ8t_DOQ watched 1m and she does a good job dodging it's attacks and such. If you decide to play or try it out I'm called fectodux on the ishara pvp server (I think ishara is it's name.) You'll be welcome in our guild if you wish. I hope this helps :)

---

this is amuch better answer than i see on other forums. most answers just say its grindy and i wonder "why? how?" but your answer shows how to play the game and what bits you enjoy. so definitely i will keep an eye out Tera to consider trying - the video looks a lot like Monster Hunter to me! So that's pretty exciting cos I saw Monster Hunter last week and i like it.

Your description also reminds me that when I left neverwinter pvp behind, I was hoping that all the spells and skill combos would one day be like mortal kombat - just like Tera ! so yea, i hope to try Tera soon. Not quite sure when yet, but thanks for the great heads up ! definitely a genre and game ot watch carefully.

( one reason i am not ready to try Tera quite yet is because, actually im really crap at mortal kombat action games, tho i still enjoy them..... o.o edit: i just checked the system specs for Tera and realised i dont have the 30 gig HDD space yet, my 200 gig HDD is packed with games and movies.  )

i wasn't going to post this but then i accidentally replied to a post in a thread on this forum, so i thought, ah.. why not just post it for discussion/criticism.

( it's probably way too long to read)

Here is the link to the post on the other forum :-http://www.onrpg.com/boards/showthread.php?215973-Very-long-conversation-screenshot-during-critical-battle-in-Champions-of-Regnum

Here is the introduction appearing on the other forum :-

"I thought i would post this just to give an idea of what last night's battle was like in Champions of Regnum. I know maybe a vidcap would be better, but this conversation shows more of the inner tension and gameplay than just a hectic video. I also like recounting and remembering this battle because it was one of the hardest fought battles ive been in for about 6 months. Ok it is a massive read so.. yea its like a plot of a novel.

This is about a 40 vs 40 vs 40 battle in the fort of Syrtis named Herbred. It is a critical battle because Herbred holds the last of the three relics. Alsius, whose chat screenshot this is, holds Herbred and must hold it for 30 minutes before they can take the relic from its pedestal. Alsius must then somehow carry the relic away from the fort, which is surrounded by 80 enemies in total (dying and respawning and coming back continuously). The chat begins once the player Swipe tells everyone that the Guard Captain (GC) of the fort is dead. This GC is an very strong NPC which helps the defenders of the fort and which must be killed before the fort can be taken. So it is now that the fort battle begins in earnest."

this is a pic of a fight in front of the Herbred fort (not of the same fight above, but a typical fight)

this is the conversation screencapped and explained :-

oops. thought i hadnt replied when i had.

so i deleted the post ><

um.. ill post something else >< sry

i think i agree with a lot of what you are saying and i suspect it is just differences of personal opinion.

i wasnt around when they did a fatigue system ( i dont see any fatugue system now) but if they did it like how you described i would leave too.

Actually by coincidence i came back here to see if you had responded because i wanted to ask you about Tera and its grind. Some players still seem to regard Tera as super grindy 

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/379410/Still-an-Insane-Grindfest.html

so i am not sure if i am going ot give Tera a try. Maybe one day i will. You were saying Tera had really good combat? You could be right because like you said CoR you can just cycle your attacks and grind PvE but it sounds like in Tera you can't do that. I'm not sure if that appeals to me yet but i can see how it could make grinding less of a chore. (actually at the moment i like that hte grind in CoR is repetitive because i tend to chat at the same time, or listen to music or whatever)

Originally posted by HeavyBadass

you are wrong, you DO buy your way to winning in this game unless you want to spend hours and hours grinding for money or equipment (if you are even lucky enough to get the gear you need)

1. it doesn't balance itself out, and unless the developers can earn money on it they will not lift a finger

2. rvr was fun, for a while, but it becomes dull and boring over time, it's not a lot about skill, more about who has the most players and who's the luckiest

3. NGD became greedy which the game reflected, as it is focusing more on graphics than on actual balance.

Don't try to give people a wrong illusion of the game please, be fair and warn them that they have to spend a buttload of time to be able to enjoy the rvr, the game lacks too much and has gone downhill since it came out of beta

i think whether it is pay to win is a matter of personal opinion. i do find voices on both sides, but on the web, the majority seem to say that relative to obviously pay to win titles like Allods, that CoR is less pay to win than most.

