there is a small community there, that are actually really good friends with each other.

the game exists only because of this small pool of people still playing. its not because the game is actually good.

its really really sad, such a low level of ethics to have a cash shop, and be the 'gold' spammer too.

i will play skyrim until swtor,.. in a way, its almost a blessing, it was the kick in the pants to let me move on.

already in the plans,..... swtor. will be fun.

I have watched tons of people get 'hacked', we are talking 25 percent of the game population.

the owners, galanet, do absolutely nothing, no statement, nothing officially on forums.

I realized, that this is such a horrible, low populated game, it would only take 1 staff member to post something every maintenance day, and then everything is on autopilot.

There are no active gms in this game. 3rd party spammers plague the game, and nothing is done, and no mention of it exists from the company.

I realized, that, they dont do anything about it, because they are the 3rd party, and the 'hacker'. it makes perfect sense. they can sell stuff in thier cash shop, and 3rd party, and get both populations of buyers. they can 'hack' accounts, and take stuff away so that people dont progress with the items. if everyone quit rappelz, they would just shut it down, because its such an old game, no one cares. It is disposible.

My only regret, is that I actulaly spent time in this game, which is embarrassing.

When I was in the navy, my engineer would say " don't come to me with problems, come to me with solutions."

I personally want to escape to another world when i play an mmo, and join friends to face challenges that I can not do alone, or do much more efficiently with a group.

with that being said, solo questing should be removed. not just from rift, but lets say, the next anticipated game. no quest should have a "!". you should have to read what people are saying, and bring an item, like in eq1. you dont get a magic circle. I dont even think you should get a minimap. make your own damn map.That way, you feel like you are discovering what to do through effort. the quest item should not be soloable on equal level.

crafting in saga of ryzom, was the most fun ever for me. also the harvesting. if you didnt pay attention when you obtained items in SoR, you could DIE,.  all items would be affected with the mats you brought to the recipe, so the quality of materials and the skill of the user, would affect the outcome. there was no crafting 10 of the same exact thing. people could play the game just as a harvestor, or just as a crafter, and have fun/feel useful. the items i made, i felt were mine, because they werent the same as the next guy. material locations would change with time of day, and seasons. there were no node locations depicted by a cheesy graphic. you had to memorize where you found a good item and that area can be tapped out.

taming pets that have thier own skillset, with thier own skill tree is a good idea. having the same class/level share the same pet as everyone else, and the pet is basically free, is lame. leaves nothing to the imagination. seeing everyone walking around with the same stuff is horrible. old old rappelz had the best pet idea. you grinded a said monster until it dropped a card. then you had a CHANCE to tame it. once tamed, you leveled it, and spent points on a tree. you couldnt redistrib your points, so thought and care had to go into it, or your pet would be broken. also, dont announce the future skills. let people discover them. for over a year, no one had a max level pet, and it was great, because it left something to the imagination.

player housing, guild housing, rvr, fishing, fighting on mounts, twitch combat, build your own boat/mount can add to overall immersion. what rift lacks, is depth. what rift has, is short lived excitement for people starving, begging for something new.  having a new class system/game entices people's imagination, but once its figured out, the rest of the world is pretty dry. rifts also, are exciting at first, but they are basically the same at level 10, as level 50, minus raid rifts.

i believe that the problem isnt trion, or rift, but the fact that people want something huge that they cant conquer.  Something where you feel threatened and seek out other peoples help. A game where they can spend thier time and become really unique. there are plenty of standalone games say, mass effect, obliion etc , that beat the snot out of any mmo in graphics and depth. if you crave better solo play, then play a stand alone game and talk to your friends on vent to pass time. you dont need an mmo. mmo's should MAKE you play with other people to progress. there shouldnt be much solo progression, or you can play the whole game alone, not having met anyone, completely missing the point of going online at all. i suppose making money with your game, and making a game true to actually being ann mmo conflict in this aspect. if you make people earn thier stuff, they wont want to play, and therefore the company will make less money.

I remember grouping on orc hill outside of crushbone/kelethin, thinking sweet, i have an orc hill group, i will finally get to level 7. I was more excited about that, than getting to 50 in rift because I couldnt do it on my own. I had to meet people and ask for thier help. If you were an ass in a group, you wouldnt get invited back, and it was back to solo play for being bad. Now days, solo play is more efficient, its almost silly to group for your characters development. You will miss out on rep and more boring quest chains to solo with.

