Can't agree (with the editorial), sorry.

I saw and then played SWG, and while the wide-open sandbox (no Tattooine pun intended) game has some merits, it's long been discredited as a MMORPG method because:  if you give people freedom and anonymity, they will abuse it.

Secondly, as a Star Wars fan from age 9 (first showing, 1977) on, I think frankly Bioware has done more in developing the mythos with its "Old Republic" games than Lucas ever did with the first three films -- and Lucas' later efforts have only soured the original.

However, I'm still not pre-ordering; there hasn't been a thing EA has touched that it hasn't spoiled.  I will watch and see what happens, and hope for massive success for this game.

Originally posted by Inktomi

Hmmm,

    No. 6 you are right, it's over when it's over.  I guess that MxO was a classic case of good idea + bad execution? However one thing that other studios should take from this is the live content aspect of the game as you mentioned. That's comparable to having a Dungeon Master in D & D, expect the unexpected. Thanks for stepping up and answering my question seriously and honestly.

~Ink

I would say 'great' idea(s):

- Continuity of plot from the end of the movies
- 'We-go' competitive combat system complete with complex animations, as opposed to the 'I-go, you-go' back-and-forth whacking of standard PnP and MMO games
- Dynamic re-pluggable skill tree system justified by the Matrix mythos

combined with some traditional MMO ideas that really didn't work in conjunction with the above:
- Class 'roles' (nuker, tank, healer) clashed with the dynamic trees, causing min/maxers to find unbalanced combinations and pooching PvP
- Clothing system, while diverse, came with MMO-typical stat or talent buffs, which makes no sense in the mythos and conflicted with the skill-centric play system
 

and lastly inexperience in the MMO arena and all-too-typical scope creep, project underestimation, and time/money constraints led to:
- Game-killing bugs in critical areas of combat, movement (e.g., being stuck in elevators), and server stability
- Imbalance between character tree choices both in PvE and PvP - being able to select a very large number of build permutations through the tree led to an impossible task of balancing them in the allotted time
- Incomplete development of game content outside of the GM-run events led to a gameplay experience that was wildly fun for an hour or four a week and mindnumbingly dull the rest of the time.  The newbie missions and those associated with plot points were well-crafted and everything else was, essentially, kill 10 rats repeated a nearly infinite number of times, with slightly different textures to look at every few levels.

Monolith worked like dogs to deliver but MMO development is a different project entirely than a normal game or IT project. 

Lastly, all, leave SOE out of this one.  They didn't reinvent MxO as it clearly needed but they didn't create the initial fubar and (unlike some of their other games' overhauls) they didn't do any harm to MxO.

Originally posted by Inktomi

 

Why can't they at least give a warning and try to rally. No, all they did was charge the same amount of money for the product that obviously didn't warrant it. If it was so bad why can't they make it free?

'Cause bandwidth, support staff, and servers aren't.

Originally posted by Inktomi

Why did this game fail and how come SOE just does this without any recourse for the community?

 

Well, as a beta MxOer, I'd have to sadly say that MxO failed because, just when the MMO world was getting accustomed to accessible, well-balanced, thoroughly-tested games, Monolith had set its course on making a hardcore-style grind game, and ran out of time and money before being forced to release with bugs galore and no semblance of balance.  It did feature a nicely stylized clothing system and plenty of emotes, which drew the mmo-roleplayers.

It probably didn't help that the Matrix franchise's popularity was sagging badly due to the poor reception of the latter two films.

As such MxO sold very badly and from reports at the time managed less than 60k subscribers at its peak.

The 'live' plot, acted out by Monolith employees playing key roles, was the one shining gem in an otherwise sordid tale of MMO development.  When Monolith ran out of money from the initial pre-orders and box sales to keep people paid, though, practicality took over.

I really don't think there's much of a community left to need recourse, but for those few fanatics still there here's a salute (/bigtrouble) and take the yellow pill ... there is No Exit.  (end obscure reference to tiny Machine faction which probably nobody will remember).

Yea!  Someone else remembers Scruffy.

Originally posted by AmbushMartyr

Ok so basically whats shes saying in a underlying tone that Turbine is over subscribing servers, and dont have anyone working on real server optimizations from within the code anymore because its obvious that part of the code is "good enough" so no real need to keep up on that part anymore, 

That's silly.  There is no single more important aspect to a MMO than its servers; if they don't work, there's no game any more, and unavailability is a good way to get people to try and get hooked on your competition.