1. I like to think it balances itself out but you are right,  sometimes it just doesnt seem to. However, I did say that CoR is not a perfect game and like GW2, continues to work to iron out its difficulties. 

2. I still enjoy the RvR and a lot of loyal players still do. In fact, i hear the clan Pack of Bastards who played 1 year ago on Raven server is coming back to CoR after trying GW2.

3. I suspect NGD had no choice on the gfx issue. Relative to the industry average, CoR's gfx are extremely rudimentary (tho i like them this way). It was the best bang for buck that NGD felt they could get. CoR is a commercial enterprise and since I dont own it, this type of decision is NGDs. Players who do not like it are entitled to depart.

Actually, I feel I am legitimately enthusiastic about the game. Time and again I have asked critics to point out a comparable RvR F2P game and they can't. DAOC Uthgardt server still has crafting. Aion and Aika are graphically and leadership-wise a different game. GW2's skills do not seem to hav the depth of CoR. I would encourage you to list other games - i generally can explain why i prefer CoR over them.

So while I am enthusiastic, many of my opinions note that CoR is not a perfvect game. I would be the last person to say no improvment is needed. But. I would also be the last to put down NGD's efforts to make a game which they themselves enjoy pplaying and which is profitable for them. (btw, I also feel they spend to much on gfx).

Originally posted by morfidon

So you say that you can't invest 25$ on something so unpredictable? Geeesh. There is a chance to have a good MMO. You will get for it 1 month sub and game which in preordering costs like 50% less. In shop it would cost about 60$. 

What's more Mark is investing his own money, own career. Your 'precious'  money 25$ is just nothing. But 25$ of many ppl would be enought to have a chance to create something potentially really good. At least better than the things that are coming out right now.

Well i think $25 lots up to $2 million is ok. The risk is really spread wide so it should be ok? And you never know, you might be getting a lifetime membership  in a lgame which suddenly becomes so popular they can charge subscription fees like LOTRO did.

Personally, I'm not so charitable to pay $25 and help another person succeed. Why should I? I would prefer to see my own self succeed. If you look at the legal, medical and business professions, they are all supremely competitive. All of them regard investros who give them money as silly asshats because they know they are the ones getting a massive boost. I do not want to be a silly asshat.

Many mmo players are very rich and charitable, good for them but they are like investors in ooil and gas industries. Just punters in an industry where a fool is born every minute.

For $25, I would be inclined to go play another existing and successful F2P DAOC clone instead of helping someone else make megabucks.

Originally posted by evil13

 

Anyway, in the end it comes down to this - no one has made a daoc type mmo, where rvr is central (I suppose planetside and gw1 and 2 are the closest we've got, but both games have significant differences and funny enough daoc seems to have a better rvr system) So, this is our chance as gamers to get the game we want.

Actually more than one daoc type mmo has already been made and they already have steady userbases

1) Champions of Regnum is DAOC without the crafting and social components.

2) DAOC Dawn of Light is a mod run on Uthgardt server and this is idential to DAOC

3) Aika Online is DAOC run in a higher gfx environment

All 3 of them are capable successors to DAOC. Camelot Unchained might be MJ's vision of what a successor to DAOC would be like, but 1), 2) and 3) above already all provide competent RvR PvP capabilities. 1) 2) and 3) call themselves F2P.

I think $ 2million as a cap for a first raise is ok because it is somewhat small and hey, its risk takers.

But I strongly discourage anyone from supporting this kickstarter beyond $2 million. this type of cinancing model continues the precedent for the creation of a stream mmorpgs which are of exceptionally poor quality because 

1) There is no accountability. This means that there is no incentive to even create a game that people want. As far as MJ is concerned he could create another crap mmo and he would still walk away with a heap of dough.

2) There is no written precommitted plan of any sort. This means the game develops according to the fancies of each passing day. 