Im sure ive somewhere in all of this, contradicted myself, misspelled something etc, but you get the feel of what I am trying to say right?

says my user or pass is incorrect, but i can use the same user and pass to get into my trion account. I have found multiple posts of the same issue.

some people will be actively playing, get booted, and THEN get the error that thier user and pass are wrong.

perhaps wait a week until some of the game killing issues are ironed out.

The pet system, which if Rappelz had anything good at all in it, was appealing, but it has been watered down over and over and .........

I compare watering down of this game to homeopathic remedy, where the strength of the actual substance is 1/10000 of original strength.

It is a wonder to me, how this game keeps going.

Some mmos are just harder to kill off than Clostridium difficile.

This game tmk, is long dead, please remove it from the list. Having a game that has been unplayable with a high rating is embarrassing, it should be removed and placed into the inactive list, if that still exists. RIP.

Is it worth playing WoW?

That depends on what hole you are trying to fill.

If you want to have fun: Wow IS fun. There is a dungeon finder to get groups cross server, as well as one for pvp. You dont have to actually know people to get a group together quickly. Solo questing is interesting the first time around. Big raids can be really fun with a bunch of people on ventrilo, while you are slaying a big boss. The gameplay is fast paced compared to alot of other games IMO.

If you want to feel unique: You won't. After a month or 2 of playing, your gear will be on par with a majority of your class minus comparing yourself to the hardcore raider who has beaten the endgame final boss. Nothing you do will really make your toon stand out compared to everone elses, regardless of any amount of hard work you supply.

If you want to explore: Wow is not for you. Everything in the game is entirely mapped out on websites, with in game quest trackers to aid all questing. You dont actually have to locate or figure out much at all. With the most recent expansion, the themepark feel is even more dumbed down with phasing. Although probably reducing lag, this phasing technology takes away from the idea that everyone is in one big world struggling together.

If you need things to do with your time: Wow has a good amount of everything smashed together. Raiding, grouping, pvp, crafting, gathering, achievements etc. It takes a long time to get a character with full achievements, the best gear, maxed out on crafting recipes. If you actually do obtain all these things, there are many more classes to pick from to start over.

If you want to have an impact on the world around you: You wont. Nothing you do passed the initial storyline, affects the world at all. The economy is active, however,  you will not craft anything unique that will have people needing you personally.

If greatness through hardwork is what you desire, wow is not for you.

If having fun with friends will fill the hole, it is possible. The key is finding people you enjoy playing with. The community overall is just as other posters say, full of angry little kids. I personally have had the most FUN in wow that I have had compared to any other game on some key nights, but overall the game can be kind of drab. I think the mmo genre is worn out for the most part but that is another can of worms.

I wanted to love FF14, when I got the open beta, was very excited. I already had the mindset that no jumping or swimming wasn't a big deal. While I was downloading the daylong download at the time, I watched wowfony's review about copy pasta'd terrain on youtube. Wow. That is so cheap. I have never seen copy and pasted entire 3d terrain before. I tried the first hour of the game and couldn't get it out of my head that I would be walking outside enjoying the same graphics over and over. It's shallow of me to base a game off of that soley, but my threshold of pain is very low now days. I guess that since I have tried so many horrible games that it doesn't take much for me to reach my limit.

With that being said, no, I wont be buying FF14 even though there is a drought.

Originally posted by Sovrath

Originally posted by Wolfy2449

I mostly play lineage 2 in a low rate(4x) private server

Its a really good FUN mmo, but its not to be taken seriously cause there are classes that can one shot others at high lvls etc(ncsoft doesnt know the thing called class balance xD)

Graphic wise its awesome, very detailed weapons armors and very detailed dungeons etc

Awesome theme music at each place, the only mmo that i noticed theme music

pve wise grind, ye thats how you lvl, killing repeatedly monsters at a specific area. at high lvls you mostly get bored and just look for raid parties to kill raid bosses. At high lvls its a little slow to lvl. Story can be nice but i am not the type who is interested in story  alot so i cant tell

Some raid bosses like antharas or valakas are awesome for example. My opinion that is though xD

Economy is brutal, getting b,a,s,s80 armor sets are really difficult to get

pvp wise- You can pvp everywhere, you can even kill someone who doesnt attack you(but if you kill him without him responding you get flagged and get a possibility of droppin some of your items, flag gets away if you kill a few mobs). PvP can be really fun in low lvls since you cant one shot ppl or have insane advantages and its mostly about how you use skills. And also mass pvp is very good in l2 too(castle sieges, clan wars etc)

I can't say enough good things about Lineage 2.

