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Originally posted by simplyawful

Originally posted by dubyahite

 

That may be their intent, but I still have doubt that everyone will go through the effort required to do it.  Just because quests are repeatable doesn't mean that people are going to run around doing every quest over and over to get every skill. The more casual players most certainly won't in my opinion.

 

Let's throw that argument out though, and assume you are right. Every single person who plays the game will get every skill unlocked at some point. Or at least the vast majority will. That's fine, I can go along with that.  

 

The real point of my argument, however, is that even if your average player has every skill available to them, the vast majority will go unused by any given player. Most people are simply not going to have enough builds rattling around in their heads that can utilize all 500 skills.

There are people out there who absolutely refuse to heal, for example. In lots of class based games there are classes capable of being healers or dps. SWTOR is a good recent example of this. Your average sith inquisitor was not a healer. I knew many that had zero interest in healing, they just wanted to zap stuff with lightning. Those people aren't going to be out there using every build possible. 

Even within healers there are several different ways to make a healing build between the different weapons with healing. Not to mention the passives. 

The same could be said for any role. People aren't going to use every dps spec out there just because they can. They will use what they like

 

I get your point. Yes people will be able to swap between roles at will, noone is locked into any one thing, but will they? That is the question that matters. Like I said, just because you can make a tanking build, doesn't mean you are a good tank. 

 

 

First off, instead of levels there is degree of completion of the wheel i.e. the % of skills you've unlocked. That is essentially the level. You're assuming that not everybody will hit max level, which is kind of ridiculous. There aren't many western MMORPGs out where you can't hit max level reasonably, EQ was one but that was more than a decade ago.

It's also ridiculous to assume that people won't use more than one build. It defeats the entire purpose of the weapon system. You're supposed to use more than one set of two weapons in different situations depending on what is needed. Specialization in this game exists to some degree, but is not the core of the game. The game is classless precisely because of that.

You're not supposed to specialize heavily like in other games, you're supposed to adapt to what is needed. The combat is probably simple for that reason as well, since you're supposed to master different roles.

 

If you refuse to heal, then it's fine, because everybody else can heal. If you refuse to tank, that's fine too, because everybody else can tank. The same holds for dps. You CAN do everything, but you're not forced. You only make it harder on yourself if you want to specialize in one role though...

 

 

I understand all of this stuff.  

I'm not saying people won't use more than one build. I'm saying that they won't use ALL builds.  This is how their character will be different than others. Between the builds they are comfortable with, and the gear they have, they will only be proficient with a certain number of builds. 

I'm also not saying that everyone will specialize in one role. I'm saying that there are things that they will like to do and things that they don't like to do.

Your last paragraph is making my point for me actually.  Remember we are talking about differentiating your character from other characters (or at least I was). The skills/builds/gear you use will determine how your character is different from others, that's all I was saying.  

It's not as simple as saying that every person will have access to every skill. What makes them different is what skills they choose to use, as I have said all along

Originally posted by simplyawful

Originally posted by dubyahite
@simplyawful

Well first of all, decks are the premade builds are they not? You don't even have to use them.


Second, just because you can use all skills doesn't mean everyone will be good a every build. Someone doesn't become a good tank or healer simply because they spec for it. And really there are plenty of people that don't want to do that. Most people just want to dps. There are a large variety of dps builds in this game for everyone. Assuming decent balance then people won't have to run around with the same build.


Third, I don't believe the premise that everyone will have all skills. I do believe that it will take a decent time investment to acquire everything. Skills come slower later in the game from what I have heard and I expect a significant amount of grinding to get everything.

Most players are not going to attempt to unlock everything for a long time, and those that do will still have a few things they like.

Noone is going to use every build possible all the time. Thats crazy.


This isn't even taking gear into account. I may have a good hammer and shotgun set, but have no gear for elemental/rifles. I'm not going to run around usin ele/rifle allthe time because the guy with gear will be better at it, or whatever.



Anyways, if you don't believe this game has customization, then that's fine. I honestly don't know what it will be like either when the game comes out.

You seem to think everyone will have every skill and everyone will want to use every build, switching between them all the time. I think that is incorrect but we shall see.

 

The developers stated that the red was the intent.

With only 7 active abilities, it's pretty easy to do anything in this game in terms of combat. The only challenge is in the building of skill decks, but that's just a little bit of research just like it was in Anarchy Online

Everyone will eventually get all skills. That is why quests are repeatable, it's essentially how you progress through the game instead of leveling traditionally. The developers even said that there was progression, but it was much "flatter" than in most other games because of it.

 

So yeah.. not sure what you expect from the game, but it's pretty clear that they went for a game without dedicated roles given you can swap between them readily and learn them all. The specialization points are there to make you a unique snowflake, but ... as of right now they are kind of minor.

 

 

That may be their intent, but I still have doubt that everyone will go through the effort required to do it.  Just because quests are repeatable doesn't mean that people are going to run around doing every quest over and over to get every skill. The more casual players most certainly won't in my opinion.

Let's throw that argument out though, and assume you are right. Every single person who plays the game will get every skill unlocked at some point. Or at least the vast majority will. That's fine, I can go along with that.  

The real point of my argument, however, is that even if your average player has every skill available to them, the vast majority will go unused by any given player. Most people are simply not going to have enough builds rattling around in their heads that can utilize all 500 skills.

There are people out there who absolutely refuse to heal, for example. In lots of class based games there are classes capable of being healers or dps. SWTOR is a good recent example of this. Your average sith inquisitor was not a healer. I knew many that had zero interest in healing, they just wanted to zap stuff with lightning. Those people aren't going to be out there using every build possible. 

Even within healers there are several different ways to make a healing build between the different weapons with healing. Not to mention the passives. 

The same could be said for any role. People aren't going to use every dps spec out there just because they can. They will use what they like

I get your point. Yes people will be able to swap between roles at will, noone is locked into any one thing, but will they? That is the question that matters. Like I said, just because you can make a tanking build, doesn't mean you are a good tank. 

Originally posted by AvatarBlade

Originally posted by chelao

this game looks awsome and I wonder why is this game not known yet lol?

I'd say it is known. Not as much as others, but that might be due to the fact that it is still in alpha, so there hasn't been a lot of info on it so far.

There has been a ton of info on the game. I can't think of another game dev that has released as much info as this Planetside 2 team has this early in development.

Seriously, they have pretty much given us everything there is to know about the game at this point, and it's still in alpha!