In the car salesmen and derivatives financing bnking industries, this type of structure is called a naked call option. People like MJ and the banks walk away with all the upside. This structure caused the mortgage crisis. So -- yea, im opposed to it because i feel it sets a bad precedent for making good games for the industry.

sorry i think another thread discussed this angle. anyway look - to give it a balanced viewpoint, Mark Jacobs is probably a really good and cpable guy. But things can go wrong, things outside his control. This structure doesnt help Mark cope with the rough patches. I say, if we are going to pass him money, pass it to him in a structure which helps rather than cripples him.

the whole exercise stinks of marketing glam. mark jacobs using his name and fast talking skills to scam off a whole lot of rich kids :(

i wud much prefer to put the money towards devs who are committed to less glam and glitz and more hard technical facts on what mkes a good game. 99% of what mark jacobs is talking about is non-essential to a great RvR PvP game, and this to me indicates he is saying all of it just to suck more money in.

--- i guess im just a bit worried about these kinds of donation drives. what kind of assurance do we have that the dev will follow  our requests? what is to stop him running off with the money and doing someting complete different? why shouldn't we opt for a more rigorous and readily available legal structure where we can have greater assurance? i feel these are important and relevant questions.

belatucrados -- i think it is good that such structures have worke din the past. but i  suspect.. i suspect they are vulnerable to diifficulties and so are not durable vehicles for future ventures. Given many are so enthusiastic, i guess i can only encourage them for now.

tom_gore - i think iu r right. when MJ puts up a more concrete proposal i will make sure to take a 2nd and closer look. i feel he has ability, i too wud like to see a great successor in RvR pvp.

Originally posted by Wizardry

I really wanted to try it,as it didn't look too bad grrr.... the 800 or so mb file,not very big,good thing.That only took me to the player creation screen.

yea CoR takes a heck of a long time to get running nicely. it took me about 2 days before it was fully installed (updating.. updating..) and even some reboots. and then it took me two weeks of fiddling with the interface and asking around before the game was behaving fully comfortably for me. it was fidgety and kinda annoying at times prior to that. maybe it is the f2p model?  then again, most mmos i play are very hard to install: silkroad was a pain to get going ( had to update video card and mother board drivers ), neverwinter nights omg update update patches etc. i have not yet seen an mmo that runs straight off the bat --- except maybe torrented ones.

programmers just dont seem to have a sctrong sense of engineering efficiency these days - probably because they are all using SDKs instead of building in machine code.

Heavybadass --- id consider NGD very fortunate if CoR is still running after 3-5 more years. I suspect if it is running it will not be in the same form it is today. League of Legends is amazing - a great marketing effort and i think if you get enough initial momentum then u can do an LoL. I dont think CoR can get that momentum -- tho i have suggested NGD stick a drive in theatre ingame so players can rock up and watch a movie together -- but all i can hope for is that CoR remains fun and intellectually stimulating for me for years to come.

But the only way i can be really confident about a gamne lasting, is if i own it and run it myself. As we all know, the majority of mmos dont last beyond 3-5 yrs at the moment. But i cant look back at any mmo which has survived for a long time (maplestory, runescape, wow  etc) and say i wud want to play it over CoR.

Originally posted by HeavyBadass

I know that regnum is not as bad as other games but you still have to use money unless you want to spend time grinding, and that's after max level since you need money for repairs (and arrows if you are an archer.) a paying player has an advantage over a non playing player in pvp since he has an easier time getting gear because of the item boxes. Besides this you'd have to be a complete and utter noob to lose to a level 50 if you are 60 but you'll be spending time fighting before you get there. The reality is that there are a lot of better games out there where you can get some action and adrenaline without having to spend an endless amount of grinding before you are able to do so. The game was good and fun once, but it just kept on going downhill because ngd focuses on money instead of game play, fun, player experience, content etc. things that makes a game fun.

you made regnum sound as if it could be the worst game in the world...

most F2P RvR games u need to spend time grinding...

you don't need ingame money to buy arrows anymore. if you grind a little bit you should be able to cover repair costs. or just sell some stuff for ingame money. paying realy money for repairs using repair hammers is a bit like donating to the game.

i dont think gear makes that huge a difference. you do get some players with OP gear (Lucky Luke at the moment), but most players laugh at him for being rather silly.

i think spending real money on lucky boxes cant make a huge difference because well, each item of bonus adds so little (about 0.5%-2% maximum damage bonus) and you cant have more than 2 maybe max 3 on at a time.

there are still quite a few noob 60s losing to 50s (esp mages to barbs). CoR is a tough game to master.