However, I don't really think of it as being a good fantasy game. Oh, it is fantasy. But the game really is more about the player vs player interaction over any sort of world/universe development.

each area is there so that players can level and/or fight over them. The areas are beautiful and it's a testament to the game that most of it is open world. I say most because Gracia strikes me as a series of islands or areas. I haven't really delved too deeply into Gracia.

I am currently enjoying Aion. Laugh it up, but I am. I kind of like the grind aspect, so that I am not maxed out and complaining about being bored. This game might turn me on to more asian mmorpgs.  I have heard good things about lineage 2, however, one thing that always smashes it, is the strong complaint of botting. Is there still rampant botting?

This thread is growing faster than I can read it LOL

I ironically recently subbed and bought the recent expansion to EQ2, approx 10 days ago.

FAIL.

The worst part is that I spent 2 months debating what game to go to, to delve my time into, and I picked the wrong one. If i wanted a f2p game, I would have picked runes of magic (eq2 lite)

3 amps of epi and atropine given, been shocked 3 times, Im sorry eq2 is dead. RIP.

Originally posted by elocke

I just want to get lost in the feel of the world, the music of Nobuo Uematsu, and the DEEP gameplay. I LOVE games where I can play one character and persue EVERYTHING possible and it keeps my progress. Even though I will probably never max everything, I always make it a goal to have everything maxed. If that makes any sense. Square games always give me so much to go for.

Amen.

Horizons: empires of Istaria.

It was a game I left everquest 1 for, and before world of warcraft came out. It was supposed to be a game where players could build houses, towns, all weapons and armor and even talior make spells. It was the first game I know of, that had flying. No content was added for a rediculous amount of time. When an update finally did come, it took away many of the things everyone had worked for. It was a game abandoned by its developers at release.

Originally posted by Knytta

No the cash shop is noting to worry about, the xp potions and mount are the only things affecting gameplay but they are not game breaking travel is ultrafast anyway and if you belong to the "the game starts at 90" school you will need potions. I have played since late 2006 and I still have fun, the endgame has its problems and can be elitist (depending on server) but it is still a great game.

 

The major problem at the moment is that it is possible to solo to 90 relatively fast and arrive to 90 withouth any grouping experience, undergeared and with too few Advancement points (I have heard about Lvl 90 with 90-100 Aps, when max is 250) that makes the player and toon have huge problem managing the group instances and the raiding is of course out of the question.

Thats cool. I couldnt take it anymore. Im now subscribed to EQ2 for better or for worse. I think I will develop a few characters before I decide to join a guild, so I have time to explore the low end before I feel obligated to push to the end game. I havent felt excited about an mmo for a very long time and I now know to appreciate the excitement I have currently. Will have to research what server to go onto now, and take Vikinggamers suggestions into consideration.

Every game has its issues, but for the most part, I believe eq2 has what im looking for, for now. I will have my eye on ff14 like many others, but at least I have a game to mess around in now. It took almost 3 months for me to decide

Thank you for the excellant post Vikinggamer.

I had played eq2 for 3 weeks at launch, and still have my account (still remember the user and pass~!~!)

I had left for silly reasons and never went back. I remember the crafting and it has been calling to me ever since. Im not concerned that there arent millions of players. If there is a decent population on the servers that are left, regardless of total amount acrossed all servers, than it will be good.

The cash shop question was the important question for me. The heart of a game to me is the goal. To craft to max level, get max skills, have the factions, do the raid instances. Having a shop that just gives you an item to make crafting obsolete, raiding obsolete, faction grind for an item obsolete would be game breaking for me. I wanted to know how players that are actually in the game felt, thank you for responding. Wouldnt mind a couple more posts from current EQ2 gamers though.

Originally posted by Krux

Originally posted by Riboflavin
*snip*

Has a decent playerbase of people who enjoy the game.

 *snip*

I just find this interesting. 

 

WoW and Aion are major subscription successes in the mainstream market with subscribers in the millions, most of which are perhaps asian.

 

EVE Online is the most successful Indie mmorpg with upwards of 300,000 subscribers.

 

All other supposed mainstream mmorpg's have anywhere from 50,000 - 200,000 subscribers, and with EQ2 in that category, it's still considered a decent player-base.  Of course anyone paying for an entertainment service is doing it because 'they' enjoy it.

 

I think you'll actually find the early to mid levels, quite a bit of game-play, in EQ2 to be quite barren.  It doesnt mean that if you buy the box and give it a go, that you wont enjoy your time, but I happen to think that many have put as much thought into playing an aged low population game and have left for the same reason that leaves it ranking in the actual medicoer subscription-base category.