Now you have  a half-point in that like many services MMOs do 'oversell' in that they are not providing capacity for every single subscriber to be online at one time, but then you throw out your half-point by venturing into hyperbole.

Besides, if you had been looking, you would have noticed that lately Turbine was in fact advertising for a server programmer.  I know this because I was recently in the job hunt and almost applied, but MA is a bit more uprooting than I wanted to do at the moment.

Originally posted by Sanya

Next week, I’ve got some discussion with an actual server professional to share with you. Tune in then!

Oh, I can't wait to see who that might be... could it be her long-time friend and one-time Mythic server professional Lum?  What are the odds?

Originally posted by Jeff44

 

 

While Greyhawk, FR, et.el. were certainly created during and tied to 2nd edition AD&D, 

Ah yes, here we are, a handy link:  http://rdushay.home.mindspring.com/Museum/Fantasy/DDrevw.html

The OP's comments are appropriate for his tastes.

Yes, the combat is like other traditional MMOGs.  So it's similar to WoW, EQ2, EQ1, DAoC, and many other successful titles.  The OP prefers a different style, something very active.  Personally I think a more standard system is appropriate for LOTRO.

The graphics are spectacular.  They are not a translation of the movies, and they're not intended to be.  Ditto sounds.  I like them, I *do* think they're in line with Middle-Earth, but Howard Shore wasn't involved.  This is not Lord of the Rings - The Movies - Online.  If you were hoping for shield-surfing elves and comic-relief dwarves, you may be disappointed. 

Originally posted by PwndStar

as users who have logged into the game from internet cafes within the past 30 days."

This really makes it difficult to compare apples to apples with respect to subscription-only MMOGs.

Anyway:  I am not a WoW player, never have been, and have no intention of starting, but Blizzard's success is earned and not luck.  They simply took the best features of the existing crop of MMOGs, polished them to a fine sheen, and resisted the temptation to risk disaster by experimentation.  This is *exactly* what they've done with all their other games and the formula has served them well once again.

Lest anyone think I'm flaming Blizzard in the above:  it is not a trivial exercise to accurately deduce what the best features of MMOGs are; it certainly isn't easy to refine them; and while new and unbroken ground is a great thing it does carry with it the risk that what your designers and in-house playtesters think is the greatest gameplay idea since the mouse will be received by the playerbase as one enormous wtfbbq (note this is a noun, used in place of clusterf...).

---

Originally posted by Cutedge
This actually isn't module three. Module three is a bigger release that will come in another month or two. This is some sort of smaller patch

---

Therefore DDO module 2.5 ... good, I'm glad to see Turbine is continuing the tradition of D&D version naming. 

OK ok, that was for humor's sake.  Honestly I don't know of another company that has given so much additional gameplay for their MMOG free of charge.  With everyone else, you get what came in the box until the publisher delivers another box for you to buy.

I don't wanna hear about how this or that "should've" been in at release.  Given a chance, gamers (or at least the ones who post) want *everything* at release and go into instant-whine mode the minute they power-grind their way through the shortest path to max (ignoring, of course, the 90% of content not previously posted as the best xp/loot per picosecond method). 

DDO:  more fun, less grinding.

"They got the D&D franchise and made DDO, a very average game also plagued by doing the same dungeons over and over, and initially, no solo play and no PvP."

Here's an odd concept for you:  not every game wants to be WoW.

Now granted WoW is absurdly popular (and according to mmogcharts.com, over half its userbase is in the Pac rim) but really, unless your game is ready to BE WoW, it's marketing folly to try and be the things (PvP, raiding, fast soloing) that WoW is.

So what *is* Dungeons and Dragons?  It's not about grinding, it's not about mega-raids, it's not about killing the other players, it's not about tradeskilling, and it's definitely not for playing by yourself.

It's about a group of people adventuring.  So, that's what DDO is.  Adventures for parties of players. 

Now as you pointed out not everyone wants this, so DDO did not become a 6 million user megahit.  It did become a goodly 100k hit.   More importantly, it actually IS D&D, not "WoW with D&D mobs."

The point of all this is:  if you are hoping for someone to take the revered LOTR mythos and turn it into d00d this and n3wb-ganking and other such things people in MMOGs these days enjoy, I think you'll be very disappointed.   Those who have some remnant of respect for Professor Tolkien's work should be glad Turbine and not someone else is in charge of the MMOG bearing the LOTR name.