You need to name some of these games. I tried Aika, C9, looked at GW2, Aion. Even tried mobas like Bloodline Champions. I tried DAOC Dawn of Light. None of them gave me what CoR does. CoR's players stick with CoR for a reason. Im prepared to consider any game you suggest. (GW2 is a serious alternative to CoR for me).

Actually, I find getting to level 28 in CoR very fast. At level 28 i enjoy the challenge of killing a 60. And I still kill 60s at 28 (either as part of a team or when 60 is at low hp). So I feel I can get into the RvR action fast.

CoR is a commercial game. I don't own it. But even so, I dont go around bashing the game without an even handed  explanation.

Look -- i would probably be the last person to say CoR is perfect. There are a lot of good alternatives out there. But not a single one of them gives me sidestep keyboard controls + high top down 3rd person view + simple gfx which do not hurt my eyes + simple grind and gameplay (i can zip thru the quests without reading them, i hate reading quests) + acceptable disclosure of all stats and formulas and so on --- all of these CoR offers in one package. I feel no other game does this in one package.

---

Originally posted by HeavyBadass if you value your time don't play this game since you have to spend a lot of time unless you buy your way to win

---

but just spending money on xp scrolls doesn't make you good at the game. in general a player 10 levels below you will still beat you if you are not very good in how you use your battle skills. game requires you to be sharp and alert no matter how much money you spend on items or xp scrolls.

a good example of buy to win would be Camelot Unchained.

Have you seen the crazy tiers of spending they have, even before the product is set out in a blueprint? Check out this spreadsheet. $750 for membership of a game whose combat system is undefined :-

 Spreadsheet Link

(it also appears t o be a monthly subscription game... !)

Originally posted by RealLifeGobbo

Originally posted by ringdany

i am hardly a troll. look at what all of you are advocating. seriously. you are giving money to a guy without any real accountability back to you for his actions. if things stuff up, you are willing to accept "oh well, its just bad luck". this isn't a really wise way to look after your own money.  if you have heaps of money, i suppose its a free country and you can do it.

but it doesn't make the points of view of others who are opposed to it any less legitimate. i look around and there are so many viable alternatives to Cam Unch and yet people are saying they want to donate to another one? with the track record of such mmos? nope, not for me.

it's long past time for commnuity forums to stop rejecting posts on the basis of just proclaiming them as "trolls". the thing is, if you cannot come up with a reasoned argument why what people are saying is probably not right, then you are probably in the wrong.

Let's look at short list of games MJ has worked on:

•     Attack of the Killer Bees (designer, programmer, A.U.S.I., 1983)
•     Aradath (Lead designer, programmer,CEO A.U.S.I., 1984)
•     Galaxy (Lead designer, programmer, CEO A.U.S.I., 1989)
•     Dragon's Gate (Lead designer, programmer, CEO, A.U.S.I., 1990)
•     Splatterball (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1996)
•     Magestorm (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1996)
•     Castles II - Online (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1996)
•     Aliens Online (designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1997)
•     Rolemaster: Bladelands (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1997)
•     Darkness Falls (computer game) (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1997)
•     Starship Troopers: Battlespace (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1998)
•     Godzilla Online (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1998)
•     Splatterball Plus (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1999)
•     Darkness Falls: The Crusade (Lead designer, head acrobat, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1999)
•     Silent Death Online (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1999)
•     Spellbinder II - The Nexus Conflict (designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1999)
•     Darkstorm: Well of Souls (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 1999 - never completed)
•     Independence Day Online (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2000)
•     Imperator Online (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2001)
•     Dark Age of Camelot (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2001)
•         Dark Age of Camelot: Shrouded Isles (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2002)
•         Dark Age of Camelot: Trials of Atlantis (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2003)
•         Dark Age of Camelot: Foundations (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2003)
•         Dark Age of Camelot: 'New Frontiers' (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2004)
•         Dark Age of Camelot: Catacombs (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2005)
•         Dark Age of Camelot: Darkness Rising (Lead designer, EA Mythic, 2006)
•         Dark Age of Camelot: Labyrinth of the Minotaur (EA Mythic, 2007)
•     Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning (Lead designer, CEO Mythic Entertainment, 2008)
•     Camelot Unchained (Lead designer, CEO City State Entertainment, TBD)

Call me crazy, but I think he knows what he is doing. 

