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All Posts by Graveblade

All Posts by Graveblade

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123 posts found
Originally posted by Amjoco
Originally posted by AlBQuirky


Originally posted by Havekk
Some of you sound insane. These are video games. They're entertainment, nothing more. Some of you sound freaking miserable lol. It sounds like some folks around here are defined by these games. That's a pretty serious condition and not a solid mark that you're doing it right as a human. I mean, once things stop being fun... walk away clean. I play Wow for no other reason then the fun I have whilst playing it. It's a small escape from my hetic life and career. If it wasn't fun, I would do somethinget else. There's just sa'damn much emo in this community lol. 

And again you make sweeping (uninformed) psychological diagnoses about players who have a "passion" for a hobby. You're happy. Good on you. Play away. Keep putting your hands over your ears and yelling "Nyah! Nyah! Nyah!... I can't HEAR you!" all you want.


Sorry to inform you that not everyone is happy or even like the same things. How does change come about? By keeping silent? I know you'd prefer that, but too bad.

Nope, all he is saying is some people take gaming too serious. 

That is a load of rubbish in reality though, you think the developers are not serious about games? Ofcourse they are and so are tons of other people who work in the industry.... So are some players because they invest a lot of money, time and also because it is their passion just like some people love art or film or any media or sport... Anyone is entitled to take it serious if they wish when they have an interest in something.


Originally posted by Kopogero

Graveblade surely knows what he is talking about. Fact is the technology and tools are available, but for X reasons the product is missing and it's why WOW is where it is a decade since launch. Their vision on making a MMORPG is there and they kept building it further and further brick by brick from it's foundation and successful launch.  Reality is WOW does not control the majority of the market because despite of it's popularity it only does several things significantly better than the rest. A lot of the lost subs over the years contribute to bad decisions from their side with the game.

I can clearly see WOW being overthrown by a new MMORPG and I can clearly see 1-2 other AAA MMORPG's functioning and prospering alongside WOW if done right.

I agree with you there also they certainly do have the technology and tools available. Blizzard do have a vision for wow and they keep trying, I played WoD on release and was impressed with the leveling experience and some other aspects, some of the changes they made were very good, but after the leveling it couldn't keep me entertained enough so I recently ended my sub.


There is the potential there for other mmorpgs to take the throne or at least become a royal within the genre but I think it will require a company with a true vision to create something which is more like a bit of art. Its like films, you get lots of films which are good but nothing special, every now and then something comes out which is outstanding and tries to push the boundaries... Hopefully that will happen soon.

I don't understand the people trying to tell the OP that they think they know better or are trying to tell him what to do, it is his opinion.


I personally agree with the OP and believe that the potential for the genre is great, but developers are not making games to full potential. I played Ultima online, Everquest, vanilla wow, Daoc and lots of others since.... Currently I find the genre quite stale and find that there has not been a good AAA polished title for a very long time in this genre. No doubt I am going to get some people just making an excuse for their favourite games saying I am burnt out on the genre or something similar but it is simply not true.

The vision seems to be small and lacking or rehashed in some aspect for practically every new title.


For me, the point of an mmorpg is not what the ui looks like, it is not the fact there is a pet system, it is not that it has 30 man raids or something similar etc. The point I am getting at is that the concept comes first and you should aim high. These people who made the oldschool mmorpg's had a vision, they were not simply making a computer game with specific game mechanics and options. UO was supposed to be a sandbox game, and by god it certainly was a sandbox gamem just consider the skills and crafting options when that game was released. Everquest was supposed to be an epic adventure game and the adventure, the environments and boss fights in concept are more epic than 99% of the stuff people have come out with nowadays... And we are talking about a game that came out in 1999.


Yep I am aware it is called nostalgia. But that is my point, I am ephasizing the fact that over all the many many mmorpg's I have put lots of time in over the years, daoc is one which is firmly stuck right up there at the front of my mind. :)

While thinking of a new mmorpg to play my mind got onto the subject of the current state of mmorpg's in general as it tends to do every now and then when I feel like I need my fix. To put my own experience briefly into perspective, I have been playing mmorpg's since about 1998 (and dabbled in basically every single briefly known title out there too).


I wondered what others thought about my thoughts... It is funny that Daoc has always stuck in my mind as an mmorpg that I think I had the most fun in, in the least ammount of time.


What I mean by that is, while I played the game a fair bit overall, I used to have loads of fun just making alts and going to the low end pvp dungeons and battlegrounds. I will never forget some of the little battles I had in them, they were little, but epic at the same time... The atmosphere of the game was great it was very immersive! (besides the fact that the far clip meant enemies suddenly appear from nowhere in the distance xD) How was daoc so damn fun, there was some magic about this game in general and those little dungeons and battlegrounds among other things.

Originally posted by Nephaerius
As far as I can tell the only thing you don't like about the newer crop of games is the combat system which has moved away from a passive hit Tab + Numbers and target dies.  That type of combat is what I find boring so I am glad to see it go.  Personally I am enjoying WS a great deal and I think content wise it's one of the best MMO launches in quite some time.  Even if WS didn't peak my interest WoW certainly has nothing on offer I haven't already done or seen 1000000000000000000x at least WS might be familiar but a different skin.