I know quite a few of those WoW subscribers who actually hate playing the game. They hate the chat, they hate the crafting, they only play to raid. I myself feel that the raiding is the only progression left, minus achievments with all other aspects stagnant. People stay because they believe there is nothing else out there and simply to not feel alone. Alot of people have tried to leave wow and wasted time on 2 month long mmo's that die as well.

Aion I havent given a fair amount of research and will do so.

I play Eve.

The meat of my post remains unanswered though. Aside from my error in thinking EQ2 had a decent population, I believe there is alot of fun things to do in the game. Is the cash shop death to the game? If one who plays the game reads this, can you give me your opinion on how cash shop in a pay to play game has made the rest of its playerbase feel? I am more than anxious about this pay to play cash shop. Why strive to get crafting max level, even if its fun, if someone can just buy a better item for a few dollars? If it isnt like that, please let me know.

I have scoured the desert of mmo's for something that suits me, and I keep coming back to the idea of EQ2.

The graphics arent bad

The game is big enough to do things for awhile

Has raid endgame and good crafting.

Has a decent playerbase of people who enjoy the game.

Cash shop is the only thing scaring me. The question is, will cash shop replace the efforts of crafting and raiding? If you play EQ2 does the cash shop make you mad or just add a little to the game?

I also heard about 'some' servers allowing trading of bound armor, is this true? What server doesnt do that if it is?

     There are many examples of the games I had listed, that I didn't mention, but overall, sandbox or not, they had something to do. If you release a game with lack of content like MO, or content you cant get to like darkfall (because you will just be slain over and over with everything you earned taken), or content that is broken like vanguard (and no new content promised to come), then the things to do are gone. People cant picture themselves doing it anymore, the fantasy of the game is smashed. Hardly any mmo truely dies, there will always be a minimal playerbase willing to stay, but the majority of people need a constant struggle to overcome (having all your items taken so you can reget them doesnt count). The need to progress is key. Whether its crafting that unique item that is hard to do, conquering that huge dungeon only a few guilds can do, playing a rare class combo that is very useful but hard to level to, wearing that piece of armor that took 40 people to get, people want to feel like they accomplished something, and have things left to accomplish. If everyone has the same armor, everyone max level/skill, everyone has beaten the instance, people arent going to continue to play for the sake of playing. The game needs to be big enough for people to pour thier effort into.

I don't think its a sandbox people are after but rather the idea that they aren't done. If you make a game too hard, people will cry until its nerfed down to thier comfort, but ill put my house on the fact that those same people max level and complain that there isnt anything to do. One reason why the asian itemmall grind games are so successful is because they usually make it really difficult to max in level or skills without the cash shop. So, even though the game itsself is ugly, the horrible feeling that one is capped off without future expansion comes much later. The end of the new AAA fantasy mmo's can be seen from the beginning or shortly after. They have good graphics, sometimes good mechanics, but nothing is left to do but wait when all the content is eaten up. I think there are alot of people who never want to feel finished, or maxed, or have the best armor, and always have something to shoot for.

This is why wow added achievements and has faction grind. Even though this is cheap content, it is something to do.

Its why ff11  ability for everyone to have every job.

Ryzom is set as an example many times, a game which you can also have many jobs, and I think max level in all those jobs was 250? I don't remember but it was high. Even though it wasn't successful, there are many people in love with it.

Eve is successful because the amount of planets is staggering, its just huge. The skill system limits insta-progression and allows the player to feel as if he/she is always obtaining something.

UO graphics were a strongpoint I think. Because everyone was so small and not intensive to machines, the world could be made huge with many things to do in it. Same goes for Runescape. You may laugh, but tons of people play and love it.

Could be much more detailed with my little examples but the point is made. If a game is made, even though its beautiful like AoC, regardless of bugs, if people gobble up the content too soon, why play? If everyone is maxed out and there is nothing left to do but gank new people, then the feeling of progression is gone.  Most people need a goal whether they realize it or not.

Originally posted by Alberel

Well many of the concepts and game systems are very similar between FF11 and FF14 so it depends on what you want. Either play 11 so 14 won't feel so alien when you eventually play it or play EQ2 so that 14 will feel entirely fresh and new.

I value both of those trains of thought. I am my most own worst enemy. I cant decide, too many choices. If i knew more about ff11 crafting, would probably help me to decide. the ff14 crafting looks amazing. I will go do this now. In the mean time, how does crafting in ff11 stack up with eq2 in thier current state? I know that everything in eq2 was "watered down" to be a bit more soloable due to lack of player base in the low and mid areas. I remember liking the little minigame that you did with eq2 crafting.