 

sorry but more reason why i would not back him. why should i help someone aggrandize himself when the return to me is so little via a kickstarter? all i get is a donators interest?

why not force him to go to capital raising on the NYSE or NASDAQ where, for your donation interest, you get an equity stake and the potential to get a real financial return?

so this is why i say personalities and celebrities like MJ (and im sure hes a nice man) by way of the industry's marketing machine have duped a great many of the community, including many here at mmorpg.com, by their means of self-promotion. the entire games industry has evoled to train you guys to swallow their hype. its like apolitical machne where all you guys see is the glitz and you do not think critically about what you are precisely doing or what he is precisely offering for your hard earned money.

edit: post below . omg forum participation might get a beta key >< ohoh lol. see? even im being sucked in. help !

Originally posted by Plastic-Metal

^

He's a troll.  Look at the post history.. that or he's honestly that, what's the nicest way to put it..  "dense".

i am hardly a troll. look at what all of you are advocating. seriously. you are giving money to a guy without any real accountability back to you for his actions. if things stuff up, you are willing to accept "oh well, its just bad luck". this isn't a really wise way to look after your own money.  if you have heaps of money, i suppose its a free country and you can do it.

but it doesn't make the points of view of others who are opposed to it any less legitimate. i look around and there are so many viable alternatives to Cam Unch and yet people are saying they want to donate to another one? with the track record of such mmos? nope, not for me.

it's long past time for commnuity forums to stop rejecting posts on the basis of just proclaiming them as "trolls". the thing is, if you cannot come up with a reasoned argument why what people are saying is probably not right, then you are probably in the wrong.

Originally posted by Maephisto

The $50 and $110 digital tiers look really tempting.

i didn't even need to read them to know i didnt want them. it's a free donation right?

even if u r rich, why wud u give money away to someone who is going to make much more money than you ever will out of it? just get a few years of playing pleasure from an rpger? while this guy goes on to fund a nother 10 big mmos and ends up as rich as Peter Jackson?

not for me no. not when there are already perfectly viable alternatives.

People have to stop thinking for what they want and focus on what they NEED.

Otherwise we're just going to end up with more unneeded things like Apple crapware coming out of China. Enough of that already - we are facing a massive climate change crisis and i dont think we need another 100 servers running a carbon copy of 10 other mmos already doing the same thing.

Originally posted by sweetdigs

 

You're not part of an investment fund that gets any ownership interest in the game.   

Your list is pretty hilarious though.  Tell me again how the "legal capital raising regime to which they are subject" would reveal to you the remedy that would be available to you if things went south, money ran out, and the project shut down?  This should be entertaining.

well the point is, if people did contribute significant monies (say $5 million) and the vendors vanished. where would the contributors go for a legal remedy? Would they have any? Or would it cost more money to engage lawyers and establish new litigation precedents?

instead, why not go for a regime where the remedies are clear, fast and have already been worked out? That way when the promoters scam people, the lawyers can act faster and more cheaply.

i dont need to be an investment fund to have rights or desire remedies. I just need to be a donator. It serves no one's interests to promote a capital raising scheme which eventually attracts scam artists, organised crime and used car salesmen.

edit: HOORAY! for Grunty below! pls stop with these wild crazy ideas from MJ and get MJ to do a proper prospectus. They say a sucker is born every minute, and boy u have to be a sucker to donate for figurines for a pie in the sky game. (even if the game does turn up in 10 years tme).

Originally posted by sweetdigs

Originally posted by ringdany

yes pls Zero PvE or less the better.

need to keep pansy players out. the more pve or crafting you have, the more players u get who complain about pansy things like dying in PvP or saying "oh the gfx isn't pretty enough".

let's get to the PKing fast.

Hey, keep us crafters out of your disparagement!   Plenty of crafters here from Eve who are used to always being at risk of being ganked.

ah. heh sorry just being reactionary >< EvE is a credible game. maybe Cam Unch can be moddeled to have those epic qualities? (EvE in't my style of game but a lot of people like it so.. yea).