Well it is not that I don't like it as such, I do welcome different types of combat systems. I think the reason I focused on that on Wildstar is because the combat system seems to be a large factor of appeal to a lot of people and how it is advertised, just like some other games have done in the past, take Age of Conan for example. Personally I don't mind the combat either way whether it is a more arcade style like Wildstar or tab targetting like on wow. I come from EQ and UO and have played tons and tons of mmo's over the years but never have I truly enjoyed an mmo's combat system over another to the point that it results in my favour towards that game. :)

Anyone else played the newer mmo's like GW2, TERA, ESO and Wildstar?


I have played them but am actually seriously considering coming back to wow. I just wondered what some of your opinions are about these games, but in direct comparison to your experience with wow.



I played ESO and left after about 3 weeks. I just couldn't bring myself to log in because I didn't enjoy the questing very much and having the pvp all in one area, while good in some respects feels lacking somehow to me. I can see why some would really enjoy the game though.


I am currently playing Wildstar and it certainly has some good aspects to it. I was very surprised by the amount of content at release and how much there is to do generally while leveling. The combat is quite fun although after playing through it, it is starting to feel a bit more like a gimmick rather than a combat system which is truly intuitive. It also currently feels a bit spammy in pvp, it feels like you have less of a true impact to me. A good game and quite surprising though as I was unsure about giving a go.


That said about the former games mentioned, wow is still a beast to be reckoned with. There is something that still draws me back, I am just unsure about taking the leap and if I should resub or not. The simplicity and the direct approach with regards to progression is quite appealing still. The Warcraft franchise is certainly one with a lot of charm. The combat is easy to do, but hard to truly master and each class is fairly unique. Very tempting to return and with a new expansion on the horizon, the temptation is a bit greater.

Yes older systems where you have to create community to work together and play your specific role to the best of its ability in a "ROLE" playing game sucks. I want everyone on the same playing field and to have no real specific reason or role so that I do not really need to be there.


I mean after all in a game, lets say baseball, where is the fun in having a specific role like being a batsman or a fielder.


Lets just make it so everyone can bat and catch and then make the ball whiz around and smack whoever it likes in the face.






You can say "I will bat" or "I will catch" but in the end it means nothing. You have no real grander purpose in a game system like eqn, everyone does the same thing. Hurt stuff.


Don't get me wrong, I enjoy hurting stuff alot. But there needs to be more in an mmorpg that you could potentially be playing for years. More individuality please WITHIN a specific role. Roles also help to create community and you will be rewarded for your ability to play a specific role well.

Originally posted by arieste
Originally posted by loopback1199

Just switching builds to fill a role doesn't mean you'll actually *fill* that role. If you spend the majority of your time with one or two builds, and you're needed to switch to a third build that you have access to but have never played, you're useless to the group.

Exactly.  So what you're saying there, is that despite the ability to fill all possible roles, people will still be only good at a few and known for those few.    Hence the whole idea of "role and identity" remains the same.  You're just able to fill more than one.


I knew tons of people in Rift that - despite the ability to fill multiple roles - still only chose to play one.   For those people, the system worked fine.  For other, who usually have a ton of alts and can play them all, the system also worked fine.  Seems like a win-win to me.   So long as there ARE actual roles to be filled.

That is the thing. In this game it is said that roles are pretty much going out of the window. Every person will be close to being able to fill any "role" whenever they want but just mix and match to lean your character one way or the other. That is how it is balanced.

The devs said that the system is not only one that allows you to pick from multiple different classes but that those classes will not as such have a specific role in the first place. It certainly sounds like they are creating the classes so that the majority of the game (if not all of it) can be done by many many different mixes of classes so they can do content equally and not have to rely on anyone ever.


This is what retracts from the whole community aspect and your individuality of your character within the grand scheme of things. In the minority of things then you will seem individual but there is no greater purpose for you.

You have to remember that mmorpg's are actually all about community in the end. If you have classes that can do a very specific thing that people will want then that is great and can create bonds with others.


A great example of this could be necromancer in EQ1. They could locate corpses very well and dying in that game was quite harsh.


That meant you felt more individual, you had something that all other people may very well want at some point and people will call upon you just for that. Or Enchanter that gives you a 2 or 3 hour buff that regenerates your mana faster. Stuff like this really helps community and the feeling of individuality because people want you for your own personal choice.

Originally posted by wizardanim
Originally posted by Graveblade

If you have a specific class (as long as there is a nice selection) I believe that gives you more of a sense of individuality within your class choice and its specific role. Then after your personal choice of class, you should have a lot of customization within that class.

Yes but in a role playing game, where every encounter requires the exact same group setup (with small deviation), a lot of times the small portion of the group who leaves causes the entire raid or group to fall apart.

The only answer to the above is either get more tanks (or role you need), or have one of your many members switch to the required role.  Let the group of people keep playing ...

In any system where the core of the game is the makeup of 3-4 roles, you're going to run out of possibilities after a while.  I feel they have over-booked the concept, so many games have done exactly this.

Lets say you can have 0 tanks or 1 tank.  Let say you can have 0 dps or 1 dps, same for healers.  So in a group of 3 you would have 1 tank, 1 healer, and 1 dps.  Now, lets say each of those characters wanted to build a class that was unique, and half of another role.  Some healing abilities, maybe some tanking abilities, maybe some dps abilities.  Would they be able to kill every mob in the game? No.  Some mobs will destroy you if you don't build a tank.  But, some areas of the game will be approachable, possibly even the best possible approach.  This promotes community, reliance on different types of characters, unique skill and ability.  Much more than, "Are you A, B, or C."  So many more options.


Yes mate but this is part of the challenge of doing a large raid. To actually have those people available to take those roles in a guild and to succeed should be rewarded greatly. Having lots of classes like eq means there are multiple different ones that can do the job. If it was just one out of many that would not be good.


Still I do not think that is the problem. What I am really talking about is not just simply tank, healer, dps but specific abilities of your class which can deal with many different situations.... not actually just healer, tank or dps.

Originally posted by Apraxis


I love sandbox mmo's but it is a little different system than what would be deemed a sanbox in the older days...

Different because for example in UO you skilled up to be good at the roles you wish. Or take eve online you choose a path to fly specific ships you want and so you take that specific role.


In a system where everyone fends for themselves in all situations that removes the whole role individuality.

I do not understand why devs of more recent games always say that a class/skill system that allows you to mix and match skills helps give a player more of a feeling of individuality because you can customize your character to how you want it.


I would have to disagree with all these devs who boast of an open ended system like that....


If you have a specific class (as long as there is a nice selection) I believe that gives you more of a sense of individuality within your class choice and its specific role. Then after your personal choice of class, you should have a lot of customization within that class.


If you have a system that allows everyone to fend for themselves in any situation, then that takes away individuality. If everyone can pick up whatever classes they like and mix and match then no one will feel individual because of the very fact that anyone can be the same or similar if they really wanted. They will be able to deal with any situation just like you.



That boggles my mind.... I think they have it the wrong way around!



Someone in the audience mentioned about EQ1 on the recent panel when talking about classes. The devs mentioned about the annoyance of not being able to, for example, do a raid because a tank or healer is not online at the time.


Well I sort of disagree with that being such a bad thing, it gives you a sense of identity and purpose in the game and helps you to feel like more of an individual in the game because they would like you because of your personal choice of role. Eq1 had so many classes and each one had a lot of specific spells and abilities which would help out A LOT in different situations.


It was more like instead of getting a party and thinking ah it is a shame we don't have a rogue but it does not matter in the end... It was more like if we had a necromancer right now, the ease at which we could gain experience would be 10 fold.

I really liked that about EQ1. In my opinion there were enough classes, each one with specific situational abilities, to make you feel like an individual a lot more so than games with a system where you can mix and match any skills.

What???     We shall have no contextually correct posts on this site, xray00.

Av are running a business, yes, and people give them money. The money is not just to let you play the game and keep the game running but it is also to help pay the lackeys to improve the game. Some posters here seem incredibly butt-hurt and judgmental with no real evidence.

People put money into projects that are literally just a concept aka kick-starter. If someone enjoys a game and wishes to back a company then go for it... In the end it is subjective and you do what you want to do with your money.


I think it is a bit stupid how some people on here try to rationalize their opinion with numbers. And some are so critical (some with misinformation which makes it even worse) that they do not even understand their own position. It is like trying to rationalize with an over zealous film critic.



The point is in the end the person who follows what they enjoy wins. You can make predictions, you can whine, you can blame, but in the end it actually gets you nowhere.

What you should do is back a game you enjoy the concept of, while making proper criticism tot he company. Companies love criticism of their product. Criticize things that can be changed to improve the experience but do so in a manner which does not include raging like an emotional little girl or literally only appeasing to your own selfish ego.



Yeah. Give them a break, have a kit-kat.


I agree it sucks a bit that there are no buddy keys or a trial yet but It is not like they are trying to steal money off of people. They need all the money they can get to improve the product and they obviously used any money they made from the first revision to help with updating the game to something they think more people will enjoy. 


You can be pessimistic all you want, it seems a lot of mmorpg gamers are so. I am not a fanboy by any means but I choose to take an optimistic approach because I enjoy the overall concept of the game and it is being improved upon, albeit slower than some other games, but the company is small and funding is small.





I did play the first game and I also beta tested the new one. You seem to be sort of missing the point about my post though Deerhunter.


What the real point of my post is about is that if you like the initial concept of the game you should definitely give it a go because you may really enjoy it. Secondary to that though that a new player must be aware that they are not a big company and so you can not expect an A* product right off the bat and it will take a bit longer than some of the bigger companies to improve upon, but, also that they are infact constantly working on the product to improve it which is good.

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